I'm relatively new to magic, but have quickly become absorbed. I have learnt so many sleights, and have learnt some great tricks. The problem is I tend to improvise a lot, i.e... I make the tricks up myself as I go. I have just perfected the Pass, the Hermann version being my favourite as it is undetectable and leaves the unsuspecting audience baffled and bewildered when they see their card appear on top of the pack, when the hands have barely moved.
My favorite trick involving the Hermann, riffle and classic pass is "Passing along the invisible Aces". It's a great effect although a bit limited after having done it a million times. Please friends fill me in on some more tricks using the pass. I would be very greatful.

In the majority of cases the pass is simply used as a control, so you could simply continue to use that as your preferred method of control.

I must admit, I used to use and like the Hermann Turnover pass, but most tricks do not use any kind of pass and it is no longer an essential sleight to master.

You said;
I have learnt so many sleights, and have learnt some great tricks.

So many sleights?
Some great tricks?

Be careful you don't just become a sleight collector! Try not to learn a sleight on it's own, learn it in conjunction with a trick that utilizes it.

There is a thread elsewhere on the site about the best five sleights, and really you probably need to know, no more than five or six.
I would say a couple of good card controls, a couple of good forces, (so your procedure can vary from time to time) a double lift/turnover, a false shuffle or cut, a palm. Though many get along quite well without the latter two.

Check out "The Card Expert Entertains" by Fitzkee.

If into packet tricks, then a few false counts/displays are in order.

Many magicians know and recognize myriad moves, but cannot perform them well. You really do not need to have a large arsenal of moves to be a good entertainer. Having knowledge of lots of moves does not make you a good magician, and why waste time learning things you may never use.

Get on the right track early if you can.

Pass tricks? I'm sure other members here will point you to some. I have none in my repertoire at the moment.

Paul Hallas
http://www.PH-Marketing-magic.co.uk

I'm not a big card man myself, but I know that "Royal Road to Card Magic" has 5 tricks utilizing "the Pass" (as well as many, many other sleights and tricks). If you are a card man, you probably already have this book. Check 'em out! If you don't have this book, I *highly* recommend it for any card man.

Gotta go with Paul on this--

I've met LOTS of guys who have great technique on a myriad of sleights (they refer to themselves as "technicians"), but if you put them in front of an audience, they can't even do one entertaining set, much less an entire show!

Learning sleights for their own sake may be fun, and it may boost your ego to show them to the guys at the club, but it isn't magic!

If you are "pass junkie" check out 'The Complete Works of Derek Dingle.' He explains several different versions of the pass, and -- if I recall correctly -- many of the card effects in the book utilize it. If you can master all of these versions, I'll hire you to teach them to me!!

The pass is not something YOU master...

Something to reflect upon:

"I know a thousand ways of making love to a woman.....but I don't know any women."

Do the pass in front of a mirror, it is not invisible. If you like to make a card rise to top (ambitious routines), I suggest simple double lifts. The pass is supposed to be used with misdirection, hence, it is only a utility move for you to control a card to a certain position. When executing a pass, there is movement, and when there is movement then the spectators know that you are doing someting, and knowing that you are doing something is just as bad as seeing it. So a card rising to the top via the pass is not magical, because in the spectator's mind YOU DID SOMETHING. A simple double lift is more magical. You do nothing, yet when you snap your fingers, sprinkle dust or whatever, the card magically rises to the top. I studied the pass for over a year. Then I had an ephiphany, it can never be invisble and no one can convince that it is. It is an ego thing, YOU AREN'T A CARDICIAN UNTIL YOU CAN DO THE PASS. Fine, I can do the pass now, next......

I actually use the turnover pass (or a version of the turnover pass) in 3 routines.

Since it is not angle proof, it does require some misdirection which is simple enough for the routines I am performing.

I also agree with what Paul said. If you are going to learn a sleight, you should learn it because it is needed for the particular routine you are working on. There are too many people out there who grace the magic magazines but they would die a horrible death if they ever had to perform for a real audience. (This also includes some of the bigger names in close up.)

I guess it depends on what you want to accomplish in magic. There is an audience that appreciates technicians but most lay audiences would get bored.

I actually find myself spending as much time structuring the effect and writing a script for it as I do practicing the sleight of hand that goes along with it. I also do not perform the effect until I have mastered everything involved in it. (Maybe I should put I try not to perform it but sometimes I get anxious and show the routine to friends even if it is not ready).

I agree with what several here have stated.
The pass is of very little use and you would do well to learn many more useful moves and get them smooth (you may have already done this of course). The pass is kind of a toy. We like it, it's fun, we do it for magicians and unlike many think, a pass will not make you a good magician.

I do not agree that the pass cannot be invisible however. It can be just as invisible as any other sleight. The problem is that many are stuck on "classic pass" type passes, which involve severe movement of the hands (unless used with misdirection instead of being covered by hand shaking (fishing rod moves). The best passes utilize the normal movement of cards (half pass: the deck is turned over for some reason and a pass is done in the process). There are several passes that can be done like this and if done in the context of a routine, they are very convincing. That said, there are simpler ways of doing it. Some manipulators do find however that after doing a pass for enough years, it is just as easy to use that pass as anything else, esp. if you can combine it with simple misdirection.

All that said, I do about six passes and hardly every use any of them in performance. I have an ambitious card routine (where the card is face up the whole time) and it involves nothing but passes and colour changes. I made it just for magicians though and probably wouldn't ever use it for a lay audience. For them, I like very simple, self-working routines. There are no odd movements and I feel it looks more like real magic.

Jeb (Sable)

[quote]On 2002-03-15 04:59, John Pezzullo wrote:


"I know a thousand ways of making love to a woman..... but I don't know any women.

John,
You really got me with that one! That's a lot to think about.

Ted (Leondo)

I use passes all the time. I just get a thrill out of controlling the card that way.

Classic pass or turnover work fine for me.

I also like using multiple shifts, double undercuts, jogs, crimps (infinity)....there are many ways to control a card or lots of cards to the top or bottom of the deck.

I don't really use the pass for ambitious card type effects or anything like that..

I love passes though...I'm not even sure how many I know...more than 10 for sure...but they are just Tools to get a job done...many different tools to get the same job done.

Just a quick agreement with Sable, the pass can be invisible. May be angly, but it can be invisible. Misdirection comes into play with most, but not all. Dingle was the best I've seen do it on video, or not seen do it should I say Just looks like he's riffling the cards. The whole point is that it should not be seen.

Nice to know that at least YOU get a thrill out of your ten passes Lonnie.

Paul.

For those who want to do the pass but can't, check out Geoff Williams second set of lecture notes. He has an entire section on passes that are covered with a larger action and/or misdirection that anyone can do. Some of my favorites - "Do these pants make my butt look big" pass and the "Didn't there used to be a door here" pass. But his "Estimation Pass" is very easy and kills.

Mave favourite is still one I call the "Shrug pass" (I'm sure others do it too). I also like the "cockroach pass".

Jeb (Sable)

Let's not forget the world famous Cockroach pass.

Your ready to do your pass and your being burned... look to the floor and scream ROACH!! while you stomp like a mad man.... do the pass while you are stomping...

it's been tried and tested and it's totally invisible.

very subtle too.

Yeah, but you have to pick your venue for that one! lol

Paul.

First - the pass in many of its' incarnations is, or can be, invisible. That pretty well negates the "lay audiences are bored by technicians" theory. How can they think you are a technician if they can't tell that you are doing anything?

Second - the ad hominem attacks on un-named performers because they CAN do the pass, (statements to the effect that even though big name close-up performers can do moves they would die in front of an audience), or any other difficult sleights for that matter, smack of justification to me. Just another reason not to learn the hard stuff - it would make you just like the people you disparage (envy?).
It also presumes, falsely, that poor performers are bad because they are skilled technicians. Maybe they're just poor performers - regardless of their skill, not because of it?

Finally, check out the Stars of Magic - there is a classic trick with the pass in its pages...

Best, PSC