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Marcel.Allen.van.Bulck
New user
63 Posts
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Posted: Mar 18, 2009 3:32pm
"If I am a layman, I will be very disappointed if I know magicians use stooges."
If I am a layman, I will also be very disappointed if I discover the secret of a trick. You're a magician. Either way, we're still lying to our audience. Or "performing theater," however you want to look at it. I'm not sure about this "is it ethical?" business because magic wasn't created to be ethical. It was created to be mysterious and entertaining. The question should be "Does it mystify and entertain the audience?" I say, if you can get away with it, and the audience is entertained and mystified...why not?
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stijnhommes
Special user
568 Posts
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Posted: Oct 28, 2009 6:33am
I've always hated extremes, so the idea that stooges are NEVER a good idea is something I just can't swallow. Now, what the right conditions are, I don't know. The only time I ever used a stooge was when I had my sister's boyfriend read someone's mind to determine a playing card. Somehow, the rest of my family never expected that I'd use him as a stooge....
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daver
Veteran user
Jupiter, FL
364 Posts
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Posted: Dec 14, 2009 9:13pm
So I just had an interesting discussion with a friend on this...
Let's say it's not a "stooge" in the pure sense, in that it really is not totally set up, but you bring someone on stage whom during the show you have determined would be a willing shill (rather than stooge) and during the patter of the effect, the participant gets a cue form you on what to do or how to behave. So they are in on it, but not a prepped, predisposed "this is the person".
First, while a stooge, although an impromptu and unpreshow'ed one, are you comfortable with this?
a) The person has to be trusted to actually execute the effect with you.
b) Does it diminish the effect when later on, or the next day, or whenever, they spill it to someone, and the effect you did was just a trick, and not "the impossible" bringing you down in their eyes as a performer,
c) Do you think that the participant will feel it in themselves to not spill it because either they want to make others believe they are really part of something magical or because they don't want to be thought of as lying to their friends?
d) Do you think the participant will spill it to "be cool and a know it all" and expose you?
Thoughts?
Dave
What's the difference between a magician and a deck of cards? A deck of cards has FOUR suits...
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HMAC
New user
60 Posts
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Posted: Jan 2, 2010 1:08am
I personally do not mind stooges too much.
However, I do mind people using bad stooges. Someone showed me a few Cris Angel's video lately. And it hurts. Really.
Please, when you use a stooge, make sure he can act.
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Jason Fox
New user
Washington, D.C.
48 Posts
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Posted: Jan 7, 2010 11:00pm
I think they can be a blessing and a curse. You could be the best performer in the world and use a plant that can't act and that can blow your whole set.
Not my favorite magician but for example I'll use Chris Angel. On His TV show Chris used several stooges for one trick(i'm sure more that once, but in his defense it is hard to come up with original magic) - Where Chris vanishes and shows up on the roof of a nearby building - the first thing that I notice was that 5 people walk up to a moving crowd of people with Chris in tow and peppered through the crowd, then immediately turned to Chris and volunteered to be a helper for the stunt. Chris only picked those guys to help. Now in effect they did accomplish the trick, but it was not graceful or was it magical. I felt less amazed and more like a con man took me for a fool.
speaking of plants - anyone know why L&L has the same people in all there videos to fill the crowd? I'd like to know, and that seems like a fun thing to know. PM me
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DATMagic
Loyal user
Shreveport, La
281 Posts
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Posted: Jan 29, 2010 3:46pm
A magician friend of mine used me as a stooge the other evening at a large gala function, I thought he was an idiot to do so since he is a competent magician and shouldn't stoop to stooges, was I ever wrong. He did a tie steal and a watch steal from me and I believe that is what everyone left talking about. I still don't like the idea of stooges, but it certainly opened my eyes to the possiblilities they bring to a large crowd.
David A Trombetta
DAT does the Trick
DATdoestheTrick.com
email DATMagic@aol.com
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Lawrence O
Inner circle
Paris France
6269 Posts
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Posted: Mar 26, 2010 4:30am
Never used one but would have no problem doing it (properly as Patrick Differ underlines): we are professional liars after all
Magic is not a performing art where people don't know how situations are reached, it's the art of showing parallel dimensions that can't be reached
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Mr. Mystoffelees
Inner circle
I haven't changed anyone's opinion in
3361 Posts
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Posted: Apr 3, 2010 9:46am
Like a one-way deck, used sparingly it kills...
As I felt the soft, cool mud squish between my toes, I thought "Man, these are not very good shoes" Jack Handey
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Ms. Merizing
Loyal user
Opening soon: a trading post for my
228 Posts
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Posted: Apr 10, 2010 11:56am
If Larry Fine wasn't deceased, he'd be a part of my new routine in a heartbeat.
Pleased to continue finding that all the world's a stage.
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Doruk Ülgen
Elite user
423 Posts
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Posted: Jul 6, 2010 5:06pm
I feel great:)
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brody
Inner circle
Omaha
1137 Posts
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Posted: Jul 7, 2010 5:19pm
Properly handled, I think stooges are fine. I do Karrel Fox's Little Red Table a LOT, and it is an instant-stooge type effect.
It's very solid, and I do have an alternate ending (Brainwave) ready in case the helper decides *not to help*.
But, it's never happened.
And I know for a fact that at least in one case, the info that they were my "stooge" has stayed pretty well concealed, since one lady pestered me for over a year about how could "the card the girl thought of appear in my billfold".
I do admit though, that as I escort the volunteer off the stage, I mention to them that "If you don't tell anyone, it'll drive them all crazy".
I also have to admit that there's not much work for the stooge to do in this effect. Just name a card.
I'm not sure I'd trust any instant-stooge to do much more than this.
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aaronharp88
New user
68 Posts
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Posted: Nov 28, 2010 1:29am
Very funny topic. I paid good money to see a famous magician perform. not going to say his name. but me and my wife had front row seats... a lady comes up and asks if I have good seats and I told her to pretty much go on that I wasnt selling her my tickets to get in trouble.... then she says no she is the assistant of this magician and that my wife is perfect size for an illusion.... he then takes her backstage has her sign a waver and then she performs origami on stage for him during the show.... luckily she new this trick since we performed it.... but he had that risk of once she is in the box of being clostrophobic or anything in that nature.... but that's a way he uses stooges..... she also got a bunch of stuff free after the show... but to me that's very risky
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joe yang
Loyal user
Florida
296 Posts
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Posted: Jan 22, 2011 10:34pm
As an escape artist, I use stooges a little differently, not to make a trick work, but to speed up an act. Some venues only allow a few minutes per act. Taking audience "volunteers" on a walk through of some of my more elaborate rope ties can save time. Just pre-selecting volunteers can save time. Pretending we've never met or worked together can add to the comedy.
Now I'm submitting scripted routines, small, one act clown shows to fringe festivals. I'm looking at expanding my use of stooges. There are a lot of opinions on the pros and cons of using stooges. I'm experimenting with the practical reality. I want to see what works, what doesn't and why. My two cents from a new guy.
aka Mike Booth
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