How do you feel about using stooges...?

As I noticed, this theme mostly brings up heated discussions with a wide range of different opinions and views.

When I talk about stooges, I mean any kind of secret helpers in a show, that can make impossible effects work or ensure the performer that a free chosen volunteer from the audience won’t kill your show by any misbehaviour (like DC uses them in his TV-Shows for example).

I’m talking of stooges used for cool gags, prearranged behaviour, speech- and bodycodes etc.

My personal way is not to use stooges (mostly) but I did. And I don’t condemn anyone going this way.

After using a stooge in my show I asked myself:
Was the audience amazed? – Yes they were!
Did they applaud during and at the end of my show? – Yes!!
Did I get paid? – Yes

So I only can come up with the conclusion: Whatever it is that amazes your audience and let them freak out, DO THOSE TRICKS!!!!


Now, I’m looking for your thoughts on that...


Magic greetz,

Larry Wilson (I think) does an interesting arash where he gets his stooge from the audience then basiclly does stuff that he couldn't do with an audience member and asked "NOW how many of you believe she was just a memeber of the audience?!" That was a good use of the stooge.

I believe more in using it to enhance an effect rather than "creating" an effect. A stooge can be great insurance. When used to blow a heckler out of the water(such as in a mentalism routine) that is stooge use at it's finest!

I don't mind it say when Copperfield uses them for his "joke" tricks...i.e. "incredible egg" but in the "barclay house" not so much....
basicly for a laugh it doesn't hurt anyone, but anywhere else I'd rather not see it.

There are some effects which just aren't doable without stooges,
but in this case I havew a preference for "instant stooges". If you choose your wording right and let them have the fame and applause of doing something unbelievable, they will never tell ...

And, in the end its the effect that counts. Just don't overdo it.

S%

Hmmm I am torn on this one. Yes and no. I use stooges for a Bruce Kalver effect- it's a systematic simplex code for learning serial numbers and thought of cards. Using an assistant. Anywho- buy his lecture notes if you want to learn it; I would strongly recommend it. Not going to tip anything. Bruce's stuff is really clever.

best always,
Matt Tomasko

I'm just sixty. Perhaps when I get older, I'll consider it. I have nothing against acting but not all acting is magic.

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander

Stooges may "play big" under the right conditions but normally they do not "pack small".
Actually, when the situation can be enhanced and the amazement raised by the use of a carefully trained Moe, Larry or Curly, I say go for it. This argument borders on the "what type of lying do you do as a magicain; the honest lying or the dishonest lying." Look, I promise to decieve and do my best to deliver! I use a stooge for my sword thru neck routine. I have polled other audience members and friends on whether they thought she was "in on it" and 90% say no. That being the case I will continue to use her because her co-operation more than a real spectator would do, I feel, really elevates the mystery factor to the point of creepy mythology.

I only use stooges when performing magic on film, whether it be TV a DvD or whatever. Say what you like, but when it comes to my magic on video I say "anything goes."

One of the most famous tricks- the shirt trick isn't possible without a stooge.
And that's a killer effect.

My problem with using stooges is I can't seem to keep them from hiting each other. Realy makes it hard to perform.


OK, Now that I have that out of my system. Stooges are fine, but they must live up to the same performance standard that you do.

I think one of the big things to remember is that we are entertainers. It is perfectly acceptable to me professionally to do "bits of business" that entertain. For the most part it is all clowns do and I have a lot of respect for them.

What I don't have respect for is an entertainer who is doing "bits of business" but calling it magic. It's like playing the radio and claiming to be a musician.

It certainly has its place in the entertainment industry. So does dancing. But I don't call that magic either.

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander

I totally agree with the whole philosophy of using stooges for comedic effect. One of the funniest routines I have EVER seen is the 'pickpocket' routine that Steve Martin did with Bill Murray as his stooge on Saturday Night Live. I have probably seen that 100 times and it is still laugh-out-loud hilarious!

Count me in, I love jokes with stooges. I have used stooges in some effects I do in a dinner setting. Although I am not being paid it is fun and I get a great reaction. Now a paying “stage” gig is a little different (in the sense you are performing for more than a dozen people and you are getting paid.) I think if you are going to use stooges it needs to be very, very believable. I think a lot needs to happen for the whole thing to work. They cant over act!

Pull out your old tape from 1994 of Franz Harary making NASA's Space Shuttle disappear. (After watching) Take a look at his audience and their reactions after he makes the Shuttle disappear. Although it's a few years old… ((Come on.)) I think the one thing that makes it all believable and work is the stooge looks just a little uncomfortable and unsure of what’s going to happen. LITTLE being the main word! Then it works. It needs to be shuttle… I mean suttle.

Would you risk a big illusion with a regular audience member? I mean, to come up and inspect the gadget for example, that´s ok. But would you actually perform the illusion on the audience member? Now before everyoen jumps on me, I know that there are several illusions that are required to be performed with members of teh audience, but those are smaller every day efects. I am talking big unique effects. If you saw the Mindfreak episode of Criss Angel season 2, where he vanishes two spectators of the audience, then you had to start thinking... mmm And after some thoughts, I say no.

I don't think there is anything wrong with using stooges, as long as the audience is entertained.

I look at a stooge as a gaff and I have decided not to use gaffs, yet. I figure there is plenty of Magic for me to learn before relying on a fake coin/card/bill/person/fill-in-the-blank.


"Not that there is anything wrong with that." Jerry Seinfeld

One of my magician friends will use a stooge for his stage show once in a blue moon. But when he does, he lets the audience know later in the show. He will even introduce the person and thank him for their help. Sometimes even pay them on the spot. It is funny how most people don't remember that a stooge was used.

To me it's almost unethical to use a fake audience...in any kind of trick. They are mostly used in mentalism and that's why I don't like mentalism. Also you always have to prove that they are real so you invent strange ways (like big balls running around) to show they are not fake while they are. The audience still goes home thinking...I bet the two were friends. I admit you can do impossible things but as I said I think is non-ethical. Is like a painter that uses assistants, or a tv showman with an earphone. It is just...wrong.

There is another way to see it. An election year is coming!

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander