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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The September 2007 entrée: Daryl » » Memdeck work » » TOPIC IS LOCKED Pete McEwen Special user Raleigh, N.C. 570 Posts Posted: Sep 21, 2007 1:23pm       Daryl, First I'd like to thank you for all our conversation at the MAGA convention in Fayetteville, NC. I learned a lot from you in your lecture and sitting and talking with you, I learned the most in your performance in the show though despite a biker gang dance going on next door. A story I'll let you share if you'd like. But to my question, We talked a little bit about memorized deck work, but I wanted to know more about your ideas on it. Would you ever memorize one? If you could go back into your career would you memorize one? do you like or dislike it. Thanks again Pete Thanks for the Steve Forte book as well, I've been studying it daily. The magician formerly known as SPEEDcuber "no one will believe the things we do if we don't believe them ourselves." - Slydini Daryl Easton V.I.P. 101 Posts Posted: Sep 21, 2007 1:45pm       I think that the memorized deck is an extremely powerful tool. I have memorized (and forgotten) a least a couple of different stacks and I would certainly recommend it to anyone who has the desire. Having said that, I do not use any memorized deck work at the moment. One thing you should be aware of is that (at least in my experience) if you do not keep a memorized deck in constant practice, it’s easy to lose. I think the expression “Use it or loose it” applies perfectly to memorized deck work. After I forgot the memorized deck the third or forth time, I decided to let it go. Perhaps someday I’ll try again. If you do decide that you want to give it a go, you can do no better than to study the works of Juan Tamariz, Simon Aronson and Michael Close. All three gentlemen are masters of the memorized deck and they have the very best work available. Maritess New user 93 Posts Posted: Sep 21, 2007 1:57pm       I'm performing at the Magic Castle in January, and was thinking I wanted to do something super duper impressive that the magicians would love, so I picked up Mnemonica. Since we're talking about memorized decks, Daryl, what is your fave memorized deck effect for magicians? It doesn't have to be something that you have done, it could be something that you saw that left a lasting impression. www.youtube.com/queenofmagic Alan M Loyal user Sherman Oaks, CA 216 Posts Posted: Sep 21, 2007 2:02pm       Even though you are not using any mem deck work, I am curious if there was a specific stack you chose to learn and any special considerations that went into that decision. Your thought process might be illuminating to some of us considering this... Thank you for being here and Happy Birthday to Laura. P.S. I've been practicing Cardboard Chameleons since 1985. I've almost got it down... Dennis Loomis Inner circle 1602 Posts Posted: Sep 22, 2007 12:12pm       Daryl, you're one of my favorite magicians and you're also a GREAT teacher. Thanks for contributing so much to our art. That said, I would like to comment on memdeck work and memory training in general. What you said was basically correct... if you don't use it, you lose it. How many of us that took High School Algebra could solve a 2nd degree quadratic equation a few years later? However, keeping on top of it is FAR less work than most people understand. And, the longer you work with a stack, the closer you get to having it embedded in your long term memory. I find that on days when I'm not using the stack, I can do a quick review of less than five minutes and that's all it takes. I do that when going for a morning walk, while driving, while standing in lines, and even during TV commercials. And, if I miss a few days, I can go back to it and the same 5 minute drill session is all I need to use it in shows. So glad you're on the Café, Daryl. Dennis Loomis Itinerant Montebank http://www.loomismagic.com RicHeka Inner circle 3045 Posts Posted: Sep 22, 2007 12:50pm       So very true Dennis.Also,I highly reccommend your site http://www.loomismagic.com/ for woderful information re: Mem stacks...along with a lot of other cool stuff. I realize that all Mem stacks have inherent pluses and minuse.For my needs,all I need at this time is Doug Dyments 'Quickstack'. Quickstack is sooo easy to learn and even easier to remember.Because of the well organized yet invisible formula...I truly believe If I were not to use it for months..I would have no problem recalling it. Like Dennis said,Mem stacks can be kept fresh by 'visualizing' them during routine tasks. Best. Rich Hand Crafted Pendulums from Mentalcraft! See 'Failsafe TK Pen Kit' here: http://tinyurl.com/mnqmdw PENDULUMS:UNDERRATED,UNDERUSED,AMAZING! Daryl Easton V.I.P. 101 Posts Posted: Sep 22, 2007 5:29pm       Maritess: My favorite memorized deck trick was one that I created and performed about twenty years ago using a Birthday Book and three decks of cards. It’s difficult to explain the exact effect but basically, it’s a triple coincidence thing (three selected cards – one from each deck – all match) and this is the same card that is written on the spectator’s birthday in the Birthday Book that was placed on the table BEFORE the effect began. I believe that if you read Mnemonica from cover to cover (the best book in the world on the memorized deck), you should have no trouble finding a killer routine. Alan: I learned what I felt were the best stacks available at the time. About thirty years ago, I learned the Nicola Stack (this was before Simon Aronson made his stack available). Years later, I learned the Aronson stack and that was the one I used most often. If I were to learn a memorized deck today, I believe I would have to choose between the Aronson stack and the Tamariz stack. Both of these stacks are excellent and they both have smaller stacks within them that are used to perform a number of individual “mini-stack” tricks. Before taking the time and effort to memorize either one of them, I would research and learn which individual effects were woven into the main stacks. I would then decide which stack contained the most tricks that I would like to perform and that’s the stack I would learn. Dennis: I agree, you’re right. It only takes a few minutes to keep in shape. I suppose the same thing can be said about physical exercise, but when I don’t do that for a day or two (which is more often the case), I tend to simply give up and loose that as well. Rick: I’m not familiar with “Quickstack”, but I suspect if there’s a formula involved – even if it is invisible – there are probably not smaller stacks built within it. I think that these smaller stacks that are available with the full deck stacks are what put the Aronson and Tamariz stack several levels above the rest. Dennis Loomis Inner circle 1602 Posts Posted: Sep 22, 2007 8:47pm       Doug Dyment's Quickstack is a remarkable construct. You can literally learn it in about half an hour. If you are only occasionally going to use a memdeck, it is a logical choice. But, the price you pay, as Daryl correctly guesses, is that it does not contain any built in routines or effects. So I would recommend it for \"memdeck lite\" work. I also agree with Daryl that the two best memdeck stacks are the Aronson and Tamariz. I first learned the Nicola when I was in High School, but found little use for the built in effects. (I don't run across many Whist Players.) About 12 years ago I switched to the Aronson stack because there was a lot of available information on it. I was aware of the Tamariz stack, but Mnemonica was not then available in English. Today, it's a real toss up. Both have advantages and disadvantages. And much exploration has been done on both stacks. I don't think you can go wrong with either of them, but I would say this. If you would like a lot of Poker Deal Routines, then go with the Aronson stack. It also has a killer bridge hand built in. I don't use it often, but when I do happen to encounter a bridge player, it's right there, built into the stack, easy to do, and makes you look like an incredible card mechanic. Simon and Juan have very different techniques for initially memorizing their stacks. Simon is more traditional. He uses the well know mnemonic techniques popularized by Harry Lorayne. Juan has a variety of other kinds of memory techniques including making up song lyrics and singing things over and over. Understand this: you could use mnemonic techniques to memorize the Mnemonica stack, and you can use Tamariz' newer and more unique approaches to learn the Aronson Stack. The main thing is to jump in and start. Pick a stack and start learning it. I think you'll find it less challenging than you think. Daryl, I'm sure I'm not the only one that would enjoy hearing a few more details on your three deck Birthday Book routine. There has been great work done on this by Alex Elmsley (he started it all), Mike Close, and Simon Aronson. But, we'd love to hear more about yours if you can recall more and if you want to share it. Certainly there are many killer routines in Mnemonica. But, I hasten to add that the same thing can be said for all 4 of Simon Aronson's books. Dennis Loomis Itinerant Montebank http://www.loomismagic.com Bill Lhotta Veteran user on top of a 14000' mountain in Colorado 341 Posts Posted: Sep 23, 2007 8:45am         If you like Memdeck effects, Darwin Ortiz has some killer routines in his Scams & Fantasies with Cards book. Cheers! ** Bill ** Daryl Easton V.I.P. 101 Posts Posted: Sep 23, 2007 3:28pm       Dennis: This is one of my pet routines that I have never shared with anyone. I suppose that now is the time and this is the place. Maritess, are you reading this? This may very well be just the effect that you’re looking for to fool everyone at the Magic Castle. It hasn’t been seen by anyone in more than twenty years! My inspiration came from the Alex Elmsley Birthday Book trick. I believe that his method had ten cards repeated whereas I used 42 cards. To determine the number of the card in the stack that was written on the page of the spectator’s birthday, I simply added the number of the day and the number of the month. January 1 would be card number 2 (1 for January and 1 for the first). October 17th would be number 27 (10 for October plus 17 for the 17th). The highest number would be 43 for December 31 (12 for December plus 31 for the 31st). Three decks are introduced and all are shuffled – two by spectators and the third (the stack) is false shuffled by the magician. The magician’s deck is then placed aside in full view of the audience - or you could have a spectator sit on it, etc. Once I knew the spectator’s birthday, I knew the card that was written on their page. Next, I had to arrive at the same card (the target card) in the two shuffled decks. For one deck I used the Elmsley idea of spelling to the card using either one or two of the special words (used in the opening patter) “Fate”, “Zodiac” and “Birthday”. These words spell with 4, 6 and 8 letters and with these, you could arrive at cards anywhere from positions #2 (spell “Zodiac” then spell BACK “Fate”) to #15 (spell “Birthday” and “Zodiac” then take the next card). You could spell from either end of the deck and if necessary, you could have the spectator cut the pack (or separate the spread) before you begin spelling. For the second deck, I would arrive at the target card by either performing the Dai Vernon Trick That Can Not Be Explained, The Moving Pencil by Harry Lorayne, or a variation of a two-deck countdown coincidence effect (I don’t remember what it’s called) by Peter Kane. So far, you have arrived at the same card in two shuffled decks. This is good, but it gets better! Next, you take the third deck from the spectator (the stack) and you arrive at a random (?) card by counting down to his birthday. Let’s say his birthday is August 13th (the same as mine). Deal one card for each month (8 because August is the eight month) then one card for each number until you arrive on the actual birthday (13 because he was born on the 13th of the month). AUTOMATICALLY, you will arrive at the target card! For the final blow off, have the spectator open the birthday book (which has been in full view since before the trick began) to the page of his birthday and read out loud what is written. It will be the same card that was “randomly selected” in all three shuffled decks. As always, you finish clean and everything can be examined. Believe me, this was a killer! Maritess New user 93 Posts Posted: Sep 23, 2007 4:01pm       Daryl! You are awesome. I hope if you're around the Castle during the week I'm there Jan 21-27, you will say hi and see the monster that you have created Holy toledo, that is such a great routine, something I would NEVER do for a regular gig, only something very special like the castle. I'm thrilled! Thanks for the permission =) www.youtube.com/queenofmagic Daryl Easton V.I.P. 101 Posts Posted: Sep 23, 2007 4:06pm       Enjoy! Dennis Loomis Inner circle 1602 Posts Posted: Sep 23, 2007 6:38pm       Thanks so much for sharing this Daryl. I can see how it absolutely would be a killer. I particularly like the idea that you count down to their birthday and arrive at the target card in the stacked deck. Don't recall anyone else having recognized how direct and simple this is. For those that might not be up to the challenge of doing "The Trick that can't be explained," a brainwave or invisible deck could be used. You can't have the spectator shuffle, but it's so clean and direct that it would probably go unnoticed. One might make good use of the Eric Mead idea of cancelling a spectator's shuffle with a slop shuffle. He explains this in Tangled Web. With the deck initially stacked, you would have the spectator shuffle the cards once and you then do the cancellation. Your three deck routine would be particularly stunning if you have a way to get the spectator's birth date without them knowing you know it. Dennis Loomis Itinerant Montebank http://www.loomismagic.com Pete McEwen Special user Raleigh, N.C. 570 Posts Posted: Sep 23, 2007 7:34pm       Daryl, thanks so much for that idea. You're truly brilliant. I hope you make it out to NC again soon. Pete The magician formerly known as SPEEDcuber "no one will believe the things we do if we don't believe them ourselves." - Slydini The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The September 2007 entrée: Daryl » » Memdeck work » » TOPIC IS LOCKED <<< Previous Topic   Next Topic >>>

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