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Lord Anacho Regular user Kessel-Lo, Belgium 157 Posts |
Hi All,
Just received Michael Ammar's Easy To Master Card Miracles, Vol. I DVD in the mail (together with volume 1 and 2 of Giobbi). The material in the DVD is wonderful; very strong effects, indeed. (Well, apart from the last one (Night at the Improv), but that is a language matter. Can't use that effect, as I speak Dutch.) Most of the things are very well explained. There is one huge disappointment that causes some frustration also. On Red Hot Mama, there is only a casual mention of the Dai Vernon DL. It is shown only very briefly and is not repeated in a Super Practice Session. I do know what a DL is, I just don't know exactly what is meant by the Dai Vernon DL. It bothers me a bit that something so basic is not really given enough attention. A DL is a most powerful sleight, but it is not the easiest one to do well. I was caught out on my first attempt by my truelove. (And that was a DL that was automatically prepared by the routine. No need to get breaks or anything, but she spotted it all the same. Means I need a lot more work, of course, but I would have hoped to have had some good hands-on instruction by Michael Ammar.) I also own Royal Road to Card Magic, together with the Paul Wilson 5-DVD set. But I suppose I'll have to buy Giobbi's volume 3 also, as it seems there is more explanation of DL in there. Or, would Daryl's Encyclopedia on sleights bring the answer? Ciao for now
"The secret impresses no one. The trick you use it for is everything" (Alfred Borden in The Prestige)
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The Amazing Noobini Inner circle Oslo, Norway 1658 Posts |
If I remember correctly, the DL technique isn't something Ammar is famous for. This sleight (or world of possible methods) is one of those techniques that are so crucial that I recommend getting a DVD or book on it alone.
In fact, I recommend one DVD specifically, which is Gregory Wilson's Double Take. Besides covering a great variety of DLs, it includes a lot of really great tricks to use them in. Most of it requires a lot of practice, but the greater part of that practice lies in the DL technique itself, something which later can be used for all kids of things. A very worthwhile purchase, I think. Daryl's Encyclopedia has one "flaw", if I could use that negative word. From a fellow beginner's point of view, that is. It has everything clumped together in chapters. So you start out by learning 200 cuts and no shuffles, and then 200 shuffles and no DLs, etc. Daryl is brilliant, but the presentation isn't optimal for a beginner. Furthermore, Daryl isn't famous for his DL neither. Regarding the language, I can relate. American style patter just isn't translatable to Norway. There are cultural differences in terms of behavior, as well as the language itself. As far as the Dai Vernon DL, there are actually more than one, I think. As far as I know, the one usually referred to as his DL is one that I personally don't think is the best possible way to go. But, that is highly individual. Not sure if that one is on the DVD I mentioned actually. I'm not at home now.
"Talk about melodrama... and being born in the wrong part of the world." (Raf Robert)
"You, my friend, have a lot to learn." (S. Youell) "Nonsensical Raving of a lunatic mind..." (Larry) |
Joker63 New user 48 Posts |
Giobbi mentions the 'Push-over double' in Vol 3 (p. 573) and accredits the move to Vernon (and lists others that provided background to the push-over double he describes).
Greg Wilson's Double Take mentions the Vernon DL. A quick look (as I sit here typing this post) suggests they are pretty much the same move. I will have to take advice from more experienced (more learned in the art of magic) people at the Café, but I have found that it is sometimes difficult to pinpoint the 'exact' originator for some moves, and then some moves that are very similar have different names (or attributed to different founders), sometimes there appears very little difference. An example (identified by Bannon himself in Smoke and Mirrors) is the 'Creased Lightning' fold. I remember looking to Giobbi (I have the first four volumes) for an explanation of a move identified in a DVD (Ammar ETMCM Vol 2 I think) and couldn't find it. Somewhat surprised as Giobbi pretty much covers all Card Sleights (all the major stuff anyway). I continued to search through Giobbi and found the move attributed to another great magician (Giobbi accredited Houdini, whereas the original source identified someone later [chronologically]). I tend to think your post arouses (reintroduces) the subject of learning from DVDs and/or books. I often find that DVDs are great for the overall explanation of a routine/trick and explains the required sleights to a greater or lesser degree; obviously not always to the level of detail needed. Books can often provide greater detail of individual sleights. At least this is my experience, especially with Giobbi. I guess if you need greater detail on the DL you mention, buy Vol 3 of Giobbi (this will always be useful anyway), of go for Greg Wilson's DL DVD. I tend to buy DVDs for the material, then refer to Giobbi for the finer details needed to perfect any given move. just my two (Australian) cents worth cheers |
Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
In Daryl's Complete Encyclopedia of card sleights, Volume 5 is a DL identified as Vernon DL. Though to the best of my recall it is the push off dl, but it has been a while since I looked at the video. There are quite a few dl's on that volume.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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Fresh Regular user 134 Posts |
Check out Ron Bauer's "The Mechanical Deck" booklet at his site - it gives an incredibly thorough explanation of the Vernon-Finley Double (I think that's what it's called).
Click the RBTV picture on the right in this link to see a video of it. It's very deceptive. http://www.thinklikeaconjurer.com/all24r......four.htm |
Andy the cardician Inner circle A street named after my dad 3362 Posts |
The DL is pretty difficult to master, I dare to say. Years of practice are required to come to a truly natural looking result. I would additonally recommend to turn to books as well.
Cards never lie
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spycrapper Loyal user Indonesia 295 Posts |
For DL, I think you just need one that you can do very well. Wheter it needs to get a break, strike out DL, or any other method, that's fine. As for myself, after a few years exprerimenting with a few DL method, I stick with one DL method which described in Card College vol 2. Yes it needs a break, and for that I spent the last few months practising the pinky count.
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tupawk New user 87 Posts |
I agree with spycrapper. It sounds like you should be more focused on finding one double lift that "works for you" and practicing it until you can do it extremely well. Just because someone mentions doing a Vernon Double or a Strike Double or whatever in a trick does not mean you have to learn that double and perform the trick with that version of the DL. Some good sources of basic DL's in books are RRTCM, Expert Card Technique, and Card College.
If, on the other hand, you already have a DL you like and would just like to find out more information on what exactly the Vernon DL is then the previous posts should point you in the right direction. |
Lord Anacho Regular user Kessel-Lo, Belgium 157 Posts |
Hi all
This discussion, interesting as it is, might have deviated slightly from topic. What I really meant to convey (perhaps I failed because of my incomplete command of the English language) was the following. A course that titles itself "Easy to Master Card Mysteries" should come through on its promise. I -as a beginner- would not label any effect that requires a DL 'easy' ! This being said, all your comments were very instructive. I love this place. Ciao for now Erik
"The secret impresses no one. The trick you use it for is everything" (Alfred Borden in The Prestige)
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kenodad Regular user 141 Posts |
I learned most of my basic card magic skills and routines from the Easy to Master Series. A DL is a very basic sleight, but requires a lot of practice to do well. I did not perform a DL for a layperson (and certainly not a family member or girlfriend) for months. I do not mean to be critical, but perhaps you should practice a bit more. You say you just received the information in the mail-you should spend several days to weeks perfecting the techniques before performing. The technique is taught on the DVD, but it takes practice to do it well. Do not be discouraged by being "caught," but think about why it happened and how you can avoid it happening again.
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JordanB Special user dallas, tx 626 Posts |
The Vernon DL is explained in the Dai Vernon Book of Magic. If you are interested in sleight of hand magic then I can't recommend a better book. To the best of my knowledge it's also in the Stars of Magic Book (another "must have" book).
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Lord Anacho Regular user Kessel-Lo, Belgium 157 Posts |
Hi Kenodad
To clear up a few things. I did receive Vol. I in the mail, but of course I did not perform any of the routines in ti. I am daft but not that daft. As stated, I know what a double lift is, though I have still to start practicing it. Still working at the ol' injog shuffle at the moment. When I said my truelove found me out, I didn't mean I was performing for her. I was just toying around with some stuff, when she walked in and I just demoed a quick oil and water effect and one other, requiring a DL. But that was a DL that (due to the routining) did not require getting a break or anything. The routine just leaves the necessary two cards in your hand. That she still spotted something is indeed due to my lack of practice. So I agree with you that I need more (a lot more) practice. But I disagree with you if you say that the DL is taught on Ammar's volume I. It is mentioned in passing during Red Hot Mama, there is one alternate camera angle showing it, but you cannot really see what's going on. And practically all the moves of all effects are repeated in Super Practice Sessions except the DL... But I love Ammar, make no mistake. The effects are truely awesome. I also received his double Cups and Balls DVD's and they are nothing short of fantastic IMHO. Ciao for now Erik
"The secret impresses no one. The trick you use it for is everything" (Alfred Borden in The Prestige)
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