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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Magical Accessories » » The Raven, Highly Overrated. (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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ChrisMagic52
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North Vancouver, Canada
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Honestly, when I first bought the Raven, I thought it was going to be really cool. But when I tried it, it stunk! I hate setting it up, and it's so useless in my routines. What a bad trick this was. Smile
Franfran
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Paris!
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I think it's pretty good,

Try the video released for the Raven, it's really giving more dimension to the trick.

Franfran Smile
Franfran's magic, the real French Touch!
MacGyver
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St. Louis, MO
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Well everyone has an opinion....

What did you expect for 20-30 bucks?

This is the CLEANEST way to change one coin for another, or to vanish a coin known to magicians. Its there, then its gone, that simple. The Raven doesn't do 3 Fly or coin matrix, it does a vanish / change, and its the best at that.

Try practicing more, both with your setup and your handling, I use it a lot with no problems and the effect is always amazing!
redstreak
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A.K.A David Kong
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You really have to practice with the Raven to get really good. My first day, it took me 30 seconds to get setup while I turned around and even then a lot of people saw the gimmick. Now it takes me about 4 seconds with my hand behind my back. The Raven video helps a lot, mainly for the "empty hand move".
Rival11
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The Raven Is "ok" - you have to keep in mind that it if you want to do a longer routine (instead of just walking up to somebody, placing a coin on their palm and making it disappear) you need to utilize the break to it's max, It's not that hard but you should practice a lot to make it look as smooth as possible.

FranFran -well said, the Raven video will help anybody out tremendously with their routine.
"Don't ever think you're better than everyone else because if you do, we will prove you wrong"
manipulator
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Houston, Texas
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I agree that the Raven is not a very good trick. I was really disappointed when I first saw it. It might not be that bad, but since most people are saying that the effect is extremely good, I was kind of expecting more. I think this effect is overrated. Smile
RandomEffects
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Boston, MA
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The effect is great!! However, saying that, I must point out that I do not, nor will I ever likely use my own Raven for any show. It takes too long to reset and use, and it has to be done right away after set up, it cannot be used as a closer without revealing the gimmick. SO neat, but not very effective.

Mat
Steve Friedberg
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Mat:
I believe that's known in the industry as "damning with faint praise."
Cheers,
Steve

"A trick does not fool the eyes, but fools the brain." -- John Mulholland
nostromo
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Pensacola, Fla
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If you don't like to use the Raven as a vamishing device, why not take advantage of the fact that it's a powerful m****t that you can do great PK with? Since it's got the perfect attachment points with a strap built in, it shouldn;t be too hard to strap to your knee or even pin it to the inside of a trouser leg. I'm going to be using my Raven for some seance type effects- making a jewlery box lid close, moving a piece of jewelry, etc.

When I got the Raven, the freindly shop owner (are there ANY surly ones?) insisted that the video was a must-purchase at the same time. He was right. The directions are clear and the pictures very helpful, but the video puts it all together.
MacGyver
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The raven isn't very powerful....

It has trouble with a steel shell coin at about 2 inches, I doubt it will work for any PK effects, just buy a M5!
redstreak
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A.K.A David Kong
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Quote:
On 2003-04-14 02:04, MacGyver wrote:
The raven isn't very powerful....


what?!? You don't get much more powerful, you show your hands empty, put a borrowed coin on their hand, and simply wave your hand over it and it vanishes without you ever touching it. All you do is borrow a coin and do a shuttle pass.
dpe666
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As I have said before, The Raven is a very long way to go just to make a coin disappear. If one magician used The Raven, and I used a Retention Vanish, a spectator would say each one made a coin disappear. Two weeks later they would swear we each did the same trick. So, I do not recommend The Raven. Smile
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MacGyver
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Quote:
what?!?!?!?!? You don't get much more powerful, you show your hands empty, put a borrowed coin on their hand, and simply wave your hand over it and it vanishes without you ever touching it. All you do is borrow a coin and do a shuttle pass.


I was refering to the m*g**t, which someone said:
Quote:
If you don't like to use the Raven as a vamishing device, why not take advantage of the fact that it's a powerful m****t that you can do great PK with?



and I don't think it is very powerful for a m*g**t.

I think it is a great effect, though if you are only using it for a coin vanish you need to get the video and an imagination.
HuronLow
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I too feel it is overrated. Once I used sleight of hand to vanish a count which appeared in my pocket. And my friend thought I was using a raven. =) It's a beautiful effect, but there are gaffless methods for similar effects.
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HiraseMagic
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With "appropriate use", RAVEN is very very good! Comparing to Retention Vanish, one advantage is that it can happen in spectator's hand!

Yet, to do it appropriately is not very easy, you need tonnes of practice. Frankly, it is very difficult to show your hand empty, the move is not an easy one to master.

I do not own M5, so I cannot compare it with Raven. Personally, I do like its idea.

best,
Hirase
In love with magic!
magicmanr
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It's all in the finesse...I personally don't use my Raven, however, a close friend has mastered his...He can show his hands empty very deceptively, and he can set it up right in front of you in a split second (with proper trimming & adjustments of the device)
absolute
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I absolutely think that the Raven is overrated. I tried it, not very impressive. Maybe I didn't do it well enough. Not a trick for me though. Smile
TheNightBringer89
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I bought the raven, didn't like cause of the set up time so I bought the M5. I LOOOOOVE IT! One of my greatest magic purchases!!!!
"Dreams are born of imagination, fed upon illusions, and put to death by reality."

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If you're not like the others then you don't belong.
Gidon
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Tacoma, Wa
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What advantages does this have over the pro pk?
Chris Harland
"No WAY...wait...do that again."
Amadeus_Magi
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Jakarta, Indonesia
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Well at the first, Raven seems to be impractical to use, but if you find a way and routine to use Raven properly, it'll be the first weapon in your arsenal in vanishing coin magic effects...believe me.
Magic Beyond Your Imagination
Harvey Nerzof
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HN Review 10: The Raven set + video – Chuck Leach

AD:

The Raven has been called one of the best tricks of the last decade! Perform visual vanishes like you've never seen. Make coins appear, disappear, shrink or change to a different coin or an entirely different object! There are no funny moves or sleights. Simply show your hands front and back, then wave one over the other and a coin appears or vanishes! It is that easy and natural (and amazing)! Many additional effects with bills, matchbooks, playing cards and a variety of coin effects, as well as the valuable 'Empty Hand Move,' are taught on the video. Perform in a coat, even a short sleeved shirt.


REVIEW:
The ad is a bit misleading, since the “short sleeves” technique is quite different from the jacket method – the range of motions is obviously limited, and you can’t do the “empty hands move” (i.e. showing you hands front and back before beginning).

With a dark jacket and shirt, the effect looks great even though the angles feel a bit uncomfortable. I only use it as a secret gimmick to reinforce other effects, such as Mike Powers Cap in Bottle.

As a side note, I can’t remember where I saw such a physically “arguable” lady in a magic video - but the real beauty lies within, as Mr. Leach reminds us all.

Overall rating: acceptable

H.
tdowell
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I bought this when it first came out. Used it once and dumped it. Buy a PK.
cardican66
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I agree with tdowell. A PK would serve better than the raven. I used mine twice, and haven't used it again in a long time. I get more use out of my vernet magnetic TT!
Regards,
LLoyd


Experience teaches only the teachable.
Aldous Huxley (1894 - 1963)
MacGyver
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a PK might be stronger, but how could you say it perform what a raven can do?

The raven is the cleanest coin vanish in magic and does its purpose... it is not meant to be the best thing ever, but when it comes to a gimicked coin vanish, this does the best!!!

It's both amazing to see, and fun to do... I still say this is what of the best tricks out there, considering that for 4 times you money you can get something that you will never use and looks obvious, while with the raven it is ONLY 20-30 dollars and really delivers.
djvirtualreality
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The raven is OK like many say. I read a lot before I bought this trick and a lot of people said it was great! When I got it, it came in a little box........I was looking for more lol. I couldn't believe that was it! Setup is ok for street performances because I just walk up to a person and have it ready.
Life is an illusion, death is reality.
Fast Eddie P.
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Maryland
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I think the vanish is great but did not like having to be set up all the time. Chrismagic52 please pm me in reference to your list I can't seem to get an email or pm through to you.
Showmethatagain
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The video really gives ya some nice ideas I love how visual it looks an I don't think it's to difficult to set up
Fraser Gould
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Recently started using my Raven again after a six year hiatus. I use it as a follow up to Dreamweaver. After the spec examines the safety pins used in the Dreamweaver routine, I put two safety pins back in my pocket then vanish the final one from the back of their hand. The examination of the pins gives just the right time/misdirection for setting up the raven...
Fraser Gould
Turk
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One downside to the Raven (IMHO) is the fact that the vanish into your sh**t really only works well for magicians that are dumping the coin from their left hand into their right hand. That gives a straight line shot for the disappearance into your sh**t. For us non-ambidexrous magicians who are right hand domiminant, dumping the coin from the right hand into the left will not work for the vanish up your sh**t because the mechanism is "bent" and will not cleanly go up into your sh**t. Of course, you can "solve" this problem by having your left hand way to the right of center but then the hand positions become very constrained and unnatural in appearance.

Since I don't wear a coat when performing, the alternative option was not an option for me. So, I traded my Raven for something else.

Additionally, I agree with dpe666. IMHO, a Retention Vanish or other properly performed vanish can be just as strong in the minds of the audience as the use of the Raven. True, you cannot necessarily immediately turn over both hands as you can with the Raven but, there are many reasonable and viable aternative. (i.e., "Wiped Clean", "Back Clip" sleeving, ditch in front shirt pocket, "Downs Palm", etc. to name just a few such possible options).

Mike
Magic is a vanishing Art.

This must not be Kansas anymore, Toto.

Eschew obfuscation.
Bill Hegbli
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Raven is not for amateurs it is for magicians that want to do the best coin vanish ever.

These above comments sounds like the package was opened and after looking at the gimmick. They just closed the box and put it in the drawer. Then thought of all the reasons why not to practice or perform it.

That is perfectly okay. I have looked for a clean coin vanish for many years and Raven fills all the voids.
Graduate of Chavez College of Prestidigitation and Showmanship

"Magic With A Twist Of Comedy"
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