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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workers » » Kolossal Killer (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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alex cahill
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Well guys, what do you think about this trick? For me, I hate it with a passion. It is over-rated and the effect is not that good. I worked it out when I saw it, and if it is shown to someone with a mathematical brain I think it is easily worked out. What do you guys think?
Ozer4
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I agree with you FULLY. The fact that the card has to be named, and THEN the wallet is opened makes the effect look terrible. If you had the card they are merely thinking of in your wallet, you should open up the wallet. Let them plainly see the card, and say what card are you thinking of, and boom there it is. None of this OFF BY ONE stuff, or wallets 4 inches thick.
Geoff Weber
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I don't like it either. However I have seen laypeople say wow to this, even when it was performed poorly, so there must be something to it. It just doesn't appeal to my taste in magic.
alex cahill
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Ozar and jeff you are men of impecable taste. As for the wallet being 4 inches thick well what is a few inches among friends. lol. I believe this trick is just an updated version of having 52 wallets on your person. lol Smile
Logan
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I personally think it's an OK type trick and I've floored several with this as well!

The fact that you are able to 'figure it out' is regardless, because we are magicians... we KNOW when a magi is doing a DL, spectators don't, we know when a magi is doing a pass, spectators don't - it's what WE ARE.

I agree that the fact that the person has to NAME it first lowers the effect, but the effect is BASED on your presentation...

Spectators have no doubt during an Ambitious that you're putting their card at the centre, after about 5 times of that happening, they should somehow 'figure out' that their card STAYS on top, regardless of what YOU say ...but they don't - a lot of them accept what you say, THAT'S presentation.

We can all pull a few miracles off, KK is one for me, it's what I say, I let them handle my wallet, I use the mini Bike cards, so it looks more plausible. Plus I make them CHECK the wallet (I have my ways) Smile and further more, I make it sound incredibly impossible and more importantly - I try my best to CONVEY that to them, so that they themselves think, "No way this can happen..."

That's what sells the effect - I beg you to please at least give it another shot, just because YOU figure it out and YOU know how it's done, doesn't mean that THEY will too... remember, you are a magician, they aren't Smile

I ain't saying you guys are wrong, we all have our opinions... maybe this type of stuff is not your style, but you guys REALLY should give it another shot.

This reminds me of my 'Twilight Angels' mistake, which you can check out here, it isn't long:

Click Here!

All the best and take care,

Logan
Smooth Criminal Magic

You've been hit by, you've been struck by, a smooth criminal.
the_great_stupido
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When I first got this I was very disappointed - I posted a review on another magic site saying as much.

A couple of months later I discovered The Magic Café, where most people were raving about KK. I felt like a fool for disagreeing with these 'experts' (while I'm merely a
'hobbyist'). So I tried it out again - the spectators are really, really amazed by it. That's good enough for me.

My one slight gripe is that the cards I use (Bikes for consistency with all my other magic) are bigger than my credit cards, etc. so the cards often 'poke up' from behind the credit cards. I find that I have to readjust all my credit cards before using KK, although it only takes a second or two.

As for using mini cards - surely this lessens the effect? You could practically fit 52 mini cards in your wallet without the spec knowing, so where's the magic in that?! Smile
johnathanblades
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My favorite trick, Period.
Fred Berthelot
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I must admit I was disappointed when I got this effect. I carried KK with me for awhile without ever performing it. Finally one night, I had no cards on me, so I decided to do KK for a friend -- he was speechless (it was off by one). I've only performed it a few times since, but every time it's a killer.

I got a good wallet for it - it has a clip on the side for bills. This makes the wallet thinner than your average wallet. I only carry four credit/ID cards in it. The clip also adds to the presentation. I take the money out and place it on the table as a bet. The wallet looks really thin that way.

And if they say "How many cards do you have in there..." I open the wallet up, which actually makes it thinner, and say sarcastically "No, I don't have a whole deck in here!" Smile I think this is one that works really well for lay audiences even though the method might seem too logical to magicians. It's also nice to always be able to carry it on you...
Logan
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Quote:

As for using mini cards - surely this lessens the effect? You could practically fit 52 mini cards in your wallet without the spec knowing, so where's the magic in that?! Smile


Not incredibly...I was once told that I could have a whole deck in there...but the guy was quite unsure about his own statement...as I said, I let them handle the wallet, have a look around, and it's when they believe that I can ONLY have one card in there - that's when I carry out the effect.

And no, you can't have a whole mini deck in your wallet, I carry a hip style wallet with me, it's flat and the thickest thing in there would have to be my ID card.

Also, mini cards ARE thinner, it makes the wallet bulge less Smile

All the best,

Logan
Smooth Criminal Magic

You've been hit by, you've been struck by, a smooth criminal.
manipulator
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I think this effect is ok. I was disappointed when I first read the instructions, but then I read a lot of good reviews about it. I still haven't tried it out yet because I haven't tried finding a suitable wallet yet. When I do, I wouldn't use mini cards though. I think this will make the effect a lot worse. Not very impressive.
Logan
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Here's a thought,

if you don't like the fact that they have to name their card...then don't let them name it.

Use a peek device (if you have one on you at the time of performance), i.e. Thought Transmitter, SUC II, etc.

The rest should be common sense Smile

Take care guys,

Logan
Smooth Criminal Magic

You've been hit by, you've been struck by, a smooth criminal.
kull_spider
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I was a bit dissappointed as well. I mean people are ALWAYS goin to say 'let me see that wallet' or 'you have a whole deck' in there. Some smart-alec also say 'if you don't have the whole deck in there, u must have those commonly chosen ones' or something like that. But surprisingly enough, it does get reactions when performed to the right audience. I've read somewhere on the good and garbage section where someone uses a spceial wallet that allows you to show ONE card inside your wallet before performing this effect. I think without this kind of wallet, the trick is useless. But that's just me. Smile
Pete Biro
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If you have ever seen Terry Seabrooke use this you would RUN RIGHT OUT AND BUY IT...

I did! Smile
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
MisterE21
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I've performed this probably 50 times in the last 8 months and have never failed to get a truly astonished reaction. I've performed it for family, friends, strangers, employers and potential employers (I usually close an interview with it, even though I'm interviewing for regular jobs and not magic jobs. Helps keep me differentiated from the other 45,000 applicants out there right now...)

I've had maybe 3 people make a reference to me having a "whole deck" in the wallet. I usually don't even say much, I just open the wallet and get a "riiiiight" sort of look on my face. They usually shoot down their own hypothesis.

I think this effect is bolstered by the fact that I'm nearly always 1 or 2 cards off of theirs before even going to my wallet. Using a conglomeration of techniques in Killer Konception, I usually hit the card with purely mental appearance. I then usually say that I had, truly, misinformed them...while I was trying to read my mind, they had actually read mine...because I have a favorite card..blah blah blah...

Anyway, short point made long...I love the effect and use it frequently. Smile
Your EFFECT is only as good as its AFFECT.
RacerX
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I have to say it's one of my top 5 card tricks. After performing it over 100 times I've come up with my own performance approach.

I can tell you, at this point, I NEVER have ANYONE ask to examine the wallet. And I probably get the "off by one" 2 out of 10 times. After all, it's a stronger reaction and a heck of allot harder to figure out if you nail their card.

I see it like this....you've already figured out the 2 common flaws in the trick, so why not adjust the trick or the presentation? I chose the presentation.

If I'm doing it for a group that is going to try to disect the trick I either "A" don't perform it or "B". Don't stand there and let them talk their way to figure it out (a lesson learned). I immediately go into another trick under disguise of telling them how I did KK. Once their brain is frying trying to "back track" KK and say OTW (or another trick of choice) you'll have them like putty in your hands.

Needless to say....I Love this Trick!

X
Geoff Weber
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the word "bought" really shouldn't be in quotation marks. That implies that the definition of the word is subjective, which it isn't. I think you might want to reconsider purchasing this; you can still find a lot of new ideas in books like Killer Konceptions, even if you already know the basic routine.

Even if you decide not to purchase this and continue performing it anyway, you might not want to publicize such indiscretions. This forum is a strong proponent for creator rights. Using their ideas without compensating them is harmful to the magic economy.
GlenD
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I love this trick. I think the effect is very good. And its just fun to do, for me anyways.
If we really were miracle workers then every method we use could be criticized and dismissed.
Plus it is one of those that can be done impromptu, anytime and anyplace.
Well, those are my thoughts, there are plenty more on other threads where this effect has been discussed at length.

GlenD
"A miracle is something that seems impossible but happens anyway" - Griffin

"Any future where you succeed, is one where you tell the truth." - Griffin (Griffin rocks!)
ixnay66
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I don't have a problem with someone watching an effect and then coming up with a method on their own. Kevin King came up with his bill switch after watching Michael Ammar do the Koslowski handling and came up with something better.
niva
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First of all it's no wonder some of you do not like this effect. This topic is posted in the card tricks section. This is not a card trick, although it uses cards, but rather a mental effect, which is a lot different. This is not an Ambitious card effect... Just go and post this in the mentalism forum and you will see.

These kind of tricks do not require sleight of hand, but rather sleight of mouth. They do not require dexterity with the hands, but rather dexterity of the mind (if that makes sense at all. Smile ) Presentation is everything here. People never trouble on whether you pulled out the card before or after they named it, with the right words and presentation. You can take the approach of Mr Knepper of having an invisible deck and they eliminate cards from it. But again, with the right presentation they will not question your asking for the card. Besides, this is just like the Brainwave deck, but more portable. Everyone likes the latter and no one ever said anything about having to know the card. Logan's approach is also good.

Another important thing to remember with these effects is to never challange the spectators or tell them before hand what is going to happen (as is with most tricks).

I say, give it a shot!!! I fooled a magician with this one, too.

Ivan
Happy Easter to Everyone Smile
Yours,

Ivan
johnathanblades
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I believe some people have not been working in magic long to make such quick judgments amoung such a gem. I think all the top pro's that carry it are hoping to see a negative thread to turn some people off to it. Mabey you boys are fishing to get some "killer" tips.

I have some advance work and tips on the routine, that make it work perfect every time
and that is.......well, nevermind!
tboehnlein
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the simplest trick in the world can be a total mind altering experience & the most expensive illusion in the world could be explained away as done with mirrors. KK can & is for many a dynamite effect
MTaylor2002
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The original effect as presented by Mr. Knepper is good; there are one or two additional ideas in "Killer Konceptions" that, properly applied, make the effect nothing short of brilliant. After several presentations, now no one asks me about the wallet, multiple cards or anything else -- the most common reaction is nothing but stunned silence and awe.

Learning about this effect from the Café was one of the great accidents of my magic life!
Harvey Nerzof
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HN Magic Review 107: Kolossal Killer – Kenton Knepper

AD:

Kolossal Killer has long been one of Kenton's Knepper's favorite creations!

Unfortunately, versions sell for over one hundred dollars. Not any more...What is Kolossal Killer?

Spectators just NAME a playing card, and you have the correct card in your wallet. YOU ARE ALWAYS CORRECT! It is the ultimate card 'out' for Close-up work. A spectator can mess with you all they want - RELAX - you can still produce a playing card from your normal wallet, as absolute proof that you knew their card all along. Kolossal Killer has become a classic piece of mentalism as well - used by such pros as Larry Becker and Jeff McBride. It's a full-blown stage effect, with nothing but the minds of the audience and your everyday billfold.

NO Forces NO Gaffed Wallet NO Sleight of Hand NO 52 Card Index (Not 26 cards either)

. . . Whatever they name, you are right. Simple, direct, awe-inspiring magic and mentalism - the kind you have come to expect from Kenton Knepper.

PLUS With this - Kenton's original version - you can do effects even the expensive gaffed wallet versions simply cannot do. AND you will receive complete routines, right out of Kenton's act. This couldn't be easier or more diabolical. Only a very select few have been privy to Kenton's original version of Killer - until now. THIS IS YOUR CHANCE. Get the complete original work with all the devious touches in this manuscript (just add your own billfold and cards). Forever more you will have a truly groundbreaking reputation maker, not 'up your sleeve', but in your own wallet.


REVIEW:

I don’t know about you, but I am becoming allergic to the Wonder Wizards hypes…

The prepared wallet is not examinable, and this could be a problem for magicians. The impact can be strong, although I suggest you do not use Kolossal Killer as an effect in itself, but as an out for “thought-of cards” routines – in fact, the booklet includes the excellent effect “Truly Invisible”, already published in the accompanying notes of Wonder Words vol. 2.

The manuscript is very thin and should have included the ideas described in the sequel (Killer Konceptions), which takes the basic effect to new heights. But I guess that 2 booklets sell more than 1 book.

OVERALL RATING: good

H.
Brandon Delgado
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By no means am I an expert magician, but I will offer my 2 cents.

I actually like KK. Done properly, it can be a very powerful effect. The most common criticism seems to be spectators reverse-engineering the "out." I think that to avoid this, one might consider presenting this not as a prediction effect, but as a telepathy effect. Why not tell the spectator that you have a card in your wallet and you are going to attempt to project the image of that card into their head. "Now I want you to picture in your mind a playing card, and once you have a very clear picture of it, name it aloud for everyone to hear." Pull the card out of your wallet. If you must use the out, you could say something like: "Well, it appears we were very close. Not to worry. You were exactly right because this card was supposed to be off by one." Show the out. The spectator will be thinking "How did he make me think of that card?" and NOT "How many prediction cards can he fit in that wallet?" with the follow-up reverse engineering of the out. Just a thought on a slightly different presentation of this effect.

Brandon
paisa23
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Personaly I love this effect. I loved it when it was done to me and I love it as I perform it. This is true that this is not a card trick but a mental effect. As far as mathamatical specs, its all in the performance. don't allow them to take the time to do the math , my roomate is a math genius and he was stumped. I also do Heirloom which to me is just as great or maybe even better because it does away with cards in your wallet altogether.Just MHO though.
jbadman
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If you like Kolossal Killer, might I suggest you take a look at Heirloom ? It's thinner to pack than KK, has a great storyline and is entirely logical as an effect performed from a wallet...

Take a look here:

http://www.underground-collective.com/ef......uct_id=1

The price we offer is (we believe) the cheapest anywhere and includes WORLDWIDE postage plus a 'bonus' booklet which is not available from any other vendor!

Cheers,

Jamie.
http://www.underground-collective.com - check out our new DVD now!
JarrodHenry
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Didn't I see Harry Anderson perform Heirloom on Mondo Magic?
paisa23
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Yeah he did. and he did it prett ycasualy and effective , but the story can become very very emotional if its performed that way.
dpe666
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Quote:
On 2005-01-19 15:36, JarrodHenry wrote:
Didn't I see Harry Anderson perform Heirloom on Mondo Magic?




Yes.

Heirloom is a very cool trick, however I do not feel that it is a replacement for KK. Heirloom, in my opinion, is better suited for formal situations. KK is suited best for both formal and informal situations. Smile
Find my e-books and videos at:



http://www.lybrary.com/david-devlin-m-98836.html
Partizan
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Psych! That what what I say too myself every time I do KK.
I think alex cahill fails too see how this trick works. The gimmick is the specs mind and not your KK deck!
"You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus."
- Mark Twain
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