|
|
Go to page 1~2~3 [Next] | ||||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
I had this idea a while ago but given I did not have a cup set at the time it left my mind. Now that I have a set I could do it. For my final loads I was thinking of making three fire balls appear with the middle fourth load being a smoke bomb. I know don't play with fire unless I really know what I am doing and have professional supervision but that is why I am posting this. Besides I am not trying something fancy, besides how cool it would be especially when the final one lifts revealing a big cloud of smoke drawing my next crowed (I will be street performing). I just need to make sure my table top doesn't have a flamable pad on it. The smoke bombs are cheap and I can use old cotton washcloths to make the fire balls soaking them in lighter fluid or buy flame juggling balls if need be. My pockets would need a liner of a sort to protect them from the balls and smoke bomb. I guess just do some measuring and sew a pocket to safety pin in the pocket. The problem is igniting them and keeping the cups from egstinguishing them before the productions. I so I have two questions on the lighting do I use Haslett Fire Starter or Jim Peace Igniter. I know nothing of the Haslett Fire Starter except by the description and it sounds cool. I just don't know if it would be accesable still enabling full motion of the hands. I know Jim Peace Igniter would work in the demo video he shows what it is and a bit of its working. Plus it is cheaper but if anyone really thinks the Haslett Fire Starter is better let me know. Secondly how do I keep the cups from extinguishing them. I could drill holes in them but that just seems wrong in many ways even if it worked. Holes in the table is out for obvious reasons. Perhaps if I could have them elavated somehow with air pockets underneath but that would mean the smoke leaking. Okay perhaps the smoke bomb is out of the quesion, fire ball could still work though.
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
Darkwing Inner circle Nashville Tn 1850 Posts |
||||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
Seen it a couple other times cant remember why though. Anyway that is a totally different situation. Besides I have read all about fire breathing, eating, walking, and resisting of various sorts including formulas. Most of which outdated but none the less. I don't plan on doing any of it though except fire walking, breathing, and eating once under proffesional help just to try it. What I would do though wont be near me worst case a scorch my hands and table a bit. I would be doing this with a bucket of water, fire extinquisher, and first aid kit for burns by me making sure the crowed was back a little before I revealed them. Although I did just have a quick thought on one possible problem. Being under the cups without air for a short moment could mean when they are reavealed that sudden exposure to the air could cause the flames to burst larger for a split second. If I did this at all it would be once I worked with traditional loads for a while and made the money to get the stuff. Not even sure that I would do this but just a cool idea. Like I said if I did it would be really wicked especially since the cups and balls are wild to begin with even with regular final loads.
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
Darkwing Inner circle Nashville Tn 1850 Posts |
The average temperature of a flame (depending on the fuel) is 1650 - 3452 degrees F. Human skin begins to burn at 130 degrees F and ignites at 480 degrees F.
What a cool idea. |
|||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
Have you ever played with fire as a bored child at a resturant? You can hold your finger above a candle flame for three to four seconds without being burned and I don't even plan to hold the fire balls. Just hold them soaked in fluid set them and then light immedietly covering them with the cup. Speaking of which though a magician sent me a video link to fire balls which was the start of this idea by the way. Anyway you can make them from old cotton washcloths as I have mentioned then once lit can be picked up held and rolled around between your hands without any fancy formulas or anything as long as they are not dormant in your hand for more then a few quick seconds. Also keeping hands underneath since heat goes up and the top of the flame is hottest bottom only warm. Same principle used for fire eating with torches or hot coals. The mouth is tilted upwards so the top of flame doesn't contact your nose or anything. I just want to have ideas though if no one has any I can't do it. If I can get some I will and no one will really convince me. Everyday is a risk paper cuts, poisonous spiders in your room (the average person eats 6 spiders a year in their sleep), ever watch 1000 ways to die, blue collar work to many to count, infection from little cuts leading to gang green, snoring getting so bad you suffocate in your sleep, I could go on and besides I wouldn't be using explosives or a lot of flamable liquid that could get all over me. Worst case scenerio my hands catch and possibly sleeves but I would notice pretty quick and douce myself in the bucket of water before the flames reached my highly flamable undershirt or started giving me third degree.
Posted: May 6, 2010 11:31pm This discussion is getting to intense. I don't want to argue about how safe or dangerous it is anymore. Besides sooner or later I will just sound stupid like in some of my other posts. I am already wondering if I should have posted this one. Posted: May 6, 2010 11:39pm What about a single fourth final load as a smoke bomb replacing the fireballs with three safe loads. A smoke bomb only uses fire while the wick is burning down and come to think of it really doen't need air because it isn't fire.
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
gaffed Inner circle So far I've managed to gimmick 1817 Posts |
Well, messing about with smoke bombs and fire, and the ensuing dangers to you and the public (you did say street performing did you not?)should really go over great with city ordinances! If you find a way to pull it off, maybe someone will be kind enough to give you a tip before you are arrested! It may not cover the ensuing ticket or court appearance, but it may help in some small way.
"Half this game is ninety percent mental."
~Yogi Berra~ "To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible." ~St. Thomas Aquinas~ Twitter – "A means of proving how pathetic and lonely you are in 140 characters or less." ~Anonymous~ |
|||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
There are fire jugglers and eaters on the street I have seen videos. Even watched them myself at the Wizard Of Oz Festival. No problem their and that is far more dangerous. Besides I would half to check with whoever first anyway.
I did some rethingking and I could make a small hole at the top of the cups rather than the sides. That way the fire balls can get air and the loads cannot be seen before they are supposed to be. The smoke bombs would smoke from them a bit but it would be the fourth and final load being the smoke bomb anyway. So I would be reavealing it almost right afer the load anyway. Speaking of smoke bombs though I thought of a solution and problem. As for lighting the wicks, the ignitor would really not be good without looking and concentrating since it is such a specific point to hit. I would not only half to look but have it positioned just right. So I youtubed how to make a pull ignitor I can have the ring safety pinned to the hem on the bottom of my pocket it is in. So as I pull it out making sure wick isn't contacting my skin as I pull it will ignite. I would half to have fire resistand formula on my hand though or cotton gloves. It could catch my coat but if pulled fast shouldn't like the match pull gimmick you can make with the striker a safety pin and a match with some tape or small rubber band. Now they sell factory made ones for rediculous prices. http://www.tonyclarkmagic.com/storefront......start=12 Anyway the problem is two things one the crowed doesn't want smoke in their faces. Secondly they smell though I might be able to find one not so stinky. Yet then again if it isn't in their faces they probably wont smell it. No matter what the situation though come near July when they are being sold in stores I should grab some and experiment with them to see their radious of smoking. Plus to find one that doesn't cover much area and possibly on that doesn't stink badly. Might actually be a bad idea unless on stage or other environment at a distance. The fire balls could very well work though. While I was thinking of that though it occured to me that I could use incense of a sort to draw a crowd. They would stop or at least slow down to smell it and then hear and or see me drawing the crowed. Anyone have any new thoughts?
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
thegreatnippulini Inner circle of Hell because I've made 2582 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-05-06 18:27, Darkwing wrote: You know, sometimes you'll see a guy driving towards a train, track arms down, lights blinking, bell ringing and he'll just keep going. This is the type of driver that shouldn't be behind the wheel.
The Great Nippulini: body piercer, Guinness World Record holder, blacksmith and man with The World's Strongest Nipples! Does the WORLD care? We shall see...
http://www.greatnippulini.com |
|||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
I did some experimeanting got some cheap smoke bombs and drilled the holes on the top of my cheap aluminum cups. I discovered a couple things for one the smoke bombs worked under cups only after the holes were drilled. Whick burning before hand the holes they only smoked under them and I had to let the whick burn down out of them. The fire balls don't work even with holes under the cups they just went out. I could try fluid that doesn't need so much air I guess. Also regarding the smoke bombs though they stain the inside of the cups I had to scrub the test cup to get the residue out. Maybe some home made ones from ping pong balls wont stain I will see. Before I mentioned the smoke being in peopoles faces and or stinking. I couldn't really smell them unless my face was in the smoke. Secondly I got the small dino eggs ones and they don't cover more than thirty feet. A bit far so if it does go into the audiences face I can quickly cover the bomb with a cup to reduce the smoking as I discovered. If it just doesn't work I think it could make a great stage act at least. Eisier to get permision and I won't have any in anyones faces. Just a side not unrelated to smoke and fire I discovered other uses for the holes in the cups. Posted here. http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......um=115&0
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
thegreatnippulini Inner circle of Hell because I've made 2582 Posts |
The Great Nippulini: body piercer, Guinness World Record holder, blacksmith and man with The World's Strongest Nipples! Does the WORLD care? We shall see...
http://www.greatnippulini.com |
|||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-05-28 16:56, thegreatnippulini wrote: Even though I disagree nice, you are very funny.
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
Norm Regular user 124 Posts |
J.G.
Although I agree with these guys that what you are proposing is unsafe, I respect your willingness to try something "new" and to go for it! I'm not here to judge you man! There is a "trick" that my friend showed me a while ago where he filled his closed fist with the gas from a butane lighter. Somehow, after a few seconds, when he opened it, a small ball of fire came out. I don't recall if there was an open flame or not. what about something like that with the cups? Aren't there other forms of "safe" smoke as well? Doesn't Sylvester the Jester sell something that makes smoke? Keep up the good work of experimenting, who knows you might discover something different but good. Just be smart and safe about it. |
|||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-05-28 18:02, Norm wrote: Ya I have tried that but don't like to it gets scarry hot on your hand. A good alternative that is more safe with more bang is to do the same thing in a empty pop or beer can. Not only is their more held and thus a greater flash but it has a kick and nearly flies from your hand if you don't hold it well enough. In this though and the fact that I uped it modifiying the lighter. If you take a adjustable cigarrete lighter and dismantle the top sections exposing the adjustable weel you can turn it untill it nearly comes off. Then reasemble and a lot of butan comes out at once causing a foot long or so flame. Great gag for a cigarette routine or just us it to freak you freinds. Anyway I did the same butan thing with my mini trash can in my room after I removed the bag and then used the sparker like an moron when I was bored and it wooshed huge. So cool though it almost scorched the hair on my hand. Needless to say I only did it once. This is open at the top like a cup so it could work with a cup. My thought would be to have a tube up my sleeve that could deliver the butan. Then as I lift the cup a ignitor of a sort well you get the idea. I will look up Sylvester the Jester's smoke gimmick though. Thanks
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
hou_dini Regular user 103 Posts |
J.G. What you are proposing is way too dangerous--to yourself and to a crowd of onlookers. Ping pong balls, when ignited, give off a highly toxic gas which, in addition to being poisonous, is, in itself, highly flammable. Playing with butane/propane is playing with a potential bomb, flames reaching out to a crowd for example.
Fluid does not dictate whether something will burn or smolder. You need four things to produce fire: heat, fuel, oxygen, and a chemical reaction. Remove one of these four things from the equation, and fire is extinguished. Best to check with the local fire marshal before playing with fire in public. There are numerous and strict laws as well as big fines for doing this without consent. Fire may be fun, but the liability isn't worth it. But, what would I know, I'm just a professional firefighter/hazmat technician. Take care--John K |
|||||||||
Darkwing Inner circle Nashville Tn 1850 Posts |
John,
I am glad someone else has chimed in. I think it is very foolish and not to mention dangerous to encourage these types of effects. As I memtioned in my earier post, this is a train wreck waiting to happen. It is not cool to hurt folks you are trying to entertain. |
|||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
Okay ping pong balls and butan is out then. Besides the butan was just a conversation for the most part anyway. I wasn't too serious about that one even though it was interesting. Though I can't imagine it reaching the audience. I am disregarding that anyway though. Once I get some more supplies and do some more experimenting I will let you guys know what I change and discover. I might disregard everything more now than before. We got in a little discusion about it hear. http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......art=0#12
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
thegreatnippulini Inner circle of Hell because I've made 2582 Posts |
Quick question, JG... do you have health insurance? Two reasons: 1. When you go to the ER with 3rd degree burns on a major percentage of your body, having insurance makes a world of difference. 2. If you do have insurance, they may drop coverage due to the injury you cause yourself through negligence. Insurance companies have good lawyers, they may even cite and/or subponea these threads where you are ignoring expert advise.
The Great Nippulini: body piercer, Guinness World Record holder, blacksmith and man with The World's Strongest Nipples! Does the WORLD care? We shall see...
http://www.greatnippulini.com |
|||||||||
Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
J.G.
Would you please do us all a favor? Please consider dividing your posts into paragraphs. It makes them much easier to read. I'm going to make a couple of suggestions here. You can take them or not. It really makes no difference to me. Before you decide what is or is not dangerous, ask yourself if sparklers are dangerous. Most people would say no. There are many who have learned the hard way that ANY source of heat can be very dangerous in the right circumstances. Maybe you are too young to remember as far back as 2003, to Warwick, Rhode Island, and a night club called "The Station." The group was called "Great White." You can read about it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Station_nightclub_fire I know that there are a lot of people who use fire, even juggle and eat it. You would be surprised at how many of them have injured themselves with it. Fire eaters with liver disease are not uncommon. Fire manipulators with severe body scars are also not uncommon. Granted, it's none of my business what you do to yourself. However, if your playing with fire and/or smoke causes injury to just ONE audience member, you will have that on your conscience for the rest of your life. Consider this: smoke can only be produced three ways. 1) Condensation 2) Heat 3) Chemical reaction Smoke bombs almost always use heat to ignite some chemical or another. What are you going to do if some child inhales the smoke from your smoke bomb and ends up in the hospital? You may find that everything you OWN will end up belonging to that kid's family. Really. DON'T DO IT. If you must fool around with fire, take a course in pyrotechnics and get your pyrotechnician's license. Then you will know just how dangerous this stuff can be.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
|||||||||
dmueller Loyal user Central Illinois 227 Posts |
Wow this is kind of ironic. I haven't really been able to practice with my cups for a week now, because of a nasty burn I got from a hot oven rack and failed depth perception. And now this guy is wanting to burn himself with his cups.
Do you have any idea how hot a relatively thin aluminum cup will get with fire burning inside it? What kind of surface are you going to be working on? You have mentioned in the past that you want to work the streets in Chicago, also known as the Windy City. They call it that for a reason. What if the wind grabs one of your fireballs and rolls it into the audience. Can you say panic? You mention seeing videos of fire performers. Good, glad to hear it. BUT I lived and worked in the Chicago are for years and I have seen all sorts of street performers, but I can honestly say I don't remember any fire performers. Any fire performer worth the title will also only work behind some type of rope or barricade to separate themselves from the audience, from what I have seen. I could be wrong. Yet another thread where I have to just kind of shake my head. Oh to be young and innocent again. |
|||||||||
J.G. the magnificent Special user Griffith Indiana 886 Posts |
Good thoughts perhaps it should stay on stage if done at all. Plus even if I were to do it on the street and things went safely. People might be frightened over it and not tip me because of that. Though I don't have medical insurance I am under my parents though I don't think they would enjoy covering me for something so fullish now that I think about it. Even if I am successful at it I should give it time until I do stage acts and have my own coverage. Though I doubt I would inhale smoke. If I get a whiff I simply step back.
The burns I see a possibility now though. When a wick burns it is like a torch. Even with a formula on my hands their is still a danger. The fire balls might be my safest bet. Yet at the same time the fuel could stick to my hand and continually go in. One of my first arguments regarding burns was I have nerves and could water myself and pull away before it was too late. After all fire wont chase me it sits where the fuel is. Though somtimes it takes a second for your body to react and by the time you notice it really burns. I have noticed from picking up hot plates of food and experimenting holding my hand above a candle. If I do just do fire balls though like Donnie Buckley mentioned in my other post it is hard to top fire balls. If I do this perhaps only every great once in a while given the danger. I am slowly beginning to doubt this whole bit though. Experimentation will finalize my opinion. Quote:
On 2010-05-31 18:17, dmueller wrote: As stated above before noticing a new reply I realized the failed depth perception problem. I would use a wood table top with a sort of protectant on it. A bit flamable I know but my dad is in construction and he gets free wood all the time and though I could get a plastic tray or something from a store it melts plus metal is expensive. Anyway as also stated above I decided not to do it on the street and your warning about balls blowing away is all the more reason. Though I cannot see them going that far and certainly not with the wind but merely falling off perhaps flying a foot or two. Posted: May 31, 2010 7:07pm Just realized I could also put small holes in it for more air helping the fire balls. Plus thinking of the strike anywhere matches in them for starting them instead of buying a expensive gimmick I realized striking them on the table is a unnatural motion of the traditional loading. Plus I cant do it from the palming position and would need them at the tips of my fingers being exposed. Goes agains every motion so I would need to think about a good way to strike them. Perhaps sitting in a chair and doing it on the chair as I patter. Anyway an advantage of doing this on stage would be that the audience would be at such a distance that misdirecting them from that would be much eisier than close up on the street. Quote:
On 2010-05-31 19:07, J.G. the magnificent wrote: Quote:
On 2010-05-31 14:09, Bill Palmer wrote: Ya I never liked pyrotechnics they scare me even with professionals. I went to a concert and when the band came out fire works shot just feet from the ceiling and speakers of the stadium.
Jeremy Gates
|
|||||||||
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Up in smoke! » » Firey final loads (0 Likes) | ||||||||||
Go to page 1~2~3 [Next] |
[ Top of Page ] |
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.11 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < |