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Review King Eternal Order 14446 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-08-31 21:15, Vick wrote: Then you have had a charmed life. I'd say a magic shop struggling in a tough economy doesn't quite compare with children diagnosed with cancer.
"Of all words of tongue and pen,
the saddest are, "It might have been" ..........John Greenleaf Whittier |
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Ken Northridge Inner circle Atlantic City, NJ 2392 Posts |
An excerpt from Denny’s Newsletter:
“I have NEVER discounted magic in the past…” Might I be so bold as to suggest that this is a major problem? I understand Denny’s strategy, but, I’m sorry, the majority of people like a good sale, the feeling of thinking we’ve saved money, the feeling that we’re a little smarter with our money than others. It must be a good 20 years now, but I remember Sears department store came out with a new strategy. They were no longer going to have sales, just everyday value pricing. That strategy failed and they very quickly went back to having sales. I like Denny and other honest businesses, but I also like getting more ‘bang for my buck’. The two can certainly coexist successfully. Just being honest.
"Love is the real magic." -Doug Henning
www.KenNorthridge.com |
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Mentalist Sam Regular user 173 Posts |
Ken,
You bring up some interesting points. What the real problem seems to be that Denny is more expensive than other places. It's not a question of discounting, it's a question of competitive pricing, and that's a big difference. Every dealer is buying magic for the same wholesale cost. There is an MSRP attached to that. But MSRP is just that, a SUGGESTED retail price. Denny sells at MSRP. Most other dealers don't. But that doesn't mean they are discounting. In my mind a discount is when you list a product at one price and then provide a discount/sale. These other dealers who are selling the same items for less money aren't discounting. It's their regular pricing. Sales are fine for impulse buys and holiday promotions, but it's not the way to sustain business the rest of the time. At least competitive pricing puts you in the game. Some dealers are holding on to a business model that is out dated. There has been a shift in the perception of not only how to buy magic, but how much it costs. That's not going away. |
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cairo Elite user 406 Posts |
People who want the best quality for the lowest price shop at Costco, but Costco doesn't offer expert advice.
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RS1963 Inner circle 2734 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-09 11:20, cairo wrote: That doesn't fit with magic however. Or it shouldn't. A real magic shop (as in not a tourist trap such as Magic Masters or Houdini's.) Can and should offer expert advice. Not every shop is going to have a Denny Hanney as the owner but there isn't any reason why they wouldn't have someone there at all times with a wide base of knowledge. It's not the knowledge here that is at issue it's the business end of it. Denny is trying to change some of his thinking on not having competitive pricing, and discounts etc.. Hopefully it will work |
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Mentalist Sam Regular user 173 Posts |
When you are shopping on the internet, no one is giving you advice, even on Denny's site.
I've never placed an order with Denny where he then made suggestions or asked questions about it. Expert advice is easier to get these days. Before making a purchase, I'm sure most people wait until they read reviews online. There are a lot of magic forums around, so getting expert advice is just as easy as ordering magic at less than MSRP. |
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tabman Inner circle USA 5946 Posts |
Shoot, I emailed Denny and asked about a set of books and he emailed me back within a couple of hours. I think, all you have to do is ask. Not just Denny, but any responsible dealer including Houdini's will answer any reasonable question respectfully.
Now, I'm hoping the books I ordered from Denny get here before I leave for the Clanton Alabama southern magicians gathering at Bob Sanders Magic Valley Ranch so I have something to read at the hotel. http://MagicValleyMagic.com
...Your professional woodworking and "tender" loving care in the products you make, make the wait worthwhile. Thanks for all you do...
http://Sefalaljia.com |
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Kent Wong Inner circle Edmonton, Alberta, Canada 2458 Posts |
I realize that brick & mortar stores have higher overhead costs and so, I don't mind paying a little more to show my support. In many cases, the brick & mortar stores not only offer sage advice but also form the focal point for the local magic community. It's a great place to visit and become inspired by the people who walk through the door.
Although I've never met Denny, I have had countless conversations with him on the phone and consider him a trusted friend. When I was developing my Sword Basket routine, I kept hearing about Denny's fantastic performance of that effect. I called him up to purchase his DVD and, while in the process, I ran my routine by him. He took the time to provide me with some great suggestions, and he recounted his own experiences with the effect. To this day, I still remember his exact words: "You know, if I wasn't retired, I'd steal that routine!" Of course, it was said in jest, but from that point onward, I knew my Sword Basket routine had the potential of becoming a real winner. Kent
"Believing is Seeing"
<BR>______________________ <BR> <BR>www.kentwongmagic.com |
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Mentalist Sam Regular user 173 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-09 14:47, Kent Wong wrote: Kent, I agree with that 100%. That was certainly my experience when I first started in magic almost 35 years ago. Had it not been for a local store that hosted a local magic club, my hobby would have been a passing phase. I still have lifelong friends from that time! There are probably many on this thread who have the same experience. But (I hate to add the "but"), that was then and we're in a new situation now. So the question becomes, if Denny is so valuable and worth supporting, why is he still having a difficult time keeping the businesses open? |
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Vick Inner circle It's taken me 10+ years to make 1120 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-01 07:43, sleightly wrote: Your post is spot on sleightly, thanks for sharing Please allow me to share why it is so sad to me, After our families what is next in importance? What makes us who we are, helps define us, is a part of our identity, keeps our minds sharp, our reflexes quick, our eyes bright and keeps us learning and striving (for perfection) and keeps us going? Our careers! Our passions! Denny and his shop have been a huge part of the learning, the growth and success I have enjoyed as a performer. I wouldn't be the performer I am today if not for Denny and his shop. If his shop is to close not only do we lose a huge part of what has enabled us to have that much enjoyment and learning, an amazing resource but what has enabled us to share that with many others, what helped us to put a smile on their lips and wonder in their eyes. We also lose a great place, a very special place in our field. We lose what helps us grow and build our vocation, our craft, our art, a huge part of our lives What has helped me develop to where I am now in my calling, the career and calling that helps identify who and what I am, could be lost forever and that will be lost for generations to come and that I find very sad.
Unique, Thought Provoking & Amazing Magical Entertainment Experiences
Illusions By Vick Blog of a real world working magician Magic would be great, if not for magicians |
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Vick Inner circle It's taken me 10+ years to make 1120 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-09 10:03, Review King wrote: Here is what that "magic shop" has help allowed me to do http://bit.ly/cYwpld Please allow me to introduce you to my friend, Cormac Murray http://www.macsteam.org Mac's Story is one of outstanding courage. Cormac Murray is one of the most amazing, most courageous about to be 6 years old young man you can ever imagine. Warning, this video brought tears to my eyes http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IpImIIurrc You see Mac has MLD, Metachromatic leukodystrophy. Every day Mac lives like a Champion Because I have a very small talent that I got in part from a special "magic shop" I can help support Mac and help raise awareness for MLD and that's what I've been doing promoting this Bull Roast and that is what I'll do when I take the stage tyhere for 45 minutes on October 3 Please if you live in Maryland or close by feel free to come have a great time, join us and support Mac and help raise awareness of MLD Tickets are available here http://www.macsteam.org/BullRoast.aspx Yeah, that is what a "magic shop" and a little bit of heart can do Sorry I'll return the thread back to the subject at hand
Unique, Thought Provoking & Amazing Magical Entertainment Experiences
Illusions By Vick Blog of a real world working magician Magic would be great, if not for magicians |
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tabman Inner circle USA 5946 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-09 13:25, tabman wrote: Funny thing. The set of books rolled in here today. Very fast UPS shipping when he could have used media mail. They're in the truck ready to go to Clanton tomorrow. Thanks Denny.
...Your professional woodworking and "tender" loving care in the products you make, make the wait worthwhile. Thanks for all you do...
http://Sefalaljia.com |
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Dennis Michael Inner circle Southern, NJ 5821 Posts |
I support Denny when I can. The best shopping can be done at our local magic clubs. We have usually five dealers and if there is something you want ask, and they will bring it.
None of them have a "Brick and Mortar" store front because of the overhead. My browser is Firefox and I have two Add-in (plugins) which list the cheapest prices for any item I am looking to purchase. It's a cool plug in. When I wanted a camera, it presented me with other places to purchase it for less. The sad fact is, it is the wave of the future. The kids today buy online, the "store shoppers" will be history with in 10 years. This is a sad truth of the internet low-ball pricing, no-overhead. If Denny wants to survive, then Denny must see the truth in what's coming via online stores, online TV Channels, online communications, etc. The music industry is collapsing because of the internet. And so will the basic channels on TV. The future is online business, and will be online TV
Dennis Michael
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mhsam New user 51 Posts |
I read this topic whle I happened to be in Vegas this past week, so I broke away from the shows and slots to pay Denny's shop a visit. Needless to say, I dropped a bit of $ !!! I just love it there.
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Domino Magic Special user 999 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-11 21:34, Dennis Michael wrote: Dennis, It's not the wave of the future. It's not what's coming. It's already here and has been for years. The music industry didn't collapse. The OLD music industry collapsed. There is still a music industry, it's just different than what we were used to. The music industry is still making money from iTunes and other legitimate online music distributors. Magic retail is bigger than ever. It hasn't collapsed. Now we have the ability to buy smarter. As was mentioned by someone in an earlier post, we have access to more experts than ever before via online forums. The old brick & mortar model is just about gone. It's a choice that consumers have made. If all the local guys really felt bad about the potential of their local shop closing, then they would have shopped there. They've made their decisions about where to spend their money. It's not all bad though. More competition, better pricing, bigger selection. Also we do have more access to information than we had previously. You don't just get one guy's opinion anymore. You no longer have to wait a month or two and in some cases longer to get a review of something you're considering purchasing. Printed magic magazines are obsolete when it comes to giving you up-to-date information. Dennis, you mentioned a camera purchase. Why look online? I'm sure you have a locally owned camera store in your town. Why aren't you supporting them? Why aren't you relying on the expertise of the owner of the store? Again, it's not coming. It's all here now and we're all taking advantage of it. |
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Vick Inner circle It's taken me 10+ years to make 1120 Posts |
Are we really buying the smartest?
Are you taking acting lessons on line? What do your on line dealers know about your act and how to suggest the best books that lead to the knowledge you need to have, what you need to know to develop YOUR best possible show. PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHEN YOUR ON LINE DEALER HAS LECTURERS LIKE JOANIE SPINA, Banachek, Jeff McBride, John Carney, Darwin Ortiz, Michael Ammar & Christian Painter, (If don't know about Christian Painter. He's an outstanding performer, totally amazing and doing very exciting work. Your on line dealer might not be able to tell you about him. If they can't you are missing one of the most exciting and significant workers today. That could hold back YOUR Work and YOUR ACT ) Do you think actually attending LIVE lectures with these amazing artists & performers will help you? Can it make you better? Where you can actually speak with the in person, ask them YOUR questions? It just could happen that if you don't support the Brick & Mortar shops.... you won't get those lectures in person (and all the above mentioned performers and artists, I've seen in person at Denny's. Had the opportunity to speak with and in the case of Joanie Spina I have the amazing privilege to work live on stage with Joanie on my show performance, presentation and so much more. That time with Joanie helped me so much and made me a better performer. Jeff McBride called me after his lecture at Denny's and spent time working on one of my routines also) PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHEN OR HOW YOUR ON LINE CHEAPEST PRICE NOT REALLY KNOWING YOU, YOUR SKILL LEVEL OR YOUR NEEDS CAN DO THAT FOR YOU ;-))
Unique, Thought Provoking & Amazing Magical Entertainment Experiences
Illusions By Vick Blog of a real world working magician Magic would be great, if not for magicians |
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Vick Inner circle It's taken me 10+ years to make 1120 Posts |
So called "expects" on line hmmmm...
Can I see their body of work, know whom they were taught by, what books and acts have influenced their work, can I see the past 25 years they worked all over the world Well some you might be able to, some ..... not so much The new music industry ... you mean the one where artists sell just singles for .99, where perhaps their "album" doesn't have depth? From my perspective much of the music being made now is lacking, where is the musicianship, the depth of skill, the playing ability? Don't know about your market but the market I'm in, DC/Baltiumore .... talk radio has flourished over the past few years ... could that be because the music industry is lacking quality product? I don't know the actual number of sales but .... Bottom line, if all you are going to do is buy on price through the internet, your magic will never be as good as it could be.
Unique, Thought Provoking & Amazing Magical Entertainment Experiences
Illusions By Vick Blog of a real world working magician Magic would be great, if not for magicians |
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leondo Special user Las Vegas 759 Posts |
I attend the "Caustic Basturds" meetin every Sat @ 11 oclock. I can't even believe that I'm considered a "member" of the group that sits at that table. VERY notable, and famous magi exchange ideas, concepts, etc. It's impossible to do this on line.
We have at the table, guy's/gals trained, and/or worked by/with the BEST Magi that ever lived! Amazingly succesfull illusion designers and thinkers, close up icon's, etc. Do they stay as "elite" people....NO! An unknown "student" will walk in and join the group for pizza, soda, etc, and have his/her questions answered by the best in the buisness This personal attention dosen't happen, face to face anywhere, but in, what seems to be, the passing of the Brick and Morter store's! Long live this type of environment. Thank you Denny! Ted L |
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the Sponge Inner circle Atlanta 2771 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-12 16:52, Vick wrote: Sorry, this argument won't fly. The last 4 lectures I saw were not put on by the local Brick and Mortar (and there is one). You know there are magic clubs, right? Isn't that supposed to be the purpose of a magic club? s |
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RS1963 Inner circle 2734 Posts |
[quote]On 2010-09-12 18:27, the Sponge wrote:
Sorry, this argument won't fly. The last 4 lectures I saw were not put on by the local Brick and Mortar (and there is one). You know there are magic clubs, right? Isn't that supposed to be the purpose of a magic club? [quote] That is where you are wrong. Magic clubs are not the only ones that have put on magic lectures. A good many times if the shop has had the room that is where the local magic club meets. Magic Inc has held lectures, Misdirections Magic Shop in San Francisco has help lectures, So it isn't only up to magic clubs to provide lectures to local magicians. |
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