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Sam Sandler Inner circle 2487 Posts |
Payne,
unfortionatly that article has way to many false teachings and false info and way off base on so many accounts not going to get into it. Merry christmas and happy Chanukah everyone sam
sam sandler- America's only full-time DEAF Illusionist
http://www.samsandler.com http://www.deafinitelymagic.com |
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TonyB2009 Inner circle 5006 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 01:33, Payne wrote: I know it was a typo, but when you consider the wealth of the Vatican and the other churches (your televangilists in the US) it makes you wonder! It is no surprise that those religions that have seized the most temporal power are the ones that thrived. The rights of the poor were upheld in Christ's original teachings, but seem to have been conveniently dropped by most off the organisations that claim to carry on the message. No surprise, really, as religion is a human construct, and humans are motivated by power and wealth far more than they are motivated by love and fellowship. Happy Holidays everyone.
Check out Tony's new thriller Dead or Alive http://www.amazon.co.uk/Alive-Varrick-Bo......n+carson
http://www.PartyMagic.ie |
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Magic Patrick Inner circle Minnesota 1591 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 08:04, Sam Sandler wrote: I love how when our beliefs are challenged that it is false teaching. The falsehood is only in the eye of the beholder and nothing will change that until you challenge yourself to really look with an open heart. This discussion is like a coin it will always have two different sides and it will never change. To tell you the truth, the Rev said it perfectly. No one is going to convert anyone here and it is only going to make us dislike each other. So I apologize for my part in hijacking this post and will cease to do so. Happy Holidays to you all and I hope that it is a very profitable and or prophetable one. Patrick |
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Sam Sandler Inner circle 2487 Posts |
Magic patrick what you say is true to a point however I did provide Facts previously and whether some one choses to believe them or not is on them.
this is why I did not choose to get into it any more. I agree we are not going to convince any one through this chat but I don't think it has come to hating any one at least I hope not! I too agree I hope all your shows are merry and plentiful. sam
sam sandler- America's only full-time DEAF Illusionist
http://www.samsandler.com http://www.deafinitelymagic.com |
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RNK Inner circle 7493 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-11-27 19:33, TonyB2009 wrote: Christmas- "CHRIST"mas- means Jesus Christ it is not a secular holiday- sorry. RNK Quote:
On 2011-11-28 21:26, TonyB2009 wrote: No Tony- I believe you are sounding more and more bizarre with your posts. This is an OPEN forum- people can say what they want and disagree with what they want. USA was founded under the basis of GOD whether you lik it or not- sorry! Best, [/quote] You are wrong, RNK. Our country was not based on any god, or any christian beliefs. Please remember this is an international forum and don't impose your insular view on the rest of us. [/quote] Sorry- you are wrong! Don't like my view don't read it. Best, Bob RNK
Check out Bafflingbob.com
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TonyB2009 Inner circle 5006 Posts |
RNK,you are coming across as a narrow minded bigot. This is an INTERNATIONAL forum, whether you like it or not. I disagree with a guy like Sam, but he is not dogmatic about things, and is willing to see other's points of view. You could learn from that.
The Christ in Christmas was only put there when christians hijacked a pre-existing pagan celebration of winter. The celebration itself has nothing to do with Christ or christians. Whether you like it or not. Our country was not founded on any christian principals, but is a secular republic. Whether you like it or not. Your country may be different, but you cannot make sweeping assumptions about the rest of us. Whether you like it or not. International forum. International community of magicians. Please do us the respect of remembering that. Tony
Check out Tony's new thriller Dead or Alive http://www.amazon.co.uk/Alive-Varrick-Bo......n+carson
http://www.PartyMagic.ie |
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Dynamike Eternal Order FullTimer 24148 Posts |
Christmas is a time to care, show love and give. But look where this thread is heading.
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charliecheckers Inner circle 1969 Posts |
Wow - 5 pages in 10 days with this topic and it no contributions from the usual suspects. Now imagine what this thread would look like if Benji had posted and stated his opinion.
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RevJohn Inner circle Oregon City Oregon, Oregon 2473 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-11-21 15:05, TrickyRicky wrote: Getting this thread back on track with a quote and a re-quote from my post: If they are paying you for the gig, then they have the right to request that. Much like if you are presenting a show for Pepsi, and they want you not to mention Coke, they have that right. They are paying for the show. Period. If one doesn't like it, there is nothing to say that you have to take the gig. RevJohn |
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Dennis Michael Inner circle Southern, NJ 5821 Posts |
For the Believers, Merry Christmas, for the others use the coal to keep your house warm.
Dennis Michael
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Sam Sandler Inner circle 2487 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 13:07, charliecheckers wrote: now that was a funny statement -- thanks for the laugh there charlie!! oh that was funny! sam as I mentioned several pages back I think we are all in agreement that if the client hires us and wants merry christmas you give them that if they want happy chanukah you give them that yes the person hiring you has the right to ask you to stay on or off topics. pretty all corporate workers will ask the company if there are any topics that they don't want mentioned in the show. this is just common sense. when I perform at this big Chanuakah party on christmas day I will not be pushing anything other then magic, fun and Chanukah in my show. if after the show some one should ask me a question that is different. sam
sam sandler- America's only full-time DEAF Illusionist
http://www.samsandler.com http://www.deafinitelymagic.com |
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TomBoleware Inner circle Hattiesburg, Ms 3163 Posts |
I think we need to pass the offering plate for Sam. A man that can preach to a house full of mixed religions from around the world, mixed with a ton of full blooded atheists, and remain standing deserves a tip.
Well done Sam. As for as Christmas, like it or not it is coming. Be here December 25th. Ya'll have a merry one. Tom PS. For me, it's not about proving God to others, (that can't be done) it's about proving myself to God.
The Daycare Magician Book
https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/amazekids/the-daycare-magician/ My Blog - https://boleware.blogspot.com/ |
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bowers Inner circle Oakboro N.C. 7024 Posts |
PS. For me, it's not about proving God to others, (that can't be done) it's about proving myself to God.
[/quote] amen to that tom todd |
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Potty the Pirate Inner circle 4632 Posts |
I really don't think anyone of us who has some kind of faith will dislike anyone else for holding their opinions and faith. Of course, I respect many religious folks. I just always feel obliged to mention the simple truths of which I'm aware, which are partly based in the secular, and party in the religious. If I can convince even one Christian, or other religious fellow, to really study the origins of the religion to which they find themselves espoused, then I believe it will make a difference.
Modern Christianity is founded on false principles....on doctrines created by men, not Gods. Astarte, the Goddess of Fertility, was recognised by Pagans....and so, the Catholic Church chose to use the image worshipped for centuries by Pagans, as the very same image they would present..."Madonna and Child". No doubt, this is how the whole rather fantastic story of Christ's "Virgin birth" came about. Rational folks will realise that the Birth of Christ went completely unnoticed. Whatever the truth about the "Three Wise Men", the "Star of Bethlehem", the slaying of the children by Herod, etc....surely it's rather unlikely that the truth is what the Bible tells us? The World is just the same today (from a Spiritual perspective) as it always was. Today, we know that predictions and soothsaying is far from a precise art (I hope some of our fellow magi's are well versed in this.) I say this categorically: there is a way to reveal the love and truth within your heart. But to use the beliefs of others as a template for your own connection with the Universe is folly. If you believe that there is a "God", then seek the truth within yourself, and disregard everything that you are told. See, I'm not "preaching" any particular doctrine....I'm telling you that you can, and will, find the truth within yourself, if you look hard enough, and open yourself up to the possibility that this may be so. Just as Jesus tried to teach. Why am I saddened by those who dogmatically adhere to religious tenets? Because I don't believe that these folk have really found the truth from within themselves. There is nowhere else to find the truth. Accepting as the truth the opinions of others, especially opinions formed centuries ago, which evidently have an ulterior motive, is folly. Study your history, and understand just how vapid modern Christianity really is. Within this thread, I have read comments from those who espouse the religious views, and those who have their own thoughts, as individuals. Really, it's the free-thinkers who are far closer to the mark, than those of a religious disposition. Tony, Payne, and others, who apparently have no "faith", are probably closer to "God" than those who accept blindly the Chinese Whispers that are the modern interpretation of Jesus' life. I have studied the Bible extensively, as well as many other religious texts. And I have a close connection with what I call the "Universal Intelligence". Am I a prophet? Perhaps. But then, I'd say anyone who speaks the truth which they have witnessed during their lives, is a prophet. There is nothing as powerful as the "truth". I only ask you, if you really have "faith", that you also seek the "truth". Or, in simple terms, who do you accept as your teacher? Jesus taught well, but his words alone can guide you....so seek out the actual meaning of his words, and realise that the Bible was translated (for instance, the King James version) with an agenda in mind. The specific translation of words was dictated by the King....and are vastly innaccurate. There was a political agenda. Or do you believe the hyperbole that is spouted by preachers and priests? What makes you think that these, mere men, have any true understanding of, or connection with, "God"? There is a great teacher...and you can find it within yourself.....the best teacher is YOU. Go study the real truth, pray for enlightenment. I did this over thirty years ago....and I was astonished to be given so much understanding. I found the right books to read, and experienced many miracles. My mind was opened to the infinite....and from there, I have never looked back. For me there is no anger, but perhaps frustration, that so many have been convinced that a relationship with "God" must neccessarily mean "religion". By the way, "God" is not fond of that name, as it is so commonly used "in vain". If you pray to "Jaweh", or even create your own, personal name for "God", you will discover (instantly) that this wonderful intelligence is able to respond to you in ways that you probably never imagined were possible. Rant over. He he, OK, we are all brothers, sisters, and here on Planet Earth at the same time. I hope my words mean something to someone......it really has been my life's work. Doug |
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Payne Inner circle Seattle 4571 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 11:37, Sam Sandler wrote: No, you provided your beliefs and opinion. Facts actually have verifiable or confrimational evidence or data to support them.
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
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Potty the Pirate Inner circle 4632 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 14:57, Payne wrote: Thank you Payne. As I have said, you and other secular folks have a better understanding of the "truth". I would ask you to seek within your heart, to see if there isn't a "messenger" within you?! You are a free thinker, and most likely, you are just the kind of person who is able to discover the "truth", where others cannot. I do not aspire to be the one to "convert" you...but you are just the kind of person that might easily discover that greater reality which some choose to call "God". He he, call me bad if you must...... Doug |
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MichaelCGM Inner circle Oklahoma City 2286 Posts |
Quote: Now there's an example of how to carry on a meaningful discussion. Typical, Tony… just typical.
On 2011-12-01 12:35, TonyB2009 wrote: RNK,you are coming across as a narrow minded bigot. Quote: Actually your words come from ignorance of what unbiased study would show, especially in certain areas of your assertions about biblical (small b) history. That being said, regarding what you insist is the "truth," I'll simply quote Payne: "No, you provided your beliefs and opinion. Facts actually have verifiable or confrimational evidence or data to support them. (sic)"
On 2011-12-01 14:07, Potty the Pirate wrote: I hope my words mean something to someone......it really has been my life's work. I suggest we all revert to the OP instead of arguing religious rights and wrongs. The OP was a great topic that is less likely to get a good thread deleted. |
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Payne Inner circle Seattle 4571 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 15:12, Potty the Pirate wrote: Thanks, but no thanks. Unfortunately I haven't a spiritual bone in my body. Trying to explain god(s) to me is like telling a blind man about colors. I understand the concept but can't truly comprehend it nor see why it would have any bearing in my life. I don't need an invisible guy in the sky to give meaning to my life nor an imaginary father figure to keep me from doing wrong. I don't suffer from guilt so I have no need of a non existent redeemer. I don't fear death nor the eternity of non existence I am facing after my demise so the empty promise of an after life holds no interest for me. In fact there is little else I can imagine that would be worse than having to spend eternity as a conscious self aware entity. The boredom one would experience after the first few millennium is unimaginable. Plus I've never seen the draw of getting to spend eternity with ones family. I've spent most of this life trying to avoid them. Why would I want to spend an eternity with them?
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
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Potty the Pirate Inner circle 4632 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 16:20, Payne wrote: Brilliantly put, Payne. Exactly why I imagine that you might be just the kind of person who might experience a revelation, and despite your assertion that you have not a spiritual bone in your body, I would argue that you are, in spite of yourself, a most spiritual person. Indeed, more spiritual than many others who have contributed to this thread. It's quite possible to be a spiritually-minded individual, whilst being unaware of this. Perhaps you will be one of those who will experience a miraculous event, which convinces you that your vision might yet be broadened. But I admire your pragmaticism, and your belief in your own mind-set, which is likely to offer more truth than anything another may proffer. Not that I want to divert you from your obviously very well-conceived and wholesome understanding of Life and the Universe. Doug |
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seadog93 Inner circle 3200 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-01 14:57, Payne wrote: I agree with Payne. I have total respect for everyone here's faith or lack thereof (not that I have respect for the way that many here on both "sides" are posting). I strongly feel (believe even ) that if we can't make make fundamental distinctions between professing our faith and beliefs and offering proof then this "discussion" is even worse off then it seemed before. Anyways, have a: Merry Christmas (Happy Christmas to those who swing that way) Happy Hanukah Kwazy Kwanza Spectacular Solstice Beautiful Bodhi Day Merry Modrenact yeppy Yalda Fabulous Festivus <---(a festival for the rest of us) AND Happy Winter Holidays :babyface:
"Love is the magician who pulls man out of his own hat" - Ben Hecht
"Love says 'I am everything.' Wisdom says 'I am nothing'. Between the two, my life flows." -Nisargadatta Maharaj Seadog=C-Dawg=C.ou.rtn.ey Kol.b |
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