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Tom G
Inner circle
1772 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 11:42am
I've been ripped on site and I know who they are....
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Tom Jorgenson
Inner circle
LOOSE ANGLES, CALIFORNIA
3718 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 1:56pm
Not withstanding the screams of the terrified, I cannot imagine Steve Brooks joining up AND touting this without knowing the people involved, being shown the stuff already on the shelf,and having trust in the people's ability to pull this off.
I'd drop $150 on this...I've dropped more on highly touted unworkable carp from other people I've heard of...but none of those names were Brooks, Maven or Weber.
Tho...it is probably time to fess up to the other info such as names of the founders and publishers. This thing could be REALLY exciting and could call out some high end work...private, limited, no revealing...sounds real good to me.
It may well not be something they want hoards of people joining. There well be some altruistic things going on.
Then again, I could be wrong.
But, in the meantime, I'm in. It's worth the risk of a 3-month subscripton at the least.
For the Fumble-Thumbed who wish a good CT: John Wells' THE BARFLY'S BILLET TEST &INDEX CARD TEAR
http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/jorgenson
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J-Mac
Inner circle
Ridley Park, PA
3004 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 2:23pm
I see where you can sign up and pay via PayPal, though it says there that you agree with the Terms - which are nebulous at best. Also, no privacy policy that I can find. I think I will beg out of this one.
Thank you.
Jim
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insight
Inner circle
1655 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 2:40pm
My understanding is that one of the names associated with Real Secrets is going to make a statement regarding the major concerns of people...in the meantime, hang in there!
Regards,
Mike
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todsky
Inner circle
Montreal, Canada
1976 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 2:46pm
I took the chance the other day and paid a full year membership, because I like the idea of getting a magic surprise each month. However, after reading many of the concerns posted here, I'm having second thoughts, and I emailed Real Secrets to ask them for a refund. I'll let you all know how that goes.
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Tom Jorgenson
Inner circle
LOOSE ANGLES, CALIFORNIA
3718 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 2:59pm
[quote]
On 2012-02-20 06:24, Xiqual wrote:
I wonder how hard it is to cancel? They say "recurring" these things can be a nightmare.
James
[quote]
With Paypal, it's as easy as pushing a button on their website.
For the Fumble-Thumbed who wish a good CT: John Wells' THE BARFLY'S BILLET TEST &INDEX CARD TEAR
http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/jorgenson
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Jon Hackett
Special user
UK
712 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:14pm
Saw Mr Weber at blackpool convention this weekend and he was selling subscriptions to this on his stand. For me, that is enough proof it is legit.
Moreover, he was really excited about this, and the things they were going to release.
Good day gentlemen,
Jon Hackett
It is not the brains that matter most, but that which guides them -- the character, the heart, generous qualities and progressive ideas. Doystoyevsky
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Tom Jorgenson
Inner circle
LOOSE ANGLES, CALIFORNIA
3718 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:14pm
Nice to see a rabbling mob trash this with no evidence of anything. Assumptions of intent flying like snarky arrows. Assumptions of the very worst instead of assumptions of the very best. Perhaps, if everyone who objects does NOT join in, the actual members would be better off? So far there are....oops, as a member, I cannot comment on content.
However: $12 a month for exclusive hot stuff....cheaper than ANY eBook out there.
Relax. If you don't like the setup, DON'T join, and it doesn't concern you. If you do like it, join up.
...and I'd bet refund request will be handled promptly. Think about it...why would anyone give anyone a hassle on refunds this early in the game?
For the Fumble-Thumbed who wish a good CT: John Wells' THE BARFLY'S BILLET TEST &INDEX CARD TEAR
http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/jorgenson
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Zombie Magic
Inner circle
I went out for a beer and now have
6499 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:16pm
Some people will join because of the creators behind it ( I wanted to ). In about two months they should receive their first 'miracle'. Maybe we'll get a review.
But..the "REAL SECRETS TEAM" says in their first and only Café post "Certainly you can discuss whether you like or hate Real Secrets with others around you but you simply have to agree to the rules of the game to be and continue to be a member".
So...will they just come here and say the first trick they received is the greatest trick they have ever seen...but...they can't discuss it. Just take their word for it and join right away.
I'd be very suspect of reviews that come in as online forums already have the friends of creators giving glowing reviews. There is talk that companies and creators pay people to give glowing reviews. The online world of magic is like a Twilight Zone episode where you don't know who to trust.
Do do do do, do do do do......
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Tom Jorgenson
Inner circle
LOOSE ANGLES, CALIFORNIA
3718 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:22pm
Quote:
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So...will they just come here and say the first trick they received is the greatest trick they have ever seen...but...they can't discuss it. Just take their word for it and join right away.
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If the stuff is good, members will NOT want others to join. Exclusive is exclusive, and silence is the lock.
And apparently the creators are demanding secrecy. How is this bad?
For the Fumble-Thumbed who wish a good CT: John Wells' THE BARFLY'S BILLET TEST &INDEX CARD TEAR
http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/jorgenson
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sirbrad
Inner circle
1254 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:30pm
Quote:
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On 2012-02-20 15:14, Tom Jorgenson wrote:
Nice to see a rabbling mob trash this with no evidence of anything. Assumptions of intent flying like snarky arrows. Assumptions of the very worst instead of assumptions of the very best. Perhaps, if everyone who objects does NOT join in, the actual members would be better off? So far there are....oops, as a member, I cannot comment on content.
However: $12 a month for exclusive hot stuff....cheaper than ANY eBook out there.
Relax. If you don't like the setup, DON'T join, and it doesn't concern you. If you do like it, join up.
...and I'd bet refund request will be handled promptly. Think about it...why would anyone give anyone a hassle on refunds this early in the game?
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Not $12 a month, $144 paid in FULL a year. There is a difference. Now if it was monthly I would not mind trying it for a few months or so and then I would make my decision. I don't call being cautious and aware trashing a product, a product that no one has any information about. And it makes sense not to want to pay for something blindly and not know what you are getting. That is called smart consumer/business practices. As opposed to just jumping in blindly and possibly getting burnt. That is where experience and awareness comes in. I personally think it is legit and probably good stuff. But the point is that I will not be making the purchase because of the overly secretive nature of it all, and the lack of support and information does not appeal to me as a consumer.
The magician in me wants to jump on it, but the consumer in me says it is not a smart risk. Unless you have loads of money in reserve you don't mind blowing. Better safe than sorry. But there are just too many variables going on, can't talk about it, can't do a video of the material, recurring payments, no registered company, can't review it, no this no that etc. As a consumer I would be willing to take the plunge if I could buy back issues later and if I could read reviews that would tell me what I am getting. If not they will lose my business, and I am sure the business of many others who are cautiously aware and have been burnt in the past via pre-orders.
I don't call being skeptical about purchasing an unknown product trash mobbing, I call it intelligent consumerism. Lack of information leaves no other choice BUT to assume. And most assume the worst so they are not disppointed nor surprised when they get it.
The great trouble with magicians is the fact that they believe when they have bought a certain trick or piece of apparatus, and know the method or procedure, that they are full-fledged mystifiers. -- Harry Houdini
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sirbrad
Inner circle
1254 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:40pm
Quote:
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On 2012-02-20 15:16, Zombie Magic wrote:
Some people will join because of the creators behind it ( I wanted to ). In about two months they should receive their first 'miracle'. Maybe we'll get a review.
But..the "REAL SECRETS TEAM" says in their first and only Café post "Certainly you can discuss whether you like or hate Real Secrets with others around you but you simply have to agree to the rules of the game to be and continue to be a member".
So...will they just come here and say the first trick they received is the greatest trick they have ever seen...but...they can't discuss it. Just take their word for it and join right away.
I'd be very suspect of reviews that come in as online forums already have the friends of creators giving glowing reviews. There is talk that companies and creators pay people to give glowing reviews. The online world of magic is like a Twilight Zone episode where you don't know who to trust.
Do do do do, do do do do......
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Yeah the review would be something like this:
Wow just got my REAL SECRETS in the mail and it ROCKS!!! Awesome stuff in awesome packaging!! The effect is by ****** ******* and involves taking a **** and placing it an ******** and thus setting in on **** and then ********* it. Did I tell too much? I hope not I do not want to be removed from this awesome ELITE group! I would tell you what I give the effect out of 10 but that is a secret chumps! Join now!! AWESOME STUFF!! ********** (secret rating 10 stars please don't remove me!)
The great trouble with magicians is the fact that they believe when they have bought a certain trick or piece of apparatus, and know the method or procedure, that they are full-fledged mystifiers. -- Harry Houdini
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Zombie Magic
Inner circle
I went out for a beer and now have
6499 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:49pm
Quote:
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On 2012-02-20 15:14, Tom Jorgenson wrote:
Nice to see a rabbling mob trash this with no evidence of anything. Assumptions of intent flying like snarky arrows. Assumptions of the very worst instead of assumptions of the very best. Perhaps, if everyone who objects does NOT join in, the actual members would be better off? So far there are....oops, as a member, I cannot comment on content.
However: $12 a month for exclusive hot stuff....cheaper than ANY eBook out there.
Relax. If you don't like the setup, DON'T join, and it doesn't concern you. If you do like it, join up.
...and I'd bet refund request will be handled promptly. Think about it...why would anyone give anyone a hassle on refunds this early in the game?
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Actually, everyone is following the rules of The Latest and Greatest section and in response to the original poster, Real Secrets Team.
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=179360&forum=218&0
"To provide a place where folks can discuss the latest rumors, read announcements and speculate about the obvious hyperbole surrounding many of the upcoming products that are released into magicdom. Will they be genuine miracles or mere rhetoric? We ponder the question... "
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sirbrad
Inner circle
1254 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:51pm
Ouch, the Café shot it itself in the foot. 
The great trouble with magicians is the fact that they believe when they have bought a certain trick or piece of apparatus, and know the method or procedure, that they are full-fledged mystifiers. -- Harry Houdini
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FrenchDrop
Inner circle
I can name that tune in
1662 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 3:56pm
Maybe they should put out one "sampler" issue for $12. People could check out the content and quality and decide if they wanted to spend another $36 for three more issues or $144 for another 12. I guess the sample issue couldn't be one of the regular issues, since they've promised exclusivity to subscribers, but it could still be representative of what the regular issues will be like.
It's the sight-unseen nature of this project, coupled with the fact that the smallest investment you can make in it is $36, that has people hesitating. If they could make a smaller investment and get a clearer picture of what they'd be getting with a subscription, it seems like that would be beneficial to both the Real Secrets people (whoever they are) and to their potential customers.
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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waltsal
Loyal user
270 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:15pm
Here we go again.
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RevJohn
Inner circle
West Linn, Oregon
2411 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:15pm
I am in. Will see if in a year, I say, "I am glad I did that." or "Well, mmmm."
But I am in.
RevJohn
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Tom Jorgenson
Inner circle
LOOSE ANGLES, CALIFORNIA
3718 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:16pm
I think a 'wait and see' attitude is intelligent, and a 'jump on it from available data' is also intelligent. It is not the available data that is off-putting...so far, sounds great....it is the info that is missing that is driving people up a wall.
But the assumptions of intent ("I'll bet they...") with no evidence...is high school thinking.
Anyway, I've layed out my opinions, backed up with a year's subscription...and they don't need me to play Devil's Advocate for them, as they've got all the skinny on this. Now, it's time for ME to play that 'Wait and See' thing.
Rage on.
It's back to the hammock for me. Life is good.
For the Fumble-Thumbed who wish a good CT: John Wells' THE BARFLY'S BILLET TEST &INDEX CARD TEAR
http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/jorgenson
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GaryLee
Loyal user
276 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:25pm
Maybe they should fix their website so it's secured. Any info you give on their website in regards to your personal information is NOT protected. Their paypal account is unverified. They do not have a merchant id number. Yet, we are to trust them? Are you serious? This is very amatuer even if so called reputable people in the industry are involved in the project. From the cheap unsecured, unprotected website that does not protect your personal information, to the marketing of it.
Everyone should be warned that the website is unsecured, especially when it asks for personal information. The website is very amatuer, and as someone pointed out, no specifics on the terms and conditions. The paypal account is a week old, and still unverified.
No matter how you look at it. This project was badly introduced, and is poorly put together. Amateur is written all over it. It thinks nothing of protecting customers, while secrectly hiding protects them 100%.
It's not an issue of if it's a scam or not, and no one has claimed that. What is being discussed is some facts that have been presented, and concerns about who is in charge of the project, not who is contributing to it.
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jaybest
Loyal user
274 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:32pm
Well my platinum membership is in, looking forward to the surprises myself.
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GaryLee
Loyal user
276 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:38pm
****edited****
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Ray Chelt
Special user
607 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:41pm
Quote:
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On 2012-02-20 16:38, GaryLee wrote:
****edited****
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Gary, how do you know there are 60 registrations ?
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Zombie Magic
Inner circle
I went out for a beer and now have
6499 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 4:53pm
From their amateurish, unsecured and UNPROTECTED website, to their lame "Who is behind Real Magic... we have decided not to focus on that or share"....what can you actually expect in reliable service each month? They made a big announcement on The Café and have been flooded with complaints about how they run their website. Yet, they remain silent. Can you imagine how they'll handle problems that naturally will occur with this type of endeavor?
Why have they made this announcement in February and are taking money, but you don't receive any product until 'the beginning' of April?
Considering that BIG name creators in the magic world put out dvds that contain a great deal of filer material, what can you expect as your monthly trick?
When you think about it, how great is this monthly trick going to be? Max Maven himself says 90% of everything released is crap. So this sloppy company is going to release the 10% that is fantastic?
This is what happens when you hide who you are and what you'll get: people start to speculate.
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toberman
Loyal user
220 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 6:40pm
We have an amazing amount of skeptics and one or two "private investigators" here. What's the big debate? Either give it a try for as little as $36 or wait for some feedback in April. It's a pretty simple choice. Personally, I think this is going to be an exciting project.
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JCheng
Loyal user
285 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 6:48pm
Quote:
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On 2012-02-20 16:53, Zombie Magic wrote:
Why have they made this announcement in February and are taking money, but you don't receive any product until 'the beginning' of April?
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I think it's so more people can join/subscribe before sending the first product. So more people have the chance to get the first product. It makes sense to me.
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J-Mac
Inner circle
Ridley Park, PA
3004 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 8:55pm
I already posted my feelings, but just to clarify them:
First, I don't fear this is a scam, but personally I like to have a little more info before committing this much money. I know it is not a lot to some, but to a hobbyist who is retired and disabled it is too much to risk. I would subscribe but I need a little more of a comfort zone. (I previously subscribed to two other such sites that were disbanded part way into the year. Neither as expensive as this one though)
Second, Gary-how do you know that the site does mot use https? Snce they use PayPal I would almost bet that it IS secure. From experiece I kknow that many sites do not show as https where you fill the form but your data is indeed transmitted over https. I'd like to know if you definitely KNOW the site is not secure, or if this is just a supposition on your part.
Again, I believe that Real Secrets is not a scam and will be safe to sign up. I say that because Brooks is pushing it and more so because Mr. Weber is selling it anad talking it up at Blackpool. I'd just like to hear a few more details before I commit.
Thanks!
Jim
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saysold1
Inner circle
Recovering Cafe addict with only
4127 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 9:15pm
Yes I'm curious too in a positive way.
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GaryLee
Loyal user
276 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 10:27pm
Anytime a web page asks you for sensitive information, you need to be able to identify if the page is secure or not. The ability to recognize a secure web connection is extremely important as online fraud cases have increased substantially from year to year. This FAQ is intended to guide you to safer online shopping.
What exactly do we mean by "secure"?
Anytime you view a web site information is sent from your computer to the web server and from the web server to your computer. The transmission of this information is normally sent in "plain text", meaning anyone would be able to read it should they see it. Now consider this. Each piece of information transmitted traverses many computers (servers) to reach its destination.
Try it! - Windows Users, to see just how many machines your information traverses, follow these steps:
1) On your computer, click Start, then Run
2) Type "cmd" and click "OK" (or press Enter)
3) Type this in exactly: tracert http://www.ssl.com
4) Press Enter
Each listing in the window is a different computer/router/switch (a "node" in networking terms). Each "node" represents a point at which any data you send might be recorded! It is not uncommon to see 20-30 listings.
Big deal, right? Consider this the next time you type in a password or your credit card number. Ah! Therein lies the problem. The solution to this problem is to encrypt this data for transmission. Secure Sockets Layer (SSL) was created for this very purpose.
SSL uses a complex system of key exchanges between your browser and the server you are communicating with in order to encrypt the data before transmitting it across the web. A web page with an active SSL session is what we mean when we say a web page is "secure".
ALL WEB PAGES ASKING YOU FOR SENSITIVE INFORMATION SHOULD BE SECURED USING SSL!!! click to read more http://faq.ssl.com/article.aspx?id=10068
http://www.realsecrets.org/ home page
check out page requiring persnal info. http://www.realsecrets.org/cart/checkout
Check the web page URL
Normally, when browsing the web, the URLs (web page addresses) begin with the letters "http". However, over a secure connection the address displayed should begin with "https" - note the "s" at the end.
Some site will only make certain pages secured. For example, if you typed in Ellusionist.com you would get http://www.ellusionist.com/. But, when you get to a page that requires personal info it will look like this, https://www.ellusionist.com/customer/account/login/ or like this, https://www.ellusionist.com/customer/account/create/
I am not saying this is a scam. Nor have I mentioned that. I want to make clear here that there are several concerns that I do hope get resolved.
The gmail account that is used for financial transaction cannot be tracked by reverse search, but the url originally came from godaddy and then transferred to Tucow in Toronto. They have gone to extremes to hide who they are, and some people think that's okay?
So, in answering the question of if the site is safe or not, all depends on if you are going to give it any personal information. To order from them, you will have to give them personal info first. I highly warn people that that info is not protected.
Posted: Feb 20, 2012 10:36pm
I can assure you that those who have registered already have given their personal information on a unsecured website.
This could of been an oversight on realsecrets part, but it's a huge one. One that should never had been missed by anyone who is operating a legit business. By legit, I mean legally registered, tax paying company, not an under the table unregistered mystery company who uses a free email account, and a free website.
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Zombie Magic
Inner circle
I went out for a beer and now have
6499 Posts
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Posted: Feb 20, 2012 10:37pm
GaryLee, thank you for taking the time to raise a red flag in order to protect Café members. I for one appreciate it!
I hope Steve Brooks publicly thanks you as well. After all, he owns and operates The Magic Café and gave his endorsement of realsecrets.org.
Clarke
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sirbrad
Inner circle
1254 Posts
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Posted: Feb 21, 2012 12:33am
Quote:
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On 2012-02-20 11:16, Mr. Marko wrote:
I'm signing up, too-- to Reel Magic Magazine.
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That is a great investment, I have them all.
The great trouble with magicians is the fact that they believe when they have bought a certain trick or piece of apparatus, and know the method or procedure, that they are full-fledged mystifiers. -- Harry Houdini
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