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bishthemagish Inner circle 6013 Posts |
That is the question? I have little drive to perform for magicians and become a big name in magic and do lectures. I could not care a less about having my picture on a magic magazine. How about you? do you like performing for magicians?
Me I like performing for people at shows and in restaurants. How about you?
Glenn Bishop Cardician
Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs |
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Aaron Smith Magic Inner circle Portland, OR 1447 Posts |
I totally agree. My happiness comes from seeing that look of wonder on a laymen's face when performing a miracle for them. You just don't get that type of reaction from a magician.
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Stanyon Inner circle Landrum, S.C. by way of Chicago 3433 Posts |
Ditto on performing for laypeople. I see the only reason for performing for magicians is to sell them something. Like marketing fishing equipment, you catch more fishermen with lures than you do fish.
FWIW
Stanyon
aka Steve Taylor "Every move a move!" "If you've enjoyed my performance half as much as I've enjoyed performing for you, then you've enjoyed it twice as much as me!" |
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General_Magician Special user United States 707 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-05-03 11:51, bishthemagish wrote: I like performing for both magicians and other people. Sometimes, magicians can offer some helpful tips to help you improve as well. Not only that, but it's an opportunity to trade knowledge on various tricks and sleights and to learn from each other. Performing for regular people is also boatloads of fun as well. Regardless, I am always happy to perform for both fellow magician and layman. I have fun performing for either audience. When performing for fellow magicians, even though they may know how a trick is done, it can still be a fun experience if you are practicing your showmanship such as comedy. The performance of magic is not all about the trick.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown
Company Website Facebook Business Page Twitter Business Page |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts |
Lay audiences pay better than magician audiences.
However, a good magician audience can sometimes give valuable feedback that I cannot get from a lay audience. Occasionally, I'll find a method that works extremely well with lay audiences, that is also relatively unknown to magicians. With that, it's fun to perform for magicians, because they're at a loss to explain what they just saw. For the uninitiated, Simon Aronson's UnDo Influence control falls under this rubric. In the final analysis, it depends on the magicians who compose the audience. If they know their stuff, are willing (and able) to give constructive criticism, and can leave their egos at the door, then they make as good an audience as any, and better than some. |
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w_s_anderson Inner circle The United States 1226 Posts |
I enjoy performing for whoever is signing the paycheck I have performed at a few conventions for magicians, and while it was fun, it just was not the same as performing for a lay audience.
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pepka Inner circle Uh, I'm the one on the right. 5041 Posts |
I enjoy more informal jamming with magicians than actually performing for them. That said, I'm actually performing at a convention in a few weeks. 2 original pieces, to oldies buried in a book, so they might as well be originals to most guys today. I DO save one or two routines as magician foolers. Once at a convention in Vegas I fooled the pants off some young punk using his deck. He followed me for 3 days begging me to teach it to him. On the last day I gave in....."It's in Stanyon's"
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Mary Mowder Inner circle Sacramento / Elk Grove, CA 3659 Posts |
I love to perform for both.
Magicians make me more nervous. I love to watch good Magic as well. -Mary Mowder |
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MR Effecto Inner circle 2836 Posts |
I just love to perform in bars with all my friends around. I don't get paid its just for fun. I do get paid for kid shows. Kids are the best to perform for in my book. The looks on there face are pricless even with the easyest effect.
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bishthemagish Inner circle 6013 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-05-04 03:02, pepka wrote: Me to. I would rather session than perform with magicians any day.
Glenn Bishop Cardician
Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs |
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
With a lay audience, my performances are always with the same mentality on my part, although with considerations for variances such as kid shows, magic at the bar, etc.
For magicians, my approach is similar, but with a different mind set, usually depending on my goal. I have found that if you have a solid routine that entertains laymen, audiences of magicians can be just as appreciative... assuming you're not the third guy on the bill doing a Matrix or ACR!! Ha! The level of knowledge and performing skills is widely varied among magicians. Your own position on that scale can vary depending on who is in your audience. But in general, anyone can enjoy a well-performed set. If the aim is to completely fool magicians, the magic usually must be unique in some fashion, so as to bring them along cold. It may also need to be structured differently, because their manner of observing is different. Magicians analyze throughout, and often before they react. If you are expecting the reaction timing as you normally get from magicians, you can be left feeling off your game. Lecturing is yet a different bird. All of the above applies, but response is going to be better, if they can also visualize themselves performing what they are seeing. They are often there to learn.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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eatonmagic Special user Orlando, FL 737 Posts |
One can never rule out the financial gain of magician vs. laypeople. In certain cases, a convention pays WAY more than a regular gig. I know that a good friend of mine who's an amazing coin worker and is a hot name in the magic scene right now has made close to $20,000 once at a convention. Another close friend pulled in nearly $30,000 at Blackpool.
I make a great living performing here in Orlando. I've been one of the magicians for the Orlando Magic basketball team and our team of magicians within our company have seen lots of gigs come through as a result of that venue as well as our partner restaurants. I have also lectured for many magicians clubs and conventions but personally I have seen more income through my corporate clients than anywhere else. |
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Futureal Inner circle 1695 Posts |
Depends on what you wish to concentrate upon. Many well-known magicians (within the industry) no longer perform in public very often at all, they make their living selling products to magicians.
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bishthemagish Inner circle 6013 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-05-04 00:04, S2000magician wrote: I remember talking to several of the older guys and asking the same question? At the risk of name dropping I will say that I asked the same question to Don Alan and his answer had nothing to do with money or income. He just said that the "Lay audience is a better audience". After a few years in the business I agree. Below is a link to a thread and on the thread is some stuff written by Bill Palmer - and reading it I was reminded why I wanted to learn magic - and how I learned magic. And it had little to do with buying stuff at conventions. And in my opinion magic is not about tricks - it is about people. http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......art=30#9 By the way I think Bill's post is the best one of the year - so far.
Glenn Bishop Cardician
Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs |
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Brent McLeod Inner circle 1792 Posts |
I enjoy performing for Lay audiences as they do pay well
and the reactons & entertainment generated make it a fun & magical enviornment... As one of the busier Pros in our area I very rarely perform for magicians at meetings & many times can go a year without showing anything... I just prefer the reactions of Lay audiences.. One reason is I have about 15 or so effects I use to make a living performing & don't really have a lot of effects to show clubs all the time so just keep it to myself really... When I perform I usually do so in a session with working performers that I respect & need specific feedback or are showing someone an effect that theve asked for help on and will help as much as I can.. Brent |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-05-08 17:22, bishthemagish wrote: You do realize that (that portion of) my answer was tongue-in-cheek, no? |
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Rampage New user Florida 62 Posts |
I like doing magic for laymens much better. I usually do magic for friends, family or co-workers and when I do I only do 2-3 tricks. I like quick hitters that are very visual. I am working on growing my repotoire of card magic, I can do about 4 really good tricks with a normal deck and 2 more with gaffed cards, that's all I need right now.
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Dimitri Mystery Artist Veteran user Israel/Ukraine 355 Posts |
I hardly have magic friends, but when I do meet a magician that ask me to show him something, I perform the same way I would perform for lay-people. but magicians don´t respond the same way, they just stare cold at me and this makes me act less naturally.
bottom line, I don´t doing magic for magicians as I can never achieve the same ¨WOW¨ I would get from lay people. also I think it is useless doing routines especially for magicians, it is like a theater show made for impress other actors. |
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bishthemagish Inner circle 6013 Posts |
I have found it to be very funny when 2 magicians meet for the first time. It almost becomes a game of can you top this. Each one trying to blow the other guy away like they are trying to win something.
It is a fun game for those who wish to play. However I have not wished to play that kind of game in many, many years. I have a theory that magicians that are what I consider good reach a certain point of balance - it is the balance of technical ability and showmanship/entertainment. Once they reach that balance in my opinion it is like what Nick Papas said at the New York lounge when he said "were all great". (When I perform for you - you say I’m great - when he performs for you you’ll will say he is great - well, were all great - get the money.) The can you top me comes from "ego" in my opinion and I think that is one of the reasons some magicians can be very annoying.
Glenn Bishop Cardician
Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs |
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MikeTheKid Veteran user vancouver 329 Posts |
I gain confidence from lay people
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Magic is a performing art that entertains an audience by creating illusions of seemingly impossible.... www.mikeliumagic.com |
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