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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Rings, strings & things » » The Little Hand - by Michael Ammar (5 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Bonz
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Twickenham, London, UK
159 Posts

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Richard you no little about this subject other than that Bob's biased point of view on this subject!

It was my idea to donate money the the charity and the reasons that this never went forward was because Bob suddenly changed his mind as to whether he owned the rights to a doll hand or the choreography!

I was just as I was about to agree to credit him and do everything right, even though I do not believe he owns the rights to this, just to keep him happy and stop his rude, angry emails demanding money from me.

I changed my mind when Bob suddenly decides that the money to charity is just for the rights to produce a small hand of any kind (ridiculous!! …at this point I had deleted all instructions). If I wanted to include any kind of instructions, then I would have to enter into an expensive licensing deal with Mr Ammar! This I was not willing to do for the reasons that you are not even aware of Richard!

Bob did not invent this gag, only popularised it with a crude doll hand, I produced my first purpose made version, way before Michael popularised Bob's version to which I can provide plenty of video evidence, I do not make a fortune from these hands, each is hand made by me to order in the dozens, not thousands, which I make VERY little money from, the design is very different! (An adult hand, not a baby arm with a magnet) and the handling is very different, mine was the first to be made for the job, it does not contain a magnet and the only thing similar to Bob's is that it can make objects vanish (his only a steel object) and mine will give children a high/love five. The concept of a gag using a small hand in cupped hands was most definitely not created by Bob as you can ready in the email thread below when Bob first contacted me.


....anyway Richard, who are you to make accusations of theft when you stole from me at the Session Convention 2016!! You asked to take a pack of my Bonsalopes and said that you would bring the money over in a few minutes. You never came back and when I went to find you on your stand, you had packed up and gone!!

Dave Bonsall


EMAIL THREAD BETWEEN BOB AND I
—————————————————
“I am the inventor and the owner of the Little Hand trick. I have never given you permission to manufacture and sell any version of my trick.

I'm also an intellectual property lawyer.

It would be in your best interests to contact me.

Bob Farmer”

———————————
“Dear Bob,

First of all, wow!! What an aggressive and threatening opening to an email, there was no need for that Bob, pleasantries cost nothing and make all feel better, but if this is the tone the email must take, then so be it!

I am aware that you have previously released a version of a little hand gimmick, but I can assure you that you were by no means the inventor of this trick Bob! You may have been the first magician to release it as a trick, but the concept of using a toy or puppet in this manor has been around for decades! In the early 70’s my grandfather used to scare me with a broken gnome hand! An idea he had had from a fellow serviceman he served with back in world war 2 who used to do a comedy gag about a tunnel rat with a wooden carved hand holding a pistol! I find it utterly comical that you are declaring the to be the owner of this gag and that others would require permission to have a version! Especially as my version is Dave Bonsall’s Little Hand Gimmick, which literally means that, it is an exact miniaturised replica of my hand, with every small detail, line and crease identical in every way to my hand. My purpose created version holds very few similarities to the version you released (or Ammar) and, from what you are saying, every single doll manufacturer or craft shop who should happen to sell dolls hands should first ask your permission before selling them, this is utterly ludicrous! Just search the internet and there hundreds of versions out there.

As for the mention that you are an intellectual property lawyer, I am confused as to why you would mention this, is it meant to be a threat or scare tactic in some way? I fail to see how this would make any difference whatsoever. Especially as before I created this gimmick, as with any release of mine, I did a thorough search of patents, trademarks and copyrights and found not a single reference to anything even remotely resembling it. I can’t think what kind of intellectual property lawyer would think that he has the right to try and aggressively bully or scare someone over something as trivial as this, especially as you no longer make your version and have not for decades. So why all the fuss Bob and why would this possibly be in my best interests to contact you?

If you feel legal action is required, then please, please do go ahead Bob, I’m sure that legal system would have a great laugh over this.

It’s a shame that this correspondence could not have been a more pleasant conversation between two adults with a passion in common.

I wish you a good weekend.

Kind regards

Dave Bonsall
———————————————————————

Dear Dave:

There is no question that I invented this trick in the late 1970s. This is well-known among informed magicians.

In all previous cases where someone wanted to publish or sell this trick they did so in accordance with a written agreement (including Michael Ammar). In fact, Michael Ammar’s wide use of this trick made it famous and every copy contains my name as the originator.

Now, I don’t really need the income from the sale of a small plastic hand—you obviously do—however, in magic the key return is credit and respect, things you seem to have ignored.

Here’s what I want, no later than Friday, March 9, 2017:

1. The number of little hands you have manufactured.

2. The number you have sold.

3. The gross receipts from these sales.

I would be happy to enter into a license with you on reasonable terms, but before I do that I need the financial information. However, this license would have to comply with my agreement with Michael Ammar and could not infringe any of his exclusive rights.

—————————————
Bob I can see that you seriously have a chip on your shoulder about this! To think that you can extort money from others just because you happened to have published the use of a doll hand as a comedy gag is utterly ridiculous!

I did not do this to make big bucks, it was something I simply did a decade before your published material with a doll hand, that I lost so decided to make my own, to which others asked me to make for them too. This is not some mass produced item that I have made thousands from, but a beautifully hand crafted item that I have only ever sold in the dozens through my website. I do have plenty of videos of me performing this, long before your published material in 2011.

If you are so pathetic to think that you can bully me into giving you money for the use of a gag, then you are mistaken, I do not give in to bullies. Had this have been a trick, then things would have been very different and of course I would have sought permission, credited and respected all rights, but this is just the use of a similar item as a gag that was taught to me by my grandfather years before you ever came up with the idea!

So I will not comply with your requests and as you now wish to take this seriously though legal action, then please forward any further correspondence, physically in writing, and it will be dealt with by my legal team. It such a shame that it has come to this Bob.

Kind regards

Dave
MichaelJae
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The best use for this prop imho, is used as the approach. "Have any of you seen sleight of hand magic"? As I breifly make eye contact then immediately look down at my hands placing a bottle cap on the lower base of my thumb. Their eyes are following mine, almost hypnotic, as if their in a trance. Again, making eye contact, "sleight of hand?" At this point someone responds and I say "don't take your eyes off of it. Build a little tension then finish the routine, get the laughs then immediately follow with an opener. I use this as my approach, almost like cold calling and have never been rejected.
Kaliix
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Inner circle
Connecticut
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If this was created and sold in the 70's or 80's and protected the proper legal way, the patent would have expired on it in twenty years. When the patent expires, anyone is free to sell and produce the product. It has been way more than 20 years since this was released so it would be in public domain now.

Magicians are not entitled to protect their creations for any longer than a patent would protect it so this is a non-issue. IMHO, YMMV...
The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion that stands at the cradle of true art and true science.
~Albert Einstein
Howser
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I got the tiny hand from propdog first and eventually got Ammar's version as well.
Michael Ammar's little hand looks much "funnier" when in motion and I like the handling more.
I got some great laughs already but one time this girls response was "so your always carrying a puppet arm with you?"
..couldn't come up with a good reply so far Smile
Kaliix
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Inner circle
Connecticut
1238 Posts

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Only when I need a little hand...

Quote:
On Mar 7, 2018, Howser wrote:
I got the tiny hand from propdog first and eventually got Ammar's version as well.
Michael Ammar's little hand looks much "funnier" when in motion and I like the handling more.
I got some great laughs already but one time this girls response was "so your always carrying a puppet arm with you?"
..couldn't come up with a good reply so far Smile
The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion that stands at the cradle of true art and true science.
~Albert Einstein
Howser
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Quote:
On Mar 7, 2018, Kaliix wrote:
Only when I need a little hand...


good one! unfortunately it wouldn't translate to my mother tongue
Dollarbill
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Special user
Colorado
710 Posts

Profile of Dollarbill
Quote:
On Mar 7, 2018, Kaliix wrote:
Only when I need a little hand...

Quote:
On Mar 7, 2018, Howser wrote:
I got the tiny hand from propdog first and eventually got Ammar's version as well.
Michael Ammar's little hand looks much "funnier" when in motion and I like the handling more.
I got some great laughs already but one time this girls response was "so your always carrying a puppet arm with you?"
..couldn't come up with a good reply so far Smile


Hillarious! 😂😂😂
John Oaks
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57 Posts

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I have one bought from Ammar at the Toronto Magic Bash last year I think it was. Forgot about it, but pulled it out now and am having fun with it.
Looking forward to the 2018 Bash in mid April!
Have a Magical Day!
------

I really didn't know how to explain it.
So I told them the truth, and they fell for it!
DaKine Oregon
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Medford, Oregon
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Here's a source for all the ungimmicked Little Hands you can use in left, right, light skin, dark skin, rainbow colors, glow-in-the-dark, even "Little Hands for Little Hands", and small or wholesale quantities: https://mcphee.com/collections/hands
Ubernutz
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58 Posts

Profile of Ubernutz
I found mine at the Magic Apple in LA and I love it. Quirky little prop
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Rings, strings & things » » The Little Hand - by Michael Ammar (5 Likes)
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