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Ray Haining Inner circle Hot Springs, AR 1907 Posts |
Houstoun's version of Shadow Coins, which is Ammar's version of Roth's Chink-a-Chink, is one of the most beautiful pieces of magic, coins or otherwise, I've ever seen.
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daniel116 Regular user 196 Posts |
This is a quick two coins across routine that I made up last night, with the jump back concept, but with no extras or shells, what do you think?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rm8uwbwHYU&feature=youtu.be |
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Jiceh Special user France 742 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 7, 2014, Michael Rubinstein wrote: First point : I agree. I don't like it too. I think it gives clues about the method. It also give some confusion to the effect. Second point : I disagree because this move (the magician taps the two coins with the one that traveled, making a substitution to get ahead in the process) must be done in a relaxation moment (the move is good only if you use misdirection and relaxation) |
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Mb217 Inner circle 9520 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 9, 2014, daniel116 wrote: Nice little play daniel. I've done that (pretty much just like that) for years, playing around with just 2 coins. Sometimes I think 2 coins is all you need. But you should be able to see why the little extra used by Houstoun makes it all look so much more visually magical and stunning.
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic
"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb |
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Michael Rubinstein V.I.P. 4665 Posts |
Jiceh, misdirection can be a very powerful tool, but there is no misdirection when you call attention to your action by doing the move right in front of their eyes. If you go on youtube and look at the many many performances by amateurs and pros alike, maybe out of the entire bunch there is maybe one person who effectively hides the switch (and I am not sure if that is accidental or the guy figured it out). Everyone else exposes the move. You see a discrepancy that just doesn't look right, even if the coins are where they should be at the end. Magic doesn't look like magic if you see something. You shouldnt see anything. People get away with it because laymen don't understand what they saw, since the coins in each hand are correct. But that doesn't mean its a good move. You see this all the time in card magic. You can see something but you arent sure what it is. It just looked like you did "something". I guess we can amicably agree to disagree, but if you watch others do it, you will see the discrepancy which is the coin substitution.
S.E.M. (The Sun, the Moon, and the Earth) is a sun and moon routine unlike any other. Limited to 100 sets, here is the promo:
https://youtu.be/aFuAWCNEuOI?si=ZdDUNV8lUPWvtOcL $325 ppd USA (Shipping extra outside of USA). If interested, shoot me an email for ordering information at rubinsteindvm@aol.com |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
@Bob, you've got a good eye for novelty. The feint has not been extensively explored. Maybe a fun way to setup a s -> c+b change.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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Jiceh Special user France 742 Posts |
Michael,
I haven't see the person you talk about (The person who effectively hides the switch even if it is probably accidental) but I'm a little curious about it. I think that the problem with this move (the magician taps the two coins with the one that traveled, making a substitution to get ahead in the process) seems so easy that magicians do it without even having practiced it. There is the same problem in cardmagic with the zarrow shuffle for example. I also think that the move can be good (I agree that we an amicably agree to disagree ;-)) in goods hands or more exactly with the good attitude. You don't have to put attention on the fact that you taps the two coins with the one that traveled. Here my sequence : - Begin with 3 coins in one hand (and one hidden in the other one) - You make one coin fly from one hand to the other one - You relax - You do the move (in a vertical way). The noise is here just : 1) to recover the attention of the audience and 2) to put attention back on the coins - You tap again the two coins with the one that traveled The spectators don't see the move because you do it at a relaxation moment. They hear it first. Then they see it the second time you do it without doing any transfer. They have seen a complete sequence but not in the right order. But that doesn't really matter because they will reconstruct and remember the sequence in the right order ... |
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Bob_Hummer Special user 842 Posts |
I love novelty - Jonathan!
All the best, Joe Mckay PS Thanks for al the responses so far. I am surprised this idea seems not to have being used as often as I thought it might have done. |
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Mb217 Inner circle 9520 Posts |
Y'know, I actually don't do the phase of 3 Fly where the coin jumps back. I did learn it but dropped it from my own versions of the trick. I think it's cute but never did it much at all.
Now the other phase, speaking of "discrepancy," I often do and like. While I guess there is perhaps some jump-cut feel to it, to me it is minimal, at least when done well. Anything can look bad when not done well. Perhaps specs notice something about it, but it also seems to go right by them, at least it does for me. I don't give the move a second thought when I perform it. I mostly do the trick for laymen, and doing it smoothly they don't catch anything for the same reason they don't catch an Elmsley Count or Packet Switch in card magic, I would think. They may "see" something but it looks too much like reality to discern as anything too far off the beaten path of things, as the effect continues on. You certainly don't stop there long enough for them to better consider anything, and typically they don't that I have seen. Just my 2 cents on it, but for me people do a HPC much more noticeably, it regularly looks fishy in a lot of good and or bad hands at it.
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic
"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb |
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Jiceh Special user France 742 Posts |
About the sequence with two coins (Will Houston) : This is the first time I like the use of the Jump Back concept
There is no confusion in the sequence It's an effect linked to the 3 fly trick Very good |
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Michael Rubinstein V.I.P. 4665 Posts |
Marion, I would have to disagree. If the spectator sees "something", even if they can't comprehend what they saw, it diminishes the magic. It looks more like you did something, even if they don't know what. They know we are doing sleight of hand and are forgiving, but it doesn't mean it is ok to accept something that diminishes the magic. If a spectator sees "something" with the elmsley count, it no longer looks like you just showed four cards, even if they don't know what you did. Our goal is to find a way to make our magic as magical as possible. That is why we learn better moves as we progress as magicians, which allows us to make our magic look more magical. This is not an original move, it is a move that was used in a three fly routine, and solved a problem, so everyone and their mother put it into their own routine. There is a better way to get from point a to point b. Finding that way will make your routine look better. Why settle for ok, when you can have great? I am constantly reworking my routines to make them look as magicial as I can. That is how we evolve as magicians. We should all be doing that. (And there is a better way, you just have to look for it)
S.E.M. (The Sun, the Moon, and the Earth) is a sun and moon routine unlike any other. Limited to 100 sets, here is the promo:
https://youtu.be/aFuAWCNEuOI?si=ZdDUNV8lUPWvtOcL $325 ppd USA (Shipping extra outside of USA). If interested, shoot me an email for ordering information at rubinsteindvm@aol.com |
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Ray Haining Inner circle Hot Springs, AR 1907 Posts |
I need to point out that my mother never added that move to her routine.
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David Neighbors V.I.P. 4910 Posts |
WHAT !!! I did not Know that your mother Did Magic ???
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Mb217 Inner circle 9520 Posts |
Doc,
I certainly respect your opinion here and don't necessarily think we disagree all that much as to the magic. But I just don't find the supposed discrepancy to be such a big deal in this effect. I think it works more-so than not and whatever specs comprehend as to it is minimal, certainly not enough to ruin the effect. I think magicians are always reaching to do things better, I know I've tried to do things better, to show things in better ways, I think progress happens, no matter where we are in the continuum. We can't help but to get better and improve in everything we do. Anyway, appreciate your comments here. Always good stuff to think about and consider.
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic
"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb |
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Michael Rubinstein V.I.P. 4665 Posts |
Ok, I guess we can agree to disagree for this move.
S.E.M. (The Sun, the Moon, and the Earth) is a sun and moon routine unlike any other. Limited to 100 sets, here is the promo:
https://youtu.be/aFuAWCNEuOI?si=ZdDUNV8lUPWvtOcL $325 ppd USA (Shipping extra outside of USA). If interested, shoot me an email for ordering information at rubinsteindvm@aol.com |
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David Fillary Special user 662 Posts |
I still can't work out how the classic coin through hanky discrepancy flies by most people... and that's a major discrepancy really. So not quite sure how to measure how much the specs pick up.
I do know my friends at uni suspected an extra in Ponta's 3fly (never saw it, but said he must be using one), but were clueless when it came to his winged silver - just food for thought. |
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harris Inner circle Harris Deutsch 8812 Posts |
Early in my coin career, I heard something like
I saw something, not sure what. That statement was a bit different than I know how you did that- Sleight of Hand. Harris Still too old to know it all
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
drlaugh4u@gmail.com music, magic and marvelous toys http://magician.org/member/drlaugh4u |
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Michael Rubinstein V.I.P. 4665 Posts |
When we watch others do magic, we are quick to point out problems in their routines. Often we may find that their solution might not have been adequate for a part of their trick. Likewise people look at our tricks and point out areas they feel are weak. We should be able to look at our own routines, analyze them and decide what is strong and what is weak, and attempt to fix the weak. That is what makes creating fun!
S.E.M. (The Sun, the Moon, and the Earth) is a sun and moon routine unlike any other. Limited to 100 sets, here is the promo:
https://youtu.be/aFuAWCNEuOI?si=ZdDUNV8lUPWvtOcL $325 ppd USA (Shipping extra outside of USA). If interested, shoot me an email for ordering information at rubinsteindvm@aol.com |
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David Neighbors V.I.P. 4910 Posts |
Yea Even after 30-35 Years Of Doing a Routine I am steal looking for ways To make it look more like Magic!
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Mb217 Inner circle 9520 Posts |
It's been a while for me too now, and I have learned that simple is better, especially with an in-depth understanding of what specs see of it all. When you begin to do it well and each note of it blends more into a symphony and not just a song, well, you begin to make magic happen quite easily.
I've been playing with some movements I've been doing for a long time now, and it's still very much a part of what I've always done, and it still works well, even better now. I did it at work several times the other day in a little change-play with a coin. It really looks like magic. The more you play with all this, the more you come to see that it don't take much when you truly come to understand all the dynamics. That's how I know so much better now what people see & feel and or don't as to all this stuff. I can do a lot but really it don't take much, once you've practiced and practiced and practiced the secret of it all.
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic
"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb |
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