I recently saw Shoot lecture and for years have heard hype on the Ninja Rings. I am considering taking this on as a learning project to become a worker. I am curious though... How many folks actually use this as a regular performance piece? I hear a lot of chatter about the rings themselves, how good it looks when done by the "masters", and how some of the moves are very difficult / knacky. Ive also talked to several folks who have the equpment and done "some degree" of work, but no one who actually performs it regularly

How many folks out there actually "use" a NR routine regularly?
How was the learning curve?

I use them regularly.

I don't use Shoots routine. I thought if I ever learned his, I would never explore them for myself because his routine (and his performance of it) were so excellent. I wouldn't want to do anything that needed a table or could make a loud jangly sound like a poor execution of the loose link from above that is in Shoot's routine so I never pursued those moves myself.

It gets a very strong reaction from audiences who are in parlor or closer situations.

There is a high threshold for just getting good enough to do them that close (and the heel of one of my hands got pretty sore for a while LOL). After that it is a matter of how good you want to be. You'll feel pretty good till you see Kim Silverman, Shoot Ogowa or Dan Fleshman at a lecture but you don't HAVE to be that good for people to enjoy your performance. Your job is to entertain the people at a show and hone to your best degree for fun at home.

Mary Mowder

Mary, do you find that people want to examine the rings after you conclude? This is the only thing stopping me from performing it.

I perform cards and coins and I know that people wanting to examine them isn't as much of a problem as some people think. If you perform an entertaining routine that flows people rarely even want to examine things. I'm just concerned that the rings might be different because there is no assumption that they are ordinary as there is with cards and coins.

I don't seem to have a problem. I do start with a pretty good show of four "separate" rings.

They may ask but I'm not handing them out so I either give them one at random to look at (guess which one) as I put away and move on or I just move on.

When working for Kids you find that they say a lot of things that you would not stop the show and address, you just choose what you will address and sort of get on with the show for the others. If you stopped and answered or acknowledged every comment from them you'd never get anywhere. Once I realized this, I didn't feel quite so guilty about not addressing touchy questions about methods. This skill is transferrable for many different kinds of performance.

It is just like with cards. You are probably using a straight deck but you wouldn't hand them to a spectator on request because it would disrupt the flow of the show and they might bend or otherwise ruin the deck for further use. If I wouldn't hand out a straight object, I certainly won't feel guilty about not handing out a gaffe.

Use the same attitude you'd use with cards or coins. You are the MC of your Close-Up Show and you don't let the audience lead for their own good.

Have you ever noticed how fast food employees are able to avoid eye contact and seem not to notice you when they don't want too? Learn from the Zen Masters.

(None of this worked on my father LOL. )

-Mary Mowder

Re: examination of the rings-
A strength of the Messado routine, is that 'all' the rings are given out during the performance at various stages, in a well routine. Worth a look if you have audience management concerns.

Another option is to finish with one ring in their hand and then to segue into another complimentary routine such as ring & rope, the ring as a portal (coin & ring) etc.

Thanks Mary, I just wanted a little reassurance. I remember years ago when I first started performing Copper-Silver-Brass I felt so vulnerable and now it is a complete non-issue. No one asks to see them after the trick and if they did I would simply move on.

Mary,

Thanks for your comments regarding practice. I know everyone is different, but what kind of time did it take before you got visually clean and quiet links and unlinks. Im not afraid of the time, just want to know what it look like.

Unfortunately, with you as the only responent (although its still early) I don't think is effect is being "worked" nearly as much as the chatter would lead one to think

Scott,

Puggo is right, your routine should do all the convincing that the rings are solid. I did start by going into Ring and Rope after the Ninjas but gave that up since it was not needed and the ring is not the weight I prefer for Ring and Rope. It did help me get over my nerves about people asking to see the rings though.

It was probably six months before I should have been doing them Close-Up for strolling gigs. I still practice a lot for fun and not all that I practice has made it into the routine. I already did larger Rings but not often.

I don't do nearly as many strolling Close-Up gigs as I'd like so most of my early opportunities came in Children's Birthday Parties (which are low stress parlor shows).

Fortunately my first couple of forays for adults were for a very friendly Magic group (and I did not do well). Still, I knew it was working well at home and that it was only nerves because it was looking great with the Kids so I pressed on. I've never had any problem for a real gig (real audiences are different and we are different with them).

It is now very comfortable to do for adults in strolling situations (if I'm carrying my small purse like kit) If you have an outfit that can carry the rings they would be great. Maybe a man's suit coat can hold them. I've seen guys who work in casual dress have a back of the thigh pocket for them but I don't think it caught on. Some have a clip of some sort up under the jacket.
I think it is better to do them when you have a corner at a party and maybe a small table and you are doing a small show or if you are working large tables.

Strolling with just you and what can comfortably fit in your pockets seems more pro. to me. I carry more than I need because I'm not as confident as I could be. It is not a habit you want to get into.

-Mary Mowder

And what about Raymond iongs gold rings.

Wally, this is the 3rd time (at least) you've asked the same thing.
things are getting curiouser and curiouser ...

Scott, it's a great routine/trick and worth your while to put into your strolling set.

Like Mary, I never ventured into the table moves. I wanted to be able to do it anytime/anywhere.

Frank, I have the advantage (crutch) of carrying a small purse like magic kit. How do you carry your Ninjas for strolling in a cocktail environment (or do you?)?

Sometimes I'll stash my kit behind a sign in table.

-Mary Mowder

I'm learning toward taking the plunge. For me, I like the strolling, totally in the hands, routining. Four 4 1/2 inch rings should not be a problem strolling. If the wont fit in a pocket, Im sure there are simple solution to attach them to a belt or belt loops.

I have no expectation that Ill perfect it, or even if Ill get it to performance level. But it is a pretty piece, and I think it may be a good exercise in training and patience

Scott

I have used my Messado rings for a strolling gig but I was wearing a suit. The rings fit great in my left inside pocket of the jacket where I can grab them with my right hand. When I finish the routine they go right back into the same pocket ready to go if needed. I only used them near the end of the event as they really attract attention. The only problem is they take up the entire pocket so I lose that pocket for other effects.

You don't have to start with expensive rings.

Some cheap Royals on up will give you a feel for the rings. See if you are into it before you invest a lot.

-Mary Mowder

Mary,

I may take your advice and "break myself in" with some inexpensive rings. I see 2 set avail, one 4" and one 5" in diameter. Can you advise "whose" rings your use and the diameter... I belive one of the "better sets is 4 1/2" ???

I have only once had a spectator ask to look at the rings while I was putting them away at the end of the routine. I kept the single ring out, put the rest away and took a rubber band off my wrist. He examined the ring and rubber band and then with him holding the ring I did a penetration of the ring with the band using the crazy handcuffs move. That satisfied him !!!!!!
Phil

Really liked that chaining of effects. =)

Scott, I use Ninjas which are 4 1/2".

Phil, I like your solution.

-Mary Mowder

Of course I do. I think it's one of the best strolling trick ever.
I use one of my Ninja Ring bags to carry them in so they never get mixed up due to the ring closure. (as opposed to drawstrings).
I also have a gag I can do with the bag itself. I do it every time unless I'm following my strolling set with a stand-up act.

I keep the bag 'o rings in my suit jacket pocket. Fits fine.

Voila!

I have been doing close up rings for years.

I would like to find a nice set in 5 inches with a good weight and ring to them. I started with the set Dan Fleshman used to include with the restaurant VCR. Anyone know who made those?