The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » New to magic? » » Buying Magic (A how-to Guide) (33 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3~4~5~6 [Next]
hokeypokey
View Profile
New user
Chicago
71 Posts

Profile of hokeypokey
As a beginner, I actually found it better to order online because I got better quality and better service. I went to a few local shops to get advice and ended up buying inferior products (which I only discovered after doing online research).
Oz Fan
View Profile
Loyal user
277 Posts

Profile of Oz Fan
Thanks for the great advice!!!!!!!!! I will definently use this! Thanks a lot!

-Blake-
Blake S.
celloboo
View Profile
New user
7 Posts

Profile of celloboo
As like many, I have now aquired quite a few purchased never to be used again magic tricks.
However I have purchased some very cheap excellent packet tricks. As a beginner I have found their use very beneficial in giving me the confidence to progress to more difficult close up magic. A good example would be "2tenty one" two cards six changes, easy to carry and perform at anytime.
So I would say don't always be put off by a trick being cheap just remember the advice given in this forum. I have learned a lot. Well done Aus, like Gavink I only wish I had read this before I started
paulajayne
View Profile
Inner circle
London England
1160 Posts

Profile of paulajayne
Cheep tricks with BIG effects and always favorites.

Sponge balls
Th*** T**

A challange for your self - design a 10 minute close up routing using just those two items.

We all have cupboards full of magic which was tried once and then never used.

Paula
Paula Jay - Magic to Remember -
---------------------------------
I once wrote a book on elephants, I think paper would have been better.
----
Peter Marucci
View Profile
Inner circle
5389 Posts

Profile of Peter Marucci
Aus,
Some excellent points.
But I have to disagree very strongly with one:

"Which brings us to the next thing you are paying for, and that is the secret."

If that were really the case, then I would buy the "vanishing widget" for $10. If I wanted another, it should be less than $10, since I already know the secret.
But it isn't.

I market several of my own creations. At lectures, I demonstrate these effects at the end and then explain in detail how they work and how the magi at the lecture could make them themselves if they wished. However, several would require the destruction of, for example, several decks of cards and the final price would be higher in making one for yourself than buying one from me (because I make many at a time).

The hapless magic public have for ages been sold a bill of goods when it comes to "buying the secret". Frankly, that point is a load of rubbish! (But, as I said, the other points are excellent!)
Aus
View Profile
Special user
Australia
890 Posts

Profile of Aus
So the hesitation in the magic shop owner to give away the secret would be why Peter? Why do magicians and creators and magic shops push the perception that this is indeed the case? If not for the secret then the effort it took to develop it maybe? Just would like to know your reasoning for this Peter

Magically

Aus
Derek Dean
View Profile
Regular user
Monterey, CA
126 Posts

Profile of Derek Dean
A wonderful discussion. Personally I still enjoy the many things I've bought over the years. In fact I've come to the conclusion that I'm more of a collector of magic than a performer. But even as a collector I've found it wise to be skeptical of ads.

For years I've made the journey to a particular magic shop in San Francisco and spent the whole day there. I know the owner and his assistant/demonstator well, and they know me and just what I'm looking for.

They show me stuff, tell me the "secret", and let me handle everything before I make any desicions. They steer me away from inferior quality items that they might sell to "tourists". Yes, it does cost more, but I always come away happy and I always return the following year. I just feel lucky to have found such a nice shop to deal with.
stuper1
View Profile
New user
California
100 Posts

Profile of stuper1
Excellent post, Aus, and thanks to the others for other good posts. In my hometown, we used to have a good magic shop, but they have closed their doors and now only sell on the internet. I can buy things cheaper from other internet dealers who have lower prices and don't charge for shipping. I don't feel any loyalty to a shop that closed its doors on me.
Sam Griffin
View Profile
Regular user
Australia
170 Posts

Profile of Sam Griffin
Aus,

Which Dealer is your local? I also live in Australia, N.S.W. - I'm Loyal to Hocus-Pocus. Why? Cause I don't think there is any shops around me. I live in Sydney.
You know of any?

Thanks man.
"When we are on stage, we are in the here and now."
"The eye is the window of your soul."

"The PERFORMER must BELIEVE in everything that takes place on the stage, only then will the AUDIENCE BELIEVE!
Aus
View Profile
Special user
Australia
890 Posts

Profile of Aus
This thread should answer that question: http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......um=41&13

Magically

Aus
Sam Griffin
View Profile
Regular user
Australia
170 Posts

Profile of Sam Griffin
That's Great Aus, Thanks heaps. Most appreciated.
"When we are on stage, we are in the here and now."
"The eye is the window of your soul."

"The PERFORMER must BELIEVE in everything that takes place on the stage, only then will the AUDIENCE BELIEVE!
JJP161
View Profile
Special user
Columbus, Ohio
504 Posts

Profile of JJP161
Aus, thank-you for such a great post, like many here I've learned the hard way from years of buying magic I will never use. One fantastic point is the magic must fit you and your act. I may read 20 reviews of an item that everyone loves to only find I don't like it at all and of course the reverse is true as well. For instance I heard many bad reviews of the Sanada Gimmick and then saw it but "didn't see it" in the hands of Dan Garrett and Scott Guinn and saw what a powerful tool it can be. Nonetheless thank-you and all that have contributed to this post very much, to many this advice will be priceless.

Joe
DrNorth
View Profile
Veteran user
North Starr Entertainment, Harrisburg PA
364 Posts

Profile of DrNorth
I know that some, having mentioned it here, and heard it elsewhere, do not appreciate Eugene Burgers approach will fail to see the idea of "You own too much magic already" as being valid. God knows I have a basement full of stuff ZI have yet to master. I find that I end up spending money I can ill afford to just to learn the method more then anything else. Now I am scaling back to 5-6 well rehearsed effects and sticking with them. Polishing the performance rather then changing effects. With one or two back ups for returning viewers, in restaurant work for example.
Another trap even seasoned magicians fall into is buying magician foolers. Good God how many brain wave deck methods does one need? All lay people see is an odd backed card in a given deck, they don't care how it got there, but I knew a guy..ok it was me, who had six different brain wave effects just to fool the guys at the club, what a waste of my time and energy!! But, in clubs some guys get too focused on the contests, and the "judges" get too focused on was I fooled ort have I seen it before, rather then was it a good performance. Just because you know how cups and balls was done don't discount the effect or the performers handling. Oy but that's a whole new thread.
In short, look at what you want to achieve ask for a demo if you ar eat a live shop, if not, ask here I am sure you'll get enough feedback as to if an effect is good or not, last..don't be dissappointed by the method, you may look at it and think That's it! That's all? How easy! So what, did it look good? Did it fool you? It will probably fool them.
Smile
"For it shows things that were, and things that are, and things that yet may be. But which it that he sees, even the wisest cannot always tell"
~Galadriel

"A heretic is a man who sees with his own eyes."
Justin S E Hardy
View Profile
New user
7 Posts

Profile of Justin S E Hardy
Hay aus Great post and thanks for tips all I am just starting off.
Seen my brother in law use this post because he does magic all the time so I thought I would check it out.
Seems to be working great on my end. Thanks all!!
Tom Cutts
View Profile
Staff
Northern CA
5419 Posts

Profile of Tom Cutts
When starting out or just getting back in to magic there is nothing like a swapmeet or flea market to get great deals on a huge array of different things. If this interests you, you might want to check out this thread.

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......rum=30&0


Cheers,

Tom
magicbymccauley
View Profile
Special user
827 Posts

Profile of magicbymccauley
I agree with Dr. North, and I have something to add:

Packet Tricks are the absolute nut low awful badness.

You should never, ever buy a packet trick.

Okay, I have found two good packet tricks in all of magicdom. One is B'wave by Phil Goldstien, and the other is Michael Skinner's Ultimate 3 Card Monte. That's it. If you want those, buy them, they're the only good ones out there. The rest (including ones that I've never heard of, and haven't been invented yet) are all awful.

Here's the thing. If you are really interested in packet tricks, go out and buy Nick Trost's book. He is an authority on Packet tricks and he will tell you how to make them in his book: "The Card Magic of Nick Trost". Another good book with packet trick in it is Phil Goldstien's "Focus". Buy a "mixed" deck of cards, some double facers, double backers, blanks and so forth. Then buy some roughing fluid. That's your best bet. If you get really into it, you can buy entire blank decks, entire deck of double facers and so forth.

$15 for a set of four or five cards is a awful financial transaction from your perspective. One packet trick is equal to 1/2 a book or video. Think about what you could be getting for your money instead of five funny looking playing cards that can't be examined and require sleights you're no good at anyway.

If all this fails and you still have an urge to buy packet tricks, try this:

Go into a room with very little furniture a nice big hardwood floor. Bring three brand new decks. Open the decks and cascade them randomly all over the floor. Then spray your entire body with roughing fluid and lay down on the floor. Roll around in the cards until the urge to by packet tricks diminishes.

It really works for me, I haven't bought a packet trick in years.
"Tricks are about objects, Magic is about life."
-Max Maven
lynnef
View Profile
Inner circle
1089 Posts

Profile of lynnef
I've noticed that Michael Ammar's card miracle series usually includes a packet trick as one of the bonuses. His advice is to use the packet tricks sparingly as part of a set. Darwin Ortiz says you must have a reason to bring out a packet (eg "I saw this guy play 3 card monte like this...."). So I'm not against packet tricks at all; but they should fit into a routine and not relied on. About buying the packets? why not make them.
loved all discussions on this topic of buying magic.
blade
View Profile
Loyal user
Philippines
208 Posts

Profile of blade
Quote:
On 2004-04-08 02:21, Black Hart wrote:
I've just browsed through this thread and believe me from a dealers point of view it was very interesting. At Black Artefacts we are always very interested to get a handle on the customers point of view.

I started Black Artefacts 8 years ago because I was interested in weird and bizarre magic, but in the UK and Europe there were no dealers specialising in this genre. I had no idea that it would grow the way it has. I had no real idea about the business of magic dealing. I wanted to be able to supply the kind of effects and props that I myself would like to purchase. I also wanted Black Artefacts to be the sort of magic dealer that I would like to deal with.

My philosopy was: good quality, fair price, honesty, a range of exclusive effects.

I never wanted to be the sort of dealer who buys cheap wholesale packet tricks and then sells them to all and sundry.

Let me state now that Black Artefacts is a commercial business. We invest a lot of money in equipment, stock, time developing new effects, general running costs including credit card transactions and one full time member of staff. All of this has to be taken into account when setting prices.

However I do feel that over the 8 years we have stuck to our principles.

For example how many magic dealers offer an unconditional 90 day money back guarantee? Yes, you can return any product within 90 days and we will refund the purchase price in full - no questions asked.

Why do we do this? Simple. We want our customers to be able to shop with confidence. As has been mentioned if you purchase something you are dissapointed with, you (the customer) feels cheated and you may not deal with that dealer again. However if you can send it back and get your money back or request a different item instead, then the chances are that you will use that dealer again. It is a win win situation.

Of course we are open to the devious person who may want to copy a book, steal a secret or copy a video. But we feel that people trust us to send them the items ordered so we must trust them as well. In actual fact we get very few items returned because we are honest in our descriptions and dealings.

Also we never try to sell customers anything that we do not think is suitable for them. What is the point - you will have a dissatisfied customer.

At Black Artefacts you can speak by telephone or email to the person who actualy developed the effect, purchased the props and uses them in real life preforming situations.

I believe that all of this makes a real difference to the experience of buying magic.

Of course we ARE human and will occasionaly mess things up. Sometimes we will be waiting for delivery of an item that we need to manufacture an effect. But we will always tell you if there is a delay and we will do whatever is possible to rectify a problem. We find that our customers appreciate this and we find that we have many regular customers who are now more like friends than just customers. It makes the business of magic dealing an enjoyable exberience for BOTH the customer and the dealer.

Our genre of magic may not be to the liking of all magicians, but it was never intended to be so. We are a specialist dealer for a niche market and we intend to stay that way.

Anyway there has been some good advice on this thread, especially the bit about asking questions. Ask away, it's your money bt remember there is a bit more to being a magic dealer than just buying in cheap tat and bumping it out again at twice the price...at least for some of us anyway.

:)

Black Hart


and now, a word from our sponsors... lol... just kidding... can't find your site... do you have a link? I want to look around your shop Black Hart...
salamangkero/musikero

boj_ice@yahoo.com
cerberusdog
View Profile
New user
OH
1 Post

Profile of cerberusdog
This will show to anyone how new I am to magic, but I have to ask, "What is a packet trick?" I've seen the term in a few posts I read but don't know what it means. Can anyone help me?
Thanks
SamChak
View Profile
Veteran user
367 Posts

Profile of SamChak
Quote:
On Jan 10, 2016, cerberusdog wrote:
This will show to anyone how new I am to magic, but I have to ask, "What is a packet trick?" I've seen the term in a few posts I read but don't know what it means. Can anyone help me?
Thanks


Packet tricks are effects that do not use an entire deck of cards, only a few cards, such as Three-Card Monte, 21-Card Trick, Oil and Water, Dai Vernon's Twisting the Aces, Paul Harris' Re-Set, John Bannon's Twisted Sisters, and so on. You can find many effects of this kind in the "Deckless!" section.
"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science."

~ Albert Einstein ~
US (German-born) physicist (1879 - 1955)
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » New to magic? » » Buying Magic (A how-to Guide) (33 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3~4~5~6 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2017 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.19 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL