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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Set list for a Cruise Ship (5 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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thomasR
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I base it on the fact that I see Juggler / magicians working in Orlando, Branson, Pigeon Forge, etc.
Dannydoyle
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Got it.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Ray Pierce
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I think cruise ships tend to be an invisible market to the outside world. Unless you're actually working on the ships, you have no idea what goes on, the rules, the demands, the standards or anything else. Unless you have experienced peers you can trust to give you good information, it is really a blind leap onto an island. I was very lucky in my early years that there was a lower end line doing Mexico runs out of Los Angeles that gave me a chance to get my feet wet and learn the market. With most of the lines going to these megaships, there aren't as many places to get in at an entry level. I just finished designing the magic for a new ice show that's going on to the Harmony of the Seas. The ship is massive! As you know, they also are not willing to take a chance with an unknown commodity or act. It seems that people who are not familiar with the market view it as a field to just jump in to. The big leagues are not where you start but where you end up.
Ray Pierce
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thomasR
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Do you really consider cruise ships to be the "Big Leagues"? I know of performers who regularly work cruise ships, and I wouldn't consider them top level performers.
They have good, solid, commercial material. But they aren't doing anything particularly unique or original. (I'm thinking of stand up acts... not someone with a "headline" show like when Jason Bishop performs on cruise lines for example).

The point I'm trying to make is... I really don't see it as being that difficult. If you are a good performer, with a good commercial act... you should audition. If you get the job... you'll figure it out. Everyone has to start somewhere. If you're not a good performer with a good commercial act.... work on that first. ha.
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On May 9, 2016, thomasR wrote:
I base it on the fact that I see Juggler / magicians working in Orlando, Branson, Pigeon Forge, etc.


Do you consider Branson or Pigen Forge the big leagues?

And are you guessing at these posts or are you currently working in these markets?

Do you believe you have to do unique original material to be booked regularly?

No offense but you seem to have several misconceptions working here.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
thomasR
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No offense taken. I'm just participating in the discussion and not making any claims. I do work full time in the live entertainment industry, but not as a performer.

To answer your question... I consider Branson and Pigeon Forge to be as "Big League" as Cruise Ships, yes. Obviously a headline show in Branson is a higher level than a guest spot on a cruise. Likewise a headline show on a cruise, is a higher level than a short stand-up segment in a Pigeon Forge variety show.

No I do not believe you have to do original material to be booked regularly. You have to have strong, commercial material.
Ray Pierce
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Quote:
On May 10, 2016, thomasR wrote:
Do you really consider cruise ships to be the "Big Leagues"?


Lol, there I go getting in trouble making sports references! There are hundreds if not thousands of athletes playing professionally in what most people would call the big leagues. It is just a way of separating the working pros from the people in the minor (or bush) leagues who are still learning their craft and haven't necessarily proven themselves under fire. Are there a WIDE range of performers that have worked on ships? Of course as there are a wide range of salaries and needs in different categories of performance. It's the same in any field.

My point was simply that it is not a place to learn to be a professional but a place to go after you've learned that.
Ray Pierce
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Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On May 10, 2016, thomasR wrote:
No offense taken. I'm just participating in the discussion and not making any claims. I do work full time in the live entertainment industry, but not as a performer.

To answer your question... I consider Branson and Pigeon Forge to be as "Big League" as Cruise Ships, yes. Obviously a headline show in Branson is a higher level than a guest spot on a cruise. Likewise a headline show on a cruise, is a higher level than a short stand-up segment in a Pigeon Forge variety show.

No I do not believe you have to do original material to be booked regularly. You have to have strong, commercial material.


What do you do in the entertainment industry? Do you have personal experience with Branson?
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
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Funny how perception is so different than the real thing. I think there is some opinion vs. fact clearly at work here as you two seem to be coming from opposite ends on this, one with vast experience and the other just perceiving. Having spent the summer in Branson last year, trust me reality is different than perception.
TomBoleware
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ThomasR,

I like the way you said this,

Quote:
On May 10, 2016, thomasR wrote:

No I do not believe you have to do original material to be booked regularly. You have to have strong, commercial material.


because I’ve never believed that “original” material is as important as some make it out to be. Magicians like to insist that other magicians be completely different from everyone else, but the truth is, the public will never see all those other magicians.

May be a shocking statement to some but I’m willing to bet that the average person will never see more than two (if that many) magic shows in a lifetime.

So I think ‘Strong’ is the key word. It’s not so much about being different, it’s about being better.


Tom
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Dannydoyle
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Having lived, performed, produced and consulted in Branson for a decade I think you are right. Having worked on cruise ships is a different perspective than just having an opinion.

I just am curious what that opinion is based upon is all. Thomas can think anything he wants and express it freely. I just don't think it is wrong to ask what informed that opinion.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
charliecheckers
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Quote:
On May 10, 2016, thomasR wrote:
Do you really consider cruise ships to be the "Big Leagues"? I know of performers who regularly work cruise ships, and I wouldn't consider them top level performers.
They have good, solid, commercial material. But they aren't doing anything particularly unique or original. (I'm thinking of stand up acts... not someone with a "headline" show like when Jason Bishop performs on cruise lines for example).

The point I'm trying to make is... I really don't see it as being that difficult. If you are a good performer, with a good commercial act... you should audition. If you get the job... you'll figure it out. Everyone has to start somewhere. If you're not a good performer with a good commercial act.... work on that first. ha.


Ray shared some really great insights and you choose to question the very last point while ignoring most of what he shared. Having "good, solid, commercial material" is only the very beginning. It has to fill an unmet need for a particular cruise. I would guess more than anything, dependability and reliability plays a huge factor. This is why Ray shared that an unknown simply auditioning is not likely to succeed. Referrals from trusted sources would be a huge factor. The OP has the perspective I once had. I thought it would be exciting to work a cruise ship for the summer. Many people (lay people) also asked me if I ever thought of it and that I would be great at it. Participating here made me realize quickly that pursuit of such a venture would be fool hearty in my situation. The best advice for the OP is to have more practical, reachable goals. Establish a step program towards working cruise ships (if that remains his desire). The only way to know how high the staircase is, is to listen to those here (or elsewhere) who know.
thomasR
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Quote:
On May 10, 2016, charliecheckers wrote:


Ray shared some really great insights and you choose to question the very last point while ignoring most of what he shared.[/quote]

I'm sorry that I came off that way. Was not my intention... I thought Ray made some excellent points. What's more.. Ray has real-world experience in that line of work. I don't.

My perspective is, I know performers (about 7 total, magician and jugglers) who work cruises on an almost part time basis. They pretty much do treat it like a paid vacation. They work a cruise for a few weeks here and there, each year.
They are pro performers and have good solid material. They have an act relatively the size of the OP's proposed act. Watching them, and hearing them talk, it doesn't seem that difficult to get booked on cruises and work them as you see fit for your schedule. (provided of course, you have good, solid, commercial material.)
Dannydoyle
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Provided you are willing to work for free, as a trade for the cruise.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Dannydoyle
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As for what is and is not the big leagues let me say the following.

You do not have to be a household name to be in the big leagues even in baseball or pick a sport. How many quarterbacks can you name not from your city? Or pitchers, point guards or hockey players? There are guys with single diget game minutes every year who are in the big leagues and in the top 1% of their profession.

I think ANYONE working with magic as a sole means of support has made it. This includes kid show magicians doing a bazilluon shows a weekend qualify. So to answer the silly question Yea cruise ships are big leagues. A guy working them for trade might not be.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Ray Pierce
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Quote:
On May 10, 2016, thomasR wrote:
They have an act relatively the size of the OP's proposed act. Watching them, and hearing them talk, it doesn't seem that difficult to get booked on cruises and work them as you see fit for your schedule. (provided of course, you have good, solid, commercial material.)


I can only speak from my experience and that of the acts I know well (and it depends on the length of the cruise) but I don't know any lines where you just need 1 act. You will sometimes need a small production spot for the opening night show, at least 1 full length show, a smaller show (sometimes splitting the bill, sometimes for a smaller room) as well as a compliment of other things like lectures and other sets to round out the cruise. I would always plan on having at least 2 hours of solid material before even thinking about that market. Again, You are being asked to carry a show yourself for 45 minutes which took me about 10 years of performing constantly to work up to. I did a 15 minute spot for many years, then eventually learned to carry a 25-30 minute slot. Eventually after a lot of work I was able to carry 45 minutes alone but don't underestimate how hard that is. Ask Danny and the other guys who do that how many years it took to master that time on stage. Yes, the tricks are a good start but there is a lot more to it. I am fond of saying that just because you put flour, butter, sugar and eggs in a pan, that doesn't mean a cake is going to come out. Do your homework then master your craft!
Ray Pierce
<BR>www.HollywoodAerialArts.com
Dannydoyle
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It is the equivalent of saying that all you need to do is know how to fly the plane to be a pilot.

And worse yet being told that by someone who is not a pilot and can't even fly the plane.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Donald Dunphy
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As a part of your research into that market, you probably should check out this information.

http://magicianbusiness.com/cruise-ship-magician/

http://magicianbusiness.com/cruise-ship-......-becker/

Fred Becker's Cruise Ship Course: http://gigsonships.com/

- Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
Jerskin
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I worked ships for 30 years.
The effects in your "set list" are mostly too small for the 1200-1700 seat showrooms.
Plus, not sure razor blades & human blockhead will sit well (There are children in the audience. Sometimes lots of them)
GrEg oTtO

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R Don
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I was a passenger on a cruise last month.
The magician did 2- 45 minute shows that were different;
and that was only a 4 night cruise.
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