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Mindpro Eternal Order 10618 Posts 
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I'm betting even if you asked Copperfield he would be the first to tell you he is not a mentalist and doesn't want to be seen as one.
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Mindpro Eternal Order 10618 Posts
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Quote:
On May 31, 2016, SolidSnake wrote: UNDERSTATEMENT OF THE MILLENNIUM!!! |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2604 Posts
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On May 31, 2016, Mindpro wrote: This is SUCH a valuable concept! You can call yourself a mentalist but that doesn't mean you are perceived as one by the viewer. It's the same for any artform. The term "Mentalist" is something that is awarded to you by the audience when you've earned it. It's more about perception then what you want to claim. The "Star" performer is a different category as they are seen as an "exceptional artist" in many ways and have skills that transcend definitions and labels. David Copperfield (although an amazing illusionist) never really fit into this category for me as much as David Blaine did. David B. had an aura about him that created a mystique about his "powers". The other one that more powerfully does this you probably haven't heard of yet. His name is Ahmed el Bayed who is a big star in the Middle East. The common thought over there is that he has special powers but conceals them by doing magic tricks so he can blend into society. lol... I'm not kidding, that is how he is actually perceived! It allows him to shift into any type of effect with ease and be totally believable. Unfortunately, not everyone can pull off those characters so we need to focus on one cohesive image that the audience can accept.
Ray Pierce
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
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Slim- You keep using the odd phrase "mentalism effects" and then jump to the conclusion that anyone who performs them is, therefore, a mentalist.
The effects are called "mental effects." (As in "Practical Mental Effects.")Whether or not they are mentalism or mental magic depends on who's doing them and the context in which they are performed. Copperfield, as everyone seems to understand except you, is a famous magician who sometimes includes mental effects in his magic show. He has NEVER held himself out to be a mentalist. Why do you insist on trolling this topic whenever it comes up? |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18028 Posts
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Let's look at the definitions (As I always recommend)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mentalism This link puts David Copperfield on the same level as The Amazing Kreskin !!!!!! A person who performs mentalism is a mentalist ... it's just that simple .. Even though he's the greatest magician of our era. I know it's sour grapes for many of you ...but it's a fact. http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mentalist http://www.yourdictionary.com/mentalisth......entalist
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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Mindpro Eternal Order 10618 Posts
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But he doesn't perform mentalism. He is a magician that perform mental effects.
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18028 Posts
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Quote:
On May 30, 2016, Sleepymentalism wrote: I agree ... A person can be a Dr. and a Lawyer. Nothing prevents them. In the same way a person can be a Magician and a Mentalist.
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts
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I've asked to be banned
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18028 Posts
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Quote:
On May 31, 2016, IAIN wrote: Exactly ... a person can play both Pop and Blues!!!!!
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts
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You've failed this troll attempt...better luck next time!
I've asked to be banned
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
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Quote:
On May 31, 2016, Slim King wrote: Yes, it refers them both as magicians! Not surprised you didn't actually quote the Wikipedia article because it directly contradicts your silly notion that Copperfield is a mentalist. Here's the very section you conveniently neglected to mention: Quote: ...However, many magicians mix mentally-themed performance with magic illusions. For example, a mind-reading stunt might also involve the magical transposition of two different objects. Such hybrid feats of magic are often called mental magic by performers. Magicians who routinely mix magic with mental magic include David Copperfield, David Blaine, The Amazing Kreskin, and Dynamo. |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18028 Posts
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Exactly ... Copperfield is just like Kreskin!!!!! Kreskin was a Hypnotist first. He also does card tricks .. I've seen him do them. The card tricks don't prevent him from being a mentalist. I've personally worked with Copperfield and he IMHO is a fantastic Mind Reader. His presentations are flawless. His mind reading skills are better than anyone I've ever seen with the exception of J. C..... a VIP here on the Café. So to answer the question of the OP .. YES ... You can be both. Many performers do it. In fact I've seen Mentalists do balloon work!!!!! Being a good magician does not disqualify you from being a good mentalist.
I myself separate the two in performance for obvious reasons. Neither do I give a disclaimer.
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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Twisted Mentat Regular user Giedi Prime 147 Posts
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On May 31, 2016, Slim King wrote: And the reason is that you are a troll? 
Just kidding. |
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Axel Elite user Berlin 456 Posts
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On May 31, 2016, Slim King wrote: Man, this sounds quite manic... |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
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Nah, Axel, this is just Slim's trolling style. He ignores any facts that prove him wrong and then just keeps repeating the same thing over and over ad nauseum. He has never, as far as I can recall, admitted to being wrong about anything, whether he understands a topic or not.
The next stage will be more of the same, but with lots of exclamation points and dancing fruits and vegetables. |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2604 Posts
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Quote:
...However, many magicians mix mentally-themed performance with magic illusions. For example, a mind-reading stunt might also involve the magical transposition of two different objects. Such hybrid feats of magic are often called mental magic by performers. Ah yes, there is little more convincing then those "mind-reading stunts"! Isn't the real issue when people place mental effect into the "hybrid" category with the solid implication that it is ultimately a "trick"? It MUST be viewed as a totally separate process and ability.
Ray Pierce
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Axel Elite user Berlin 456 Posts
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On May 31, 2016, mastermindreader wrote: I've seen him do it quite often.I just don't understand what motivates him. |
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts
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On May 31, 2016, mastermindreader wrote: there's a joke waiting to be said...i shall just mentally transmit it whilst producing sponge rabbits from inside a sealed envelope...
I've asked to be banned
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18028 Posts
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Quote:
On May 31, 2016, Axel wrote: Manic??? ... because I have a difference of opinion? Or because I walk the walk?
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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MagicalEducator Veteran user 369 Posts
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Some would say no but just because they say it with conviction doesn't make it so. One can do magic, mentalism all within the same character. There will be those that oppose this notion and despite the fact that some most famous mentalists have done so. These inconvenient facts won't dissuade them from their fervent beliefs. Most intelligent people know it's a trick...as in magic. Watch as they gather to defend their sacred art and in doing so denigrate magic and magicians. It's so typical and tedious.
Jeff
Voted "Canada's Most Inspirational Magician"
www.MagicalEducator.com Check out my column "Magic is Education" in Vanish Magazine |
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| The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Can you be a magician and mentalist?? (129 Likes) | ||||||||||
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Posted: May 31, 2016 05:24 pm 
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