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The Duster Inner circle 1693 Posts |
So Saturn have some collectable Bikes
I decide to PM Karl to let him know - as he likes to collect cards I get this message The user "Karl M" is currently banned at The Magic Café Any idea why he was banned [?] As he has always seemed harmless - I was surprised he had done something to get banned Sorry for the derail Anyway for anyone who does collect decks http://www.saturnmagic.co.uk/saturn-magi......ick.html |
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JackMagic Inner circle 1982 Posts |
Anyone that collects cards only has to look at the never ending PM from Steve Brooks sometimes with just a day inbetween yet another collectable "Limited" run
If I was given $ for every post about collectable cards I could retire now |
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Thorn (UK) New user United Kingdom 52 Posts |
There are many reasons for collecting, whether it's cards, stamps or comic books. And for many magicians, cards are the ultimate symbol of being a magician, and collecting them or obsessing over them is a positive affirmation of their, for want of a better word, 'magicianess'.
For myself though, I've never really been that into card magic. I acknowledge there's a lot of exceedingly good material a magician can do with a deck of playing cards, however my personal feeling (and I suspect I'm deeply in the minority here) is that playing cards are really, really overused. I like to think that if someone 'really' had magical powers they wouldn't use them to make a playing card disappear, change the colour on the back, or rise to the top of a deck. Sometimes I really feel like telling a magician to put down the playing cards and think about doing something more 'magical' instead! |
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Thorn (UK) New user United Kingdom 52 Posts |
Oh and yes, I do see the irony of me saying that while my profile picture is of me with cards!
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MazingMandy Special user Has tolerated the trolls here for 676 Posts |
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On Aug 7, 2017, The Duster wrote: I thought he'd been quiet lately. |
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EndersGame Inner circle Reviewer EndersGame 2196 Posts |
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On Apr 23, 2017, JackMagic wrote: I collect and review decks of custom playing cards, and have been involved both with card magic and cardistry for quite some time, so I think I can shed some light on the original question. I would identify a number of different factors that have contributed to the rapid growth of the custom playing card market: 1. CROWD-FUNDING: A big factor is the arrival of Kickstarter crowd-funding in 2012. Prior to this, the world of custom playing cards was small, and dominated by publishing companies like Ellusionist and Theory11. Kickstarter changed that, and caused the custom playing card industry to explode, so that today we live in an era where the market is flooded with all kinds of custom decks. Technology has reached a stage where the smart graphic designer can create a quality deck of playing cards from his desktop computer at home, then partner with quality printing companies, harness the marketing power of crowd-funding via Kickstarter, and produce a lovely deck of playing cards. I've documented this development in my article here: The life-changing Kickstarter success story of Tyler Deeb. 2. CARDISTRY: Another factor is the emergence of cardistry as a legitimate and separate art-form. Card flourishing comes with a unique set of requirements, and while this includes the high performance handling that magicians have always wanted, it adds to this the need for visuals that showcase the look of a deck of cards. As a result, we've seen the rise of custom playing cards which are designed exclusively for cardistry, and new decks keep appearing all the time to meet the needs and wants of cardists. Perhaps the most well-known example here is the Virtuoso deck, which was arguably the world's first deck that was created specifically for card flourishing, as I documented in my article here: The world's first ever cards created just for cardistry. An extreme example of this trend would be the School of Cardistry decks created by the New Deck Order, as shown here: The New Deck Order's non-standard playing cards. Many of the decks produced by expert card flourishers Dan and Dave Buck under their "Art of Play" label would also fall into this category, as shown here: Playing cards for cardists from the Art of Play paradise. 3. COLLECTORS: Another factor driving the growing market for custom playing cards is the collector. Some people just love the novelty of custom designs, and appreciate high end artwork and unique designs, and purchase playing cards simply for their beauty and uniqueness. It may seem odd to some, but some collectors will even keep these decks sealed in shrink-wrap, and never open them. Regardless of what you think about that, the reality is that collectors can never have enough, and this creates a demand that ensures that new designs will continue to find buyers. Popular designers like Robinson Jackson, Jody Eklund, Steve Minty, Lorenzo Gaggiotti (Stockholm17), Alex Chin, and others have a legion of loyal fans who will back their new designs almost immediately, and so any Kickstarters these designers launch will almost always get funded immediately. Collectors are also attracted by novelty and bling, so anything different or out-of-the-ordinary will usually get support as well, especially in the wider market of the general public outside of magic, and for use in playing card games or even just as a novelty for the shelf. 4. CASH: Generally speaking, we are living in a time of affluence, and a lot of people have large amounts of disposable income. Not only are a lot of designs of custom playing cards hitting the market, but many cardists and magicians are in a position that they have money to spend beyond the needs of their day-to-day living costs. As a result, the cash is there to support this industry, and keep it going, and even make it grow. When people have money to spend, dangle something new and shiny in front of them, and they'll buy it. 5. CHANGE: Magic is constantly evolving, and that's true of the cards used by magicians as well. All of the above means that the market is being flooded with custom playing cards. Since they are so readily available, often at a affordable cost, we are seeing this influence the magic profession as well. Over the last decade, the internet has had a huge impact on the world of magic, because video technology makes it easy for us to see video trailers of products, and performances of other magicians. Given the wide choice of custom playing cards available, some magicians are starting to use custom playing cards in their professional work. There was a time where it was seen as foolish to use a custom deck of cards instead of a standard Bicycle rider-back deck, because it would arouse suspicion that it was a trick deck. But that's changing, and with some magicians starting to use custom decks, and performing magic in online videos and trailers, it's becoming more normal for the rest of the world to start using custom decks in magic as well, and the general public starts to get more used to this as well. I suspect that this trend will continue. Magicians do have unique needs, so the degree of customization can't be too significant - the cards need to look easily recognizable and familiar, so it is important that they be functional, and not be customized in the way a cardistry deck is. But as long as the cards are very clear and functional, a custom deck can be used. A bonus result of this is that it can make a customized marked deck look less suspicious, because people are becoming more used to a non-traditional deck being used more widely. 6. CHARACTER: Everyone likes to personalize their magic. That's important for your patter, your presentation, and your persona. It's only a small step to extend this to your props, including the playing cards you use. Again, as long as they aren't customized to the point that they distract from your magic, they can add small amounts of personality, style, and elegance to a performance. Even on a personal level, I find that it can be nice to change things up by playing around with a different deck of cards, just like someone might choose a different pair of shoes or shirt depending on their mood, or how they want to look. For example, a luxurious looking tuck box can add a real sense of sophistication and class to what you are doing, and if this fits with your performance style, this might actually strengthen your professionalism. So it can also depend on what you're doing, and whether you are going for a slick professional look in an intimate close-up setting, or a casual street magic approach - different decks might suit each situation, and while some would demand a traditional Bicycle deck, others might be stronger when using a custom deck of cards. You pick the right tool for the job you need to do. As such, I don't see this development as a negative, because it adds potential for new elements in how you use cards. Some of us like variety in aesthetics, and since magic is at bottom an art form, art can take into consideration elements like the visuals. If you're interested in seeing some of the great decks of custom playing cards that are out there, you can find a complete list of my series of detailed pictorial reviews of many decks here: Pictorial Reviews of Playing Cards by EndersGame I also have another list which showcases some of the more amazing custom designs that have been produced: The Most Amazing Decks of Playing Cards You Have Ever Seen |
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pelicantrapper Regular user VA 193 Posts |
Literally every day a new kickstarter. I Love XCM / Flourishes / Cardistry. But D.A.M.N.
I'll never understand how some cards sell for so much money so soon. IE - Fontaines. They are aesthetically pleasing but how does something become so popular, so rare, so expensive, so fast? Cardistry, having its very strong community though, the young crowd, and a growing art form. I believe is the answer. I would have been purchasing Fontaines out the a.s.s. 8 years ago. I love De'Vos "Angry Pussies" and I can't wait for De'Vos Rainbow Unicorn Funtime. My Ultimate Favorite is Ellusionists Black Deck. But now. Blue and Red Bicycles Forever Over Here. Easy to source, sexy finish. Can't beat Bikes. Unless you're Tally Ho (; |
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EndersGame Inner circle Reviewer EndersGame 2196 Posts |
Here's a few additional thoughts as to what accounts for the rise and growth of the custom playing card industry, besides the six factors I mentioned already in my previous post:
7. CONSUMABLES: All card magicians need to replace their decks of playing cards on a regular basis, since cards do wear out, and lose the ability to spread and fan smoothly over time. So both professional and amateur magicians alike will be buying playing cards no matter what - it's an inevitable reality of life that goes along with the trade. A deck of playing cards is simply not the kind of magic prop that you only buy once and then can use for the rest of your life, but it's a consumable. So there is a steady market of regular users who need new playing cards from time to time, and will be buying replacement products. This means that there is already a large and established market of those who are purchasing playing cards for conjuring use and card magic. Customized cards are just another way to meet this existing and ongoing need, and they give magicians a greater choice and variety to pick from. 8. COMPETITION: The makers of the Bicycle brand of playing cards, United States Playing Card Company (USPCC), has been around for a long time, and is certainly an industry giant with a wonderful reputation for quality. Their playing cards continue to have a monopoly type dominance in the playing card industry, and they have to be considered the main publisher of quality decks of cards, including those used for card magic. But times are changing, and with advances in technology, we are seeing other publishers stepping up, and in some cases even raising the bar. Smaller publishing companies like Expert Playing Card Company and Legends Playing Card Company operate out of Taiwan, and have mastered printing processes that equals and in some ways even exceeds the quality of USPCC produced playing cards. They have super smooth edges and more consistent printing registration than USPCC decks, and are often packaged in more elaborate and lavish tuck boxes. As a result, custom playing cards are often of the highest quality, at a level that matches and rivals the big name USPCC competitor. The rise of this competition has led to quality products that in some cases make these playing cards from other publishers a legitimate preference for some buyers and magicians, who actually prefer the handling qualities and feel of the competition. 9. COVETOUSNESS: It's an inevitable quality of human nature to want more things. We are good at buying more stuff - often things that we don't even need, just because it looks good, and we think it will make us happy. The word "covetousness" captures this well - it refers to an inherent greed, and an insatiable appetite that admires the next and newest thing, and enjoys acquiring new things. This is a quality that many of us share, and inevitably leads to a collector's mindset, where we see stunning decks of playing cards, and can't help ourselves from buying them. It's not hard to see that this characteristic also contributes to supporting a custom playing card industry. 10. CREATIVITY: The potential for new types of playing cards is limited only by the human imagination; which is to say, the scope is almost boundless. Almost every week or month, someone is going to come up with some new or exciting idea that just hasn't been considered before, and that even applies to the world of playing cards. As a result, new designs are emerging into the marketplace which are clever, creative, and beautiful, in ways we haven't seen before. It's safe to say that the level of quality and creativity is generally on the increase. Projects that would have easily funded on Kickstarter five years ago, simply won't make the grade today, because they're just not good enough. Part of this is due to the higher volume of playing cards that are entering the market, and a greater level of competition. But another factor is that the large range of playing cards that are being designed today corresponds to a greater number of decks that have a high level of inventiveness and originality. As a result, custom playing cards are appearing that are ingenious, stunning, or otherwise irresistibly attractive. No wonder it is then hard to resist purchasing them! |
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MaxfieldsMagic Inner circle Instead of practicing, I made 3009 Posts |
Although a lot of the custom decks coming out these days seem kinda “meh” IMO, every once in awhile a deck comes out that you just have to admire, and perhaps has the potential to legitimately enhance a performance piece, or compliment the image of a magician playing a certain character. This new deck is a good example, IMO:
http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S24100 BTW - you know those deck collector’s crystal card frames some places sell? Seems that Ellusionist, T-11 and others would be smart to sell those at a huge discount. Let’s say you pick up a 60 deck acrylic wall mounted display case for $20 - chances are you’ll now be in the market for 60 different types of premium decks to fill it up. Like they say on the streets, “Kid, the first one’s always free.”
Now appearing nightly in my basement.
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greig ewen Elite user 473 Posts |
Think I'll stick to Bicycle/Tally-Ho and the occasional brick of DMC's. Glad I never went to deep into the 'gotta have em' limited stock recess of magicical playing cards, I'll watch the occasional unboxing video on YT like we all do but that's about it. Most of the content on the YT channels of some of the biggest names in the cyber world of Magic is all about their card collections, newest decks with the occasional flourish thrown in ..I must be missing something. Glad this thread is up as I've been thinking the same for a while.
Greig. |
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todsky Inner circle www.magicstore.ca 2354 Posts |
I opened up my new magic shop last year, and Murphys said I should have a bunch of custom decks. I'm from the generation of magicians who use either a blue or red Bicycle deck, so I didn't understand what the fuss is all about with these fancy shmancy decks. But I bought a bunch for the store, just to see what would happen. Well, I learned a few things:
First, magicians older than about 37 use the traditional Bicycle or Tally Ho decks, while magicians under 37 love these fancy decks. Being among the older demographic, I was skeptical about all these new decks, but to be honest, after having seen hundreds of them pass through my store, I have to admit that there are some very beautiful works of art in many of them. Not only that, but, as some have mentioned earlier, a certain style of deck can lend itself to a particular thematic presentation. For example, the gothic style Bicycle cards would work well for a Bizarre magician. Some decks that might actually appeal to the traditional workers are the different coloured Bicycle decks, because it makes for a nice change when a blue Bike card changes to yellow, for instance. I think having an interesting variety of decks can add some extra visual appeal to card magic. That being said, for my performances I'll probably stick to my blue and red Bicycles, because I'm happily set in my ways.
Todsky's Magic Shop: over 15,000 tricks, books, DVD s and Card decks. www.magicstore.ca
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FilmMagician Regular user 108 Posts |
When you see a great deck of cards with an amazing design you can't help but want them. It's like saying what's the deal with all these cars? Why doesn't everyone just use a Honda Civic? It's personal taste. And I think it goes further than just how they look. I love the way White Lions Series B cards feel more than Bikes. Or how Monarchs look and feel vs Tally-Ho's. It's an artistic form, why be bland and boring with the same cards all the time when there's so many gorgeous designs and stocks and feels out there? If I could buy 100 bricks right now though, they'd be White Lions Series B and I'd be happy forever. I practise with bikes and I'll obviously use them if they're on me. But are you really complaining about too many different card designs out there? lol
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EndersGame Inner circle Reviewer EndersGame 2196 Posts |
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On Dec 7, 2017, todsky wrote: This is a great and helpful post - thanks so much for sharing your experience as a magic retailer, and what you're seeing with magicians. It really shows that magic has gone through some transition in recent years. There was a time in years gone by when using a non-Bicycle deck would have been a bad move, because it would have aroused suspicion. But times have evidently changed, and it's now acceptable and not irresponsible to use a custom deck - with the proviso that it is actually functional, and that fancy schmancy art doesn't get in the way of clarity. Rather than being an obstacle to your card magic, in some cases this can actually strengthen your magic, if it fits with your persona or performance style, and the effect you are trying to create. Once again, it's great to hear from someone who has solid experience with the magic industry, and has a finger on the pulse of what magicians are actually doing. I found it especially fascinating to read your observations about how older and younger magicians are different in this regard. |
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MaxfieldsMagic Inner circle Instead of practicing, I made 3009 Posts |
Yeah, Todsky. Thanks for the empirical data. Interesting to know.
Now appearing nightly in my basement.
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theocreswell New user Surrey, UK 61 Posts |
Perhaps, excluding those who think it worth their time to collect cards in the hope that they can make a profit, those who collect cards are simply doing it because they like cards. Cards are at the epicenter of so much culture and life and energy, they have been used across the world by so many people in so many different situations, they connect people and give great happiness. I think that is pretty magical. There are so many beautiful packs of cards and such a range, the quirkiness of Odd Bods or the simplicity of NOCs or BEEs, cards are like tactile art. I think many people who collect cards do it for the same reason as someone who collects paintings, they just enjoy it
Who knows -T |
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johndevacmaker Special user 644 Posts |
About time this boring subject put to rest
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videoman Inner circle 6732 Posts |
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On Dec 13, 2017, johndevacmaker wrote: Okay Scrooge, please tell us what topics you find interesting and we'll make sure that those are all that we discuss. Because the Café really only exists for your enjoyment after all. |
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thomasP Regular user France 138 Posts |
Does someone think that using special cards or designs let people think there are gimmicked ?
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theocreswell New user Surrey, UK 61 Posts |
Having different cards isn't going to help when trying to convince your audience that you aren't using gimmicks, however if managed properly, they shouldn't really notice.
My thinking is that if the audience is questioning your props, you're doing something wrong anyway. -T |
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MaxfieldsMagic Inner circle Instead of practicing, I made 3009 Posts |
OK, this is my new favorite deck of cards. Hilarious! https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/101......ng-cards
Now appearing nightly in my basement.
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