The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workers » » Overhand shuffle - trouble running cards (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
Hi People,


I'm having trouble running cards during an overhand shuffle. I'd be surprised if this hadn't been addressed before on the Café, but I've only found one thread (on making running *sound* the same shuffling off packets). When I try to run cards they often come off in clumps, or at least pairs or triples. I watched an Aaron Fisher video on the topic, and I'm working on following his suggestions -- keep middle finger and thumb at same height, hold deck at a 45 degree angle to floor, bevel deck. Sometimes that advice helps a lot, other times it doesn't seem to help at all. So I'd be grateful for people's ideas about how to run consistently. It helps when I run slowly, but of course my goal is to be able to run quickly, but still accurately.


Thanks,


Bob
kShepher
View Profile
Regular user
Washington, DC
152 Posts

Profile of kShepher
Well, you'll get it. Try using SortKwik on your fingers. And just experiement with the pressure. It's really easy. Keep practicing.
alicauchy
View Profile
Loyal user
Málaga, Spain
288 Posts

Profile of alicauchy
It is essentially a matter of balancing the pressure between the left thumb while running the top card and the grip of the right hand. As kShepherd said, keep practicing.
So much to do, so little time . . .
Rachmaninov
View Profile
Elite user
458 Posts

Profile of Rachmaninov
And using new condition decks of course.
I’m often hearing snapping sounds in magician’s hands doing the overhand shuffle. It should not happen. There is some left thumb pressure to peel the card only, and one should release this pressure before the card has left the deck, letting gravity do her task.
Overhand shuffle techniques are not easy to do well.
alicauchy
View Profile
Loyal user
Málaga, Spain
288 Posts

Profile of alicauchy
Quote:
On Mar 3, 2018, Rachmaninov wrote:
I’m often hearing snapping sounds in magician’s hands doing the overhand shuffle. It should not happen. There is some left thumb pressure to peel the card only, and one should release this pressure before the card has left the deck, letting gravity do her task.
Overhand shuffle techniques are not easy to do well.


I cannot agree more. Paying attention to small details like that makes a big difference!!
So much to do, so little time . . .
kShepher
View Profile
Regular user
Washington, DC
152 Posts

Profile of kShepher
Good thread. Absolutely...the overhand shuffle done well takes practice, practice, practice. You almost have to live it.

I shuffle every morning with my coffee. And I still screw it up sometimes.
kShepher
View Profile
Regular user
Washington, DC
152 Posts

Profile of kShepher
But..may I add...it us THE killer if all sleights. Worth all the practice.
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
Kevin, aliCauchy, and Rachmaninoff,


Thanks for the encouragement and all the helpful suggestions. I'm always aware of noise and am glad to have the tip on how to avoid it. And I'd forgotten about the ideas of using new cards and of treating dry hands. And -- it's especially nice to hear that overhand shuffle techniques are not so easy. For some reason I had it in my head that they're *supposed* to be easy, so I was wondering why I was having trouble. I've come a long way, mind you, in my overhand shuffling, but there's always that last little wall you have to surmount to get it really right, automatic, and consistent.


Thanks again, guys!


Bob
kShepher
View Profile
Regular user
Washington, DC
152 Posts

Profile of kShepher
Good, Bob.

I only got it after creating muscle memory.

If you actually break it down... With all the controls involved.. you then realize it's not all that easy.
kShepher
View Profile
Regular user
Washington, DC
152 Posts

Profile of kShepher
Think of it like Golf.

Looks easy...but it's not.
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
Definitely -- lots of things llike that, Kevin. Anyone who has some natural talent at something and has practiced their heart out will make what they do look easy. I'd add that it's not worth engaging in golf or whatever activity if you don't for the most part *enjoy* the practice. Why suffer for ages hoping to acheive a desired end in the distant future? I love practicing sleights and piano.


Are you a golfer? A friend and I have thought about taking it up just for fun -- not worrying too much about whether we good at it.


BTW, I'm getting pretty good at that cut we talked about. It may or may not be exactly what its inventor intended, but it seems to do the job when I look in the mirror -- usually!
Claudio
View Profile
Inner circle
Europe
1267 Posts

Profile of Claudio
To avoid the cards coming down in lump, visual an imaginary line running across the cards (lengthwise) and make sure that your thumb hits the card under the line, actually as near to the bottom as possible. It should be near to impossible to drag more than one card at a time if you apply as little pressure as possible to run each card, as a little friction should be enough to peel each card.

What grip do you use while overhand shuffling? If you use the “Erdnase grip” as described under Erdnase System of Blind Shuffles: Position for Shuffle, you’ll notice that the base, as well as the tip, of the thumb rests against the cards held in hand and will facilitate the pulling action during a run.

This is the grip I use and it has a lot of advantages compared to the “regular” grip.
kShepher
View Profile
Regular user
Washington, DC
152 Posts

Profile of kShepher
Claudio.. good advice buy WAY over complicated. Bob.. just read Card College 1. listen to the master.

And yes, I golf. My now deceased parents lived in Hilton Head for years.

I became obsessed with golf.

Great, great game.
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
Hi Claudio! Nice to hear from you. I don't own Erdnase (he said sacreligiously), but I can always refer to your videos and the web. I've been holding my thumb and middle finger pretty high on the back of the deck, with my index finger resting on the right side. I just tried your suggestion, and placed my middle finger, ring finger, and thumb as far down as I could reach while still letting me index rest on the side, and it seemed to work quite well! I've learned to be careful about saying, "Ah, at last I have the solution," because the next day or hour I'm liable to discover that I don't have it anymore! But of course that's where the practice comes in.


Hope to talk to you again soon.


Bob
Claudio
View Profile
Inner circle
Europe
1267 Posts

Profile of Claudio
Bob, if you don't have The Expert at the Card Table, you must have Smile The Royal Road to Card Magic. Look up The Overhand Shuffle I, the grip is explained in detail in the first lesson. My belief is that you'll be amply rewarded if you adopt this grip. But if you have already solved your issue, great!
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
Indeed I do have The Royal Road. I'll take a look!
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
Kevin,


You might enjoy the golf stories of P. G. Wodehouse. He's *really* funny. And then on the the Jeeves stories, and on and on...
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
Oh, and I forgot to say, I love Card College. In addition to his many other good qualities, Giobbi is precise and analytical, just like me.
Bob G
View Profile
Elite user
481 Posts

Profile of Bob G
I didn't find Claudio's advice overly complicated. I found it helpful.
Claudio
View Profile
Inner circle
Europe
1267 Posts

Profile of Claudio
Quote:
On Mar 5, 2018, Bob G wrote:
I didn't find Claudio's advice overly complicated. I found it helpful.


Thanks Bob.

I looked up Giobbi’s write-up in CC Vol. 1, and he describes the “Erdnase Grip”, but the thumb is lying vertically on the back of the top card rather than horizontally. However in the chapter “Running Single Cards”, the thumb position is more horizontal and it hits the single card about the centre horizontal line and nearer to the index.

My “advice”, in retrospect, was nothing more than relaying Giobbi’s.

Personally, I prefer the RRTCM description for the overhand shuffle where the thumb takes no action in pulling down the packets which are in fact dropped by the right hand. That allows keeping the thumb horizontal most of the time and will minimise mishaps during the shuffle.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workers » » Overhand shuffle - trouble running cards (1 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2018 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.11 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL