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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Gambling Spot » » Bottom Deal advice - Jason England (6 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

liamwilson1125
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Hi everyone. I would say the advice that Jason gives from his latest Bottom Deal video are really great to improve the techniques and handling, especially for practice purposes. However it would be more impressive if Jason can give some advice regarding the sound when executing the move. Jason if you see this topic I would be glad if you can share some. Thank you so very much.

P/S: anyone who has advice on this matter, I welcome you all.
Yowie_
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Hi liamwilson1125, what video is that?

Jason is a great teacher and is an active contributor in this very forum. Here's his profile in case you want to PM him (hope you don't mind, Jason):
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/bb_pr......ser=5469
Paul H
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Hello liamwilson, I remember a post from years ago by Jason England regarding bottom deal noise and his advise really helped me. He suggested making the deal from the top sound similar to the deal from the bottom. It may be his views have changed. This was a long time ago but give it try.

Paul H
liamwilson1125
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Hi Yowie,

The video is the Bottom Deal released by T11 last year. Big thanks for your link to Jason's profile.

Hi Paul,

Thanks for your comment. I did try this when I practiced the deal in the last 2 years. However the point is when I take the bottom card, the top surface of the card will contact the deck, and it sounds differently when I deal the top card down.
Yowie_
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Thanks, I didn't know he had updated the theory11 video. Jason has also put out some notes on bottom dealing which are no longer available - perhaps this video will hold me over while I wait to find the notes second hand.
JasonEngland
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Quote:
On May 23, 2018, Paul H wrote:
Hello liamwilson, I remember a post from years ago by Jason England regarding bottom deal noise and his advise really helped me. He suggested making the deal from the top sound similar to the deal from the bottom. It may be his views have changed. This was a long time ago but give it try.

Paul H


Still a viable solution, if not ideal. (Ideal would be eliminating the problem instead of masking it.)

liamwilson,

Without seeing your bottom deal grip, take, push-off (if any) etc I can't give specific advice. I can tell you that "soft" cards help. By that, I mean a deck that is older and has had the internal paper fibers bent and rebent in a variety of different ways for several days or longer. For me, they become more difficult to bottom deal (I prefer newish cards), but they get quieter.

If it helps, I can also tell you that my bottoms and tops are not aurally identical - there is a small difference between the two. If I was bottom dealing in the anechoic chamber at Bell Labs you might pick it off. But in most modern performing situations I've never found it to be a problem.

Jason
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
Mr. Bones
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.......I was bottom dealing in the anechoic chamber at Bell Labs......

I was doing the exact same thing 2 weeks ago - I'm surprised I didn't bump into you.
Mr. Bones
"Hey Rube"!
Cagliostro
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On May 27, 2018, JasonEngland wrote:

If I was bottom dealing in the anechoic chamber at Bell Labs you might pick it (the sound) off.

Jason


That got me thinking...

I recall a story from the "Old West" in which a hustler sits down at the table and places his silver-colored six-gun on the table and says, "If I catch anyone cheating in this game, they will have to answer to my friend here" (meaning the six-gun). He then uses the shiny surface of the six-gun as a glim to read the cards as he deals them.

Eureka!!!

How about a twist on this theme for bottom dealing? Walk into the game (or demo scenario) with a loud, blaring "Boom Box" on your shoulder, sit it next to you at the table, and let it blast away. That covers all differences in sound, guaranteed.

Or only play in games (or demonstrate your bottom deal) in noisy clubs or other cacophonous environments. That will surely hide any difference in sound between a bottom and top deal.

It is my understanding that the "Boom Box" technique has been used by some top bottom deal hustlers successfully in very fast company, however I can't verify that with absolute certainty.

Once again, the ideas and suggestions on The Gambling Spot continue to be on the cutting-edge of card table chicanery.
Peterson
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Cag stop giving away methods that are currently employed!
Cagliostro
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On May 27, 2018, Peterson wrote:
Cag stop giving away methods that are currently employed!


Yes, I'll have to be careful about that. In fact I received a couple of angry, and somewhat threatening phone calls from bottom deal pros who were irate about me tipping the "Boom Box" technique.

Thanks for the warning.
liamwilson1125
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Quote:
On May 27, 2018, JasonEngland wrote:
Quote:
On May 23, 2018, Paul H wrote:
Hello liamwilson, I remember a post from years ago by Jason England regarding bottom deal noise and his advise really helped me. He suggested making the deal from the top sound similar to the deal from the bottom. It may be his views have changed. This was a long time ago but give it try.

Paul H


Still a viable solution, if not ideal. (Ideal would be eliminating the problem instead of masking it.)

liamwilson,

Without seeing your bottom deal grip, take, push-off (if any) etc I can't give specific advice. I can tell you that "soft" cards help. By that, I mean a deck that is older and has had the internal paper fibers bent and rebent in a variety of different ways for several days or longer. For me, they become more difficult to bottom deal (I prefer newish cards), but they get quieter.

If it helps, I can also tell you that my bottoms and tops are not aurally identical - there is a small difference between the two. If I was bottom dealing in the anechoic chamber at Bell Labs you might pick it off. But in most modern performing situations I've never found it to be a problem.

Jason


Thank you for your reply Jason. To give you an overview of my bottom deal, I use dealer grip, I unlock the bottom card just only with my middle finger (I don't go too much detailed here but I don't curl the finger in to avoid the flash) and I take the card with either index finger or middle finger from the right hand. I prefer the take with my middle finger, however to avoid the sound problem I have to move to index, which is something I don't really like much though it does make the deal faster.

I actually use the technique for demonstration only, no other purposes. I do agree with others that in a noisy environment / modern performing situations like you mentioned earlier then the sound is not a big concern. However in a bit quiet environment then it does come to play.

And yes, the cards I use are normally new or brand new. I did try old cards as well and the problem still occurred.
liamwilson1125
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On May 26, 2018, Yowie_ wrote:
Thanks, I didn't know he had updated the theory11 video. Jason has also put out some notes on bottom dealing which are no longer available - perhaps this video will hold me over while I wait to find the notes second hand.


You should definitely check it out. If you did buy the first release, then the 2nd one will be updated for you (I mean for free). If not you should buy it. I would say Jason's stuff is one of the best out there.

Small hint - longer time, longer talk, more techniques, more tips, much better than the first one (though I do admit that the first one was so good).
JasonEngland
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Cag,

Your boom box idea isn't as farfetched as you might think. In my opinion the greatest cheating device ever invented for private games is a 65" OLED television. Put on the NBA finals, NFL playoffs or Super Bowl, or in a pinch (when there are no main sporting events on), a DVD of Mike Tyson's greatest knockouts. Nobody is gunning your shuffles or deals. And anyone who is - needs to be dismissed from the game. He isn't going for it.

Jason
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
Cagliostro
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On May 28, 2018, JasonEngland wrote:

Cag,
Your boom box idea isn't as farfetched as you might think. In my opinion the greatest cheating device ever invented for private games is a 65" OLED television. Put on the NBA finals, NFL playoffs or Super Bowl...Nobody is gunning your shuffles or deals...


??? Farfetched ??? And here I thought I was on the cutting edge of card table subterfuge.

Thanks for dragging me into the 21st century. However, I should mention that using a boom box gives one the opportunity to "grunt" along with the latest "mind-scrambling" rap tune gibberish which lends a certain rhythm to ones "dealing," fair or otherwise.

At that point, who cares what the bottom deal sounds like, or even looks like for that matter?

Of course, in most professional card room settings, the noise, activity and distractions can cover much of what one might attempt, That is if it weren't for those *** cameras...
AMcD
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On May 28, 2018, JasonEngland wrote:

Your boom box idea isn't as farfetched as you might think. In my opinion the greatest cheating device ever invented for private games is a 65" OLED television. Put on the NBA finals, NFL playoffs or Super Bowl, or in a pinch (when there are no main sporting events on), a DVD of Mike Tyson's greatest knockouts. Nobody is gunning your shuffles or deals. And anyone who is - needs to be dismissed from the game. He isn't going for it.

Jason

I can confirm you that it works exactly the same in England!!! Put a football (soccer for you) game in direct live, and stack all you want.
Cagliostro
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On May 28, 2018, AMcD wrote:

...Put a football (soccer for you) game in direct live, and stack all you want.


Yes, but where is the skill, the challenge, the excitement and satisfaction of cheating the marks if they are looking the other way?

Alas, don't you high-tech modern-day guys appreciate the subtleties and joy of skillfully employed manipulative moves anymore? Where is the great pride of knowing that one can deceive and defraud his fellow man under close scrutiny, using the best and latest cheating methods?

Alas, it appears the art of being a skillful and masterful crook has lost some of its endearing charm.

... Smile
AMcD
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Well, you still need to know how to stack Smile.
liamwilson1125
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So is it really necessary to have something to distract the audience guys?
JasonEngland
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On May 31, 2018, liamwilson1125 wrote:
So is it really necessary to have something to distract the audience guys?


No. It's just helpful.

Jason
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
liamwilson1125
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Thanks Jason
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