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Topic: Buck Twins on Magicbroadcast.com
Message: Posted by: geraldk (Apr 14, 2005 07:00PM)
That's right! Dan and Dave will be in studio this Saturday April 16 at 8PM PST!

Don't miss your chance to talk to two of Magic's favorite flourishers!

Be there or be picking up cards.

http://www.magicbroadcast.com
Message: Posted by: Fiddling-Steve (Apr 14, 2005 07:32PM)
WHOA!!! that's awesome. I'm so going to listen in. Everything on magic broadcast is good. Can't wait!
Message: Posted by: in flames (Apr 15, 2005 08:43AM)
Weren't they on a few days ago with Brian Tudor as well??
Message: Posted by: ewizardmagic (Apr 15, 2005 10:04AM)
It could be a rerun.

Jason
Message: Posted by: artwo (Apr 15, 2005 10:49AM)
No Tudor was on with.... Dan I think, but it was only really tudor talking really.

If its both Buck Twin's then it shouldn't be a re-run.
Message: Posted by: geraldk (Apr 15, 2005 11:01AM)
This will be a brand new show. both of them will be with me. I had Dan on Tuesday just to check it out. He wanted to see how I do my magic. :) I hope you guys have lots of questions and we will even do a call in show.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 16, 2005 04:23PM)
Will be in 5.5 hours now if I have gotten it right.

If someone calls in, NAG ON D&D TO PUT SOMETHING NEW IN THE VAULT! :P

Will be nice to hear it, I hope someone I know calls in. ^^


Posted: Apr 18, 2005 3:16am
------------------------------------
I don't know about re-run, but a few people recorded it, I am currently getting a recorded version myself right now, I will have it in a little while.

The show was good anyway,
except those specific people
calling in pranking. :/

Ah well.
Message: Posted by: S.Segal (Apr 18, 2005 10:24AM)
The pranks were actually pretty funny. At least the Bucks and I found them entertaining. Guess Gerald, the host, didn't like them too much though.

S.Segal
Message: Posted by: juggler13 (Apr 18, 2005 11:29AM)
That one guy called in every 5 seconds,Nick?
Message: Posted by: in flames (Apr 18, 2005 12:23PM)
I missed it! Unfortunately UFC was on Saturday as well. Chuck and Randy 2!!! What a fight!

I know they just released the System but any news on a future DVD?
Message: Posted by: S.Segal (Apr 18, 2005 12:26PM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-18 12:29, juggler13 wrote:
That one guy called in every 5 seconds,Nick?
[/quote]

Actually, Nick from New York was the best caller with decent questions. There was one kid who called in every few minutes. He faked a far eastern accent and was pretty funny, at least funny with the stuff we could understand.

S.Segal
Message: Posted by: kxxcheng (Apr 18, 2005 01:51PM)
My name is De'vo, not Dave-o!
Message: Posted by: S.Segal (Apr 18, 2005 03:13PM)
That was good Karen... I spoke with Jessica about that. I had no idea it was you.

S.Segal
Message: Posted by: kennymagic86 (Apr 18, 2005 03:22PM)
I wana hear it, when will ir be replayed?
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 18, 2005 08:17PM)
I think it was the "Harwin Poser" that wrote that actually,
most likely a HL guy.

He kept insulting everyone, even D&D lol.

Too bad they couldn't kick him.

Ah well.
Message: Posted by: Chris Keppel (Apr 18, 2005 10:50PM)
if anyone has a copy of that I would love to hear it. I missed it.
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 19, 2005 03:50PM)
Anywhere I could hear this?
Message: Posted by: timemaster (Apr 19, 2005 04:17PM)
Ya if anyone has a copy of the file I would be interested in it.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 19, 2005 05:19PM)
I do, you are not going to get it though.

Chris, add me to MSN and I will send it over.
Message: Posted by: whiteboy0 (Apr 20, 2005 12:09PM)
Handlordz has a condensed version with just the highlights since they were brought into it, very fast download
Message: Posted by: PasteboardPlayer (Apr 20, 2005 12:40PM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-20 13:09, whiteboy0 wrote:
Handlordz has a condensed version with just the highlights since they were brought into it, very fast download
[/quote]

Yeah, the way the HL fans called in and wrote on the forum was pathetic and immature. They brought HL into the discussion, not the Bucks.
Message: Posted by: Daryl (Apr 20, 2005 01:06PM)
It does not reflect very well on HL if their "followers" go and do that.. it ruins De'vos name to have such people from handlordz.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 20, 2005 07:02PM)
Okay, I have a few points that I feel the need to make, to clarify some misconseptions and flat out lies. HL does not have a condensed version of the interview posted. It just doesn't exist. I'm there, I'm in the inner circle, I'm not seeing anything. In fact, I was the first person to get them a link to the interview, and that thing is anything but condensed, two and a half hours of torture.

Next, the people that called in to bash Dan and Dave Buck claiming to be HL guys are not who they say they are. Many people who go around on various forums claiming to be HL guys and bashing Dan and Dave are not HL guys. They are kids who just want to make trouble, and need to get real lives. The real XCMers have no desire to feud with the magic community, these feuds are being started by immature third parties and in reality shouldn't exist. As soon as everybody figures that out, we will all be better off.
Message: Posted by: whiteboy0 (Apr 20, 2005 07:04PM)
There is a condensed version in the HL forums. You must not have that level yet
Message: Posted by: ClouDsss (Apr 20, 2005 07:49PM)
Just curipus, but if whiteboy0 has the assess level to view something that secretive on the HL forums, then why would he come here asking for more info on Xtreme Beginners as if he is a newbie and knows only whats being shown on the public forums of HL?

And to post on 2 seperate portions of the forums the same questions and replies to the same people who gave the same advice?

Its like saying that he doesn't get to view info on the Xtreme Beginners cos its much more secretive?

Just a thought that's all..no offence intended to anyone. I like De'vo, D&D, Tudor, etc's creations and flourishes :)

cheerios
Message: Posted by: whiteboy0 (Apr 20, 2005 08:02PM)
I got access today! They needed some information I have on something and after they confirmed it, I went straight to level 2 and the inside pass. Soso happy and is why you see no more posts about that from me. Now I know all the answers. :bg: extreme Beginners is :wow:
Message: Posted by: MnemonicaRedux (Apr 20, 2005 09:47PM)
OK.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 20, 2005 10:25PM)
I encourage everyone to work on something besides comebacks. In fact, here's an idea. Why don't the magicians work on magic, and the XCMers work on XCM, and everybody STOP THIS INANE ARGUMENT!!! I don't know if I'm the only one that's noticed this, but it's not getting anyone anywhere. The bashing of magicians is innapropriate. And, here's a news flash for all my HL guys, the people De'vo banned from HL have recieved their punishment, you don't have to punish them further. However, while I understand that Karen calling in and impersonating De'vo was a joke, and was in fact quite funny (we at HL got a good laugh out of it), actions like that are not going to ameliorate this problem. With that said, I don't care who you are, magician or XCMer, next time you want to post something bashing someone else or someone else's passion, stop and think, wouldn't your time be better spent working on your fanning and your Charlier cuts?
Message: Posted by: ClouDsss (Apr 20, 2005 10:28PM)
And with that

I proclaim WORLD PEACE!!!!!!!!
Message: Posted by: kxxcheng (Apr 20, 2005 10:38PM)
I forever twist in agony for being banned from HL, my cursŤd soul writhes in flames!
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 20, 2005 10:40PM)
See, we all agree on something. Now let's shake hands, stop knocking on each other, and move on with our lives.
Message: Posted by: 4Jacks (Apr 21, 2005 06:04AM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-20 20:02, whiteboy0 wrote:
I have seen posts from De'vo saying he had no problems with Dan and Dave and they do not allow Dan and Dave bashing at all on Handlordz
[/quote]
I and everyone else have seen the post by Devo bashing "the buck twins" and others, it was a sticky on HL for a while.
[quote]
On 2005-04-20 20:02, whiteboy0 wrote:
After reading the new information on the pro handlordz forum, I have some thoughts on this matter
[/quote]
I didn't realize you were so popular on HL, please provide a link to one post you have on that forum.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 07:23AM)
He is there. I can vouch for that. Official HL policy is okay with Dan and Dave Buck. They are flourishers and magicians by their own admission, and are not attempting to rip off the term "XCM" for their own innapropriate uses, as are some others. There are however some members of their forum that have been banned from HL, and are generally disliked by the HL crowd. Dan and Dave Buck are not the problem, they are two talented magicians, and are very good at what they do (which, by the way, is not XCM).
Message: Posted by: 4Jacks (Apr 21, 2005 09:05AM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-21 08:23, yahu wrote:
He is there. I can vouch for that. Official HL policy is okay with Dan and Dave Buck. They are flourishers and magicians by their own admission, and are not attempting to rip off the term "XCM" for their own innapropriate uses, as are some others.
[/quote]
Wow that sounds pretty official!! Thanks Deívo I mean yahu

[quote]
On 2005-04-21 08:23, yahu wrote:
There are however some members of their forum that have been banned from HL, and are generally disliked by the HL crowd.
[/quote]
Wow that is once again pretty official sounding, now youíre speaking for the whole HL team. I guess I would also fit into the ďBANNED and DISLIKED by the HL CrowdĒ category. Of course no one here really likes me either.

[quote]
On 2005-04-21 08:23, yahu wrote:
Dan and Dave Buck are not the problem, they are two talented magicians, and are very good at what they do
[/quote]
So Is everyone else, open your eyes dude. Harwinís and that ewizard guy have put out videos that are 10 times the skill level Iíve been seeing on HL.

Donít get me wrong, I have nothing against any individual member of HL. I have said before and will continue to say, that I really enjoy all the videos put out on HL, and I appreciate all the members that put stuff out there for the general public (like me) to see. It takes a lot of effort, and no one asks for anything in return.

But the people I have seen here and on D&D are truly good at what they do.

[quote]
On 2005-04-21 08:23, yahu wrote:
(which, by the way, is not XCM).
[/quote]
Thank God!
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 21, 2005 09:24AM)
Well maybe it's hard to compare when some do sybils/pivot(sp?) cuts, and the others are doing more varied XCM?
And I'm guessing you havn't seen any of the newest Tournament videos either. I recomend <Moneys R Us'> videos?

I'm not arguing or anything just askign questions.
(please don't anser like "not fighting a war, just dropping a bomb" lol)
Message: Posted by: 4Jacks (Apr 21, 2005 09:54AM)
Well we can argue about sybils versus ďmore varied XCMĒ and who does what all friggin day.

If theres a video of someone moving cards around, I wanna see it. Itís that simple I donít care if you call it XCM, Flourishes, or what ever other name you can think of.

Everyone is here and there for one reasonÖ WE LIKE CARDS

If some people like sybils and some donít, whatever floats their boat.

I havenít seen Moneyís new VideoÖ
Iíve been laggin on the D/Lís lately, got too much other stuff going on with work, college, buying a new car, and the like. Iíll DL that video if your recommending it. I really like Burnís videos tooÖ his round one video was just flawless. I really havenít DLíed much past round two.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 11:44AM)
Okay, 4jacks, I don't know who you are, there was somebody with the same or a similar name on the HL forums, and I have no idea if that is you, I was unaware that he was banned, and there is no bashing of him that I've seen on HL.

Next, I realize that there are some talented manipulators that have been banned from HL, but they have all been banned with good reason, and their talent level really has nothing to do with it. I see myself as a mediocre manipulator at best, but I'm appreciated at HL because I try hard to advance my own skills, and I behave in a manner constructive to the HL community, and all the other communities I am a member of.

Next, your assertion that it doesn't matter whether what any individual does is magic, flourishing, or XCM is false. If it was the same, then we wouldn't have these different names, and you wouldn't be bashing us. If you want to tell me you enjoy all of them, that's fine. I love to watch good magic. I enjoyed viewing some of the clips on Dan and Dave's website. I love to watch Jeff McBride, and I Jonathan Pendragon's magic elates me.

If you want to see some good tournament footage, check out Moneys' aerial vid and creativity vid, both are XCM gold!!!
Message: Posted by: 4Jacks (Apr 21, 2005 12:03PM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-21 12:44, yahu wrote:
Wow, Harwin, that was enlightening, lol.

Okay, 4jacks, I don't know who you are, there was somebody with the same or a similar name on the HL forums, and I have no idea if that is you, I was unaware that he was banned, and there is no bashing of him that I've seen on HL.
[/quote]
Ello, My name is Patrick and I was banned from HL for pointing out that it makes no sense to have a SECRET underground DVD, ďi.e. MotionsĒ and then to allow ONE person to purchase multiple copies of that DVD that you want to keep Secret and Underground, Because the only reason people purchase 10 copies of something is to sell it. Plus this defeats the purpose of having something really small different in every copy of the DVD, cause when someone has 2 or more copies, they can figure out what that is.

And there was a brief post from Hound dude, about me talking **** on a different forum.

[quote]
On 2005-04-21 12:44, yahu wrote:

Next, I realize that there are some talented manipulators that have been banned from HL, but they have all been banned with good reason,
[/quote]
That is a load of Doo Doo and you know it, you need to go wash your mouth out with soap. There is a whole line of people who have reasons for getting banned that are stupider than mine. And mine was stupid.

[quote]
On 2005-04-21 12:44, yahu wrote:
and their talent level really has nothing to do with it. I see myself as a mediocre manipulator at best, but I'm appreciated at HL because I try hard to advance my own skills, and I behave in a manner constructive to the HL community, and all the other communities I am a member of.
[/quote]
If you were behaving in a manner constructive to the HL community you wouldnít be here arguing on this stupid board, 1 cause Deívo asked you not too, and 2 because you make no sense and give a bad impression of the HL boards.

[quote]
On 2005-04-21 12:44, yahu wrote:
Next, your assertion that it doesn't matter whether what any individual does is magic, flourishing, or XCM is false. If it was the same, then we wouldn't have these different names, and you wouldn't be bashing us. If you want to tell me you enjoy all of them, that's fine. I love to watch good magic. I enjoyed viewing some of the clips on Dan and Dave's website. I love to watch Jeff McBride, and I Jonathan Pendragon's magic elates me.

If you want to see some good tournament footage, check out Moneys' aerial vid and creativity vid, both are XCM gold!!!
[/quote]
Donít misquote me, I am not relating Magic to XCM or flourishes.
I am relating Flourishes to XCM which are the same thing.

Imagine if Tony Hawk wanted to rebel and tell everyone he is not SkateBoarding any more he is doing X-TREME BOARD MANIPULATION.

Itís ridiculous. Flourishes and XCM are one and the same. I personally donít care what the heck anyone calls it. Iím just choosing to stick with Flourishes because HL is the only place advocating XCM and that board is riddled with hostility and contradictions.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 12:53PM)
[quote] On 2005-04-21 13:03, 4Jacks wrote:
If you were behaving in a manner constructive to the HL community you wouldnít be here arguing on this stupid board, 1 cuase Deívo asked you not too, and 2 because you make no sense and give a bad impression of the HL boards.

I am relating Flourishes to XCM which are the same thing.

Imagine if Tony Hawk wanted to rebel and tell everyone he is not SkateBoarding any more he is doing X-TREME BOARD MANIPULATION.

Itís friggin ridiculous. Flourishes and XCM are one in the same. I personally donít care what the heck anyone calls it. Iím just choosing to stick with Flourishes because HL is the only place advocating XCM and that board is riddled with hostility and contradictions.[/quote]

De'vo specifically asked me to take march in to hostile territory to inform everyone what XCM is really about, and has congratulated me on many occasions for the work that I've done these past few days, displaying the arguments of the HL community in a civil and organized manner. In fact, magicians from this board and the Penguin Magic board have thanked me for the work I've done, and the way I've done it. My patience is beggining to wear thin, and perhaps my anger has been reflected in a few of my posts, and for that I am sorry, but I have never told anyone else how to handle their own business, or whined about not receiving and underground DVD.

The way the the word Flourishing is used by magicians is very different than the way XCM is used by the real XCMers. Flourishing is something magicians do between tricks to entertain their audiences. XCM is all about aesthetic appeal, and is comparable to dancing in many respects.

If Tony Hawk was to continue skateboarding, but call it something else, that would be silly, you are correct. But what you are doing is saying that two different art forms using the same medium are the same thing, and that is just silly. That's like saying speed skating and figure skating are the same. That's like saying acrobatics and brake dancing are the same. That's just ridiculous.
Message: Posted by: joeytsai (Apr 21, 2005 01:11PM)
Huh.

Well, getting back to this thread's topic, is there anywhere I can download the broadcast? I'll even host the file after I receive it...
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 21, 2005 01:34PM)
Please, every "Diehard" HL members in here, tell me what your username over there is, you should be posting a lot as you know so much and have 45% of the respect over there, as it seems.

De'vo? Ah, I get it now...

Seriously, XCM and flourishes is the exact same thing, flourishes belong to magic.
But all they do is cutting, fanning, throwing, springing and all with the deck, nothing magic related, so that's why they wanted a new name for it all, that's where XCM got started, but now suddenly they try to steal springs, fans, aerials, armspreads and whatever from magic and not let magicians do them, and claim they always belonged to "XCM", which was created lesser than a year ago by Lars, or whatever his name is.

Its claimed that it has existed for hundreds of years but nah, I doubt that the name "Xtreme card manipulation" existed for hundreds of years, seriously...

It has not been around for longer than magic, like what also has been claimed, LOL.

Playing cards were created after Cups and balls were first done...
Message: Posted by: jessicashurtz (Apr 21, 2005 01:56PM)
Hey 4jacks, don't get me wrong here, I'm really appreciative of the fact that you're taking the time to argue, but it would be a lot better if you just stopped. it's not like either one of you is going to make some suddenly enlightening post that will make the other stop. I'm feeling sympathetic for yahu here, because as much as I didn't want to post on this thread, I ended up so annoyed that I did anyway, so I can see why he's still arguing, and I'm getting annoyed at reading this continued argument about something that will NEVER be resolved anyway. so ... just drop it :)

back on topic:

joeytsai, there is a link here:
<obsolete link removed by staff>

but I'm not sure if it's the whole thing or not (whole thing is over 2 hours). if that's not the whole broadcast and you really want the whole thing, I have a copy of it if you want (just PM me)
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 21, 2005 02:01PM)
My posting in this thread will stop now,
finally someone from HL writes posts here that isn't bashing anyone,
good work Yahu, I appreciate that.

And I hope the arguing stops now. ^^

He finally put out a description
of it all that I agree with.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 02:08PM)
See? I keep telling everyone that we really don't disagree on anything, we just don't understand each other. When flame and bashing is eliminated, and reasonable discourse takes place, we can all learn something and realize that our differences are okay, as long as we accept them as differences, not atrocities. Also, I'd like to publicy thank Harwin and Jessica for their kind words. And 4jacks, that is why De'vo sent me, because he had faith in me to turn this situation around. I think I've done a pretty good job, with the help of the magic community. I think we're all grown a lot these pasts few days, and I think now we can all move on with our lives, and if any further points of contention arise, we will be able to resolve them with meaningfull conversation, not by posting rude comments.
Message: Posted by: jlotto (Apr 21, 2005 04:54PM)
Ok people.
Whats up.
This is Jlotto from the HL forums.
Yahu, you've done a **** job on handling the situation. Im glad this topic hasn't blown up in our faces like SO many times before. I commend you on that.

My point in coming over here, is to hopefully, define xcm, as a complete, and seperate artform from flourishes. You all seem to know the difference between magic and xcm, but not flourishes.

Hmmmm.

To put it simply first:

Flourishes are card manipulations performed within a magic act or effect to ENHANCE THE MAGIC. Repeat after me: TO ENHANCE THE MAGIC.
Such as, fanning the cards so a spectator can pick a card, or doing one handed cuts for visual effect. It doesn't matter if you cut the deck all day, as the one poster said. Youre not doing xcm.

that's like saying if you can stand on your head all day, that youre a breakdancer.

don't you see the difference?

Now, XCM is:

The Xtreme Manipualtion of Cards, in a complete presentation and act, ALL BY ITSELF. No magic is there. None whatsoever. It is a routine composed of All card manipulations, such as:

Water/wind/fire/earth/light Elementals, displays, multi-person displays, one handed cuts, two handed cuts, springs, armspreads, spins, deck spins, Deck throws, aerial cuts/moves, deck put-downs, deck-pick ups, table displays, shuffles, different limb card manipualtion, which is known as stump manipulation, audience participation routines, XCM riffs, one handed fans, regular fans, giant fans, single card manipulation, balance manipulation, box manipulation, blindfolded manipulation, card juggling(hey, it IS a branch of XCM), color manipulation(using different colored backs, and blurring them together to create another color), deck protector manipulation, extreme card dealing, and....the list goes on.

As you can see, XCM has the right to have its on category, and thanks to De'vo, he has probably single-handedly created and proved the term to be the Real Deal.

No, De' did not send me on a mission to shut down you guys. I came on my own free will, so don't give me any of that crap.

The Bucks are flourishes/magicians/kutkiddies.

Why?:

They do magic(duh).
They do simple card manipulations WITH their magic(FLOURISHES)

(say it with me:TO ENHANCE THE MAGIC!!!!)

And last, but not least, they do mostly, if not all of their card manips, in the form of cuts. I have nothing against kutkiddies to some degree.

Its just, they (like some people on this board), don't see the clear and thick line between flourishes and XCM, especially Penuinmagic making proposterous claims as to Tudor being the father of XCM.

I have a good two-syllable term for what that is.

Look at my descriptions of flourishes and XCM. Please see the difference between the two.

Thanks for your time people.
Peace.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 05:08PM)
When I saw that jlotto posted in this thread, I freaked out. For those of you that don't know, he's the SH street guy, and I thought that was going to be much worse than it turned out. I'm going to make a few comments not about what he said, (I agree with him) but how he said it. It seems to me that the word kutkiddies is used as a slur, and thus, the use of this word is inappropriate. Dan and Dave Buck call themselves flourishers, and I support their decision to refer to themselves in that way, and agree with them in that regard. Also, as I have said before, I rather enjoy watching their work, it's very good magic.

Next, while I appreciate your use of my literary tool jlotto, please refrain from foul language. I've worked too hard man...
Message: Posted by: jlotto (Apr 21, 2005 05:17PM)
My bad Yahu, I don't wanna destroy what youve created; an oasis of peacefulness surrounded by gritted teeth and barbed wire.

Enough with the metaphors, but seriously, I don't want to start a fight. Im just expressing my opinion through the way I talk normally. But, in order to keep the peace, like a real pro, I'm going to refrain from foul language from now on, in this forum community.

Jus' tryin to get my word across.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 21, 2005 05:43PM)
Well, I wouldnt say that only cuts and fans exist in "flourishes", basically anything that can be added to magic is.

Flipback is. (Flipback vanish)

Armspreads are. (All card stabs I have seen.)

Aerials are. (Gregory wilson for an example, in card stunts.)

Cobra cut. (I remember some HL person writing he knew a way to force/control a card using it, both those belong to magic I suppose.)

One card flourishes. (I think it is in card college, a bunch of flashy one card turnovers there, and if that's not one card flourishes I dunno. ^^)

Springs. (Tudor published a color change using one in Gen. X

Card shuffles. (Jerry Andrus has quite some.)

And most of those people havent established themselves as XCM artists. :)

that's a few I think of right now anyway, I'm sure a lot more exist.
All I am saying is that only cuts and fans is not all "flourishes" is about,
everything can have a use in magic, to spice up magic routines, just like yourself
have written, and like you wrote, it becomes flourishes, when blended with magic, right?

I'd call Flipback vanish a flourish then, but well, that's just my opinion. ;)



Just my 2 cents, or whichever currency you use where you all are.
Message: Posted by: jlotto (Apr 21, 2005 05:54PM)
I don't disagree with you. Ofcourse they're flourishes if used in magic. When used with only other XM's, are they XCM's.

Actually, I really don't know at this point. You brought up a good point.

Its weird. I mean, De'vo would roll in his metaphorical grave, if you called the cobra cut a flourish, which......you just did.

Hmmmmmmmm.

I don't know.haha.

I guess its fine that you use these and know that youre doing flourishes and don't call it xcm. that's what this arguement/discussion is all about.

Ill get back to you on this one.
Good point bro.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 21, 2005 06:00PM)
Yeah jlotto, hehe, ive never called the stuff I do Xtreme card manipulation, I get your point now, I think Xtreme Card Manipulation sounds kinda silly, but its not what I do so I shouldnt care much, ill keep calling what I do flourishes. ^^

But the cobra cut issue, it is off course in its own, if not combined with magic, XCM, but as it has magicial uses, as it apparently does, I guess it can be a flourish in a situation as well, how much mad ever would get about it. :P

Thanks for the serious non-bashing posts, they look a lot better than the other, bashing ones, they lead nowhere. :)
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 06:12PM)
That is indeed a good point. In my opinion, a cobra cut done in the context of a magic routine would be a flourish. I think De'vo would rather have you call such a presentation a flourish than XCM, but I really can't speak for him on that issue, I haven't discussed it with him. I'll ask him, and hopefully get back to you later tonight.
Message: Posted by: Fiddling-Steve (Apr 21, 2005 06:53PM)
I just call it all manipulation. You can add manipulation to a magic routine, you can do a whole show out of manipulation.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 07:27PM)
That's fine as far as I'm conserned. Manipulation is a much more general term, that to me focuses more on the moves than the presentation. To call these moves simply "manipulations" is a good idea. The different presentation require different names, Flourishes in the context of magic, XCM in the context of, well, XCM. lol
Message: Posted by: CardConjurer (Apr 21, 2005 08:04PM)
I agree completely with J & yahu. You have expressed exactly how I feel about this matter. Good work
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 09:26PM)
Okay, I have consulted with De'vo, and he has told me that he designed the Cobra Cut as an XCM move, and therefore it can never become a flourish. He also suggests that there is really no circumstance in which the Cobra Cut can be used in a magic act.

IF YOU DISAGREE, PLEASE DO NOT BEGIN TO BASH AND FLAME AGAIN!!! I must stress that. As far as I'm concerned, the only way to appropriatly debate this issue further, is by creating a video actually proving De'vo wrong, and letting him see it hoping it will change his mind (it probably won't, but if you insist this, it's worth a try, and is clearly better than mor bashing).
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 21, 2005 10:16PM)
Nah, I wont try proving it, it was just a point I wanted thru.

I use riffle force and such every time I force a card, a cobra cut as a force would look a little... VERY un-natural. :P

Not something you see every day. ^^
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 21, 2005 10:23PM)
That's De'vo's point. The Cobra Cut just wouldn't fit in a magic act, and that's why it is at a most basic level a move that is exlusively XCM.
Message: Posted by: MnemonicaRedux (Apr 21, 2005 11:25PM)
I like ice cream. And soda. They're both nice treats, but essentially they're different tasting things altogether.

Put them together, and you get one hell of a float ;)

-Kev
Message: Posted by: kxxcheng (Apr 21, 2005 11:38PM)
Ring ring ring ring ring ring ring.... BANANAPHONE!!!
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 22, 2005 12:43AM)
I hope for another radio show in the future,
they planned to have one and that would be great. ^^
Message: Posted by: Daryl (Apr 22, 2005 01:08AM)
This was good to read.. I see peace and understanding between the two sides.. which is rare! Thanks Yahu n J.

Lets unite for the art of Cards.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 22, 2005 02:36AM)
I said cobra cut could be seen as a flourish, but it is off course meant as a XCM move, my point was all about that "flourishes" is not just cuts and fans, and can be applied to pretty much anything.

For the people buying the system, you can listen to it all in the vault. :)
It got published today, a compressed version, that is. ^^
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 22, 2005 12:25PM)
[quote]I just call it all manipulation. You can add manipulation to a magic routine, you can do a whole show out of manipulation.
[/quote]
Very clever man!
and as Yahu said, only doing manipulating and trying to do the hardest manipulating you can do and then incorporate this in a show => extreme card manipulating = XCM
using manipulation to spice up (flourish) ur magic = flourishes.

wow, this felt gd. *phew*
I think we finaly got an understatement between both "sides". No problem, No more.
Message: Posted by: ripcurl21 (Apr 22, 2005 12:36PM)
I agree that they are 2 completely different things, they shouldnt be confused.
Message: Posted by: jlotto (Apr 22, 2005 01:17PM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-22 00:38, kxxcheng wrote:
Ring ring ring ring ring ring ring.... BANANAPHONE!!!
[/quote]


hahah, I love that one.
It would drive me crazy if I had to listen to it more than once though.

Nice. It looks as though the impossible has been done. Im soooo glad that we have an understanding with each other. I wish I could say the same for some other people, but only time will tell.

I believe we have made great progress.
Peace
Jlotto
Message: Posted by: Chris Keppel (Apr 22, 2005 01:49PM)
Yea right, lets just see how long this last. I give it a week. If that.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 22, 2005 02:00PM)
I guess its just better to stay positive about it all,
and if it starts again, we are not the "bad guys"...

Enough of this now, this thread is about the D&D
interview, nothing else.

I hoped for more people to call in, I would have called
in, I just had no idea how to call from me as I am not in
U.S, I'm in Sweden.

Am I am sure it would cost me a bit even though it was toll free.
But Matt Williams called in, And Karen and Jessica, I was hoping for more. :P

Ah well, can't have it all, a lot of trouble with the time zones apparently.
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 22, 2005 02:03PM)
If they do it again, I'll call in. I have no life, so taking five minutes to call shouldn't be too much of a hassle.
Message: Posted by: Lonnie Dilan (Apr 22, 2005 02:55PM)
Good job Yahu. Hopefully this understanding will spread to other forums and this drama will be squashed once and for all.

Cheers to Yahu. The Superhandz Ambassador.
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 22, 2005 05:54PM)
To combine the two topics in this thread
Didn't sound like Dan and/or Dave had any problems with De' or superhandz either. So that's cool.

And yeah, I finaly got to know why they use them cards!
Message: Posted by: jessicashurtz (Apr 22, 2005 06:09PM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-22 14:17, jlotto wrote:
[quote]
On 2005-04-22 00:38, kxxcheng wrote:
Ring ring ring ring ring ring ring.... BANANAPHONE!!!
[/quote]
Hahah, I love that one.
It would drive me crazy if I had to listen to it more than once though.
[/quote]
What about if you had to listen to it every day at school ... MULTIPLE times ... sung by some asian chic who's always playing with a deck of cards (hint: K-A-R-E-N)... Bet it'd drive you nuts, eh? :D

We did call in a couple times... but it was surpringly difficult to think of good questions... hence such things as "what's your favorite food." plus you couldn't hear a darn thing when they picked up and tried to talk. does anyone know how many people tuned in to the broadcast in total?
Message: Posted by: ripcurl21 (Apr 22, 2005 07:01PM)
Lmao, Superhandz Ambassador.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 22, 2005 07:14PM)
Seems like people can't get back on topic, this one's about the D&D interview, not Superhandz, even though Superhandz what somewhat involved in it all, it's not the main topic..
Message: Posted by: jlotto (Apr 22, 2005 11:36PM)
[quote]
On 2005-04-22 20:01, ripcurl21 wrote:
Lmao, Superhandz Ambassador.
[/quote]

Not to open a fresh wound with you guys or anything, but, lonnie IS a moderator and the only person with the "ELite Member" title at the SH boards. He has a right to call himself that.

Please don't take this the wrong way, I was just setting things straight, so as to not make lonnie look like he's full of himself.

Peace
jlotto
Message: Posted by: Imperistan (Apr 23, 2005 05:09AM)
Jlotto,

Lonnie called Yahu the superhandz Amabassador, not himself. I heard he did a lot of good stuff to get peace. I'm happy there's peace now.

Back on topic,
I'm listening to the Dan and Dave interview now, nice stuff. I didn't now listening to people speaking english is so much harder then reading the stuff people type in english. Lmao.

Imp
Message: Posted by: ripcurl21 (Apr 23, 2005 07:19AM)
Jlotto, I was just laughing at lonnie dilans joke. lol.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 23, 2005 08:21AM)
I give up...
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 23, 2005 09:45AM)
LOL Harwin. well whats the topic again? :P
I'm sure listening to spoken english will help you in ur pronounciation Imp!

And yeah, to follow the topic.
I think that the interview was very enlightning. I learnt a lot about Dan and Dave (the Buck twins :P) I have however NO clue as of what flourishes they did, or magic trick. That was a little lame that I didn't know what was happening. does anyone have a vid of that card switch?
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 23, 2005 10:18AM)
The cuts, I don't know, the stuff I remember from is that one of then did a double, put it in the middle and its back on top, and I think Gerald or whoever it was speaking got very impressed. :P

But of the "bigger" stuff they did, I think one of them performed Jackson 5 (but screwed up a bit in it, everybody does that sometimes ^^)

And one did Tivo 2, I dunno if its a acronyme but its probably a follow up on Tivo 1 in one of their notes, and Tivo 2 is apparently a much more visual version, it is a card transposition. The transpo is this far unpublished, but will appear in their new notes. ^^
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 23, 2005 06:12PM)
Ok thanks.
But I don't remember Gerald beeing impressed of the double lift. he simply laughed about it.
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 23, 2005 10:18PM)
Well, I were kind of very ironic about that. :P
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 24, 2005 07:16AM)
Oh ok ok, my bad hehe
Message: Posted by: Chris Keppel (Apr 26, 2005 12:38PM)
Wow, I think we have a break through. This is like the first bucks thread that hasnt been locked or deleted in about 2 years.

Bravo haters.... I mean everyone.

Oh yea, that was a joke so don't get your panties in a bunch
Message: Posted by: Driver (Apr 27, 2005 08:59AM)
Lol, I don't get any of you jokes. I must be realy dumb :P
Message: Posted by: yahu (Apr 27, 2005 09:15AM)
It's not you Driver, it's him, try reading his posts in the comedy section.

Does anybody know if Dan and Dave plan on doing another show anytime soon?
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 27, 2005 04:26PM)
They, as mentioned mentioned (no echo) that they are intrested in doing another show, I wouldnt count on it being done in the coming year though, they want us to wait for more, not go "No, not again..." :P

Kepp, better not bash in any way if we want to keep it this way.
Message: Posted by: Chris Keppel (Apr 27, 2005 07:30PM)
I wasnt bashing anyone, just messing around. Anyone who knows or who has been around for more then a month would relize that EVERY bucks thread keeps getting deleted and/or erased like a day later because people want to talk smack all the time. I was just glad this one wasnt.
Message: Posted by: whiteboy0 (Apr 28, 2005 02:31AM)
Sure you were not. Do you not have some half baked dvd to make?
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Apr 28, 2005 05:08AM)
Whiteboy, do you have a dvd to make at all? :)

Back to topic guys, this thread is about the D&D interview,
not other peoples dvd: s.

Kepp, don't even bother answering his post.