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Topic: Icarus important information
Message: Posted by: robert bianchi (Mar 18, 2006 08:59PM)
I know that there have been posts forever on this effect, but there is something that I want to get off my chest about this effect.

First, I love the effect and the reactions that I have gotten so far. I think that it is worth the money, with the exception of one problem I am having, and it is a big one.

I am having some trouble with the look of the effect upon floating and resting on the curb or stair. At the thigh area, it does not look right and the pants appear to cave in. If you have the effect you know why or what I mean.

Again, while I think that the levitation looks great, I am uncomfortable really using it, as I know it is only a matter of time that it is seen and exposed.

My problem is that I have paid a lot for this effect and as part of the price was given access to the Forum for Icarus. I have noticed on the forum that there is not a lot of advice or follow up for those who are having problems fitting the gimmick, needing additional supplies, and/or having problems making the effect work.

Also, only recently were additional supplies made available to my knowledge and their price is outrageous in my opinion. The supplies like the Space Age Material is over a hundred dollars, even though I am relativly certain that you can find this material if you need to. Why so expensive, especially since most that need it, need it because they made a fitting mistake in the first place. The fitting mistakes are definatley possible, and I think that they could have given some more SAM to account for errors.

So, if you have any kind of problem making the gimmick, fitting the gimmick, or having a problem with it in general, you must know that you may be left in the dust as to having someone in the know make suggestions, and if you need additional materials and can not find them elsewhere, you will feel the financial pain!

By the way, if anyone has a suggestion on how fix the thigh part of the leg, please PM me and let me know. On the Icarus forum I asked if anyone ever had this problem weeks ago, and there has literally been not one response.

Thanks, Bob
Message: Posted by: entity (Mar 18, 2006 10:17PM)
Sounds like you're the only one having this problem, then Bob.

Most eveyone else I've talked to has nothing but good things to say about their service and communications with Aaron, the creator of Icarus Effect.

I found his directions on the DVD to be meticulously clear, making it almost impossible to mess things up if you follow what he tells you to do exactly.

Re: The space age material... It is very expensive for Aaron at the source. I know what he has to pay for it, and I don't think he makes much profit from that at all.

I think the thigh thing has more to do with your posture and the tension of the pants than anything else. Perhaps you are trying to look down to watch your feet when you do the lev and this is causing the problem. I'd suggest you video tape the way you've done the gimmick, then video yourself doing the lev, then send the video to Aaron so that he can analyze where you're going wrong.

I haven't heard anyone else with the same problems or complaints that you have. In fact, the complaints seen to be few and far between.

- entity
Message: Posted by: robert bianchi (Mar 19, 2006 12:13AM)
Dear Entity:

I am not the only person having a problem, that is simply a untruth that I am sure was an oversight and not intentional on your part (I am not being sarcastic when I say that by the way). A simple review of the forum makes it that clear that others have problems of one sort or another, as well. Also, a review of the forum will demonstrate that I am not the only person who has posted a problem with no response.

Additionally, while the instrucitons may be specific, the fact of the matter is that our body types and pants are not. Again, a review of the forum will demonstrate other persons that have had adjustment problems and had problems constucting the gimmick itself, which I did not. Also, while I agree that the instructions are specific and well articulated, there is a considerable amount of adjustment requrements that are person specfic.

It is respectfully not true that it is almost impossible to "mess" things up as there are a plethora of varriables that need to be exact for it to work, and again our body types and pants are not all the same. For example, the placement of the gimmick as stated on the video led my gimmick to go sideways, which I see from another post was a problem that another person was having, as well. I adjusted, but the fact is that the measurements given on the DVD did not work with my pants and adjustments specific to me and my pants were needed. So, again, there is clearly the possiblity of "messing" things up, which in reality is not the fault of the person constructing the effect, but simply a matter of "one size does not fit all."

Also, for example, there is a considerable amount of discussion on the forum about the type of pants that should be used, and many who were having problems with that aspect. Same with me. I followed his instructions exactly, and that is not the problem. I have reviewed the DVD and rechecked and there is no doubt that I did exactly as instructed. This has led me to believe that I need to buy another pair of pants, as I suspect that there is too much slack in the pair that I have and the extra material may be the problem. Before I go through that expense, however, I was simply looking for imput. I have video taped and that is how I saw the problem. Also, my wife upon a second demonstration quickly noted the same problem.

With that said, I think that you may be advocating on behalf of the effect a little. Whether the problem is with the effect or my incompetance in following instructions (which I followed to a "T"), the fact remains that I have expierenced a problem, have written about it in the forurm that I see Aaron views, and still do not have a solution. As to your suggestion that people receive a good response to problems that are placed in the forum, all that I can say is that mine was not and I think again that a review of the Forum will demonstrate that I am not the only person who has not received a reply to a problem. I'll leave it at that, as my post was not meant to bash the effect or its creator, for which I have considerable respect. However, since you have responded in the fashion that you did, I simply felt it necessary to make sure that the record is clear and corrected.

I will check the "tension" in the pants as you suggest, and thank you for that constructive input.

Now, let's discuss this mysterious Space Age Material (SAM) issue. I do not know if this material is propritory, although from your post I think not. This means that it is mass produced and I am sure that if need be one can easily find out how to get it. I did not look into it, as my gimmick was prepared exactly as demonstrated, and that is not the problem that I have, although others have had a problem.

I have, however, checked out the possiblity of using additional material to consturct it for another pair of pants, once I get the thigh issue resolved. I have contacts in sports rehabilitation medicine field, and know that they have very lightweight casting materials that I know will in fact work as well, if not better, than the SAM. I have asked some physicans that I know what the costs of these medical supplies would cost, and I am informed that the materials are in fact very cheap (about $25), and again, these are medical supplies that are high grade, very "moldable," and durable. How could it be that medical supplies with their extraordinary markups cost no more than $25 to make the mold, and the SAM could cost $125 for such a small amount that is needed?

I simply find it unimaginable that the materials that Aaron sells, which is only a small amount of this material, could come anywhere near the cost that it is being sold for. I suspect that the profit/markup explains why the SAM is not simply told to us and/or kept a secret. The materials do not appear to be novel and while they are refered to as SAM, are merely simple molding materials probably used in many industries, such as construction. Also, I am not the only one who has expressed surprise at the costs of these supplies.

Lastly, if you view my previous posts on Icarus, I have done nothing but applaud the effect. While I have had a problem, I recognize the power of this great effect. Regardless, if I am the only idiot that can't get it right (which again is simply not true) again the simple fact of the matter is that it is a problem that I have.

People in the Magic Café Forum have asked numerous questions about this effect, and I am familiar with many of your supportive comments and relationship with the creator of the effect. Please do not take my problem (even if I am the only one who is seemingly too dumbfounded to get it right) as an attack upon the effect.

I have a problem and no effect is flawless, especially one with so many construction varriables as this one has. There is nothing wrong with someone saying that they have a problem, but it is unfair to the readers of this forum to suggest that there are not others who have had problems. I have repeatedly stated that the effect is great, its impact is unbelievable, the direcitons are great, and that it is worth the money. I still say this, as I am sure that my problems will be eradicated with some adjustments. I just want to start using it with confidence, which I am sure you can appreciate.

In any event, thanks for the reply, as I think that your suggestions as to the tension of the pants needs to be investigated by me more fully and hopefully more adjustments in that area would do the trick, so to speak.

Regards, Bob.
Message: Posted by: entity (Mar 19, 2006 10:07AM)
Bob: First of all, I didn't say that you were the only one who ever had any problem with the construction or use of Icarus Effect. I said that you seemed to be the only one having THIS problem. Your post stated that you had posted your problem in the Icarus Effect forum, and that no one had replied or commented. I took this to mean that no one participating in the forum had anything to say, and hence, had probably not encountered your particular problem.

I was answering your post as an owner and user of Icarus Effect, not as a spokesman for Aaron Paterson or anyone else. I DO have some inside knowledge regarding the effect and especially the SAM. If you can achieve the same thing with medical supplies, go for it. Aaron searched for years to find the perfect materials for Icarus Effect and found only ONE source for the SAM, three continents away from where he lives. He must import it in bulk, and even then, with a slight discount for buying in bulk, his COST is more than 4 times what you suggest. I'm sorry you find it out of line, but that's life.

Send your video to Aaron, as I suggested. He's a very good guy, and works very hard to make sure people are happy with his product. He's out of town performing at the moment, but should be back on Monday.

Good luck with Icarus. Once you have it set up properly, it's a beautiful effect.

- entity
Message: Posted by: robert bianchi (Mar 19, 2006 05:55PM)
Dear Entity:

I'll end it at this. I did not state or imply that you are a spokesman for Icarus, only that you are a friend of its creator. I do not think that that means that you are deceiving others about the effect, as we both agree that it is awesome.

I also do not find that his charging is "out of line" although it is in my opinion a little pricey. Of course, as a business person myself you charge what the market will bear, and good for him if he capitalizes upon that to the fullest extent. Bad for us, who are left with a draconian financial decesion if we need more material. I could not agree with you more that "that's life."

But in all, thanks for the tips and the information that Aaron will be willing to review a video. I did not know that he would do something like that, and that makes a world of difference knowing that I will not be in the cold, so to speak. Its not really about the money, but rather, I see the potential for the effect and am anxious to get it up and running, knowing that it is a killer.

I hope that you had an opportunity to review my other posts about Icarus, and if you did, you see that I have had nothing but great things to say about the effect and its video. Again, I appreciate your imput. Bob


Firstly, there is much more to the effect than your post seems to suggest. Its construction is complex (not meaning too difficult to make) and needs to be done with percesion and with the correct materials. These "complexities" are well described and detailed in his video. This does not mean that it is too hard to make, only that you need to follow his instructions with particularity.

Aaron's effect also has many nuiances in construction and application that make it come together to work. It would be improper in my opinion to reveal more about the effect, as this is the very work product for which he makes his money selling and what you are asking is to reveal it without remuneration.

The Posts that you read between myself and Entity merely discuss a small aspect of a much larger overall construction. It would be difficult for me to imagine that even if you knew the concept of how it works, that you could construct it according to Aaron's specifics, unless you actually get the video and exact materials that he provides.

I realize that the effect costs some money, but it is well worth it. Part of the benefit of it being costly is that it keeps everybody from having one. So too, the higher cost means less customers for Aaron, so it is important that those who do have the money for the effect keep it to themselves out of respect to him, as this balances out his loss of customers that he suffers for not having sold it for less.

I hope you understand. Best of luck. Bob
Message: Posted by: entity (Mar 19, 2006 05:57PM)
You can also email Aaron directly. His email address in noted on his site. He tells me you haven't emailed him as yet with your questions.

- entity
Message: Posted by: robert bianchi (Mar 19, 2006 06:08PM)
True have not emailed him yet. Since getting product my mother was hospitalized and has been there for weeks. I kind of put this aside until I have chance to take more time to look at it.

Your suggestion in first post kind of confirmed what I was already thinking and I am now more confident to do some adjustments as you suggested. I will post and let you know how it turns out.

Really, thanks for the response(s)! Bob.
Message: Posted by: annemarie (Dec 26, 2006 02:06PM)
You can fix that by making the gimmick longer that is what I did and it works great