(Close Window)
Topic: Fooling an English girl
Message: Posted by: Furniture (Apr 15, 2006 03:37AM)
I have been performing magic for 4 years but I have got a problem, I have met an English girl and... I cant fool her. She figures out all my tricks: DLs, palmed coins, all mental suggestions... what can I do? any special tricks for smart people?

ps I have no problems fooling other people, I'm a skilled magician.
Message: Posted by: Fandango (Apr 15, 2006 05:48AM)
Do a "sucker" effect, it doesn't really matter how basic, in fact you cold make one up yourself.

Basically you make a certain move (preferably one she already knows about) really obvious so that she thinks she knows how it's done, and then use a different method to achieve the same result.

Once she thinks she knows how the trick is done, she'll probably stick to her theory, and that's when you blow her mind with the "different method"

Maybe someone else can explain this better, I know my explanation isn't great
Message: Posted by: Art-Fantasy (Apr 15, 2006 06:32AM)
Well said, Fandango. Btw, what kind of reactions that english women give in magic performance? for example, Japanese girls are really lively and Aussie chicks basicallt swear a lot. Am I being discriminating now??? I know people know that I'm not. Lol.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Kelly (Apr 15, 2006 09:04AM)
Is the fact that she's English the problem? Or is she just very observant. I agree with Fandango, do a sucker trick. Use her keen eye against her. If she thinks she can see everything you do then convince her you're doing something one way when you're actually doing it another way.

Someone famous once said those that are sceptical are the easiest to fool......or something along that lines.
Message: Posted by: Josh the Superfluous (Apr 15, 2006 11:24AM)
I have a brother who is the same way. One day I found the secret of fooling him; I lied when he guessed right. To this day, whenever he says he has never been fooled, I remind him of the one he didn't figure out.
Message: Posted by: Jerrine (Apr 15, 2006 11:29AM)
Ahh the lie, always the best out. One of the reasons I love Magic so much. Bond has a licence to kill, I have one to lie, and no one gets hurt.
Message: Posted by: aznparoxysm (Apr 15, 2006 11:46AM)
This is kinda like the sucker effect, but start a difficult trick that looks very similar, if not identical to another, much easier one. She'll notice immediately some things, she'll think "ok, this guy sucks." then you pull your move and she's stunned.

I can think of one off the top of my head. Daniel Garcia's "Nacho mama's triumph." basically, you start off exactly like a triumph, all the simple moves and such. Then, at the end, after you reveal her card is facing the other way, suddenly the entire deck has changed color.
Message: Posted by: Art-Fantasy (Apr 15, 2006 11:58AM)
Funny, in Ortiz's book "Strong magic" when you meet this kind of spectators...just ignore her and finish the trick and leave.

Me....I'll do sucker trick and if she still does not shut up I will look at her and say, "I can see you really want to sleep with me because you wanna be on the same level of intelligence with me. I'm not that easy, though. Look, give me your number and I might call you depending on my mood". I always get the look from women of the heckler type "no...you did not say that". And they ended up apologizing to me when we went out and she actually said that she could be wrong in trying to figure out my trick.

My point..??? Just show command and "look down" on these type of audiences in gentleman way.

if the heckler was guy, I'd just smile and say "Of course you are right" and I'll do series of sucker tricks to fool him and say, "I'm glad that we could work together". Always get respect.
Message: Posted by: TannerJade (Apr 15, 2006 12:43PM)
You could possibly try a gimmick...

I doubt she could have the knowledge to figure out something along those lines, but I could very well be mistaken...

-Tanner J
Message: Posted by: abc (Apr 15, 2006 03:15PM)
Just speak French to her.
Message: Posted by: airship (Apr 15, 2006 03:54PM)
For a smart-alec spectator, I use the very simple 'find a card' trick using a key card, presented as a mental effect. Make lots of comments about their mind being 'hard to read' and 'seeing nothing' and 'all I get is a blank' as you turn the cards over one at a time. Turn over cards until you are three or four cards PAST their card, then bet them $20 the next card you turn over will be theirs. Of course once they take the bet, you go back and turn over their card that you'd already turned over.
In my experience, spectators who think they know everything always fall for this as a chance to prove you wrong. Do this in front of others they know, and insist that they pay you. They won't try to show you up again for fear of being caught in a sucker bet like that again!
Of course, if this is a girl you're interested in, you probably don't want to do this. In fact, if you think you may want to marry this girl someday, it would be best to just give in and admit that she's smarter than you and is always right. That will save you lots of time later after you're married. :)
Message: Posted by: jolyonjenkins (Apr 15, 2006 05:07PM)
I think you should appreciate her honesty. If you're not fooling her, are you sure you're fooling everyone else? Perhaps other people are just being more polite?
Message: Posted by: what (Apr 15, 2006 10:50PM)
Why do you want to fool this girl?
She is apparently very observant and does not like being fooled.
Take her out for Ice Cream instead.

Message: Posted by: Furniture (Apr 16, 2006 06:04AM)
The Ice Cream answer is the best one, but rjenkins is right as well, maybe I'm not fooling anyone :(

Is great when someone believes in magic and you are able to make them believe, sometimes you can only say 'i fool you'. I will fake some movements to see how it works and let you know about that.

thank you very much for your answers
Message: Posted by: nucinud (Apr 16, 2006 09:35AM)
Ever think she might know magic and is fooling you into thinking she can not be fooled.
"There's an old saying in Tennessee - I know it's in Texas, probably in
Tennessee - that says, fool me once, shame on - shame on you. Fool me -
you can't get fooled again."
George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept.17, 2002
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Kelly (Apr 16, 2006 10:13AM)
Oh I love that Bush quote. One of many on my George Bush Quotes poster!

"We need an energy bill that encourages consumption." - genius.
Message: Posted by: Brad Burt (Apr 16, 2006 09:28PM)
My mother has an I.Q. just shy of 170. When I was younger I could NOT fool her. I taught her to play chess and after the second game I never won another. I was not amused. The chess I could care less, but the magic thing was literally driving me to distraction.

I finally learned to do the Professor's Nightmare and to do it well. False count on the three equal ropes, etc. That was it. Totally fooled her. From that point on I realized that a lot of it did in fact have to do with me. I learned to select things that I knew would in fact fool here.

You have to watch out that you don't get too flustered about it. That puts you at a disadvantage right off. You body language will be all over the place up tight. What fools really smart folks a lot of the time IS the acting that you do to convince them that something is not what it is.

Here's an odd story of smart folk that I will never forget: Guy calls to book me for a show. Cocktail party which is all I was doing at the time. He hesitates and says, that the show is for 50 Ph.D physists and their wives or husbands about 1/2 of which have Ph.D's in some other discipline! No problem. My experience by that time was that the smarter they are the harder they fall.

I do the show. Get good reaction on all my fancy card, coin, sponge ball, chop cup work. But, you want to know the hit of the evening??? My $5.00 set of Adam's Chinese Sticks! Yep, it blew them away!!! O.k., I really DO do the Chiness Sticks well, but come on. I learned a great lesson. Simple direct stuff fools really smart people. Why? Because they always OUT THINK themselves! It's gotta be magnets. It's gotta be some complicated mechanism, yada, yada. Once they are on that course they are doomed. Simple stuff fools smart people. Think back and remember the first time you were fooled by something like the coin thru the rubber dental dam. Crazy Cube is a classic. Remember. Remember. Best,
Message: Posted by: Matt Malinas (Apr 17, 2006 08:04AM)
My girlfriend used to do the same to me.
figured out a lot of stuff.
but, she used to.
I floored her with mindbender though.
such an easy effect that hits soo hard.
I am not sure what happened but since then , maybe she isn't expecting to figure it out or maybe just beeing polite :)

Message: Posted by: sjballa147 (Apr 17, 2006 11:29AM)
Do a self working effect where there is nothing to find or hide.
Message: Posted by: ssucahyo (Apr 17, 2006 12:03PM)
Try the Scotch and Soda and if she still can reveal it...just do not do magic to her anymore. ;o)
Message: Posted by: Anabelle (Apr 17, 2006 05:12PM)
Try Girl Power in the Inner Thoughts section.

Message: Posted by: Father Photius (Apr 17, 2006 05:51PM)
Ever take into consideration the reason she knows how it is done when you do it, is because she knew how it was done before you did it? I.E. that she might have studied the art of magic at some point.
Message: Posted by: Geoff Weber (Apr 17, 2006 06:21PM)
You've created an impossible situation for yourself. From now on nothing you do for her will be magic, it will simply be puzzles for her to try and figure out.. If you do fool her, she won't believe in the magic, she'll just be frustrated when you won't show her a second time. (because she's certain she'd catch you that time!)
Is this the relationship you want with your audience? I would try to remedy this by shifting your emphasis to [i]entertainment[/i]. Try a trick such as Sam the Bellhop that has a very strong emphasis on entertainment, and try and show her why magic is enjoyable.
Message: Posted by: Matt Malinas (Apr 17, 2006 07:30PM)
I second geoff weber's oppinion. everything is a challenge to her now.
it is all about catching you "red handed" .
I don't know what you can do to fix this. so I would go with geoff weber's advice.
good luck man !

Message: Posted by: Sergey Smirnov (Apr 18, 2006 04:55AM)
Try doing something with a memorized deck. If she does not know you are using one, you'll fool her a big time. That's a beauty of the MD, the effects are very strong and escape any logical explanation unless you know the MD is used.
Message: Posted by: trickychris (Apr 19, 2006 06:41PM)
Holy grail - card at any number - its a kicker
Message: Posted by: Dean A (Apr 20, 2006 02:09AM)
On 2006-04-15 07:32, Art-Fantasy wrote:
Aussie chicks basicallt swear a lot.

Message: Posted by: aznparoxysm (Apr 20, 2006 08:25AM)
Recently I found a friend who I had never performed magic for before, and I'm pretty certain has never studied magic (im pretty sure I'm the only one in my district). He claimed he could see through most magic tricks, that he didn't really care if he didn't. Of course, I was curious and decided to perform the invincible mindbender. He didn't have a reaction at first, so I assumed he didn't see the bend. when I pointed it out, he said "so what?" and proceeded to give me the scientific rundown of how he thought the trick worked. He explained it better than the creator. Now, I set up for the trick when no one was watching, and my performance wasn't majorly flawed in any way. I think theres just those kinds of people out there.
Message: Posted by: Kent Wong (Apr 20, 2006 10:33AM)
I find that if a person is absolutely fixated on HOW a trick is done, I have failed to provide an ENTERTAINING PRESENTATION of the effect. If the trick is being presented as a puzzle, then it's not surprising that she feels challenged to figure out how it works. Not having witnessed the presentation of the effects, it's really hard to say what the cause may be.

Regardless, you need to shift your focus. Assuming your technique is good, try to entertain instead of fooling the spectators. Solid entertainment is the best form of misdirection.

Message: Posted by: airship (Apr 20, 2006 01:43PM)
I think Geoff and Kent are right on when they say your focus should be on entertainment. The best approach might be to put a comedic twist on things. If you get her laughing, she'll be having too much fun to worry about how the effects work.
Besides, the #1 thing women always say they love about a man is 'he makes me laugh'.
Message: Posted by: molsen (Apr 22, 2006 02:15PM)
I think your purpose of showing her magic, and her purpose of figuring out your tricks are the same. You want to impress eachother. Put the cards away and invite her out instead.

Message: Posted by: Furniture (Apr 23, 2006 05:43AM)
Thank you very much for all the good advices, but I discover her secret, when she was young she read a magic book, since then she has developed a king of "eye" for magic, however I fool her with the arm twistling illusion but no way to fool her with any mentalism stuff. I know try to fool somebody in this way is not exactly "magic", but I don't think that to do magic you have to make people "belive". Probably the best approach is a funny presentation, at the end is what people always remember more than the trick. I will work on that.