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Topic: "Why are you looking at ME?""
Message: Posted by: mxray (May 3, 2006 08:16PM)
Shrubsole's recent thread "How should I treat Tablehoppers?" brought up something similar but different enough that I started a separate thread about it.
I deal for a casino party company. I do a routines and flourishes while dealing, to help with tips. The other dealers know that I do them and I have done a few for them when we are all waiting somewhere before they let us into the main room to open up tha casino. I have helped a couple of dealers with some basic flourishes when they have asked.
If there is a magician working the party, I don't do any card magic, just flourishes. No exceptions.

One night we (the dealers) were standing in a group, waiting for a party to begin ,and a nice young party stroller came over and did "unshuffled" for us. I thought he did it very well (I can't do it, though I know the method) and I thought his patter and presentation were also nice.

About halfway through the routine, I noticed that several of the dealers frequently keep glancing over at me, although I was just standing there minding my own business and watching this guy work.
He does the final revelation, and I am anticipating us all clapping and showing our appreciation, but of instead of cheering, "oohing", or saying "wow" , all the dealers look over at me. I felt on the spot and sort of froze up, not knowing what to say or do. (Though I had intended to clap along with everyone else. )
It just caught me off guard and I froze. You could have heard a pin drop. This poor guy just did a great routine and for a second, you could practically hear crickets chirping.
After a very pregnant pause, I "came to", said "Wow!", and started clapping. Almost on cue, the other dealers did as well.

Afterwards, I realized that they were all waiting for my reaction because they know I do card magic as well.. (Too bad they couldn't just make up their minds for themselves whether they like the routine or not...)

I could tell the young man had been a bit surprised by everyone's delayed reaction, and I felt badly for him. Here he did a really great trick, and the spectators just stood there looking over at someone else, and then they all clap. I hated that for him, and I hated that I weas part of it. I would never screw with someone else's performance, and didn't like the fact that just by standing there doing nothing, I had sort of done just that. Kind of a weird feeling.

I thought about trying to find him later, tell him how much I liked his performance, and maybe give my take on the "delayed reaction". But I couldn't find him while I was on break ( it was a huge party) and I was also afraid he might take it the wrong way ro something.

I guess what I learned from this is that if, in the future, I am ever standing among friends (who know I do card magic) and this happens, I should maybe "take the lead" by showing my appreciation a little earlier than I usually would.

For what its worth,
MXRay
Message: Posted by: todsky (May 3, 2006 10:19PM)
It sounds like you were the Alpha Magician to your fellow dealers, and they were deferring to you. Once they see that you genuinely appreciate being entertained by other magicians, they'll probably relax and enjoy the show.
Message: Posted by: MAGISHAUN (May 5, 2006 12:09AM)
Once I was with some friends and a bar magician was performing and being involved and curious with magic I went to check it out. As soon as he got done a trick my friends and other bystanders who seen me perform around town said "that was good but hes better" and different things along those lines and pointing to me. The magician looked at me and was like well lets see. Now, I felt bad for the guy because I know that's probably embarrasing and gave people the look like "don't say that" but before you know it he was talking crap and put me on the spot. So always being prepared I wanted to do it but didn't want to steal his spotlight (or whatever it was) but he kept insisting he was better and betting that he could figure all my things out. Now I cant stand arrogant magicians. Theres noone better than anyone it just depends on how much practice and time you put into your art. So I did, and showed some of my illusions and inventions and the place went wild. I looked at him and he was still trying to pull his foot out of his mouth. It was an interesting yet table turning moment that happens every so often amongst magicians where it seems everything has to be a competition instead of enjoying each others skills and contributions to the art. but then again if you cant walk the walk , don't talk the talk. So to refer to the post at hand ive been in those awkard moments from time to time and you definately have to be the first to comment in situations like that so others know that its not a competition otherwise be prepared.
Message: Posted by: Shrubsole (May 5, 2006 03:32AM)
Agreed. MAGISHAUN. I can't stand arrogant magicians either and why does everything always have to be a competition.

I have had friends many times open their mouths when it was not wanted. Even when I'm out for a quite drink and anyone mentions magic they usually but in with "Oh! he can do magic!" - Most have learnt by now not to do it as they always get a very serious telling off from me about not doing it.

As I'm a stage illusionist I aways have the great excuse of "No, sorry, I do stage illusions not card tricks" - That not meant to be offensive to all you people who do, but it's just a standard reply to fox laymen. (IE I don't carry my stage illusions around with me, so I can get on with having a nice evening out away from magic)

That in itself is an interesting point as in the punters view, all magicians are the same. To them, if you can do a top notch card routine, you can also make their car disappear and if you can vanish an elephant, you must also be able to put on a 2 hour table hopping show. - This is strange as all (most) doctors know how the blood circulates in the body, but you wouldn't get an Ear, nose and throat specialist operating on your in-growing toenail!

Interestingly, do any of you Close Up Artists get parents saying "Ooo my little Johnny can do a card trick" and you have to stand there whilst he shows it to you?

Then again, there are laymen who do "Card Tricks" and professional Strollers who do card manipulation. - That is a BIG difference, but to the laypeople, it's a card trick; so unless you show them the slights that have taken you lots of hard work, they think that "little Johnny" (or even an adult layman) doing their schoolboy magic is somehow the same as what you do - That can be most annoying!

That was an interesting line: "but he kept insisting he was better and betting that he could figure all my things out."
That I find very strange as I could work out or already know what the Party Stroller was doing (or how he was doing it) last night, but that doesn't make me a Close Up Artist. And what is the point of one magician telling the other magician "I know how you did that!" - Arrogance! Let's leave that sort of line to the know it all punter, we don't need or want know it all magicians. (Even if they do know it all, it's simply unprofessional!)

:)
Message: Posted by: mxray (May 5, 2006 07:34AM)
You guys reminded me of something I failed to mention in my opening post:
The night this happened, I was the designated relief dealer.
As I later went from table to table tapping people out so they could go on break, almost every dealer (in one way or another) asked "Do you know how he did that?", followed by "Okay, how?".

After a couple of times, I figured out the best answer to the first question was basically "The fact that you are asking me this means he did a great job, and you were entertained. If I did know, it wouldn't be right to ruin it after he has worked so hard to pefect somethihng so entertaining, would it?" .

I only had one dealer still persist. He (Why is it always guys that are this way?) is one of those types that will try to grab at cards, considers magic nothing more than a puzzle to be figured out, and still handles cards the same way he did when he started dealing. Whatta guy.
Message: Posted by: Shrubsole (May 5, 2006 10:34AM)
[quote]
On 2006-05-05 08:34, mxray wrote:...I only had one dealer still persist. He (Why is it always guys that are this way?) is one of those types that will try to grab at cards, considers magic nothing more than a puzzle to be figured out, and still handles cards the same way he did when he started dealing. Whatta guy.
[/quote]

:mad: Oh those are my favourites! :mad:

They do see all magic as a personal insult to their intelligence - They see you as someone who is only out to make them look stupid and think it's the height of intelligence to make you look like a prat and it's boosts their ego and improves their sex life :rolleyes:

Any smart arse who runs up to me with a "I know how you did that, it was XYZ...", whether they are right or mostly wrong, they always get the same answer: "Why are you telling me? I already KNOW HOW to do the trick!"

I can avoid an answer all night if needed: "How did you do that?"; "By studying the art of magic for years!"

I also like the people around that sort of person who say to them after 30 minutes of questioning, "Oh come on, he isn't going to tell you" - Like it's my duty to tell them and I'm being a very nasty person for not telling them!

I prefer also to do effect that can't be grabbed or effects that are inspectable anyway. I give me a better feeling of security and gives the "know it alls" no material to work with.

:)
Message: Posted by: Patrick Differ (May 5, 2006 05:52PM)
Neat stuff.

This topic has grown into two topics. The first post talked about watching another magician perform while everyone knows that you are a magicain too. The second ones talked about the wizards's duel.

First situation ... this situation happens more often than one might think. I think the reason that the pause at this finale was so prolonged wasn't just because you were perceived as the Alpha. This is a contributing factor, but not the whole thing. I think it mainly was because the other magician did the work so well, when everyone realized the dilemma the magician had put them in, they looked at you for answers. And you didn't give them any. Ultimately, you returned and showed them the way... and they followed. This is a really good example and illustration of how looking at magic through laymans' or magicians' eyes is so very different. [b]You saw it as a magician, they saw it as laymen.[/b] You knew the performer deserved applause, they were tied in knots. You put them on the right track.

Second... The Wizards' Duel. It's been said many times to never accept challenges or dares from a spectator. This case seems different because the other guy was a magician, too. But remember one thing. When you start performing, everyone, and I mean [i]everyone[/i] watching is a spectator, regardless of what they were doing two minutes ago. I accept no dares or challenges from anyone, including my wife! I perform on mine and my own terms only, and avoid these situations whatever it takes.
Message: Posted by: mc_magi (May 6, 2006 05:17PM)
For me... magicians who challenge anther into a "duel" is just another terrible magician. I view the "challenges" as the statement "I am a terrible magician". No real need to waste my effort and go up against them...

Always have a pull on you for this kind of situation if you DO want to rise up and show them that arrogance doesn't need a place in magic. Just take their deck and oi... I wanted to do something but the deck's gone... too bad eh?
Message: Posted by: glatner (May 12, 2006 07:51AM)
[quote]
On 2006-05-05 04:32, !

Interestingly, do any of you Close Up Artists get parents saying "Ooo my little Johnny can do a card trick" and you have to stand there whilst he shows it to you?


:)
[/quote]

I have seen "3 piles of seven cards" every time I work.
Message: Posted by: MAGISHAUN (Feb 19, 2007 11:30PM)
LOL
Message: Posted by: Davro (Feb 20, 2007 03:56AM)
A duel would be great if it was setup previous to the meeting. i.e. the spectators didn't know.

Best Wishes, David
Message: Posted by: MagicSanta (Feb 20, 2007 01:20PM)
I live by the 'never perform in anothers arena' idea. Mxray did the right thing and has the right attitude. I just have question for Shaun, what illusions do you carry with you to perform?
Message: Posted by: Josh Chaikin (Feb 20, 2007 01:32PM)
[quote]
On 2006-05-12 08:51, glatner wrote:
[quote]
On 2006-05-05 04:32, !

Interestingly, do any of you Close Up Artists get parents saying "Ooo my little Johnny can do a card trick" and you have to stand there whilst he shows it to you?


:)
[/quote]

I have seen "3 piles of seven cards" every time I work.
[/quote]

Happened to me once. Person at the table says, "I know a trick." I reply "Does it involve three rows of seven?" "No." It was the last table I'd be hopping that evening, so I thought 'what the heck.' She proceeded to deal three rows of nine. And mess it up.
Message: Posted by: Magic_Steve (Feb 20, 2007 08:08PM)
I hate when that happens, Josh! I have had to sit through it before, and it's just pure torture, lmao! :)...

Best,
Steve