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Topic: Center deal
Message: Posted by: Magicjg (Sep 26, 2006 08:33PM)
I would like to find any information on the Allen Kennedy center deal. If anyone knows where I can find videos, books or anything on his center deal or anyones center deal, please help me out
Message: Posted by: Steve V (Sep 26, 2006 09:01PM)
You mean how to do it or Vernons search for it?
Steve V
Message: Posted by: Magicjg (Sep 26, 2006 09:37PM)
How to do it
Message: Posted by: luvisi (Sep 26, 2006 11:22PM)
See [i]Magic and Methods of Ross Bertram[/i], and volume 12 of the Revelations video series.

Andru
Message: Posted by: Magicjg (Sep 27, 2006 10:14AM)
Thanks for the reply. I have the revelations dvd series. I like his explination, but I'm looking for alittle more detail. I'm searching for Magic and Methods of Ross Bertram now. Anyone else have an good information for me? THanks
Message: Posted by: Unknown419 (Sep 27, 2006 10:18PM)
Why are you not looking at my Expose? If you did then why is it that you're asking about the middle deal?

When expert stuff is given, people just pass over it like it's nothing. And yes I actually middle deal at times when I cheat.

Don't get ****ed at me but I'm a hard teacher

Your New Friend and Hopefully Teacher

Doc
Message: Posted by: Magicjg (Sep 28, 2006 10:52AM)
Unknown419, what are you talking about? Your expose?
Message: Posted by: Unknown419 (Sep 28, 2006 01:00PM)
[quote]
On 2006-09-28 11:52, Magicjg wrote:
Unknown419, what are you talking about? Your expose?
[/quote]

Doc's Expose.

You're in the gambling section and you don't look at other things? How can you ever learn?

Doc
Message: Posted by: sodman12 (Sep 28, 2006 10:27PM)
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=179417&forum=188&17

Might wanna check this out magicjg
Message: Posted by: Peter Woerde (Sep 30, 2006 07:49AM)
[quote]
On 2006-09-27 23:18, Unknown419 wrote:
Why are you not looking at my Expose?
[/quote]
Maybe because he was asking for sources that showed a little more detail. No offense, but that is exactly what your expose is lacking.
I agree with everyone who says your skill is outstanding and your center deal is exactly what someone should see if he wanted to see how it should look like, but for someone who is trying to learn the mechanics of the center deal your expose isn't the best of sources.

All the best,
Peter
Message: Posted by: Unknown419 (Sep 30, 2006 12:47PM)
[quote]
On 2006-09-26 21:33, Magicjg wrote:
I would like to find any information on the ... center deal. If anyone knows where I can find videos, ... or anything on ... anyones center deal, please help me out
[/quote]

Peter it depends on what you're actually looking for. I look at things to see if it looks real and the hand position etc. and then from that point on I try to invent my own variant according to my handling.

Pete I take no offense on things such as these. Thanks for your compliments regarding my handling.

Your Friend

Doc
Message: Posted by: tommy (Sep 30, 2006 01:43PM)
While I understand what Pete has said, I have to say that Doc's way, is the way I have found some things that best suit me and I can do best. It's harder because your using your own head rather than having it handed to you on plate.

However I can't do a centre, so sorry I can't help with that. It's just something I have little enthusiasm for because I haven't seen one that looks real but I will now have look at Doc's and am sure it will inspire me to at least try.
Message: Posted by: Peter Woerde (Sep 30, 2006 03:00PM)
[quote]
On 2006-09-30 13:47, Unknown419 wrote:
...and then from that point on I try to invent my own variant according to my handling.
[/quote]

I think there are a lot of stages between getting handed things on a plate like tommy mentions and the above quote and to get good I feel one needs to spend a considerable amount of time in all of these stages. I agree that once you reach the stage of inventing your own handlings to best suit your style you are not just getting good, but real good.

To get back on topic, I'll try and get a video of my center deal as well.

All the best,
Peter
Message: Posted by: Peter Woerde (Sep 30, 2006 05:20PM)
Here's a video of my center deal. As you can see I use the Gene Maze grip, from his book The Art of Bottom Dealing.
The take of the aces is not as smooth as I like it to be, but it's getting there. Any comments or suggestions are appreciated.

[url=http://media.putfile.com/Center-Deal]Center Deal[/url]


All the best,
Peter
Message: Posted by: EMVT (Sep 30, 2006 06:27PM)
Not a bad looking deal but there is a slight problem with this from the side this looks ok and I know you don't show your deals from the front but because from the front it's not that great trust me I have played with this method for many years because when you take the card the gap is very big from the front.

As an expose I guess it would pass but I don't know if you play cards for stakes I do and this deal is no good for that purpose to make the deal good takes lots of practice the front grip must be natural and it's ok if the grip is from the erdnsae grip, and don't forget laymen, spectators at the card table or whatever have absolutely have to see nothing when that card comes out including the gap as much as possible.

So practice in front of a mirror and you'll soon get it but like I said it has a flaw from the front so really take the time with this beautful sleight to make it look perfect and then and only then will you have a weapon to admire for ever, and don't forget if you show this to magicians with perfect handling they will look at you with amazement as they will like you, talk about you and even hate you a little.

This sleight is one of my many weapons at the card table I love it.

Also great expose demo Doc good to see another fellow mechanic working those beautiful moves- great work, great hands, from a great man.

Your friend and fellow mechanic
God bless
EMVT
Message: Posted by: Peter Woerde (Oct 1, 2006 08:03AM)
[quote]
On 2006-09-30 19:27, EMVT wrote:
Not a bad looking deal but there is a slight problem with this from the side this looks ok and I know you don't show your deals from the front but because from the front it's not that great trust me I have played with this method for many years because when you take the card the gap is very big from the front.
[/quote]

I think we have been using sleightly different methods because that gap you're speaking of his hardly there. Of course, you didn't know that because of the top view of the video. I'll try to make a front view video in the next couple of days.
Message: Posted by: sodman12 (Oct 2, 2006 12:19AM)
Yeah I think the best view is that of someone sitting at the table with you.
Message: Posted by: Peter Woerde (Oct 8, 2006 04:59AM)
Here's a front view of my attempt at the center deal. Any tips would be appreciated.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGd1avMTiik
Message: Posted by: Vandy Grift (Oct 8, 2006 05:21AM)
[quote]
On 2006-10-08 05:59, Peter Woerde wrote:
Here's a front view of my attempt at the center deal. Any tips would be appreciated.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGd1avMTiik
[/quote]

Peter, that looks pretty good. I can't center deal, so take this for what it's worth. If I were watching you there is two things in the clip that would catch my eye.

First, there is a slight hesitation when you deal the center card. It seems to take a split second longer for you to get the center card than it does for the first three cards dealt. I would either try to get that center card out in the same amount of time that it takes to get the other cards, or slow down the legit deal a little bit. Using a metronome while practicing could go a long way towards eliminating that little hiccup.

Secondly, when you take the center card the hand holding the deck seems to rise from the table a little bit further then when you are dealing from the top. It's very subtle but it looks a tiny bit sketchy.

Having said that, I think it looks pretty darn good. Certainly a lot better than I could ever do, so please don't misconstrue my comments. I'm only letting you know what I saw when I watched it and what I would notice if we were playing together.
Message: Posted by: Unknown419 (Oct 8, 2006 11:38AM)
Peter in my opinion even though I may have the exact same problem that Vandy said you're having I believe that your center deal will fly in any game. I'm proud of you, keep up the good work.

Your Friend

Doc

P.S. Your get ready is a 10... mine is an 8
Message: Posted by: brownitus (Oct 8, 2006 01:47PM)
Agreed, that's a really strong center deal Peter, great work. Now we know how you got all those chips there :D :)
Message: Posted by: Peter Woerde (Oct 8, 2006 04:21PM)
Vandy, thanks for your observations. I'll work on the details you mentioned. I like your suggestion for using a metronome.
Doc, thanks for the kind words. I'm pretty sure I'd screw it up if I would try it in a real game though.
Brownitus, I never used the center deal in my blackjack game. The punch deal is much safer for that and it gets those chips just as nicely.
Message: Posted by: Steve V (Oct 8, 2006 09:29PM)
Other than the rythm it looked great. Wouldnt pass in most games cuz of that lil' delay...well done.
Steve V
Message: Posted by: EMVT (Oct 8, 2006 11:20PM)
Hey Peter I liked your center deals that would definitely get the money in a game trust me even with the little minute details I wouldn't worry about it you're on the right track good job

EMVT
Message: Posted by: Vandy Grift (Oct 9, 2006 08:39AM)
Peter,

For the record, that deal would definately fly in any of the games I play in. No doubt in my mind. So please don't take my comments as any kind of criticism. The deal is excellent. The items that I pointed out are extremely fine points that very, very few people would ever notice. I only made mention of them in case you wanted to try and eliminate them. But honestly, your center deal is really very good. Great work.

I got the metronome idea from Ian Kendall. I use one when I work on 2nds and bottoms. The electronic ones are cheap and they can be adjusted to various time counts. It's a pretty handy little practice tool that really helps me with my rhythm.
Message: Posted by: Andrei (Oct 9, 2006 01:05PM)
http://www.metronomeonline.com/ also works, if you have a laptop that you can carry to your table.

Andrei
Message: Posted by: Steve V (Oct 9, 2006 01:27PM)
That is true Vandy...only magicians would really notice the rythm issue. Actually he could alter the legit moves to more closely match the center.
Steve V
Message: Posted by: Paul H (Oct 9, 2006 02:45PM)
Guys,

It really does depend on the quality of the company. But this is all a red herring anyway as Peter is focused on producing gambling demo's. And for this purpose its an excellent deal.

Regards,

Paul H
Message: Posted by: daniel1113 (Oct 9, 2006 03:18PM)
I also recommend getting a small metronome for practicing any false deals. Although you can use audio samples on a computer to accomplish the same thing, such as the ones provided by Ian Kendall on his website, there's nothing like having a tempo-adjustable metronome at your fingertips that you can cailbrate to your natural dealing tempo. I use a Korg MA-30 that I picked up on ebay for $16. It's cheap, and will definitely improve anyone's false dealing.

BTW, your center deal clip looked awesome.
Message: Posted by: Unknown419 (Oct 9, 2006 05:20PM)
To Whom It May Concern

Why do ya'll always hear me talk about my Treo phone, I have the 700P now and will soon advance to the 750 that's coming out soon. Just go to Palmgear.com and download BeatMatch or any other metronome program that you like and "Voila" you have a ready to use metronome at your service. You download Fake Call for when you're in a game to pretend someone is calling you for an emergency so you can leave the game after Cold Decking them, you download NMG to practice your number memory system, download card count to help you know your discard cards for memory, Flash Cards for the pneumonic systems, IOU mate for people who owe you money, Sound Rec to tape all conversations pertaining to what ever, a camcorder to video tape moves on the spot, Moving Board in case you have to let your friend know something from across the room. Match Who in case you have to identify someone, Translator in case you need to speak to someone who speaks in another language, Flash Lamp for your S.O.S. morse code help and for your flash light and now all we need is the 5.0 StackView, I have the old PDA one on my phone.

The list goes on and on for whatever your gambling and practicing needs are. If you're a hustler you need a Treo not only because of all the things you may need but also to remember how to cheat a particular game. Why? There are so many variants to each cheat and poker game that you've already beaten that you can't remember them all so you'll have to look up how you used to cheat a particular game so you can go right to it again.

Doc

P.S. And yes for the record I do have small metronome I used to practice with but with advanced technology of today I no longer need it.
Message: Posted by: sodman12 (Oct 9, 2006 05:43PM)
I feel like I was watching an ad for the phone when I was reading you post doc.
Message: Posted by: daniel1113 (Oct 9, 2006 07:37PM)
[quote]
On 2006-10-09 18:20, Unknown419 wrote:
Why do ya'll always hear me talk about my Treo phone, I have the 700P now and will soon advance to the 750 that's coming out soon.
[/quote]

You have good tastes, Doc. I am waiting for the 750 as well, as it may just be the finest smartphone ever produced.
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 9, 2006 08:31PM)
I guess I love a good debate. one thing I cant understand the same people here who says that shell/monte on the streets and boosting is wrong they cheat at cards and dice! go figure!
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 9, 2006 08:34PM)
I guess I love a good debate. one thing I cant understand the same people here who says that shell/monte on the streets and boosting is wrong they cheat at cards and dice! go figure! Is it better to steal from some poor sap rather than a rich store??? lol! I am not a thief I am just trying to figure out some peoples logic. I don't care what yall say I know I am right!
Also Doc, look like you love that phone!
Message: Posted by: Unknown419 (Oct 9, 2006 10:44PM)
The phone is one of your main necessities when hustling besides money, a car, a spot to hustle at and a gun.

You will need a phone to call your partner, to find out where the gambling spot is at, for directions, even to call the police if you have any problems (no matter how bad you is in your town the people out of town don't know you nor do they give a f*** about you) so the police will have to save you then, if your car brake down or if you're left stranded while running in another direction. My morse code flashing light S.O.S. signal is to let any one know I'm in trouble if stranded in the woods while also being a flash light in the dark. You can even have the police track you down using the GPS on your phone besides the fact that you can use it as a shiner while dealing.

I know I'm rambling on and on about a phone but the object of hustling is to stay alive in order to spend the money that you're making. So I'm writing this because hustling is a business (a dirty one) and the Treo phone is a business phone. I study programs that teach you how to win at checkers, chess (Chess Genius) and learn how to play specific games. My phone can record my phone conversations as well as any other conversations just in case something goes wrong on the road or with an officer etc. (You need this as your proof that you were in the right). Memph33777 as you know blacks encounter a lot of problems on the road.

Your Entertainment Center

While you're on a bus or in a car it will entertain you with games, music, pictures, videos/TV shows and the bible while still being able to access the internet for whatever info you need. Hustling is not all about cheating it's about surviving on the road when you're all alone or don't like the person you're hustling with and you want to leave. I know this to be true because I've experienced everything I'm talking about while on the road and like most hustlers know things happen just when you don't expect it to.

The Other Necessities

The Gun: It's not for you to hurt or kill any one unless it's absolutely necessary but used to get yourself out of a bad situation or danger.

The Car: To get you to and from games and for escaping to safety.

The Money: Needed in order to hustle with and to buy food while on the road (you can sleep in your car).

"Doc, look like you love that phone."

Yes memph3377 I do love my phone if it wasn't for me hustling an ordinary cell phone would do me fine.

The Conclusion

Remember safety 1st, hustling 2nd. Why? Because if you're dead or locked up hustling will be the least of your worries.

Respectfully,

Doc

P.S. You know you can even have a picture of your driver's license in your phone just in case your wallet is lost or stolen etc.
Message: Posted by: tommy (Oct 9, 2006 11:13PM)
These Remote Video Cameras that have their own phone number, such as this Pupillo one here, might be a useful thing for an enterprising hustler. Note it has IR. You would need to get the audio bleep disabled.

http://threestore.three.co.uk/PAYG/default.aspx
Message: Posted by: Mr. Z (Oct 9, 2006 11:51PM)
And to think I learned by just pitching cards around the table and occasionally in front of a mirror...

:)
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 10, 2006 12:47AM)
I might have to get me one of those phones.
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 10, 2006 12:49AM)
I want to know what some of you hustlers weekly take is. How much money do you hustlers usually take a week?
Message: Posted by: sodman12 (Oct 10, 2006 01:21PM)
Its not enough
Message: Posted by: brownitus (Oct 10, 2006 03:38PM)
I've had a Treo 650 for over a year now and I run a business as well (though quite the polar opposite to yours, Doc :)), and the Treo definitely rocks the spot. It's unbelievable how much you can do with it, especially when you add a decent memory card.

I'm curious if there's any substantial enough differences to warrant grabbing a 700 or 750 over my 650, Doc?

Take care
Bobby
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 10, 2006 05:48PM)
I wonder is a treo better than a pocket pc?
Message: Posted by: daniel1113 (Oct 10, 2006 08:07PM)
[quote]
On 2006-10-10 18:48, memph33777 wrote:
I wonder is a treo better than a pocket pc?
[/quote]

I think so... you get all the benefits of a pocket PC and a mobile phone in a single unit. I currently carry a Dell Axim and cell phone everywhere I go, but that will change once the 750 is released in the US. Plus, the newer Treos (700 & 750) can be purchased with either Palm OS or MS Windows Mobile, which is good for everyone.

As for whether or not the 750 is worth the upgrade from a 650, that is a bit more difficult to answer, and probably depends on which OS you prefer. The 750 is really the first smart phone specifically designed for the European market. As such, it lacks an external antennae, which may be a big selling point for many. That aside, the 750 will supposedly add support for threaded SMS to the Windows-based version, which will also be upgraded to the latest version (Windows Mobile 5.2). The other changes are pretty insignificant overall, such as the change from an Intel to a nearly equivalent Samsung processor.
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 11, 2006 03:16AM)
I have 2 cell phones. one is unlimited local,long distance and text for one rate of $45 a month. my other cell phone is one that runs off of minutes that I have a number to give my vics.
Message: Posted by: gump (Oct 11, 2006 04:10PM)
[quote]
On 2006-10-11 04:16, memph33777 wrote:
I have 2 cell phones. one is unlimited local,long distance and text for one rate of $45 a month. my other cell phone is one that runs off of minutes that I have a number to give my vics.
[/quote]
I hope you mean that your phone "that runs off of minutes" is of the prepaid/disposable type. :)
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 11, 2006 04:26PM)
Yeah the one that runs off of minutes is definitely prepaid/disposable!!!! I never use it anyhow.
Message: Posted by: memph33777 (Oct 12, 2006 01:34PM)
I am curious to know if any of you guys or girls would be interested in purchasing specialty dice for (entertaintment purposes) of course. You name them and they can be made. Also if anybody wants to learn how to shoot pool from a real street hustler let me know.
Message: Posted by: Gustaf (Oct 16, 2006 05:39AM)
I wonder which Center deal is the easiest to learn? It doesn't have to look flawless because I'm only going to use it in gambling routines for laymen. I am currently practising Andrew Wimhurst's Center Deal.
Message: Posted by: Paul Sherman (Oct 16, 2006 01:10PM)
I'm surprised no one has mentioned that there's a very detailed description of the Kennedy deal by David Ben in the December 2001 issue of Genii. The back issues are sold out, but I'm sure there's some floating around on the secondary market.