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Topic: Chris Angel's Mindfreak
Message: Posted by: ed rhodes (Dec 29, 2006 10:42PM)
They ran a block of Mindfreak last night. I got to see (on my big screen TV) the sequence I'd caught on YouTube where Chris had the girl on the park bench pulled in two!


When I saw it on YouTube, I was stunned for a second because I hadn't been expecting it. Then I recognized the effect which I'd only read about for years.

However, if I can ask without giving too much away... how did she move so naturally and how did she lie down so casually?

PM me if you have a suggestion or if you want clarification as to what the Hey I'm talking about!
Message: Posted by: Cory Gallupe (Dec 31, 2006 10:11AM)
It took me while too. I had to rewind it a few times on my DVR (Pause and rewinds live tv) to find out what in the heck happend. I was shocked! My whole family just yelled WHAT THE %$R^%$#^%#???????
It was kindof disturbing. But if it was done the way I am suspecting, then I have the same questions you do. How DID she move so freely?
Message: Posted by: munkywrench (Dec 31, 2006 10:13AM)
Wireless comunication and plenty of practise?
Message: Posted by: MagicMatt13 (Dec 31, 2006 10:34AM)
This is what I think. I believe that the top half of the women was a real women who was born with only the top half of her body. (I've seen it.) The bottem half was a women that could stretch her body in half. Before the trick they stacked on top of each other and the one on the bottem holding the top women.
Message: Posted by: DStachowiak (Dec 31, 2006 01:27PM)
It's actually an illusion originated by Kevin James, called (I think) "Operation" or some such, and I understand there's been a lot of discontent about Criss Angel using it on TVwithout bothering with permission or credit.
Message: Posted by: BrianMillerMagic (Dec 31, 2006 02:48PM)
From what I understand Criss uses a lot of effects credited to others without asking permission. I guess he has enough money to just pay them to go away.

I remember seeing this illusion on Mindfreak when it originally aired, and my stomach flipped over. Afterwards of course I realized how it was done but it was nonetheless a very startling illusion.
Message: Posted by: ed rhodes (Dec 31, 2006 11:47PM)
[quote]
On 2006-12-31 14:27, DStachowiak wrote:
It's actually an illusion originated by Kevin James, called (I think) "Operation" or some such, and I understand there's been a lot of discontent about Criss Angel using it on TVwithout bothering with permission or credit.
[/quote]

That illusion was done back in the '40s I believe. Although I can't remember the name of the magician who originated it.

Perhaps KJ is the one who came up with a way to do it in public. The other magician did it on a stage and switched people at the last second.
Message: Posted by: DStachowiak (Jan 1, 2007 05:32AM)
There's probably a long history of this kind of thing, people who have unusual physical anomalies being the basis of bizarre theatre. I know little people have been eployed this way often in the past, and the carnival geek shows were often performed by people who were either born different or maimed.

It's tempting to condemn this as exploitation, but it may just be a way for people to come to terms with, or even benifit from, being unusual or different.
Message: Posted by: Illucifer (Jan 1, 2007 12:12PM)
This was not originated by Kevin James.
This illusion was done in 1937 by Raja Raboid using Johnny Eck and his twin brother, Robert. The difference between the two twins was that Johnny was born with nothing beneath his ribcage, i.e. he consisted of trunk, arms and head.
His twin would be invited onstage and then switched for Johnny and a midget dressed up as the bottom half.
Message: Posted by: DStachowiak (Jan 1, 2007 07:37PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-01 13:12, meauxfeaux wrote:
This was not originated by Kevin James.
This illusion was done in 1937 by Raja Raboid using Johnny Eck and his twin brother, Robert. The difference between the two twins was that Johnny was born with nothing beneath his ribcage, i.e. he consisted of trunk, arms and head.
His twin would be invited onstage and then switched for Johnny and a midget dressed up as the bottom half.

[/quote]
Then I stand corrected. If that is so, then I think Criss Angel is owed an apology from a lot of magicians, as he has been really widely criticized over this. Where can I learn more of the history of Rajah Raboid's version? Milbourne Christopher's "Illustrated History of Magic" only mentions him twice, referring to him rather dismissively as "Rajah Raboid, a Vaudeville crystal gazer", but mentions him in connection with the Thurston show and La Follette, which would tend to indicate that he must have been a bigger name than Christopher would have us believe.
Message: Posted by: sibbie (Jan 1, 2007 08:40PM)
Rajah Raboid's version, I believe, is quickly mentioned on A&E's "The Story of Magic" with Ricky Jay. The only difference in the effect is that in Raboid's version the bottom half would run away and the top half would chase it and in Criss Angel's version just the top half scurryed away.

As Mandrake pointed out, Mr. James's may have a method but the plot outdates him by several decades.
Message: Posted by: Tony Iacoviello (Jan 1, 2007 09:27PM)
The "Illustrated History of Magic" is a great read, but one should take what it says with a grain of salt, as one should with any book. As writers, personal opinions color what we write, and not everyone has the same standard of research.

Tony
Message: Posted by: ed rhodes (Jan 2, 2007 05:04AM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-01 06:32, DStachowiak wrote:
There's probably a long history of this kind of thing, people who have unusual physical anomalies being the basis of bizarre theatre. I know little people have been eployed this way often in the past, and the carnival geek shows were often performed by people who were either born different or maimed.

It's tempting to condemn this as exploitation, but it may just be a way for people to come to terms with, or even benifit from, being unusual or different.
[/quote]

It might be exploitation, OTOH, it just might be that she enjoyed freaking out the "straights!"
Message: Posted by: DStachowiak (Jan 2, 2007 09:30AM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-01 22:27, Tony Iacoviello wrote:
The "Illustrated History of Magic" is a great read, but one should take what it says with a grain of salt, as one should with any book. As writers, personal opinions color what we write, and not everyone has the same standard of research.

Tony
[/quote]
True Enough, Tony, it just happened to be the reference that was close at hand.
I have always enjoyed Christopher but I have always been suspicious of history written by someone who was almost a contemporary of his subjects, they tend to grind personal axes a lot. Christopher would have been in his teens, and certainly active in Magic, at the time Rajah Raboid was performing. He might well have had an opportunity to develop a grudge, or at least a negative impression.
Message: Posted by: rpierce (Jan 2, 2007 03:54PM)
I saw Criss Angel on youtube, does anyone know where to find the effect of disappearing from the outside garden tables?
Message: Posted by: ed rhodes (Jan 2, 2007 10:37PM)
I <did> notice something in watching the clip for the umteenth time.

Angel reaches up and cradles the head of the woman as she's laying down. This would make sense if she's "top heavy" and won't be able to lay down gracefully on her own.
Message: Posted by: Alex Linian (Jan 6, 2007 07:34PM)
...Not an exposure forum...
Message: Posted by: Scattered Dream (Jan 7, 2007 11:52AM)
I was looking up criss angel on youtube and I saw something very bizarre. I was watching him performing a levitation with a women, the video was old. The women he was levitating was the same women he levitated there on Fremont Street in his season 1 of mindfreak.
Message: Posted by: Scattered Dream (Jan 7, 2007 12:08PM)
I was looking up criss angel on youtube and I saw something very bizarre. I was watching him performing a levitation with a women, the video was old. The women he was levitating was the same women he levitated there on Fremont Street in his season 1 of mindfreak.
Message: Posted by: Maleficia (Jan 15, 2007 10:31AM)
Apparently, there used to be a similar effect to "that quarter through arm" one Criss performed called "Surgical Reveal", but it has since disappeared from the market. I don't think it's the same one, but it's close. Ebay might yield some results.
Message: Posted by: Dougini (Jan 15, 2007 08:31PM)
Well, a cable network just did a story on the very woman in that video! She developed a disease, as a child, that made it necessary to remove her legs at the hips. The woman was a VERY good sport, as the camera followed her around, doing her daily routine, taking care of her kids, husband, and helping with the kid's softball team.

I had tears in my eyes at the end of that segment (I believe it was Ripley's Believe It Or Not). I salute that woman, and all other people who have to live with an amputation! Remarkable stamina...

That said, I find her an EXTREMELY good sport to agree to an exhibition with Criss Angel! He is usually VERY well-liked, and I'm glad she did this with him, as I was just as shocked and amazed as the audience!!

I hope the General Public won't remember she is the same woman...that WOULD be a shame to expose...and hey, Alex...don't worry...I won't tell! LOL!

:)

Doug