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Topic: Looking for a Safety Pin Effect - help
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Nov 23, 2008 12:00AM)
Does anyone know where I could find this effect with a safety pin please?

Effect: Introduce a safety pin and 3 business card to the spectator and EXAMINED. The magician put a small dot on card A, and asked spectator to sign card B and C. The magician use open the pin and stab thru the dot on card A to make a hole and close the pin to lock the card in.

Next, the magician take card B and simply slide the card over the pin on card A, the dot/hole on card A is restored and now the pin is transfered to card B.

The magician then take card C and simply transfer the pin from B with a simple and quick slide motion. The magician can still move the pin up and down on card C, assuming the hole is moveable. Finally he settle at one spot on card C and the pin stays there!

The magician then have to rip the card or open the pin to remove the card to show that the pin is really stabbed thru card C.


IS THIS FROM JERRY ANDRUS BOOK? Or is it an individual effect?

Please PM me if you know where I can find it, thanks every so much!

Bob
Message: Posted by: Ustaad (Nov 23, 2008 12:49AM)
You need one gimmicked and two normal safety pins to pull off the effect.

[b]How?[/b]

Check out the above video performance by clicking -----> [url=http://tw.youtube.com/watch?v=hVActDG2Rnc][b]HERE[/b][/url]. :) ;)

Enjoy!

:xmas:
Message: Posted by: Stevethomas (Nov 23, 2008 01:17PM)
I think the effect you're looking for is a David Harkey effect, not from his book or video, but it was sold as a stand-alone effect. May have one lying on my desk unopened, matter of fact.

Steve
Message: Posted by: AdrianKeller (Nov 23, 2008 02:27PM)
The name is "the point of no return". as stated, a david harkey effect.
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Nov 23, 2008 05:59PM)
I own the Linking Safety Pin and I believe it uses the same gimmick pin. However, would still be interested to see the handling.

Steve and Adrian, May I ask how practical is it?

Thanks
Message: Posted by: Ustaad (Nov 23, 2008 07:42PM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-23 18:59, mrmuji wrote:
I own the Linking Safety Pin and I believe it uses the same gimmick pin.
[/quote]

Yes.

:xmas:
Message: Posted by: Xiqual (Nov 23, 2008 11:14PM)
Bob,
You saw Jiang Fey's show on Saturday eh?
I believe the effect is actually called "heavy metal" You won't find it anywhere.
Harkey stopped making it a while back.
James
ps
It does not use the same gimmicks.
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Nov 24, 2008 10:02AM)
Yes James, The Variety Show on 22nd. It was well cool when I saw that happended.

I believe you watched it as well huh? In fact I realised Liu uses some cool market effect for the start as an appetite and finish with a kicker.

I always have the linking pin for performing walk around but that didn't get too big reactions. Until watching it, then I know THIS IS WHAT I want.

Seems if it's not the same gimmick then it might be a magnetic one and that's all I can think of. However, if it is called The Point Of No Return, then it is still available I think. BUT if it's called Heavy Metal as you stated, then is it 100% no way I could get it?

Thanks
Bob

Posted: Nov 24, 2008 11:10am
But James, from what I know, Heavy Metal by David HArkey is a coin thru table effect.

I m getting confused now!
Message: Posted by: Stevethomas (Nov 24, 2008 12:19PM)
Heavy Metal is a coin effect utilizing a "special coin". Point of No Return in the safety pin effect featured in the video on the link.

Steve
Message: Posted by: Xiqual (Nov 25, 2008 07:45AM)
I was sure it was heavy metal. The ad is in the old Genii mags. I'll have to go and look.
sorry for the confusion if I am wrong.
James
ps
Bob,
Are you not tired of Taiwan TV magicians and their lousy presentations?
Did Liu really need to hold up the marker and say "marker" to the audience?
This whole crop of guys just saying what their actions are while the do the trick is beyond stupid. Oh well, What can we say?
Message: Posted by: Sir Pharaul (Nov 25, 2008 10:07AM)
David Harkey had a routine in the Linking Ring several years ago called Business Liquidation. It is very similar to this but the handling is different. Harkey also marketed this effect. I think by the same name but could be wrong.
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Nov 25, 2008 10:37AM)
James,

I checked on Hanklee's website and would confirmed that Heavy Metal is indeed a coin effect. Infact it's a flipper coin.

Hm...regarding the TV show. I gotta say sometimes Liu introduce something that I haven't seen before as I wasn't hold up to know the majority stuffs that is underground or limited produced. I remember he did a puzzle trick before and that's the Merlin's Puzzle and that was pretty interesting to me too. Like he said he wasn't in a competition so it's not about creative, and I noticed things he uses such as Kevin James's card in balloon, prohibition, acrobatic knot, Jepordy, intercessors, pretty much plenty of market stuffs. I won't say I like it a lot but is still funny to watch the silly teasing.

However his presentation, I would say maybe that's his style and I presume performing infront of the TV is different, dunno. Just agree with you, I probably wouldn't emphasize that way.

The audience, Jiang Fei, Wong Bin Yeun and other guests. They always see the candidates do card manipulation and still amazyed, which I m frustracted about...that's how they should react to keep the broadcasting rating high :D


Do you watch it every week too?

Bob
Message: Posted by: Xiqual (Nov 25, 2008 05:28PM)
Hi Bob,
I always appear on Lee Jing's show "Diamond night club" I am "Jobe Ke Ke"
I have been on 3 times and they called me for an appearance in December.

Jiang Fey's producers called me but I have a contract with Lee Jing's show for three months at a time and they will pick up another three months.

Personally, I always do themed routines that have a reason. Maybe you have seen my sets, if not, PM me your address and I'll send you a DVD.

I'm not saying I'm better than those guys, I just don't like demonstration style magic where they pick up every object and state what it is, then ask the helper to examine it.

Just my nitpick,
James
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Nov 25, 2008 06:40PM)
Hey James,

I didn't watch the Diamond Night Club because I didn't realised they have included any magic entertainment bits. As you know Jiang Fey's show is a mixture of variety and magic hence draw my attention to watch. However I won't say I m addicted nor be the best show, I just watch it casually.

From my memory if I am right, there is someone do a 2-3 minutes rope routine in the Diamond Night Club before. If that's you then you might be right, I have flashly sen your appearance in a youtube clip. If I know they have a magicain at that chapter, then I will watch it. From now on, if you are gonna be there then I m DEFINATELY gonna watch it!

May I say thank you for your kindness to share your set with me? I will PM you my address later. Becasue I really like to watch others to perform, rathan than only watching DVDs. The way you plan and construct your routine is what I m aiming for too coz I hate doing individual effect, put it in away and bring out something else. Do you think so?

As I m chinese origin, performing with english presentation is how I learn my magic. However performing the same thing in chinese presentation is SO TOUGH! From my experience, performing misdirection in chinese, I just hit a 60% failure rate...Haha..
Message: Posted by: chidzuyo (Nov 25, 2008 07:50PM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-25 18:28, Xiqual wrote:

I'm not saying I'm better than those guys, I just don't like demonstration style magic where they pick up every object and state what it is, then ask the helper to examine it.

[/quote]

What's wrong with doing that?
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Nov 25, 2008 09:40PM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-25 20:50, chidzuyo wrote:
[quote]
On 2008-11-25 18:28, Xiqual wrote:

I'm not saying I'm better than those guys, I just don't like demonstration style magic where they pick up every object and state what it is, then ask the helper to examine it.

[/quote]

What's wrong with doing that?
[/quote]

He doesn't like to emphasise something that is already OBVIOUS. I think it depends on who you perform to as some people are skeptical.

Bob
Message: Posted by: Xiqual (Nov 25, 2008 10:44PM)
When you pick up a pen and say "Pen" I think you are insulting your spectators intelligence. It also leads people down the path that there might be fake pens.

Sure, specs probably have an idea that there are fake gimmicky pens but let's not draw a frame around it for them.

Think about a regular situation. If you had to sign for a package and the mailman said "Here, sign you name, WITH THIS PEN." Wouldn't you start thinking the pen was special? Normally, you just pick up a pen and use it, or hand it to someone.

About examinaning props. I NEVER let people examine things. Slows down the show and just breaks the dramatic rythm. It's all about attitude.

Again, just my opinion.
James


[quote]
On 2008-11-25 20:50, chidzuyo wrote:
[quote]
On 2008-11-25 18:28, Xiqual wrote:

I'm not saying I'm better than those guys, I just don't like demonstration style magic where they pick up every object and state what it is, then ask the helper to examine it.

[/quote]

What's wrong with doing that?
[/quote]
Message: Posted by: chidzuyo (Nov 25, 2008 11:44PM)
^ I see what you mean.

I guess the effect could be better if the performer only hands out his props for examination if the audience request for it themselves. It seems more impromptu and real that way. Instead of offering every single thing for examination and making non-suspicious looking items look suspicious.
Message: Posted by: Ustaad (Nov 26, 2008 12:43AM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-26 00:44, chidzuyo wrote:
^ I see what you mean.

[b][i]I guess the effect could be better if the performer only hands out his props for examination if the audience request for it themselves. It seems more impromptu and real that way.[/i][/b] Instead of offering every single thing for examination and making non-suspicious looking items look suspicious.
[/quote]

Yes, that is how it should be. I agree!!! :)

:xmas:
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Nov 26, 2008 04:55AM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-26 00:44, chidzuyo wrote:
^ I see what you mean.

I guess the effect could be better if the performer only hands out his props for examination if the audience request for it themselves. It seems more impromptu and real that way. Instead of offering every single thing for examination and making non-suspicious looking items look suspicious.
[/quote]

Sometimes not everything can be examined, usually the props are partly examinable only. The majority of borrowed object for doign impromptu magic are examinable though. If you are to ask your audience for a sharpie then they shouldn't have bring one with them. Perhaps that's maybe the reason why Liu emphasise anything he brings.

Just my thought as well.

Bob
Message: Posted by: chidzuyo (Nov 26, 2008 06:51AM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-26 05:55, mrmuji wrote:

Sometimes not everything can be examined, usually the props are partly examinable only. The majority of borrowed object for doign impromptu magic are examinable though. If you are to ask your audience for a sharpie then they shouldn't have bring one with them. Perhaps that's maybe the reason why Liu emphasise anything he brings.

Just my thought as well.

Bob
[/quote]

Of course. It'll be extremely retarded and humiliating to hand out props that reveal the secret.

Luchen does have a tendency to conduct a "props examination" before performing the illusion. And I notice he likes to say things like, "Many people think that magicians used props with hidden gimmicks blah blah..." before he emphasize that his props are authentic and innocent.

Ultimately, to each his own. As long as you (and your audience) are comfortable with the way you're performing.
Message: Posted by: zellyen (Dec 3, 2008 02:41PM)
Hey guys I am new here, however, I found this thread by googling the same effect. I have been doing card magic close to a year now and thought to try something different and saw this on the variety show. It seems like Point of No Return, however, is not carried in a lot of shops. I checked one shop online that had it, and it turned out that they are out of stock on the material. If any of you guys know where would I get hold of this, please do tell. Thank you.

Best Regards,
D
Message: Posted by: mrmuji (Dec 3, 2008 07:48PM)
Welcome to the Café Zellyen
Message: Posted by: AdrianKeller (Dec 15, 2008 09:17AM)
Finally a reply. ;) well, I'd call the effect "practical". but not as presented in the video. in the normal effect, only one signature is used, you start and end with a blank business card. to present it the way as shown in the video, you will need an extra safety pin and some chops/misdirection, you're only supplied with 2 of them (umm ... the pins). I would rather present it in a way that the first spectator signs the card through which she has pushed the pin. btw ... harkey suggests that the spectator should push the pin through ... not recommended. since it's quite big it's difficult to handle . I don't want my spectators to hurt themselves.

although I said the effect was practical, it's not something I'd show on a regular basis. don't know why.
Message: Posted by: zellyen (Dec 19, 2008 04:30AM)
Where did you get a hold of the instruction/gimmick for said effect. I found a place but they were out of harkey material
Message: Posted by: AdrianKeller (Dec 19, 2008 07:34AM)
Mine was/is second hand. I have no clue where to get a new set, sorry. :(
Message: Posted by: luchen (Dec 31, 2008 11:35AM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-25 23:44, Xiqual wrote:
When you pick up a pen and say "Pen" I think you are insulting your spectators intelligence. It also leads people down the path that there might be fake pens.

Sure, specs probably have an idea that there are fake gimmicky pens but let's not draw a frame around it for them.

Think about a regular situation. If you had to sign for a package and the mailman said "Here, sign you name, WITH THIS PEN." Wouldn't you start thinking the pen was special? Normally, you just pick up a pen and use it, or hand it to someone.

About examinaning props. I NEVER let people examine things. Slows down the show and just breaks the dramatic rythm. It's all about attitude.

Again, just my opinion.
James

[/quote]

You think you understand the magic performing theory a lot.
But in my opinion,You don`t understand that much.
To explain why I state the objects I use and let spectators to examin the prop will take a lot of work.but I can tell you,
you said:"Think about a regular situation. If you had to sign for a package and the mailman said "Here, sign you name, WITH THIS PEN." Wouldn't you start thinking the pen was special?"

and "I NEVER let people examine things. Slows down the show and just breaks the dramatic rythm. It's all about attitude."

They are not right in some situation.
Maybe you read them from some books,but you have to think about them,not just read and do it.

I am not saying I am the best,But I am not that bad as you said,at least I can tell you I am the most famous magician in China and Taiwan now,I was invited work at magic castle and las vegas few years ago,last year I got "The Close up magician of the year in Japan",and I just did a 2 hour TV special in Japan.If I don`t have prestantion skill and originality I would not be able to do them.

by the way,The safty pin act is David Harkey`s The Point Of no return.But I used a totally different way to perform it.
Message: Posted by: zellyen (Feb 6, 2009 04:39PM)
So guys, after searching through countless numbers (like 15 lol) magic shops. I found out that The Point of No Return isn't manufactured anymore. What a disappointment. Does anyone know ANY place that I can get my hands on some? You guys said it used the same safety pins as the linking safety pins, but aren't those pins a bit small and not as visual? I really like this trick and would appreciate it if some of you can either find me a place that still carry this or sell me a copy if you have an extra. Thanks
Message: Posted by: Greg Arce (Feb 6, 2009 05:38PM)
Point of No Return basically used the same key pin found in a Jerry Andrus Pin set.

greg
Message: Posted by: Muyi Lee (Feb 9, 2009 03:56AM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-25 08:45, Xiqual wrote:
I was sure it was heavy metal. The ad is in the old Genii mags. I'll have to go and look.
sorry for the confusion if I am wrong.
James
ps
Bob,
Are you not tired of Taiwan TV magicians and their lousy presentations?
Did Liu really need to hold up the marker and say "marker" to the audience?
This whole crop of guys just saying what their actions are while the do the trick is beyond stupid. Oh well, What can we say?
[/quote]

I am not an magician, so I don't know much about the magic performing theory. But I know, a successful magician should make the spectator feel surprised ,happy and relaxed. So, as an ordinary spectator, I think it is necessary to let we spectators examine props, so that we can "make sure" nothing is unusual, and the magic effect seems more mysteriously finally. On the contrary, it seems "SILLY", we'll think "OF COURSE, they have ALREADY done something on the prop in advance!", if you don't let spectator examine the prop.
Spectators' opinions are usually different from magicians.

Lu Chen's performance is great, I think.

"I NEVER let people examine things."
Oh well, what can I say?

Just my opinion.
Message: Posted by: kissdadookie (Feb 9, 2009 10:15AM)
Lu Chen, glad to have you on the Café :D I've watched your magic shows when you had that show with the other Chinese magician, the one with the pony tail. Going to the rice place to do the rice bowl effect and turning it into rice wine was to me, phenomenal. :D

Makes me proud to be ABT (American Born Taiwanese).