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Topic: Colour Vision
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 23, 2008 09:47AM)
Colour Vision and Number Vision are 2 effects I have been pitching at our local flea market. I have a Board, which states " Test your psychic abilities"( Entertainment only)
I then ask onlookers whether they have a greater affinity for colours or numbers.
They select one, I divine the colour or number and a sale usually follows.

Has anyone else pitched these items?
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 23, 2008 09:57AM)
NO !
Message: Posted by: sethb (Nov 23, 2008 10:00AM)
Can't say that I have, I never went for the mentalism stuff; I pitch Svengali Decks, Magic Worms and Money Paddles.

But the price is certainly right for a pitch item, and you have an interesting angle to attract business.

BTW, somewhere on the Café' there was a suggestion which eliminates the need to reset the Color Vision box prior to revealing the "divined" color. It's a bold but effective move using a slight flip of the wrist, almost like an Okito Box reveal. PM me if you need more info. SETH
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 24, 2008 06:59AM)
There is basically a single worthwhile fleamarket in our area, and there is a bloke doing a( albeit poor)svengali pitch. But as he was there before me, Ive decided to respect that, and have been forced as it were to look at other items.
May I recommend Empire Magic( no 6 in the range)?..............contains 4 tricks which I like and can be demoed in a flash..........includes said Colour Vision, professors nightmare, drawer box, and Wonder Rope. Best pricing it would appear from Loftus at $2,50. Professional packaging with good instructions.
Message: Posted by: sethb (Nov 24, 2008 12:49PM)
PM'd you on the Color Vision move.

You might also want to take a look at a Money Paddle or the Magic Worms (Squirmles/Fuzzles). In my experience, both tricks are good pitch items.

And consider looking beyond flea markets for street festivals, municipal fairs, holiday bazaars, even craft shows. These are all excellent places to pitch magic tricks, and ordinarily you will have zero competition. The table fees are often a little higher, but there's usually a lot more traffic, the people are in a spending mood, and they don't haggle over the prices like they might at a flea. SETH
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 24, 2008 08:34PM)
Colour Vision, professors nightmare, drawer box, and Wonder Rope look and are boring to layman,let alone that professors nightmare is way too hard for them to learn.

You can sell 100 magic items at a flea market if you like.You can Demo them all.If you go this route you aren't a pitchman.You'll a magic shop owner in a flea market.

I promise pitching only the Svengali deck you would make way more money than having a magic shop in a flea market.You can have a package deal with maybe 3 items and still be a pitchman.But why pitch magic that won't bring in the money the Svengali deck and worm bring in ?

If you have a guilty feeling that someone else was there before you(that dosen't know what hes doing no less)pitching the Svengali deck that's another sign you aren't a pitchman.I would go pitch the deck,blow the other guy ouy of business and sleep good at night.Thats one reason I'm a pitchman.

If some dealer is selling T-Shirts do all the other T-shirt dealers not set up? What about sun glasses. etc.etc.etc.

Anyway It wasn't meant to be as "unfriendly" I'm sorry you took it that way.

All the best,
Don
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 24, 2008 09:51PM)
Thanks Don, and I acknowledge you as King of the Pitch.
As for blowing the other guy away.........Ive given it thought but the bloke is well meaning , so Ive taken to try and help him. THE LONG AND THE SHORT OF IT, BY MARK LEWIS is now in his possession. Apart from that I would describe him as a Historically Disadvanted Individual who defenitely did not have the opportunities in life which I have enjoyed. So I sleep better this way.
Success my friends is all relative.......how can I complain when I go to the market on a Saturday morning, have fun and net at least $200 for 4 hours work ( its not work, its fun actually)
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 24, 2008 10:10PM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-24 22:51, iugefu wrote:

As for blowing the other guy away.........Ive given it thought but the bloke is well meaning , so Ive taken to try and help him. THE LONG AND THE SHORT OF IT, BY MARK LEWIS is now in his possession. Apart from that I would describe him as a Historically Disadvanted Individual who defenitely did not have the opportunities in life which I have enjoyed. So I sleep better this way.
[/quote]

That's is a different story all together.Good for you!

I keep forgeting most guys aren't out there to pay the rent and live on pitching money.I'm guessing you have other income.

If you're having fun,making some money every weekend and helping someone else that that's all one can ask for...have at it my friend.I stand corrected.

Later,Don

P.S. "The long and Short of It" by Mark Lewis is a great book on a Svengali routine.(It has nothing to do with the Svengali pitch and Mark will be the first to tell you).

Don
Message: Posted by: sethb (Nov 25, 2008 06:43AM)
It's also possible (but unlikely) that the other Svengali pitchman has an exclusive for that flea market.

But as I said before, there are other places to pitch that will probably make you more money anyway. SETH
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 28, 2008 03:55AM)
Don, I wish to comment on your statement that" Colour Vision, professors nightmare, drswerbox and Wonder Rope look and are boring to laymen, let alone that professors nightmare is way too difficult for them to learn". With respect I disagree. In fact Id make the following statement:
If Daryl, the magicians magician, ( just as an example) performed these 4 effects, Id put money on the fact that he would be more ENTERTAINING than the majority of performers who could hypothetically select any material. "Its not what you do it's the way that you do it"
I would also imagine that 95% of Svengalis sold end up at the bottom of a drawer, and that the owners thereof can't even do the effect (badly.)
Message: Posted by: Cholly, by golly! (Nov 28, 2008 05:18AM)
Not to speak out of turn but I think you're missing the point.

There's a big difference between being a magic pitchman and opening a magic shop.

1. Pitchmen sell exclusively to laymen.

2. Pitchmen aren't concerned with nurturing young magicians.

3. A pitchman isn't interested in building a long-term relationship with any of his customers.

4. While a pitchman may be entertaining, his ONLY objective is to GTFM.

5. Pitchmen only sell a few select items. Less items = more focus = a more effective pitch.

6. Pitch items have to follow a certain criteria. Items should be small, inexpensive, look miraculous, and appear to be easy to do. It's all about triggering the impulse buy. A pitchman doesn't sell an item, he sells the fantasy of what the item will do for the customer.

7. Pitchmen WANT pitch items to wind up in the bottom of sock drawers. This will
mean more sales down the road... possibly even to the same person.

Pitching requires a certain mindset. Pragmatism is the name of the game... cynicism is often the end result. This is the one thing you can't learn from a book or video. You just have to get out there and do it.

Now... GTFM!
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 28, 2008 07:35AM)
Cholly, by golly!

VERY WELL SAID ! I see you GET IT ! Most don't get it.(and never will get it)Whats so hard to understand about...GTFM.

iugefu
What you're doing is great for you,keep at it.It has NOTHING to do with pitching or being a pitchman.

Don
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 28, 2008 08:07AM)
Well sorry chaps but I disagree.
Yes, I sell exclusively to laymen.
To say that makes us uninterested in nurturing young magicians........hogwash, exact oppsite is true.
I am defenitely interested in building long term relationships....... they come back for more as change effects quite regularly.
As pitchman I'm of course interested in a sale.......at the same time Im satisfied that none of these items could be described as fantasy crap....with the requisite bit of practise they are entertaining little tricks.
Its true that it helps ( the margins)if the items are small and inexpensive, but that doesn't mean the magic is rubbish or doesn't work as demonstrated. And performing these little items well is no more of a fantasy than doing effects with expensive apparatus well. What I object to is the rubbish that is found in most magic sets.
BUT OF COURSE I CONCEDE THAT I AM NOT A PITCHMAN BUT RATHER A WEEKLY LITTLE MAGIC SHOP OWNER AT THE FLEA MARKET.............. and happy with that.
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 28, 2008 08:39AM)
Iugefu,

Cholly, by golly NEVER said magic shop owners (and that's what you said at the bottom of your post,you said quote:"I concede that I'm not a pitchman but a weekly little magic shop owner")makes you uninterested in nurturing young magicians.

Cholly, by golly,said:
"Pitchmen aren't concerned with nurturing young magicians"PITCHMAN...read that again Pitchmen!So since you agree you aren't a pitchman than Cholly, by golly wasn't talking about you.Now was he ?

Than I said what you're doing is great but it dosen't make you a pitchman.

Do you understand it now ?

Don
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 28, 2008 09:11PM)
Here is a question

What percentage of Svengali deck purchasers do you think end up doing what may be called a reasonable rendition of the effect?
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 28, 2008 10:25PM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-28 22:11, iugefu wrote:
Here is a question

What percentage of Svengali deck purchasers do you think end up doing what may be called a reasonable rendition of the effect?
[/quote]

I would guess that out of 100 decks I sell 99 wind up in the landfill in less than a month.But like I said that's just a guess.

Than on the other side of the scale Mike Rogers and Channing Pollock both started their magic careers from buying a Svengali deck from a fast talking pitchman.I'm sure lots of hobbiest in magic started by buying a Svengali deck at the fair one summer day.(maybe even from me)

Don
Message: Posted by: Cholly, by golly! (Nov 28, 2008 10:26PM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-28 22:11, iugefu wrote:
Here is a question

What percentage of Svengali deck purchasers do you think end up doing what may be called a reasonable rendition of the effect?
[/quote]

How many people can actually show the cards as all the same?

Probably around 30%.

That's good news if you're a pitchman.

Not so good if you're trying to build up repeat business for your magic shop.
Message: Posted by: Jon-O the Great (Nov 29, 2008 07:44AM)
If they follow Don's DVD, 100% show them all the same but confuse the people as to WHY they are. After I show them, MOST people still ask, "How'd you make 'em.....?" I never tell 'em.

Some people say, "Lemme see those cards." and reach for 'em. "Sorry..buy 'em THEN look at 'em." If they buy 'em and come back later, wanting instructions..."$10 for the cards, $20 for instructions..." ONLY if I'm not busy will I take the time to straighten out their cards. I NEVER show the DL. "Just read the instructions...you'll get it...."

I think that showing them all the same not only dazzles 'em but MAKES the people WANT to buy 'em. And "revealing" the "secret" (according to Don's method) only confuses them more.

Jon
Message: Posted by: sethb (Nov 29, 2008 03:39PM)
[quote] On 2008-11-28 06:18, Cholly, by golly! wrote: There's a big difference between being a magic pitchman and opening a magic shop . . . .

3. A pitchman isn't interested in building a long-term relationship with any of his customers.
* * *
7. Pitchmen WANT pitch items to wind up in the bottom of sock drawers. This will
mean more sales down the road... possibly even to the same person. [/quote]

By and large I agree with Cholly, but wanted to throw out these additional thoughts:

I do work some of the same shows and spots every year, and I do have kids that come back and either buy the same thing again because they broke it or lost it, or buy a diffferent trick. Also, I deal with many of the same show operators from year to year, and they need to know that I don't generate complaints or cause problems.

For all of these reasons, I do try to keep any beefs to a minimum, and to resolve them ASAP. For the $5 I might make, it is not worth the bad word of mouth or complaint to the sponsor. And in fact, I have had VERY few complaints over the three years I've been pitching -- maybe half a dozen in total. But I HAVE received plenty of compliments from buyers and show organizers about how unusual the booth was, how neat the tricks were, and what a good draw and an asset the booth was to the show. I have also been invited back to the same shows numerous times, and approached to be at other shows, too. So in my mind it pays to mind your manners and deliver on your promises.

As far as stuff ending up in the sock drawer, that's not my problem or my responsibility. The Svengali Deck is a time-honored gaffed deck, capable of doing some very neat things, and in fact, it's often used by professional magicians to force a card (Card Ducks, anyone?). If a buyer isn't willing to spend the minimal time needed to master the deck, that's hardly my fault! And as others on the Café know, there are plenty of magicians (me included) with plenty of magical crap in a sock drawer, so it's not an uncommon thing!! SETH
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 29, 2008 09:53PM)
This is NOT a debate of the merits of pitching Svengalis versus other magic items.
As Ive explained, there is only a single ( smallish) suitable craft/flea market in our area, and there is/was a bloke pitching Svengali's.( before me) Talk of building a crowd with colourful items, wearing a mic etc just doesn't apply here...they come dribbling past. The next suitable market is a 100 mile round trip away.

That is why I started looking at other items, and that is just the way it is.
But Im happy to defend the items that I do sell. The weather can be a great leveller however as a solid downpour this morning send all the traders scattering for cover........
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 29, 2008 10:05PM)
A real pitchman would have been ready with a case of umbrella's.(snicker)

Don
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 30, 2008 11:40AM)
Youre right there Don!
Anybody had success with the bird whistle? I met a guy in Amsterdam once who claimed he was making an excellent living pitching them. I watched him for a few hours and sales were certainly very brisk. He had a shirt with a birdie on it, ditto umbrella. Inevitably, as he was trading illegally, the law arrived and he got yet another fine which he claims took his fines to $20 000 for the past year. Most of the bird whistles were hidden in the lining of the neck of his jacket to limit the damage resulting from stock confiscation, with a few loose once in his display case. I myself cant get a dam'n sound ( OK a wheeze) out of them.
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 30, 2008 12:17PM)
I have heard of him.He goes by the name of Birdy,and makes a good living pitching them.

I'm not sure about europe but here in the U.S. they are sue crazy. I would be afraid that some kid would choak on one and the pitchman would get sued big time.
(of course hoping nothing bad happens to the kid)

Later,Don
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Nov 30, 2008 08:10PM)
His name is Ronald and his site is http://www.birdy.nl
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Nov 30, 2008 08:37PM)
I have a few of his birdy's.

Years ago in the U.S. a guy named Harry Flack (not sure of the spelling of his last name) pitched the "Hum-A-Zoo" he was a one man show and could get tips of 300 people.There is a plaque at the spot where he set up at Delmar fair in southern Ca.At the Texas state fair they let him set up under Big Tex as you came in the fair.
Here is a story on Hary and the Hum-A-Zoo

http://blogs.keloland.com/blog/index.cfm?CommentID=1092

I never got to meet Harry or watch his pitch but he was a legend among pitchman and fair people.

You can googoe hum-a-zoo they are still being made.

Later,Don
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Dec 1, 2008 03:28AM)
His pitch is simple but effective.......... he does a mean bird whistle ( sounds like an orchestra).with said T shirt, umbrella and open suitcase.
People get drawn by the sound, he momentarily stops and points to the whistles in the case, shows the whistle in his mouth and says "birdwhistle".........the prices are displayed, if I remember right ( it was 5 yrs ago) as Euro 2,50 per whisle, Euro 6 for 3 ( add about 20% to get $ price)
I was actually inspired to become a bird whistle pitchman after watching him but couldn't get a decent sound out of it no matter how I tried...so I let go of the idea. My little nephew however straight away got a decent whistle going. I think Loftus also wholesales bird whistles.
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Dec 1, 2008 09:28AM)
Correction, his price was E3,50 for one, E7,50 for three.
Message: Posted by: mota (Dec 1, 2008 04:34PM)
The lawsuit point is a very valid concern. I was talking to a balloon game worker this morning. He told me he stopped giving balloons to kids who asked, even if the parent was there.

He said two times they popped by the kid's face and the parent threatened to sue. This despite both times the parent bothering him for the free balloon and the kid sticking the balloon by his own face and mangling it until it popped.

Once doing stage hypnotism I had a guy who didn't want to come out of trance right away so I worked with him after dismissing the rest. While working with him I had a kid say, "My dad's a lawyer, you can sue!" right in front of everyone. It was the last time I worked that school and a big reason I no longer do stage hypnosis.

Too many people in the US ready to cash in no matter what and too many unemployed lawyers are a bad combination.

It's a pity this removes otherwise good pitch products from the US marker.

As an aside, the balloon store guy also pitches a food chopper. He told me about another line a friend uses. When asked if the chopper would cut her fingers if she put them in there he said, "Yes, but why would you want to do that?".

She would probably sue too.

"The first thing we do," said the character in Shakespeare's Henry VI, is "kill all the lawyers."

Can that really be a crime ;-)
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 1, 2008 05:57PM)
[quote] On 2008-11-30 21:37, DonDriver wrote: Years ago in the U.S. a guy named Harry Flack (not sure of the spelling of his last name) pitched the "Hum-A-Zoo" he was a one man show and could get tips of 300 people. [/quote]
For many years there was a Hum-A-Zoo concession in front of the Woolworth's store on the Atlantic City Boardwalk. The pitchman wore a derby and a loud plaid vest. He played a pair of drumsticks as he hummed, and didn't miss a beat as he sold the darn things (by the truckload, I might add). I wonder if that was him. SETH

P.S. At least a Hum-A-Zoo is big enough that you can't swallow it, because you can't fit it in your mouth!

BTW, is the Swiss Warbler the same thing as a "Punch Whistle"? A Punch Whistle was a little reed gimmick used by "Punch & Judy" workers to accompany the puppet show. It was kept in the mouth, so both hands could be free to work the puppets. Just wondering. SETH
Message: Posted by: Rod Pringle (Dec 1, 2008 08:50PM)
Hello Seth:

Hope all is going well for you in this Christmas pitch season. The Swiss warbler is a tiny little piece of leather with a piece of thin plastic sheet in the center, all stamped together with a metal clinch. It was sold for many years as the Ventrillo, and was used as a vent device for "Throwing " your voice into a box or trunk, etc. And as a bird calling device "THE SWISS WARBLER"

The Punch & Judy Professors use a more powerful device to make Punch talk. It is called the SWAZZLE. They are made with a peice of Silver or Pewter, and other items. Most quality puppet makers of Punch and Judy Characters can be found on the internet, mostly from the UK and other Europeon countries, where Punch is very popular to this day . Most puppet makers will make you a swazzle if you buy their puppets.

However, one could make their own SWAZZLE following the plans in a nice old book entitled HOW TO DO PUNCH & JUDY by Sidney De Hempsey. This book can still be purchased on the web, just search it out. As Punch would say " that's THE WAY TO DO IT"

Happy Holidays!

ROD
MAGICMAN97
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Dec 1, 2008 11:23PM)
Interesting Rod.
Regarding the bird whistle and the risk of being sued..........I wouldnt worry too much about that one, its not the type of object that could easily slip down one's throat, but if you can't get a decent sound out of it like myself, its a non starter.
Regarding ROGUE trading like said Birdy in Amsterdam, I must say that he is hard core. I overheard him tell the law that he was going to move along and trade up the road which he then did!( although he is registered for sales/income tax, therefore staying on the right side of the law here) He has been pitching in Amsterdam for 30 years, so even though he gets a ridiculous amount of fines annually it would still seem to be worth his while..........location, location,location
Message: Posted by: Fitz (Dec 1, 2008 11:43PM)
Color Vision was the "trick of the year" in 1954...

If you want to learn a real good routine for color vision you should find Arcade Dreams by Ed Marlo. He has a four phase routine for the color vision. He also has some routines for props like the ball and vase, that he would pitch in a magic shop.

I worked for a friend of mine at a magic shop in a mall and Color Vision was one of my favorite items to "demo". But I mainly sold, can you guess it???? Svengalii decks. What a surprise.

Another routine I LOVED to "demo" was pen through bill. I did sell a ton of them but this routine served 2 purposes for me. (1) I have a solid routine I love to perform. (2) I found out if they had money (and were worth "working" for) and how much money they had. This little routine showed me who was there to buy and who just wanted a show.

Fitz

P.S. Don is the man!
Message: Posted by: deadcatbounce (Dec 2, 2008 05:32AM)
Couple of points here. There's a guy in Camden Lock, London, every weekend, stands there, whistling away, selling Bird Whistles. He never SEEMS to do a lot of business, but .. I guess he has his busy times.
I use the Bird Whistle (Birdy) in a few of my kids routines - mainly the Misers Dream. It's used to give the sound of the coins whistling through the air - adds a LOT to the effect.
Regards,

DCB
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 2, 2008 07:21AM)
Hey Rod, thanks for the information on the Punch whistle, that's a real piece of history there! BTW, the Xmas bazaars are working out well, people are still spending money, just not quite as much, but I'm doing OK with them -- there are going to be lots of Svengali Decks and Magic Worms under the Christmas trees this year! It's also nice to be working inside for a change, where I don't have to worry about the weather or the wind, and I don't have to pitch a tent.

And Iugefu, if you're still looking for alternative pitch items, you might want to look at these (in order of personal preference): Magic Worms, Money Paddles, Money Makers, Buddha Papers and Multiplying Rabbits [if you work outside, forget the rabbits, they will just blow off the table]. And just pick one or two, don't open a magic shop! :)

The worms are killers, and it seems that any trick involving money always creates interest and causes lots of impulse purchases. The Cups & Balls is a good trick for drawing a big tip, but not a great pitch item; it's too expensive (as a set with a wand and a good instruction book) and it's also too hard for people to do if it includes anything beyond the basic inertia move. SETH
Message: Posted by: Rod Pringle (Dec 2, 2008 08:31AM)
Hi Seth:

Its always good to hear from you! You always have new creative ideas for pitching. Keep up the great work at the Christmas bazaars and shows.

ROD
Message: Posted by: Matthew W (Dec 2, 2008 08:35AM)
Here are some of my big sellers.

Box of Magic - includes cups, dice bomb, color block escape, jumping gems, flying coins, instructional dvd.

Svengali Deck with or without dvd.

Fantastik/Pick a Color Stick

Ball Vase

The other stuff I have does sell, just not as often. Things like, dream queen, oddball, coin slide, knickels to dimes.

I had a person that I sold stuff to at THREE events. Each one was at a different location. Dream queen is great for adults and has a good markup. I sell them for $3 and make 5 times what I payed.

Has anyone thought of doing d'lites at fireworks displays? They sell glowsticks for around $4 or $5, and they only last a few hours, think of selling something that will last YEARS. I think people would buy.
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Dec 2, 2008 07:58PM)
On the novelty side, anyone had any luck with rattlesnake eggs?
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 3, 2008 06:50AM)
If you mean the little oblong magnets that clack together, I have seen other vendors selling them at fleas. I don't think they were setting the world on fire with them, though.

But if you pitch these, don't forget your Whoopee Cushions, fake vomit, plate lifters and Joy Buzzers! SETH
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 3, 2008 06:59AM)
Seth,
I think iugefu means these:

http://www.zymetrical.com/product.asp?3=428&dc=1-5fb_re&gclid=CPS1nbm_pJcCFROgnAodNybSzw

You can't pitch them but you can sell them.(I have no idea why anyone would want to...but you can)

Don
Message: Posted by: Cholly, by golly! (Dec 3, 2008 07:27AM)
My experience with rattlesnake eggs...

You're gonna go through a lot of demos just to sell a few. People like to pick them up, scare their friends, and then put them back on the table. The demo gets thrown to the ground a lot and the gimmick quickly wears out the envelope. Worn envelopes don't sell.

IMO... these are not a pitch item and just a so-so novelty seller.
Message: Posted by: Rod Pringle (Dec 3, 2008 08:31AM)
Plus, as Don Driver has said , People are sue happy..I can just imagine a kid getting rattlesnake eggs down his windpipe....OH BOY SUE CITY SUE TIME!

ROD
Message: Posted by: Rod Pringle (Dec 3, 2008 08:33AM)
Plus, as Don Driver has said , People are sue happy..I can just imagine a kid getting rattlesnake eggs down his windpipe....OH BOY SUE CITY SUE TIME!

ROD
Message: Posted by: Matthew W (Dec 3, 2008 08:44AM)
Anything that pops, or snaps will sell. The little throw snappers, pull poppers, they all sell and are CHEAP. They cost you close to nothing but will make you a lot of $$$. They are all safe, if you follow the instructions.

I would avoid any food pranks, like fish candy, garlick, candy. That sour popcorn could have been in that package who knows how long.

Anything that shocks will sell.

Pranks will sell themselves.
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 3, 2008 11:45AM)
[quote] On 2008-12-03 07:59, DonDriver wrote: Seth, I think iugefu means these:

http://www.zymetrical.com/product.asp?3=428&dc=1-5fb_re&gclid=CPS1nbm_pJcCFROgnAodNybSzw

You can't pitch them but you can sell them.(I have no idea why anyone would want to...but you can) [/quote]

Yep, I was thinking of the [i]magnetic[/i] rattlesnake eggs, which coincidentally are also listed on the same page of that website.

But we are getting pretty far afield from Svengali Decks, Magic Worms and pitching . . . . SETH
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 3, 2008 11:58AM)
"But we are getting pretty far afield from Svengali Decks, Magic Worms and pitching . . . . SETH"

EXACTLY !

Don
Message: Posted by: Matthew W (Dec 3, 2008 12:57PM)
I sell what people buy. If they don't buy 'em I stop carrying them.
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 3, 2008 01:18PM)
[quote]
On 2008-12-03 13:57, Matthew W wrote:
I sell what people buy. If they don't buy 'em I stop carrying them.
[/quote]

This section is called "Step right up" it should be about PITCHING.We are going way off topic.

Don
Message: Posted by: Matthew W (Dec 3, 2008 02:47PM)
What do you call it when someone makes a purchase? I say sold, or bought.

I pitch Svengali decks. I demo the other items. I have a pitch that I use for the decks. I don't call myself a pitchman.
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 3, 2008 03:01PM)
"I don't call myself a pitchman"

Than why do you post in this section for pitchman ?


Don
Message: Posted by: Matthew W (Dec 3, 2008 03:06PM)
The section is about pitching.

Lets try to get back on topic.
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 3, 2008 03:18PM)
[quote]
On 2008-12-03 16:06, Matthew W wrote:
The section is about pitching.

Lets try to get back on topic.
[/quote]

That's all Seth and I have been trying to say.Thank you.

Don
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Dec 4, 2008 03:23AM)
Don, would you be willing to (gu)estimate who many full time Svengali PITCHMEN there are in the USA?........I know its a tricky question but .....
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 4, 2008 03:43AM)
Iugefu,
If your talking actual "hardcore" Svengali pitchman like Seth,Jon,Rod(magicman97) and myself,less than a dozen.Than if you break that down to guys making a living by ONLY pitching Svengali decks,less than 3 and that's if there are a few guys out there I have never heard of.I'm 99% sure of these figures.

I'm now retired but still go out from time to time,so I'm no longer making a living from pitching Svengali's.

Now guys out there on weekends at flea markets making a few hundred a weekend,I couldn't start to guess as I have sold hundreds of my Svengali pitch DVD.

Now for my question,why did you ask that? Just wondering.

Don
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 4, 2008 07:34AM)
[quote] On 2008-12-03 15:47, Matthew W wrote: What do you call it when someone makes a purchase? I say sold, or bought. I pitch Svengali decks. I demo the other items. [/quote]
I think it is important to realize that "selling" and "pitching" are two very different things. If you have a table full of different magic tricks that people can look at and buy, you have a little store, and you are waiting for people to come in and buy something that you are selling. That is a passive or reactive situation where the patrons make the first move. Even if you "demo" something in response to a patron's request, that is not pitching. I am not criticizing this arrangement, just pointing out that it is much different from a true pitch.

On the other hand, pitching is a proactive situation, where the vendor makes the first move by building a tip. He/she does this with the "Svengali Pitch," which is a very carefully crafted presentation that is designed to attract and hold attention, then motivate the specs to make an impulse purchase. If you study Don's Svengali Pitch DVD and S. David Walker's Svengali DVD carefully, you will see how it builds and the fine points of doing this, garnered over years of pitching experience. The Svengali Pitch is constructed like a piece of fine clockwork, and if you take away or change one piece of it, you better have a darn good reason for doing so.

Perhaps the best comparison I can make is the difference between two TV commercials. A standard TV commercial for say, Welch's Grape Jelly, will have lots of pictures showing how beautiful the grapes are, the pretty jar, and the happy mom feeding her kid a PB&J, with perky music in the background. That is a soft sell, and the next time the viewers go grocery shopping, they may decide to buy a jar of grape jelly. But nobody jumps out of their chair and immediately runs to the store to get some!

Compare that with a 15-minute TV pitch presentation by Ron Popeil for his Showtime Rotisserie ("Just set it and forget it"; "Buy today and we'll include this amazing Ginzu knife at absolutely NO extra charge"). He shows you how easy it is to use, gives you 50 reasons why you can't live without it, and then has you picking up the phone, whipping out your credit card and ordering one before they're all gone. THAT's a pitch, folks!

Once again, I am not saying that one arrangement is better than another, just pointing out that they are not the same thing. SETH
Message: Posted by: Jon-O the Great (Dec 4, 2008 09:14AM)
[quote]
On 2008-12-04 04:43, DonDriver wrote:
Iugefu,
If your talking actual "hardcore" Svengali pitchman like Seth, Jon, Rod(magicman97) and myself, fewer than a dozen. Then if you break that down to guys making a living by ONLY pitching Svengali decks, fewer than 3 and that's if there are a few guys out there I have never heard of. I'm 99% sure of these figures.
[/quote]

Yep. I have yet to run into another Svengli guy. So I feel safe in doing them ANYWHERE. And, of course, I don't do them to make a living. They are an adjunct to my stripper biz. If I see kids coming down the aisle, I say, "Hey, ya seen the Magic Cards?" So probably 10-20% of my income is from Svengalis. But I can tell ya, they are a heck of a lot more fun than strippers! (Wire strippers, that is!) And if there was a way to do them exclusively, I'D DO IT!

But even at 10 bux a set (with DVDs), to do $1000 a day gross is TWICE as easy with strippers @ $20 per set. I have had MANY people tell me, "I don't know why I'm buyin' these strippers, but I'm buyin' 'em!" NO ONE has ever told me that about the Svengalis. Oh, the kids bug their parents unmercifully until they buy 'em, but I don't have 'em MESMERIZED as with strippers.

So--making a living with them? Nope. But having FUN with them? More fun than a barrel of....you know!! And when I learn the WORMS.....I CAN HARDLY WAIT! :)

Jon
Message: Posted by: Matthew W (Dec 4, 2008 09:28AM)
Seth, I pitch the Svengali decks, I call people over. I DO pitch them. The only time I wait for people to come over is during a quick lunch break, where I will stop to show them the cards, as that is usually a definite sale.

I have the other items as extras/upsells.

I have my magic sets. As soon as I am done with the Svengali/dvd pitch, I go right into demoing what is in the magic set. I try to push a package deal of several items. This is actually what brings in the majority of the money.

I use the cards to get them spending.

I have been doing it this way for a while and it has been working GREAT.
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 4, 2008 09:43AM)
Hey, Jon, if you can mesmerize people with wire strippers, I guarantee you'll have NO problem pitching magic worms . . . .

I also agree it's tough to make a living solely from pitching, not because of any income limitations, but because it's hard work -- you've got to be on your feet all day, constantly moving and talking. And the best locations are usually at outdoor events, where there are often large crowds of people, but where it can also get quite hot and uncomfortable.

I do have a full-time day job, and only pitch on the weekends. But I will not work two back-to-back shows on the same weekend, because it's just too tough. For the usual street festival or municipal fair, I am up and out the door at 6:30 am, on the site by 7 so I can unload, pitch my tent, set up my banner and table, and be ready to go by 8:30 or so. Then I pitch, usually nonstop, until around 4 pm, break everything back down, pack up and leave around 5 pm. By the time I unload, shower and sit down for dinner, it's easily 6 pm or later. It's fun and can be very rewarding financially, but that's plenty of work for one day, at least for me, and it's usually Tylenol time that evening!

So my hat is off to Don and any other full-time pitchmen, they definitely earn their pay. SETH
Message: Posted by: Jon-O the Great (Dec 4, 2008 10:45AM)
Yes, I have earned my living for going on 16 year with strippers. Of course, I've sold the occasional ebay thing, sometimes MANY things, (like 6000 spider-looking head massagers) but up until about a year ago, 98% of my income had been from strippers and, unless there was a WONDERFUL show in the middle of the week, I only worked (and still only work) weekends.

Before the last gas price idiocy, I drove all over the country doing shows. However, for the past year or so, I've stuck pretty close to home, doing smaller shows. I have always considered myself a salesman. But after 15 years of doing shows, I think I can finally be classified as a pitchman.

As for MESMERIZING people with strippers, I think they become numb to the sound of my voice and when I say, "2 fer 20, take 'em with ya" they just do it.

And of course, I have added and subtracted from Don's Svengali demo, so I'm not STRICTLY a Don Driver Svengali guy. Maybe I can be a Don Driver/Seth WORM guy soon. Then, again....

Jon
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 4, 2008 12:15PM)
Hi Jon,

Here is my friend Carl working the squirmle.Carl makes BIG money just from these.

http://magicalpets.com/ Just click on either photo to watch the vid. It's not even a pitch,you just keep working it.

Don
Message: Posted by: Matthew W (Dec 4, 2008 05:04PM)
Neither video plays all the way through.
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 4, 2008 05:17PM)
Matt,
I just checked and they both work OK for me.They aren't that long anyway.Maybe you thought they were longer of else something is wrong on your end.

Don
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 4, 2008 07:05PM)
Just played both, and both run OK.

Some VERY nice moves there, too! SETH
Message: Posted by: Fitz (Dec 5, 2008 12:39AM)
Both videos look great on my end. Thanks for sharing Don

Fitz
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 9, 2008 01:17PM)
BTW, to get back to the ORIGINAL point of this thread, I coincidentally happened to see a very good and creative routine for the "Color Vision" box in the book "Arcade Dreams," click [url=http://themagicwarehouse.com/cgi-bin/findit.pl?x_item=BK8463]HERE[/url] to view.

Ed Marlo has incorporated three excellent moves for this "slum magic" effect, that really raises it to a whole different plane. Just shows you what a little imagination can do.

I still don't know if this would be a good pitch item, but with Marlo's handing, it becomes a pretty neat effect. SETH
Message: Posted by: cassius2m (Dec 9, 2008 01:48PM)
Paul Gallagher also has a Color Vision routine on his "Miracles from the Sock Drawer" DVD that utizlizes Marlo's handling. The mention of Arcade Dreams on this DVD was what led me to purchase it.
There are a lot of new ideas for slum magic pieces on the DVD.

-Clay
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Dec 9, 2008 02:05PM)
Ok,lots of great moves from great magicians for color vision.Still not a good pitch item.I'm sure Mr Marlo didn't think some pitchman would take his move's to mass market it to layman.(not saying that's what you guys meant)

Some things need to stay secret for magicians ONLY.

Don
Message: Posted by: Fitz (Dec 10, 2008 01:22AM)
Hey Seth I pointed the Marlo reference out a while back... it is a real cool routine.

I performed it once at a magic club dealer night a few years back and during the fist phase I fried a magicians wife with original method. Her husband immediately leaned over and told her how it was done. (typical) Then I performed the last three phases and fried all of the magicians. After the demos almost all of the magicians were at my table, and I sold all of the copies of the book that I had. It was fun to fool a crowd of magicians old enough to be my grandparents with a trick they all probably owned.

Fitz
Message: Posted by: sethb (Dec 10, 2008 06:43AM)
You know, I thought somebody mentioned Marlo in this thread. I went back to look before I posted the information, but couldn't find it, so I posted. Thanks, Fitz, for pointing that out.

I will also say that the Marlo routine is not a piece of cake, and requires good misdirection skills as well as learning a few cute moves. It's the same old story, nothing good comes easy.

One interesting note. I always thought S.S. Adams invented Color Vision (he surely sold enough of them!). But the book credits a magician named Martin Sunshine with inventing the effect in the 1930's. Mr. Sunshine is a forgotten magician who was apparently quite active in the 30's and 40's. There is an interesting story about him in David Meyer's 2003 book, "Inclined Toward Magic" (Meyer rescued Sunshine's scrapbooks from a trash can). SETH
Message: Posted by: Fitz (Dec 11, 2008 01:15AM)
No worries Seth...

Thanks for the history. I perform a wooden box now when I do close-up.

Fitz
Message: Posted by: iugefu (Dec 15, 2008 07:57AM)
I came across a reference to the 'pitch' in a book , History of Magic and Magicians by HJ Burlingame, published in the late 18th century. He was referring to conjurors or "professor of the arts, frequenting the fairs, or 'pitching' ( his italics)in market places or village greens, but their names and performances have not been recorded"