(Close Window)
Topic: How to deal yourself trips in texas holdem (vid)...
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 12:36AM)
http://www.packthebowl.com/stuff/tripscheat.mov

It's best to just watch the video knowing that this could be happening in a poker game as one of the players is taking a second to chat about the last hand, and the dealer is shuffling the cards. Or, friendly conversation is going on. Whatever. Point is, there will never be heat or attention on the dealer, ever... unless you call it to yourself...

I don't speak in the video. All I'm doing is dealing out a game of hold 'em.

Say this is a game of 5 players (x variable) and you are the 5th position (y variable; you are the dealer).


Just let this remind you to be careful about who you play cards with. The most unsuspecting guy will be the most lucrative cheater.
Message: Posted by: JasonEngland (Sep 22, 2009 01:15AM)
Fell asleep at the 40 second mark. Is that when you hit me with the cooler?

J
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 01:20AM)
Agreed, it is boring. Though it is also informative.
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 22, 2009 02:51AM)
I once heard that shuffling is sometimes done with the cards face-down. Has anyone else heard about this?
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 22, 2009 06:31AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 01:36, jmstrings wrote:
Point is, there will never be heat or attention on the dealer, ever... unless you call it to yourself...

[/quote]

If you ever were in any game I'm at, I'd watch you run singles while overhand shuffling a face-up deck with a bemused smile on my face, wait till you took your minute or two to "shuffle", and then ask someone to shuffle that deck properly.

The second time you tried you'd be booted.

The two different fake cuts with the magician's hand gestures framing them were pretty darn funny I must say.

Good luck being lucrative with such obvious methods.

[quote]
On 2009-09-22 02:20, jmstrings wrote:
Agreed, it is boring. Though it is also informative.
[/quote]

Informative? You must be new here. We've seen stacking done before.
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 22, 2009 06:33AM)
Splice,

You just stole my words...

PS to jmstrings. The time you shuffle your deck we've played 2 hands in an actual game and 3 in a casino :P.
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 22, 2009 08:34AM)
Stacking face up sure saves a lot of work......why didn't I think of that?
Message: Posted by: Clock (Sep 22, 2009 08:47AM)
Am I the only here that has respect for this guy?

Cheating is one thing, but cheating the blind is a whole different ball game.

Godspeed.
Message: Posted by: Bret Maverick (Sep 22, 2009 08:48AM)
[quote]Just let this remind you to be careful about who you play cards with. The most unsuspecting guy will be the most lucrative cheater. [/quote]

That's probably true, jmstrings, but do you have any videos of an unsuspecting guy dealing to prove your point?

I was thinking the same thing Silverking...Good Lord, will someone give him a deck of traditionally cut cards so he can riffle them face-down????
Message: Posted by: gadfly3d (Sep 22, 2009 08:59AM)
If I were going through all that trouble I would at least deal myself a set rather than trips.

Gil
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Sep 22, 2009 09:10AM)
Yeah, but you didn't see what he dealt to his partner. ;)
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Sep 22, 2009 11:08AM)
Be nice to him, he has just "pack(ed)thebowl" on to many times...
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 22, 2009 02:30PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 09:47, Clock wrote:
Am I the only here that has respect for this guy?

Cheating is one thing, but cheating the blind is a whole different ball game.

Godspeed.
[/quote]

Nah, I have no respect. He's doing it wrong. Stacking against the blind is silly, just miscall your hand once in a while. That'll get the money.
Message: Posted by: Hansen (Sep 22, 2009 02:53PM)
If you can manage to find a time machine to transport you back to Kazakhstan circa 1600s, I'm sure you'd make a fortune with your sly methodology...

Best advice: PM Mr England and get yourself Mr Forte's DVD set. Watch, study, practice.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 03:33PM)
Are you all speaking from experience in play? Because I am.

I have never been caught.


Note that I do NOT cheat, it's unethical and wrong.
Message: Posted by: daniel1113 (Sep 22, 2009 03:43PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 16:33, jmstrings wrote:
Are you all speaking from experience in play? Because I am.

I have never been caught.


Note that I do NOT cheat, it's unethical and wrong.
[/quote]

It's difficult to get caught if you don't cheat...
Message: Posted by: MickeyPainless (Sep 22, 2009 03:59PM)
For whatever reason it won't play on my computer but based on the above comments I reckon I can better spend my time else where!
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Sep 22, 2009 04:54PM)
Mickey, here's a description:

He does an overhand shuffle with the cards face up.

He runs the cards one at a time to stack them.

He does a riffle shuffle with the cards face up.

He runs the cards some more.

He deals five hands.

Now, don't ask me how he controls the cards. I don't know. The guy is a wizard. But the other guys around here have a problem with his face up shuffling.
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 22, 2009 05:16PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 16:33, jmstrings wrote:
Are you all speaking from experience in play? Because I am.
[/quote]

Experience definitely isn't required to be tickled by your video - my 5 year old niece knows to shuffle the cards face-down.
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 22, 2009 06:07PM)
Yep, I'm talking from actual experience.

I'm gonna be honest, I don't exactly stack the way you do. On the following link, you'll be able to watch vids about one (among many!) way I use to stack cards.

http://www.arnoldmcdonald.org/en/code/index.php?p=6210000
Message: Posted by: tommy (Sep 22, 2009 07:59PM)
Some great work there Arnold thanks.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 08:38PM)
One of the techniques I'm using is called a molinari cull.

Anyways, what you see in the video is not what goes down in real life. The video is solely just a demonstration of the technique and the speed at which it can be done, NOT A DISPLAY OF HOW TO USE THE TECHNIQUE IN ACTUAL PLAY. I should have noted that in my original post.

In real life, it kinda goes like this. It works perfectly with two decks. Basically, you casually do a molinari cull while the hand is being played, setting up the flop. Put the cards down now and play your hand. Pick them up again after casually, for you are just casually shuffling (read: arranging) the cards ONE time followed by an overhand or riffle blind shuffle. if you do it this way, it looks like you're genuinely mixing them up, again because you're alternating all the different which ways you're shuffling.

without getting too complicated:
-stack flop in one shuffle while pocket cards are being dealt out. follow with a simple false cut or blind overhand/riffle shuffle.
-put down deck, play current hand.
-when the flop gets dealt out in the current hand, pick up deck as you wait for your betting turn, and stack first round of pocket cards. follow with false cut or blind overhand/riffle shuffle.
-put down deck, play current hand.
-when the turn card gets dealt out, pick up deck casually again and this time do a blind overhand shuffle.
-put down deck, play current hand.
-when river card comes out, pick up deck casually again and finish your stack with the second round of pocket cards. follow with a blind overhand/riffle shuffle. you are now done.
-play current hand or fold, whatever.
-do not touch cards again until current hand is over.
-when the hand is over and it is now your turn to be dealer, maintain the order of the deck via blind overhand/riffle shuffles and false cuts.
-give deck to opponent to cut.
-at this point you can either reverse the cut with a pass (easiest), or nail the side of a card and put it on top of your stack so that the cut will land in the proper place.
-deal out your stack.

also, no attention is paid to the cards in my hand whatsoever when shuffling. not even a glance. it's very casual. no one EVER calls attention to it, possibly because of the stealthy manner in which I use the molinari cull.

I will agree with most of you though. if you tried replicating this video in play, you'd get your teeth handed to you. I should have mentioned this in my original post.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 08:40PM)
Oh, and I also have to add that knowing how to stack a deck via table riffle shuffling is THE MOST effective way to do it. I do like the way I do it though when doing gambling routines for spectators.
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 22, 2009 08:41PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 16:33, jmstrings wrote:
Are you all speaking from experience in play? Because I am.
I have never been caught.
Note that I do NOT cheat, it's unethical and wrong.
[/quote]
JM, you seem like a nice guy.

Take a few days and read every post in this forum. It may give you a bit of insight into why folks are posting what they're posting about your vid.

As pointed out above, you claim you play, and that you've never been caught cheating.......but then claim you don't cheat because it's wrong and unethical.........which of course begs the question that was asked above "how can you [i]not get caught[/i] when you don't cheat in the first place?"

You're sort of talking out the side of your mouth on this one my friend, and rather than dig a deeper hole trying to offer up what you "really meant", read the forum in its entirety, and then join the club!

This forum has a B.S. meter in it that's pretty difficult to fool.........just so ya' know.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 08:45PM)
I hear ya. When speaking of my experience cheating, I choose my words carefully. I do not want a record of anything. Make what you want of the way I phrased it. I did that with intent.

I am quite confused about why I am getting flamed, though. Maybe if I had added what this video was demonstrating in my original post, this wouldn't be happening.

All that being said, I'm here to learn. I record and post videos for this very purpose -- to get feedback. There is ALWAYS room for improvement.

I have practiced and (I think, at least) become quite good at Jimmy Molinari's "molinari cull". I am more of a magician than a cheater, in the sense that I'm performing and taking up the magician role much more often than the cheating gambler role. I see now I have a lot to learn about the ladder.

Anyways, I guess it would be logical to say many of you guys have not seen this cull before? It's one of the easier ones, obviously, though you do need to develop skill to pull it off stealthily, smoothy, and most importantly, quickly.


To conclude, sorry if I ****ed any of you guys off. It seems I have. (again, for reasons I'm unaware of)
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 08:57PM)
One of my poker buddies asked to see me do it with 9 players with the 6th position being dealt the winning hand. He wanted to see if it was possible to set up a hand that looked like a number of players could win the pot. (in other words, multiple players thinking they have the best hand)


http://www.packthebowl.com/stuff/bargo.mov

9 players, 6th position get's the flush.

I don't remember which at this point, but I had one player get trip 7's and another player get 2 pair (Aces and Kings).

Player 6 rivers their flush; how surprising.

Result of hand = 6th position raking in lotsssss of money


Oh, and before someone kills me for it... I know, my pass needs work. (that's why I'm here)
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 22, 2009 09:18PM)
Holly crap!

1) Stop those fancy magician moves you do at the beginning! No fancy move at the card table!!!
2) Just forget about the Molinari cull. No use at all in true play!
3) Stop shuffling cards face up. Absolute nonsense in 2K9...
4) A standard shuffle is about 2-3 riffles, sometimes a strip and, if so, 1-2 more riffles. Say something like 12 or 15 seconds for the whole stuff. Whereas you shuffle for hours...
5) Learn how to cut properly a deck. No magician cuts in actual play...
6) I can't go further. A riffle pass just killed me :).
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 09:30PM)
I'm aware of and practice #'s 1, 4, and 5.

There's no way in HELL I would pull moves like that at the card table. I use these videos to note progress as well as practice. They're like practice sessions for me. Thus, I practice some flourishy type stuff as well.

I disagree about the molinari cull. I have previously stated why.

Yes, I shuffle a lot in the video... though, to emphasize the fact that they're mixed. (the first 30 seconds is genuine shuffling)


And again, my pass needs work.

edit:
my pass shouldn't even be called a pass, lol.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 22, 2009 10:00PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 19:07, AMcD wrote:
Yep, I'm talking from actual experience.

I'm gonna be honest, I don't exactly stack the way you do. On the following link, you'll be able to watch vids about one (among many!) way I use to stack cards.

http://www.arnoldmcdonald.org/en/code/index.php?p=6210000
[/quote]


I downloaded your videos. Top quality, man. Props and respect to ya.
Message: Posted by: tommy (Sep 22, 2009 10:59PM)
You will be alright, so long as you run as fast as Jimmy can shuffle. :)
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 23, 2009 05:24AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 21:38, jmstrings wrote:
without getting too complicated:
-stack flop in one shuffle while pocket cards are being dealt out. follow with a simple false cut or blind overhand/riffle shuffle.
-put down deck, play current hand.
-when the flop gets dealt out in the current hand, pick up deck as you wait for your betting turn, and stack first round of pocket cards. follow with false cut or blind overhand/riffle shuffle.
-put down deck, play current hand.
-when the turn card gets dealt out, pick up deck casually again and this time do a blind overhand shuffle.
-put down deck, play current hand.
-when river card comes out, pick up deck casually again and finish your stack with the second round of pocket cards. follow with a blind overhand/riffle shuffle. you are now done.
-play current hand or fold, whatever.
-do not touch cards again until current hand is over.
-when the hand is over and it is now your turn to be dealer, maintain the order of the deck via blind overhand/riffle shuffles and false cuts.
-give deck to opponent to cut.
-at this point you can either reverse the cut with a pass (easiest), or nail the side of a card and put it on top of your stack so that the cut will land in the proper place.
-deal out your stack.

[/quote]

That's a hell of a lot of manhandling the deck. The players might even think you're setting something up, what with toying with the deck at every opportunity you get (before the hand, after dealing, after the flop, after the turn, after the river, and maybe even more besides).

Yes, what I say comes from experience, at both single and double deck tables. Anyone toying with the deck that much (and face up, for frack's sake) will be noticed, and we aren't playing for high stakes.

[quote]There's no way in HELL I would pull moves like that at the card table.[/quote]

Then there's no reason in hell for you to make such a video. You don't ever practice magic moves interspersed with gambling moves because you don't want those bad habits to show up at the table without you realizing it. If you can't make a video without little magicky flourishes like spreading your hands every time you do something to emphasize how fair it is, it's unlikely you can play all night at the table without that bad habit showing up. I would bet it'll show up without you knowing, but the incredibly soft penny games you must play may not have players that are even awake most of the time.

[quote]Yes, I shuffle a lot in the video... though, to emphasize the fact that they're mixed.[/quote]

Magician through and through.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 23, 2009 05:31AM)
Well, yeah man. I was first born a magician, and then a gambler.

Anyways, sorry to waste your time, guys. It turns out I have no idea what I'm doing, and what I'm currently doing is useless.

My luck!
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 23, 2009 06:08AM)
Doesn't have to be wasted time. There is a ton of good info on the boards. If you want to keep doing what you're doing then it's all up to you, but if you want to do more then start reading.

The molinari cull isn't necessarily useless, but I would never shuffle cards face up. That doesn't mean you can't figure out a way to use the cull with normal shuffles, but it'll be hard to get around the single card runs. Still, there's no need to cull on the fly.
Message: Posted by: Hansen (Sep 23, 2009 07:24AM)
JM, just be aware that many of the folks that frequent this forum are some of the finest mechanics on the planet, with years and years (often decades) of experience. So come with humility and an open mind, and I'm sure you'll thoroughly enjoy the experience and learn mountains of stuff. Oh, and as Silver said, the merest hint of BS isn't suffered too kindly by folks around here. Think of it as tough love. You've obviously got the desire and enough talent to get you where you want to get, so keep on listening, learning and practicing...
Message: Posted by: Bret Maverick (Sep 23, 2009 11:05AM)
Attitude speaks volumes.

Bret
Message: Posted by: C-Taylor (Sep 23, 2009 12:22PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-22 02:15, JasonEngland wrote:
Fell asleep at the 40 second mark. Is that when you hit me with the cooler?

J
[/quote]


Baaahh.. You beat me I made it to the 25 second mark... Really, though everyone else summed it up... There is a ton of video"s in this section alone that can give/help you out.

[quote]
On 2009-09-22 16:33, jmstrings wrote:
Are you all speaking from experience in play? Because I am.

I have never been caught.


Note that I do NOT cheat, it's unethical and wrong.
[/quote]

Isn't this being hypocritical? And please show me a game where I can get away shuffling like this.

Gooood luck.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 25, 2009 10:21PM)
OK guys. This could actually work under ceertain conditions. Listen before you start to flame me. I play Texas Holdem 3 or 4 times a week. In every game we are always fiddling before sitting down in our assigned seats (usually draw cards for our seat. The cards are on the table and usually someone is counting them or shuffling them. Having said that it woudl be very possible to do what he did and not draw attention to yourself because in the end he does shuffle them face down. If done in an offhand way the first part of the cards being face up would not be noticed because it would just be fiddling with the cards.

Of a few things would have to be in place for this to work. First he would have to be the first dealer which is also done by dealing out the cards and first ace or high card is the dealer or often times when picking seats the high card is the first dealer as well as seat one. The other thing that would have to be in place is that the individual to his right would have to refuse the cut as in our game a cut must be offered.

Just my thoughts on this.
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 26, 2009 05:26AM)
Could work? Well, have you ever seen a shuffle lasting that long?

Of course, everything is possible and, as usual, context is everything when talking about card cheating. But there are boundaries not to be bypassed, one of'em is called credibility.

I can assure you my cat was fooled every time when I showed him my SD technique. Was cool, but winning cat food wasn't that great. It took a huge amount of practice in order to fool true human beings.

You'll meet everything and nothing around the card tables but the closer you are to actual and common human behaviours the best it is.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 26, 2009 08:51AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-25 23:21, acesover wrote:
OHaving said that it woudl be very possible to do what he did and not draw attention to yourself because in the end he does shuffle them face down.
[/quote]

Shuffling the cards face down after all these long, repeated shuffles with the cards face up is nothing more than magician's guilt and shows clearly that the performer knows full well that what he did is not supposed to pass.
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 26, 2009 10:01AM)
When a specific shuffle is put into a context for which it lacks any and all credibility, it becomes pointless to discuss it as anything other than a magic trick during which the cards are shuffled face up.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 26, 2009 08:23PM)
Listen for a minute here. The first part of his shuffling is nothinig more than stacking the deck face up and as I said before we sit down to play any number of individuals will have fooled around with the cards. That is counting them (make sure of 52) or just shuffling them and not really being watched.

However another problem with this is that we have a minium or 8 people at a table when we start and this was done with 5. I am not saying it is practial. I am saying that under the right conditions it could fly..it is strictly an effect of opportunity which may never occur, but if it did it "could" fly. I am not saying this person could sit down and perfrom this as an effect because it cannot be done with any professionalism as it is to obvious tht something is being done with the cards. But on the offbeat that one is sitting at the table just jerking around with the cards before the game starts and all the other elements are in place, 5 individuals, no cut, and 4 blind people (just kiddinig) it will work.

Come on how many of you can really do it and have it work the first time? Give the guy a break.
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 27, 2009 12:34AM)
[quote]
The first part of his shuffling is nothinig more than stacking the deck face up...........
[/quote]
You've said all there is to say.
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 27, 2009 05:43AM)
Listen, it's just not good enough to fly unless they are blind (and I'm not kidding).
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 27, 2009 05:53AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-26 21:23, acesover wrote:

Come on how many of you can really do it and have it work the first time? Give the guy a break.
[/quote]

Count out how many people have disagreed with you or jm. About that many.
We don't care for sub-par work and this is a good example of said work.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 27, 2009 06:14AM)
You know, if you wanted to, you probably could survive eating stuff out of trashcans for the rest of your life. It may work, you may live, but you'll be way better off eating real home cooked meals, and your health will be better too.

Don't satisfy yourself with trash and decide it's good enough.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 27, 2009 11:38AM)
I believe we have a bunch of elitists here.
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 27, 2009 12:23PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 12:38, jmstrings wrote:
I believe we have a bunch of elitists here.
[/quote]
You appear not to share the high standards common to this forum. (resorting to name calling goes a long way to tipping your agenda).

There are plenty of Café forums where they praise everything that gets posted without fail......you may find happiness in one of those forums?

Best of luck to you.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 27, 2009 01:29PM)
http://www.packthebowl.com/stuff/pocketkings.mov

How's that work for you guys? You think that this would raise a red flag?
Message: Posted by: MickeyPainless (Sep 27, 2009 01:42PM)
Silverking is right, maybe another area of the forum or better yet T11, E or the Buck site would be a better place to have sunshine and rainbows blown up your arse! Personally if I put something up for all the world to see I'd better be prepared for critique (good AND bad)!

MMc
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 27, 2009 02:17PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 14:29, jmstrings wrote:
You think that this would raise a red flag?
[/quote]
Absolutely.

There are some who would probably tell you that you're posting videos without having put in the time to perfect what it is you're trying to accomplish.

In other words, in order to maintain your credibility you should (presuming you're serious) stop posting bad magic videos on a gambling forum and simply join the forum as a learner.

You may think you're beyond the category of "learner", but you'd be mistaken. We're all "learners" in this forum.

................one other difference as pointed out by Mick, no sunshine and smoke here. When "video praise" is offered it's always to the very finest work, usually the result of years, or more likely decades of constant practice.
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 27, 2009 02:24PM)
First off, this isn't a magic forum. This particular forum just happens to be on a magic board. There are different rules here. When constructing a magic trick, you have all the liberty in the world to reach the desired effect. Gambling slieght of hand on the other hand is very structured...this isn't a magic trick, cirtain rules just can't be broken to compensate for improper use of a technique. There is no way around it, proper card table etequite is absolutly required and what is displayed in the video breaks the rules.

Meanwhile you are calling people elitest for pointing out a very basic mistake in this branch of what you call magic.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 27, 2009 03:43PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 14:29, jmstrings wrote:
You think that this would raise a red flag?
[/quote]

Yes. You start shuffling face up. You have long runs of single cards. You hesitate in a number of parts. Your shuffling is much too deliberate.

Why are you posting videos? To get constructive feedback, or to show the world that you're the real deal and know how to move?

It's actually sad how most people delete their videos off youtube after a few days or a few hundred views. We've seen lots of great stacking but I wouldn't know how to find the videos again save in my archive. If you could see what the level is on some of the videos, you may change your mind about your technique. Or else you could decide it's good enough and not try to improve, but I don't get that.

The games I play at use overhand shuffles, which I find to be not as good as table riffles. But I won't bust out clean, casino shuffles in an environment where everybody overhand shuffles and throws in an in the hands riffle in there. Still, that doesn't mean I don't practice riffle controls and stacks. You have to be able to work in the environment that's presented to you, sometimes with little to no preparation.

But I still can't think of a single case, ever, where you would choose to shuffle the deck face up. There is just no excuse to ever do that if you can do the techniques face down, and you ought to learn them that way. Like I said before, you don't need to cull cards on the fly, and I wouldn't try stacking cold in a real game because of all the things that must go right and the weaknesses of such techniques (at least the ones I know).

We're not saying your technique is bad because it makes us feel better. We're actually all in this together, believe it or not. Having a magician beat up because he insisted shuffling cards face up was OK is not something any of us want to happen, so please, keep playing with close friends who will "get it", or please at least listen to what we say.
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 27, 2009 03:48PM)
Jmstrings, view the following video to get an idea of the level of skill on this forum that we enjoy watching, in terms of dealing trips in hold'em.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=121502425478251013

Now do you understand why your 70 second long face-up single-card run didn't really cut it for us? That's just not how things really work at a card table.

I think if you had introduced yourself on this forum and asked for constructive criticism, rather than boasting the video as some sort of informative "how-to" with complex X and Y variables, you would have received a much more pleasant response.

Best of luck,
-Nicholas
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 27, 2009 03:49PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 12:38, jmstrings wrote:
I believe we have a bunch of elitists here.
[/quote]

We have Doc with his infinity pass and cold decks, Doc Jon with his real life stories, we had Mr. Z with all his casino experience and everything he learned from Forte, walking liberty and his incredible dice controls, we've had dice experts, card experts, three shell mob experts, and more besides.

We've had fine filet mignon, we know when we're being fed dog food. You can call us elitist for preferring the filet mignon, but that just seems like sour grapes to me. You have the chance to improve and people who can point you in the right direction. Why do you insist on disdaining your advice, because dog food is good enough for you? You can probably survive on it. I don't know why anyone would want to.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 27, 2009 03:51PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 16:48, Maitre D wrote:
Jmstrings, view the following video to get an idea of the level of skill on this forum that we enjoy watching, in terms of dealing trips in hold'em.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=121502425478251013
[/quote]

Yes, that's an good example. Smooth, standard shuffling procedure.

And again, it's a set, not trips :).
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 27, 2009 05:08PM)
Oops, thanks for clarifying :)
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 27, 2009 05:18PM)
Jmstrings,

go there:

http://www.arnoldmcdonald.org/en/code/index.php?p=6210000

and watch the one named "Hold'Em RRSRC Stacking (5/7)". I stack 3 aces for the 5fth out of 7 players. I use what they call RRSRC procedure and you can check by yourself that the whole shuffling/cutting procedure lasts about 16 seconds. And it's just normal speed.

I've tried to record it from an above point of view and I pause for every round.

Not the greatest vid of my life, but it's just to show you
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 27, 2009 06:58PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 18:18, AMcD wrote:
Jmstrings,

go there:

http://www.arnoldmcdonald.org/en/code/index.php?p=6210000

and watch the one named "Hold'Em RRSRC Stacking (5/7)". I stack 3 aces for the 5fth out of 7 players. I use what they call RRSRC procedure and you can check by yourself that the whole shuffling/cutting procedure lasts about 16 seconds. And it's just normal speed.

I've tried to record it from an above point of view and I pause for every round.

Not the greatest vid of my life, but it's just to show you
[/quote]


That was absolutely incredible. Hands down amazing.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 27, 2009 09:19PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 16:48, Maitre D wrote:
Jmstrings, view the following video to get an idea of the level of skill on this forum that we enjoy watching, in terms of dealing trips in hold'em.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=121502425478251013

Now do you understand why your 70 second long face-up single-card run didn't really cut it for us? That's just not how things really work at a card table.

I think if you had introduced yourself on this forum and asked for constructive criticism, rather than boasting the video as some sort of informative "how-to" with complex X and Y variables, you would have received a much more pleasant response.

Best of luck,
-Nicholas
[/quote]

Oh yea ..there is something I see done all the time when playing cards..an individual takes trips and puts them on the deck then shuffles...seems like you guys have double standards if you think that is legit.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 27, 2009 09:28PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 06:53, No. 92 wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-09-26 21:23, acesover wrote:

Come on how many of you can really do it and have it work the first time? Give the guy a break.
[/quote]

Count out how many people have disagreed with you or jm. About that many.
We don't care for sub-par work and this is a good example of said work.
[/quote]

If you can do it post a vid and lets see you do it.

I am not saying it is great or even magic. It is a cheat move in cards. I also mentioned that it would fly under certain conditions and I know it could under the right conditions. Look back and read where I mentioned the conditions. Is it great magic, is it great card moves? NO to both. It is a a cheat move in cards. End of stroy. It is not a performance.
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 27, 2009 09:29PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 22:19, acesover wrote:
Oh yea ..there is something I see done all the time when playing cards..an individual takes trips and puts them on the deck then shuffles...seems like you guys have double standards if you think that is legit.
[/quote]

While collecting the cards from the last round of play, the desired cards are naturally arranged in whichever way the shuffler desires. Combine this with any stored cards you may have on the bottom of the deck, and you have yourself a classic setup.

Pretty basic stuff, acesover.
Message: Posted by: MickeyPainless (Sep 27, 2009 10:45PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 22:19, acesover wrote:

Oh yea ..there is something I see done all the time when playing cards..an individual takes trips and puts them on the deck then shuffles...seems like you guys have double standards if you think that is legit.
[/quote]

It's a stacking demo not a find the card(s) trick! One method of culling has already been mentioned and there are plenty others but again, it ain't a card trick!
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 27, 2009 11:41PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 22:29, Maitre D wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 22:19, acesover wrote:
Oh yea ..there is something I see done all the time when playing cards..an individual takes trips and puts them on the deck then shuffles...seems like you guys have double standards if you think that is legit.
[/quote]

While collecting the cards from the last round of play, the desired cards are naturally arranged in whichever way the shuffler desires. Combine this with any stored cards you may have on the bottom of the deck, and you have yourself a classic setup.

Pretty basic stuff, acesover.
[/quote]

Nothing basic aabout it. First youhave to find 3 of a kind then you must arrange them in the order yu want in this case each one of the 3 at every fifth card for the first two then the third one at one of the flop cards after the burn. All this depends on there not being a cut which must be offered.

That is why I say that what was done on this vid is only possible once in a great whie. That would be in a game just starting or possibly after "chipping up" when someone is just fiddling with the cards and it looks like they are randomly shuffling the deck and not really shuffling for a deal.

Again it is not a trick. It is only a "cheat of opportunity" which does not constitute a trick as it will fool no one with any knowledge of cards whatsoever magi or not as there is to much going on with the cards and is just to obvious.

Plese I am not saying this is a great magic trick or gambling cheat method. I am saying it is a cheat opportunity that can possibly arise and that is all. Seems like many here love to pick apart anything someone says and show how smart they are. While what he did was not much of a magic trick it definitely took some thought and skill. Of course now we will here from all those who will say how easy it is to do. But what we won't see is them doing it.
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 28, 2009 12:51AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 00:41, acesover wrote:
All this depends on there not being a cut which must be offered.
[/quote]

Gentlemen, am I mistaken or is he [i]really[/i] implying that a cut cannot be beat?

Good riddance.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 28, 2009 04:42AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 22:19, acesover wrote:
Oh yea ..there is something I see done all the time when playing cards..an individual takes trips and puts them on the deck then shuffles...seems like you guys have double standards if you think that is legit.
[/quote]

You've got your head deep up your ass if you think the only way to get a hold of desired cards is to cold cull by shuffling a deck face up. Those of us who know about these things understand the context under which the stacking demo takes place.

[quote] All this depends on there not being a cut which must be offered.[/quote]

Yeah, OK, you just lost all possible credibility you may have. We all know how cuts can be forced or undone, thank you very much, do not come again, do not pass go, do not collect $200.

[quote] Seems like many here love to pick apart anything someone says and show how smart they are.[/quote]

Meanwhile in your effort to pick this one apart you only managed to show how much of a square you are. Funny how that works.
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 28, 2009 06:01AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 22:28, acesover wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-09-27 06:53, No. 92 wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-09-26 21:23, acesover wrote:

Come on how many of you can really do it and have it work the first time? Give the guy a break.
[/quote]

Count out how many people have disagreed with you or jm. About that many.
We don't care for sub-par work and this is a good example of said work.
[/quote]

If you can do it post a vid and lets see you do it.

I am not saying it is great or even magic. It is a cheat move in cards. I also mentioned that it would fly under certain conditions and I know it could under the right conditions. Look back and read where I mentioned the conditions. Is it great magic, is it great card moves? NO to both. It is a a cheat move in cards. End of stroy. It is not a performance.
[/quote]

Your barking up the wrong tree, guy. You keep on blathering on about perfect conditions...what a load! Why would anyone use and therefore waste time practicing IN PLAIN ENGLISH; BAD TECHNIQUE!!! Especially when in order to use this BAD TECHNIQUE I need to wait for the utmost perfect conditions to use it in. Meanwhile the payoff could very well be bad because the move isn't even all that strong.

But let's just say for arguments sake that these perfect conditions that you speak of do come about. Guess what anyone with a brain would do??? A: not that garbage B: something that will actually get paid.

You seem to wanna keep digging yourself a very nice hole in the ground. How is it down there guy?
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 28, 2009 06:26AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 00:41, acesover wrote:
Seems like many here love to pick apart anything someone says and show how smart they are.
[/quote]

Now hold on just a minute! That is not completely true. The real reason why we pick apart ignorant comments like yours isn't for the sake of feeling smart, it's really just to show how dumb you are!

[quote]
While what he did was not much of a magic trick it definitely took some thought and skill. Of course now we will here from all those who will say how easy it is to do. But what we won't see is them doing it.
[/quote]

Just keep on digging, hey when you get to china could you send up some lo mein?

Videos are scattered all over the thirty + pages in this section so I don't know what your bi***'n about. Maybe if you took the time to read anything here you might have seen them
or might have known how to bypass a cut,
or might have known skill when it bites you on the a**,
or might have just respected the opinions of well established members,
or...you getting the picture yet?

Sit down shut up and start taking notes guy.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 28, 2009 07:51AM)
I honestly do not know what you guys are having a problem with. What exactly are you debating with me? Is there anything I said that is not true? I never said it was great or the guy is a fantastic knuckle buster with cards. I simply statetd tht it is a possible cheat opportunity .

To address the cut issue. Obviously the individuals that have said that a cut can be beat are correct. But I defy you to beat a cut in a card game where you hand the man on you right the deck of cards and he cuts themand completes the cut then you pick them of the table and begin to deal. In fact most of the individuals that cut in the games I play actually square the cards themselves before giving them back to the dealer...go ahead beat it and please put out a DVD because I will be the first in line to purchase it. And please don't tell me aboaut cutting to a crimp as some players acatually triple cut before giving the deck back. It just shows hot little you know and how much you THINK you know.

Splice thanks you for showing your ignorance and showing how crude you are by your language. It speaks volumes.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 28, 2009 07:57AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 01:51, Maitre D wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 00:41, acesover wrote:
All this depends on there not being a cut which must be offered.
[/quote]

Gentlemen, am I mistaken or is he [i]really[/i] implying that a cut cannot be beat?

Good riddance.

While I addressed the cut issue I wwoud like to comment on it directly. I defy you to beat a cut when offered to an individual and HE cuts the cards and possibly triple cuts them as done in many card games then hands them back to you to deal.

The only comment I like about your posot is the "Good riddance"? I just hope you live up to it.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 28, 2009 08:11AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 07:26, No. 92 wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 00:41, acesover wrote:
Seems like many here love to pick apart anything someone says and show how smart they are.
[/quote]

Now hold on just a minute! That is not completely true. The real reason why we pick apart ignorant comments like yours isn't for the sake of feeling smart, it's really just to show how dumb you are!

[quote]
While what he did was not much of a magic trick it definitely took some thought and skill. Of course now we will here from all those who will say how easy it is to do. But what we won't see is them doing it.
[/quote]

Just keep on digging, hey when you get to china could you send up some lo mein?

Videos are scattered all over the thirty + pages in this section so I don't know what your bi***'n about. Maybe if you took the time to read anything here you might have seen them
or might have known how to bypass a cut,
or might have known skill when it bites you on the a**,
or might have just respected the opinions of well established members,
or...you getting the picture yet?

Sit down shut up and start taking notes guy.
[/quote]

After reading your last post I just realized an important fact that I learned years ago and that is: do not debate with a stupid person as they know what what they speak of.

As I mentioned in my other post I defy you to offer an individual a cut and when that individual cuts or triple cuts the cards and hands them back to you, for you to have them in their original order before you deal.
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 28, 2009 08:38AM)
Are you slow or something?
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 28, 2009 08:40AM)
There are many things I don't exactly understand here...

1) About culling

I suppose you're talking about my vid?. Of course, we don't often have the opportunity to get three good cards yet on top when we're passed the deck. That's why culling methods have been devised. When gathering the muck, you can just pick up 1 or 2 cards and add'em to the ones you add in your hand for instance. Or, after signaling with your accomplice, you can gather interesting cards "throwing" them cleverly in the muck. You can also use a previous slug your mate on your right has kept on the bottom the deal before. You can also cull one card or two while doing a first riffle. And so on.

In demos, we just go a litlle bit faster. We put the slug on top (or bottom) and we stack. My video was just to show to jmstrings how a standard shuffle should look like.

2) Cuts

They are thousands ways to bypass a cut. Crimps, breathers, slicks, etc. Of course, in case you're playing with paranoids triple cutting the deck every time, counting cards every deal and using face recognition tools after every 3 rounds (plus five real time cameras), it's gonna be tough to beat the game. Probably you'll have to use other weapons, like cold deck or team play. Or better, just find another game, easier to cheat.

acesover,

I've never seen guys triple cutting the deck. Of course, everything is possible. But as I said above, when the environment is too risky, you must change your way of doing. Nevertheless, moves are not the only way to cheat. Signaling, location play, collusion, marked cards, there are a plenty of ways to defeat even the most paranoid guys. And if you really think it's impossible, well, just play straight or leave.
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Sep 28, 2009 09:04AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 09:40, AMcD wrote:

I've never seen guys triple cutting the deck.
[/quote]

I always triple cut the deck. Sometimes I also do a quick overhand shuffle, too.

Maybe this place has made me paranoid.
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 28, 2009 09:21AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 08:51, acesover wrote:
I honestly do not know what you guys are having a problem with. [/quote]
[b]That's[/b] the problem.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 28, 2009 09:23AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 08:51, acesover wrote:
But I defy you to beat a cut in a card game where you hand the man on you right the deck of cards and he cuts themand completes the cut then you pick them of the table and begin to deal. In fact most of the individuals that cut in the games I play actually square the cards themselves before giving them back to the dealer...go ahead beat it and please put out a DVD because I will be the first in line to purchase it. And please don't tell me aboaut cutting to a crimp as some players acatually triple cut before giving the deck back. It just shows hot little you know and how much you THINK you know.
[/quote]

I defy you to stack a deck or do anything in a game where everyone burns you every moment of the game, where every other player riffle shuffles and quadruple cuts after each shuffle and rubber band the deck to the cut card and insist the deck should be on the table at every moment and that the deck be covered by a case when not dealing and everybody keeps every card on the table hidden from sight and the deck is changed for a new deck on every deal and the new decks come directly from bicycle and are still in the shipping box with every signature and a security guard stands over the table, one over the decks, and one over the money, and the security guards are hired by an outside party with no stake in the game and who takes no cut.

Regardless, we're not concerned about whatever conditions you make up on the spot. What we're concerned about is standard card table procedure. One cut, to cut card, dealer replaces the cut. This is the standard. If you come across particular deviations which are commonplace in a certain game, you adapt. If everybody triple cuts and shuffles the cards and completes the cut before the dealer can touch the deck, you would have to be an idiot to insist on trying to stack.

You beat the weakest part of the game, you don't smash your head against the wall trying to beat the strongest part.

[quote]Splice thanks you for showing your ignorance and showing how crude you are by your language. It speaks volumes.[/quote]

Funnily enough, I don't care what you think of me, and I don't expect it'll make any difference in my life. If I want my ignorance pointed out to me, I can easily get in touch with people who are actually in a position to correct it.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 28, 2009 09:23AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 09:40, AMcD wrote:
There are many things I don't exactly understand here...

1) About culling

I suppose you're talking about my vid?. Of course, we don't often have the opportunity to get three good cards yet on top when we're passed the deck. That's why culling methods have been devised. When gathering the muck, you can just pick up 1 or 2 cards and add'em to the ones you add in your hand for instance. Or, after signaling with your accomplice, you can gather interesting cards "throwing" them cleverly in the muck. You can also use a previous slug your mate on your right has kept on the bottom the deal before. You can also cull one card or two while doing a first riffle. And so on.

In demos, we just go a litlle bit faster. We put the slug on top (or bottom) and we stack. My video was just to show to jmstrings how a standard shuffle should look like.

2) Cuts

They are thousands ways to bypass a cut. Crimps, breathers, slicks, etc. Of course, in case you're playing with paranoids triple cutting the deck every time, counting cards every deal and using face recognition tools after every 3 rounds (plus five real time cameras), it's gonna be tough to beat the game. Probably you'll have to use other weapons, like cold deck or team play. Or better, just find another game, easier to cheat.

acesover,

I've never seen guys triple cutting the deck. Of course, everything is possible. But as I said above, when the environment is too risky, you must change your way of doing. Nevertheless, moves are not the only way to cheat. Signaling, location play, collusion, marked cards, there are a plenty of ways to defeat even the most paranoid guys. And if you really think it's impossible, well, just play straight or leave.
[/quote]

OMG...Finally an intelligent post and probably from someone who is a card player and gambler.

I play poker twice month in A.C. Two nights each stay. I play poker 3 nights a week with approximately 40 different individuals. These games consist of both cash games and tournament format. Having said that there are 3 individuals that triple cut the deck all the time. I have been involved in gambling longer than many here have lived (over 45 years). That gambling has involved card games, book making, and dice along with owning 2 pool rooms. Does that make me an expert on cheating?...probably more so than most here as I have seen most methods. The individuals that cheat are not magicians they are card cheats. They have never put on a show or got paid for a gig. They cheat at cards for money, end of story.

Havinig said all of this I really feel that I am beating a dead horse here. All I was trying to do is tell you that the vid this individual posted could posssibly be used under certain circumstances to cheat. If you do not want to belileve that, that is your right. I never said it was a good performance or good sleight of hand. It is just another method of cheating.

Just to address the "crimp" when offerinig a cut. As I said some individuals double or triple cut which negate the crimp. But in a card game even if you use a crimp you had better start dealing when handed the cards back and not play with them which is necessary in order to utliize the crimp.

I believe this will be my last post on this thread.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 28, 2009 09:33AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 10:23, acesover wrote:

Just to address the "crimp" when offerinig a cut. As I said some individuals double or triple cut which negate the crimp. But in a card game even if you use a crimp you had better start dealing when handed the cards back and not play with them which is necessary in order to utliize the crimp.

[/quote]

I ain't ever seen nor heard of any reason why anyone would need to toy with the deck after receiving it after a cut. The crimp's done its job. You'll know if it did or not after you deal the cards. It's not rocket science.
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 28, 2009 09:40AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 10:33, splice wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 10:23, acesover wrote:

Just to address the "crimp" when offerinig a cut. As I said some individuals double or triple cut which negate the crimp. But in a card game even if you use a crimp you had better start dealing when handed the cards back and not play with them which is necessary in order to utliize the crimp.

[/quote]

I ain't ever seen nor heard of any reason why anyone would need to toy with the deck after receiving it after a cut. The crimp's done its job. You'll know if it did or not after you deal the cards. It's not rocket science.
[/quote]

OK not my last post.

When I mentioned usinig a crimp I did not mean cutting to the crimp. I meant that when the cards were cut you could find their original order with the crimp as when the top card would have a crimp such as a breather crimp so the original position could be found easily. I hope you know what I mean by this post as it gets confusing.
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 28, 2009 09:46AM)
That seems like a strange thing to do. Every time we talk about crimps here we talk about them in the context of forcing a cut. That's the standard usage.

[quote]Havinig said all of this I really feel that I am beating a dead horse here. All I was trying to do is tell you that the vid this individual posted could posssibly be used under certain circumstances to cheat. If you do not want to belileve that, that is your right. I never said it was a good performance or good sleight of hand. It is just another method of cheating[/quote]

Taking the deck below the table to rig the deck could also work under certain circumstances. That doesn't mean that video would pass muster here, or that any praise at all would be heaped on someone doing that.

I maintain that shuffling the cards face up at any time is a big mistake and something to be corrected as soon as possible, regardless of how incredibly soft a penny-ante game may be.
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 28, 2009 10:45AM)
[quote]

I maintain that shuffling the cards face up at any time is a big mistake and something to be corrected ........
[/quote]
Full circle.........this is exactly where the conversation should have ended back on page #1.

(Acesover, 'sup with repeatedly defending shuffling face up cards?.....guys are going to quit taking you seriously mate :) )
Message: Posted by: Bret Maverick (Sep 28, 2009 11:39AM)
[quote] By Silverking: We're all "learners" in this forum. [/quote]
Ain’t THAT the truth – the day I stop learning is the day they nail the box shut over me.
[quote] By No. 92: You start shuffling face up. You have long runs of single cards. You hesitate in a number of parts. Your shuffling is much too deliberate. [/quote]
Exactly and, on the second video jmstrings posted, the flaws were even more pronounced.
[quote] By No. 92: Why are you posting videos? To get constructive feedback, or to show the world that you're the real deal and know how to move? [/quote]
Good questions 92, although likely rhetorical. The thing that irked me immediately about jmstrings’ post was that there was no doubt in my mind that he posted that message thinking that his card handling superiority would wow the magicians here by demonstrating and enlightening us with manipulations that we had, heretofore, never seen before he arrived (alas, he was correct from that point of view, as I had never seen a one handed overhand shuffle or a table riffle performed face-up; to see both demonstrated in one performance was mindboggling). His message was written in a condescending tone, offered as a voice of authority, as if a knowledgeable master were warning his students that cheats as talented as he could be sitting next to them in any poker game:
[quote] …this could be happening in a poker game as one of the players is taking a second to chat about the last hand, and the dealer is shuffling the cards… Point is, there will never be heat or attention on the dealer, ever... unless you call it to yourself... Just let this remind you to be careful about who you play cards with. The most unsuspecting guy will be the most lucrative cheater. [/quote]
[quote] By Splice: But I still can't think of a single case, ever, where you would choose to shuffle the deck face up. [/quote]
That was my first thought, too, but then I mused that perhaps he was going to demonstrate how he could show a rank sucker seated to his left the card faces during the overhand shuffles to make him think that he could (as Scarne would have called it) “case the deck” for key cards, only to bust the chump afterwards with a good move or two by shifting the location of those key cards to suit the dealer’s need (albeit, I was not envisioning the seemingly endless series of awkwardly deliberate moves that followed). Alas, I was wrong; there was no ulterior motive to the face-up overhand shuffle.
[quote] by Maitre D: I think if you had introduced yourself on this forum and asked for constructive criticism, rather than boasting the video as some sort of informative "how-to" with complex X and Y variables, you would have received a much more pleasant response. [/quote]
Precisely; he posted this video solely to impress the membership that he mistakenly believed was comprised magicians lacking gambling savvy.

Silverking, as usual, hit the nail on the proverbial head when he offered jmstrings the following advice:
[quote] You're sort of talking out the side of your mouth on this one my friend, and rather than dig a deeper hole trying to offer up what you "really meant", read the forum in its entirety, and then join the club! [/quote]
Jmstrings, to his credit, appeared to have heeded that advice, at least temporarily:
[quote] I hear ya. When speaking of my experience cheating, I choose my words carefully. I do not want a record of anything. Make what you want of the way I phrased it. I did that with intent.

I am quite confused about why I am getting flamed, though. Maybe if I had added what this video was demonstrating in my original post, this wouldn't be happening.

All that being said, I'm here to learn. I record and post videos for this very purpose -- to get feedback. There is ALWAYS room for improvement.

I have practiced and (I think, at least) become quite good at Jimmy Molinari's "molinari cull". I am more of a magician than a cheater, in the sense that I'm performing and taking up the magician role much more often than the cheating gambler role. I see now I have a lot to learn about the ladder. [/quote]
I am still confused by jmstrings’ admission that he does not cheat because it is unethical and immoral (values I respect) but, he then refers to his “experience cheating” to support his claim that his moves have been tested under fire. Such contradictions offer only two possibilities:

1) jmstrings has no real cheating experience because he has never cheated anyone in a money game; or

2) jmstrings has cheated in money games but is publicly denying that he does because his concerned about possible legal ramifications (or physical harm) resulting from his admitting on a public forum that he cheats.

Hopefully, in the future he will research the forums he joins to learn more about the membership and the quality of the information available before posting his own message. However, sad to say they may not be the case, since jmstrings reverted to name-calling only a few messages later:
[quote] I believe we have a bunch of elitists here. [/quote]
No, there are no elitists at work in this thread. There is little doubt that big egos do come with the territory, but the most vocal here have the chops to back their criticism and advice, and only get their backs up when their intelligence is questioned.

Remember, jmstrings, it was your “elitist” attitude beginning this thread that set the tenor for the critical responses that followed; don’t blast the others for responding to your messages as they have – you asked for it by posting your message without learning more about the forum in which you decided to post it.
[quote] BY acesover: If you can do it post a vid and lets see you do it. I am not saying it is great or even magic. It is a cheat move in cards. I also mentioned that it would fly under certain conditions and I know it could under the right conditions. Look back and read where I mentioned the conditions. Is it great magic, is it great card moves? NO to both. It is a a cheat move in cards. End of stroy. It is not a performance. [/quote]
Firstly, acesover, and with all due respect to an elite user with 45 years of gambling experience, speaking for one of those who posted earlier responses in this thread, whether or not one of us can perform the moves demonstrated by jmstrings is wholly irrelevant to this topic: he posted a message with the sole intention of boastingly teaching moves that he thought were the real stuff and virtually unknown to folks who he believed were magicians who would laud his performance and thank him for his warning. He was sadly mistaken.

Anyone who has taken the time to read any of my posts in this gambling forum would realize that I am not a cardman; do not pretend or profess to be one; and rarely, if ever, critique the videos posted by our members.

Nevertheless, my inability to riffle stack sets does not prevent me from identifying moves that will not fly in the real world, be it in a casino; private game; volunteer fire department Texas Hold ‘Em fund-raising tournament; or Friday night games in the back room of the St. Mary’s Knights of Columbus Council.

Secondly, acesover, I cannot for the life of me think of a single condition (except perhaps playing at the Perkins School) under which face-up shuffling of any kind, or one of those time-consuming and attention-grabbing streams of machinations would fly in games money is on the line.
[quote] In every game we are always fiddling before sitting down in our assigned seats (usually draw cards for our seat. The cards are on the table and usually someone is counting them or shuffling them. Having said that it woudl be very possible to do what he did and not draw attention to yourself because in the end he does shuffle them face down. If done in an offhand way the first part of the cards being face up would not be noticed because it would just be fiddling with the cards. [/quote]
Do you actually play for money under those conditions, acesover? (And the games in Atlantic City most certainly do not allow such shenanigans.) If so, I will apologetically stand corrected, although totally shocked that anyone would risk his hard-earned cash in games where anything goes (although there are a number of members of this forum who would undoubtedly like to be invited to those games). Given the glut of poker protection DVDs and books available today (ranging in quality from mediocre to superb), I find it unfathomable that anyone would tolerate such conditions.
[quote] By acesover: I honestly do not know what you guys are having a problem with. What exactly are you debating with me? Is there anything I said that is not true? I never said it was great or the guy is a fantastic knuckle buster with cards. I simply statetd tht it is a possible cheat opportunity. [/quote]
While I can only speak for myself, acesover, my sole reason for countering your assertions is your defense of a person who posted moves in an authoritative tone and manner that were indefensible, and your insistence, contrary to expert opinion, that those moves can fly in the real world. Your lecturing that we don’t seem to understand that some lousy moves get the money is offensive, considering that all of the members are well aware that some ham-fisted moves get the pots when executed with sheer balls; great timing; and a good turn. That being said, the face-up shuffling; incessant peeling-off of single cards; and never-ending shuffles that jmstrings demonstrated have no place at a poker table because they are unnatural and would draw the heat that his initial post warned that they would not. Lastly, the demonstration would not likely impress a group of magicians or even their lay audiences for that matter, since the average person has been made aware of crooked dealing techniques on dozens of cable television exposes viewable every day and such machinations would be suspect.

Sorry, but we will apparently have to agree that we disagree on this topic.

Bret
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 28, 2009 01:19PM)
Bret, I can't take credit for those words as I did not write them. My posts are not as constructive as the ones you quoted, they are more of the yelling at a wall kind of posts. Many thanks for using your superior vernacular ability to say what most of us are thinking. Although at this point I'm not so sure anyone should bother helping this guy. I say let him sleep.
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Sep 28, 2009 02:06PM)
On the first page of this thread, I immediately thought of Dioxippus. So I checked out the OPs Youtube channel.

The guy can play the guitar. Dio can't, I don't think. So the guy isn't Dio, I don't think.

Of course, the guitar playing is...ah...uh...[i]interesting[/i].

More I will not say. But ya'll should check it out.
Message: Posted by: Bret Maverick (Sep 28, 2009 02:07PM)
Sorry, 92 but, even more importantly, I apologize to Splice, whose questions I misquoted.

Don't get old fellas...

Bret
Message: Posted by: MickeyPainless (Sep 28, 2009 02:08PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 14:19, No. 92 wrote:
Bret, I can't take credit for those words as I did not write them. My posts are not as constructive as the ones you quoted, they are more of the yelling at a wall kind of posts. Many thanks for using your superior vernacular ability to say what most of us are thinking.
[/quote]

Ditto!

92, I love the "Yelling at the wall" bit!

I think it was Silverking that suggested all new comers go back and read the previous posts in this section to get somewhat of an introduction to some of the contributors around here. I couldn't agree more!
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 28, 2009 02:29PM)
Bret, very well written.

[quote]
On 2009-09-28 08:51, acesover wrote:
I defy you to beat a cut in a card game where you hand the man on you right the deck of cards and he cuts themand completes the cut then you pick them of the table and begin to deal. In fact most of the individuals that cut in the games I play actually square the cards themselves before giving them back to the dealer...go ahead beat it and please put out a DVD because I will be the first in line to purchase it. And please don't tell me aboaut cutting to a crimp as some players acatually triple cut before giving the deck back. It just shows hot little you know and how much you THINK you know.[/quote]

Your accomplice, sitting to your right, gives the deck a false cut or cuts to a brief. Proceed to deal and give him the winning hand, not yourself. Cheats usually don't work alone. This is pretty well known information. By the way, most players don't complete the cut.

[quote]
On 2009-09-28 10:23, acesover wrote:
in a card game even if you use a crimp you had better start dealing when handed the cards back and not play with them which is necessary in order to utliize the crimp.[/quote]

As Splice already mentioned, a crimp would be used to beat the procedure as the person would unsuspectingly cut to it, not as a form of locating where the stack lies within the deck, as you're implying.

I think this is the 3rd or 4th time you've been corrected on some very basic gambling and cheating fundamentals. For being a self-proclaimed 45-year gambling veteran, you sure don't know much.
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 28, 2009 04:23PM)
Hey guy,

I'd like to get a clear answer. Acesover, sir, what is a crimp? What exactly were you suggesting it be used for?
Message: Posted by: MickeyPainless (Sep 28, 2009 05:13PM)
A crimp is like a small cramp right?
Message: Posted by: acesover (Sep 28, 2009 07:19PM)
Maitre D. I will excuse your ignorance because of 9 posts. Now go wait on a table. If you never utilized a crimp that way that is your business.

For the upteenth time no one I play with shuffles the cards face up. But many people I play with shuffle the cards face up when just taking the cards out of the box and shuffling them. It may not be there deal they are just shuffling or counting the cards. You do count the cards face up don't you?

To whom ever posted about shuffling in A.C. this is for you: There is no game in Atlantic City that I play in that anyone at the table deals or even cuts. The casino has a dealer and if you were any kind of player you would know this.

Now plese tell me where in my posts that I said that the person dealing the cards would shuffle the cards face up before dealing. The only thing I said is that it is done my many before the game starts or at chip up and could be set up and if that person happens to be the next dealer. I also said that his deal would not hold as there are usually 8 to 10 at the table when we begin. However in a short table after eliminating people in a tournament format and chipping up one could "possibly" do it(cheat oportunity). If you read "my posts" which it seems none of you did, and did not let people put words in your mouth you would underestand where I am coming from. In fact I never said it was a good performance...it was not a performance it was a cheat move...get the magic trick syndrome out of your head..we are talking about cheating at cards.

Now some one brings up giving the deck to your partner in cheting at your right for the cut...when the heck did that come up. Lets see now bring in the girl that spills the drinks and you do a deck switch during the power surge and the lights flicker and etc etc.

While you commenting at games in various elements such as the Knights of Columbus etc in St Mary's etc shows how little you know about gambling. In our area Northest Pa. Scranton, Wilkes Barre area we have some rather big games after Lions meetings and church functions that would rival many of the games that you probably consider big. I guess this sounds like I am blowing my horn but honestly when I read some of your posts here it just brings out the worst in me.

This time I a done posting on this thread. Beat me up, stomp on me but all Iask is that before you do please show me where I said this person was a good performer. No more rebuttlas from me on this thread. If you cannot do this why the heck are you beatinig me up? I never said this guy was good or bad. Just that his set up could possibly set up a cheat opportunity. I never said it would fly as a legit deal...READ WHAT I POSTED. that's my story and I am sticking to it. Now add whatever you want and have fun. No rebuttals from me.

By the way if any of you gentlemen wish to play in any of our games I will definitely vouch for you and get you in. Send me a PM. They are on Tues Wed and Thrusday. Last Sat of every month we have a $200 buy in Texas Holdem tournament that usually attracts 30 to 40 players depends on the time of year. The split goes 50%, 25% 15% 10%. Additional $20 for food and beverages.

Now I am "all in".
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Sep 28, 2009 07:42PM)
Acesover, I don't know why you would do this to yourself. The more you post, the more you're getting ripped to shreds.

[quote]
On 2009-09-28 20:19, acesover wrote:
Maitre D. I will excuse your ignorance because of 9 posts.
[/quote]

It's foolish to rate a user's knowledge based on their number of posts.

[quote]
On 2009-09-28 20:19, acesover wrote:
If you never utilized a crimp that way that is your business.
[/quote]

You have made it very clear to us that you do not understand how to properly utilize a crimp in a game. Quite frankly it's becoming embarrassing for us to talk to someone so naive.

[quote]
On 2009-09-28 20:19, acesover wrote:
There is no game in Atlantic City that I play in that anyone at the table deals or even cuts. The casino has a dealer and if you were any kind of player you would know this.
[/quote]

You're disregarding all the private games in AC.

[quote]
On 2009-09-28 20:19, acesover wrote:
Now some one brings up giving the deck to your partner in cheting at your right for the cut...when the heck did that come up. Lets see now bring in the girl that spills the drinks and you do a deck switch during the power surge and the lights flicker and etc etc.
[/quote]

You think shuffling face-up will fly, but a simple cutting to a brief or crimp needs a strong turn with flickering lights?

I find it absolutely incredible that you're unable to comprehend such simple things.

Please, do yourself a favor and stop trying to rebuttal everyone.
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Sep 28, 2009 09:03PM)
Good, so we all agree?
Message: Posted by: C-Taylor (Sep 29, 2009 12:43AM)
I always like to think,"would I do this if someone had a gun on the table?"
Message: Posted by: splice (Sep 29, 2009 05:34AM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-28 20:42, Maitre D wrote:
It's foolish to rate a user's knowledge based on their number of posts.

[/quote]

Acesover's obsession with telling everyone how little they know of gambling seems to reveal some insecurity about his own knowledge. A lot of projection going on there, seems to me.

At any rate he won't reply anymore so that's fine. Letting this die is probably best at this point.
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Sep 29, 2009 05:36AM)
Letting it die?

I thought it was just beginning to get interesting.

I've been working on face-up shuffling for the last couple of days, BTW. I'm gonna spring it on my poker buddies on Wednesday.
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 29, 2009 06:08AM)
I'm with Stone :).

To be strictly fair, I've seen people shuffling cards face up in the past. According to them it was kinda proof for onlookers that cards were well mixed. Just to keep going being fair, it should have occurred 2 or 3 times and I play cards for such a long time...

Wasn't really very serious game though.

However, one stuff we meet once in a while is people showing the bottom card after a shuffle. For instance guys doing a cascade after a riffle. Not the "in the air" cascade but the one with the cards held perpendicularly above the mat.
Message: Posted by: Bret Maverick (Sep 29, 2009 10:04AM)
[quote] By acesover: While you commenting at games in various elements such as the Knights of Columbus etc in St Mary's etc shows how little you know about gambling. In our area Northest Pa. Scranton, Wilkes Barre area we have some rather big games after Lions meetings and church functions that would rival many of the games that you probably consider big. I guess this sounds like I am blowing my horn but honestly when I read some of your posts here it just brings out the worst in me.[/quote] Good Lord, you are dense. Having regulated gambling for thirty-one years I have a pretty good idea of the money wagered in my state (albeit unlawfully) at “charity” poker tournaments and, based on information relayed by personal sources, many private games. Do you really believe that the stakes in games in your Lion’s Clubs and churches in Northeast Pennsylvania would rival what I “consider big” in the private poker rooms in the City of New York?

Get real.

Don’t take this the wrong way, acesover; I am not belittling the stakes at your games (which, as a non-gambler, are higher than I would risk with my own hard-earned cash). I am merely rebutting your claim that my mentioning the less formally structured and unregulated games held at charitable halls “shows how little you know about gambling” - an accusation that I believe anyone who is familiar with the few messages that I’ve posted on this forum would refute.

The truth is, poker games with stakes in the monetary ranges that you mention occur throughout our nation, in both urban and rural areas, and were commonly conducted both before and after the pinnacle of the “poker frenzy” that we experienced a few years ago. The amount wagered in your area is not unique and, more than likely, is consistent with the monies wagered in most states. Poker has a long and very storied past in certain states, like Connecticut for instance, where the game has been traditionally accepted for more than a century in homes throughout the Nutmeg State.

Lastly, the fact that you’ve been gambling for forty-five years; owned a couple of pool halls; and have played poker extensively in both private games and tournament play does not automatically qualify you as an expert on either the methods of cheating, or in determining which moves would fly under fire. Nor does it entitle you to call everyone who disagrees with you a “stupid person” as you called No. 92 above.

Sadly, “Wisdom comes of age, but age often comes alone.”

Bret
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Sep 29, 2009 12:15PM)
Burn!
Message: Posted by: artwo (Sep 29, 2009 06:27PM)
Why are people arguing about stakes?

I'm a student. £50 means more to me than £5000 means to some people.



Stakes are all relative to what you are willing to risk.



Lets all stop belittling each other and go back to our awesome riffle passes.
Message: Posted by: Bret Maverick (Sep 29, 2009 06:57PM)
Sorry, Arthur, but if you think that we are arguing about stakes you need to spend a few more years in school.

Bret
Message: Posted by: silverking (Sep 29, 2009 09:32PM)
[quote]




Lets all stop belittling each other...........
[/quote]
"Belittling" is the wrong choice of descriptive language.......it was rather being honest with somebody who desperately needed to hear the truth.

The greatest disservice possible (and sure enough that disservice was executed in this thread) would be to say to the original poster or his thread sycophants [i]"your video was great, keep up the good work.[/i]

It [b]wasn't[/b] great, and it was important for that fact to be noted.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Sep 30, 2009 04:54PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-29 01:43, C-Taylor wrote:
I always like to think,"would I do this if someone had a gun on the table?"
[/quote]

If someone had a gun at the table, I wouldn't be cheating at all. Period. My life is more valuable.

[quote]
On 2009-09-29 07:08, AMcD wrote:
I'm with Stone :).

To be strictly fair, I've seen people shuffling cards face up in the past. According to them it was kinda proof for onlookers that cards were well mixed. Just to keep going being fair, it should have occurred 2 or 3 times and I play cards for such a long time...

Wasn't really very serious game though.

However, one stuff we meet once in a while is people showing the bottom card after a shuffle. For instance guys doing a cascade after a riffle. Not the "in the air" cascade but the one with the cards held perpendicularly above the mat.
[/quote]

Thank you. People DO shuffle face up sometimes. It's pretty common, which is why I'm able to get away with it. I've never been called on it.

Yes, I play at private home games in tournaments with a buy-in of $50-$75 or cash games with a $.50/$1 blinds. Not huge, but profitable.
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Sep 30, 2009 06:07PM)
And you cheat?

You already said you don't cheat.

I don't play for much money, but I would call you on it, and I have a hard time believing you actually shuffle like that and no one calls you on it.

Four pages of this thread, and no one has come right out and said it:

Your video sucks. Big time. It sucks so bad that I thought you were joking. The lamest people I know would not play poker with you. So I don't believe that you are telling the truth. Sorry. Don't want to hurt your feelings. I'm really a nice guy. Ask everyone here. I am. Truly. But your videos suck.

Now, that doesn't matter. If you post a video that sucks and ask how you can improve, then you will get lots of help. That's what this forum is for. But if you post a video that sucks and then try to tell us you're moving in real games and can show us how to do it ourselves, then you become a laughing stock. Again, I don't want to hurt your feelings. I'm just telling you how we think in this forum.

One more comment: you play some pretty sounding stuff on your guitar with a kind of slap technique. Then you post another video of guitar playing with a slap technique. Then a third and a fourth.

I truly say this with love in my heart and a desire to help you: you need to broaden your horizons, learn from others, taste the world, be open to learning, expand, grow, become someone who knows that the world is very big and has unknown mysteries that will enrich you if you only slow down and say...

..."can you help me?"...

...instead of trying to teach people who have already been there and done that long before you even got interested in the subject.

What? Are you now going to give me a lecture on Aristotle or something?

Again, I am being helpful and kind. Breathe twice, re-read this post twice, then think twice about how to respond. I only want to help.

Your new buddy Jeff.
Message: Posted by: Alan M (Sep 30, 2009 06:09PM)
[quote]
On 2009-09-30 17:55, jmstrings wrote:

Thank you. People DO shuffle face up sometimes. It's pretty common, which is why I'm able to get away with it. I've never been called on it.

Yes, I play at private home games in tournaments with a buy-in of $50-$75 or cash games with a $.50/$1 blinds. Not huge, but profitable.
[/quote]

Stop banging your head against the wall. You're starting to annoy the wall.
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Sep 30, 2009 09:33PM)
Perhaps you misread or misunderstood me?

I've seen such a shuffle 2 or 3 times in my life. Was kind of family/friend games with old guys (you know, the ones full of definitive ideas).

I've seen 25 millions overhand shuffles and 50 millions riffle shuffles (approximately :)).

Conclusion? I don't think it's a good idea to keep practicing it...

Of course, just in case you wanna everyone to stare at you everytime it's up to you to deal, it's a good one...
Message: Posted by: Bret Maverick (Oct 1, 2009 08:30AM)
[quote] By Stoneunhinged: Your video sucks. Big time. It sucks so bad that I thought you were joking. [/quote]

I'll admit, Jeff, that my intital thought was that the video was a parody recorded just for laughs, especailly after reading the authoritative warning provided. Sadly, I was mistaken, and now wish that, like Jason,I'd fallen aslseep a few seconds into the never-ending shuffle.

Bret
Message: Posted by: rawdawg (Oct 1, 2009 10:01PM)
All you people need to back up off of jmstrings!!!

You have beautiful work, jmstrings.... so, um.... you think you can get me a seat at one of your games?
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Oct 3, 2009 04:07PM)
[img]http://upshizzle.com/gallery/albums/October_2008/Photo%2016.jpg[/img]
here
Message: Posted by: splice (Oct 3, 2009 04:34PM)
Wow, that proves everything!

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Message: Posted by: Kimura (Oct 3, 2009 05:06PM)
Well that's proof.

Gentlemen step back, there is a new hustla in town.
Message: Posted by: MickeyPainless (Oct 3, 2009 05:25PM)
I fold!
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Oct 3, 2009 06:14PM)
Definitive proof.

I'm... speechless!
Message: Posted by: No. 92 (Oct 3, 2009 07:10PM)
Did you win all that using your sweet cards moves?
Message: Posted by: silverking (Oct 3, 2009 08:49PM)
[i]"Those who has to say they is.......ain't".[/i]

I guess more importantly, did you cheat?
Did you shuffle face up with that nasty magic stacking routine of yours?

If you just won some cash at a poker game........so what?

It may in fact be time for you to bid a quiet farewell to the Gambling Spot and go wow some kids at the Penguin or Ellusionist forums with your grainy pictures of $20 bills.
Message: Posted by: MickeyPainless (Oct 3, 2009 09:34PM)
I'd like to see a "How To" book published by THE MAN!
Message: Posted by: Clock (Oct 3, 2009 11:46PM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-03 20:10, No. 92 wrote:
Did you win all that using your sweet cards moves?
[/quote]

I second this using Napoleon Dynamite's voice.

[quote]
On 2009-10-03 20:10, No. 92 wrote:
Did you win all that using your sweet cards moves?
[/quote]

I second this using Napoleon Dynamite's voice.
Message: Posted by: Doc Dixon (Oct 4, 2009 07:17AM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-04 01:17, Clock wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-10-03 20:10, No. 92 wrote:
Did you win all that using your sweet cards moves?
[/quote]

I second this using Napoleon Dynamite's voice.
[/quote]

If that's not the funniest post I've read all year, I don't know what it is.
Message: Posted by: Clock (Oct 4, 2009 09:43AM)
Don't be jealous that he was chatting on Poker Stars with babes... all day.
Message: Posted by: rawdawg (Oct 4, 2009 03:10PM)
That Clock seconded himself with a double post is rather sublime...
Message: Posted by: Ben Train (Oct 15, 2009 03:08AM)
Hahahah!

This thread is jokes!

For the record:
Message: Posted by: DN777 (Oct 21, 2009 08:34PM)
Yup, no serious discussion here! LOL
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Oct 25, 2009 11:39PM)
Latest Stack
[img]http://packthebowl.com/stuff/stack.jpg[/img]
Message: Posted by: Hansen (Oct 26, 2009 12:45AM)
So you withdrew your life savings from the bank to take a photo to prove to a bunch of semi-interested anonymous strangers from around the globe that you're an A-1 cardsharp?
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Oct 26, 2009 01:20AM)
Jmstrings,

Speaking on behalf of many Gambling Spot users, read carefully.

We don't care, and frankly, we don't believe you. We thought you'd get the idea after 122 replies, but apparently we were wrong.

Even after our lectures and criticism, you still haven't been able to back up your claims with any remote display of skill in your videos, or any real amount of knowledge in your posts. This is pathetic; you're posting pictures of FAKE cash (read below for proof) on an internet forum as a substitute for lacking the ability to display any real skill or knowledge.

Looking closer at your picture, I noticed it's flipped horizontally. I also noticed that you were dumb enough to expose the beginning serial numbers of the top 2 bills. Both serial numbers start with "HD91" with a sub-serial of "D4."

From what I've found on the internet, the "D" in "HD91" represents which of the twelve US Federal Reserve Banks it was printed in, while the rest of the serial numbers/digits could be any of A-Z or 0-9.

26 * 12 * 10 * 10 * 26 * 10 = 8,112,000.

Jmstrings, there is a 1 out of 8,112,000 (0.000012%) chance that one of the top 2 bills isn't photocopied. From this, I find it highly likely that the majority of the other bills in your picture are also photocopied. This statistic, on top of your behavior, is significant and conclusive evidence that your desperate yet constantly failing attempt at trying to look like a cardsharp has once again failed, thus making yourself look even more pathetic. I'm surprised it didn't cross your mind that we, students of deception and manipulation, are sharp observers.

I rest my case. :goof:
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Oct 26, 2009 02:20AM)
Yeah, I saw that on the first pic. The 0 is where the 5 should be.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Oct 26, 2009 02:32AM)
Fake money? lmao
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Oct 26, 2009 03:14AM)
HA!

You don't need to look at the serial numbers, folks. The picture of Franklin is upside down.

Pretty good idea, actually. It's a little detail like that which protects someone from counterfeit charges. You know, kind of like putting a picture of Homer Simpson over Ben's.

Which gave me the idea of checking out his last picture, which I hadn't bothered to look at. Jackson's picture is upside down.

So right about now Jmstrings--who really [i]did[/i] win all of those bills in card games--is wondering about the $500 dollar bankroll he used to buy into a game where the guys in the "croo" unloaded all those funny looking bills on him.

What's he going to do, go to the police because he was stupid enough to bet a real bankroll against monopoly money? They'd be laughing for three weeks.

It doesn't matter: liar or sucker, real bills don't have the faces upside down. Not even in Australia.
Message: Posted by: Clock (Oct 26, 2009 03:37AM)
Just so you know the webcam he is using reverses the image...no mistake there. But the double serial number is hysterical!
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Oct 26, 2009 04:16AM)
There is no double serial number

Posted: Oct 26, 2009 5:16am
Unless I was paid in counterfeit bills... but I highly doubt that's the case.
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Oct 26, 2009 05:45AM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-26 04:37, Clock wrote:
Just so you know the webcam he is using reverses the image...no mistake there. But the double serial number is hysterical!
[/quote]

So it's not upside down, but mirror imaged.

Well then, I'm the sucker. :lol:
Message: Posted by: splice (Oct 26, 2009 06:45AM)
Well, the gauntlet has been thrown down. Now obviously Steve Forte, Sal Piacente, Jason England, or whoever else pretends to be a gambling expert needs to show up and take pictures of their money. Else jmstrings is at the top of our world, wouldn't you all agree?

No? Not even after he posted these pics of like, thousands of dollars (US, even)?!? Obviously no one has ever had that large a sum without cheating at cards.

Wow, it's like showing you have money means nothing whatsoever. I guess I won't have to withdraw my online bankroll just to show that I'm "real" after all.
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Oct 26, 2009 11:22AM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-03 17:07, jmstrings wrote:
[img]http://upshizzle.com/gallery/albums/October_2008/Photo%2016.jpg[/img]
here
[/quote]


so the 0 on this pic is at the top left of the bill, with the 5 next to it-instead of the other way around. Right?
Message: Posted by: AMcD (Oct 26, 2009 11:59AM)
Guys, here are the good angles:

http://www.arnoldmcdonald.org/en/images/Photo.jpg

Nothing wrong with me.

I'd like to see all the serials though :).
Message: Posted by: tommy (Oct 26, 2009 12:52PM)
What has this fanning got to do with gambling? :)
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Oct 26, 2009 03:07PM)
I guess I'm crazy, it still looks weird in my pic, but clear in yours Arnold. Thx.



Okay Jm, any new stuff? More cash? Any sweet ed hardy shirts?
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Oct 26, 2009 05:24PM)
I have a funny feeling jmstrings still isn't giving up with all this nonsense.
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Oct 30, 2009 10:03AM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-26 16:07, kcg5 wrote:
I guess I'm crazy, it still looks weird in my pic, but clear in yours Arnold. Thx.



Okay Jm, any new stuff? More cash? Any sweet ed hardy shirts?
[/quote]

I do not own any "Ed Hardy" clothing.
Message: Posted by: euro76 (Oct 30, 2009 12:17PM)
JM,

Are you in some "Prince Syndrome"?

Especially, for your money spread picture, that is wrong
even my 4 year old daughter said "dady, that money looks strange"

you should know better.
if you want to convince people, you should be more concerned.

sigh,
Message: Posted by: jmstrings (Oct 30, 2009 02:14PM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-30 13:17, euro76 wrote:
JM,

Are you in some "Prince Syndrome"?

Especially, for your money spread picture, that is wrong
even my 4 year old daughter said "dady, that money looks strange"

you should know better.
if you want to convince people, you should be more concerned.

sigh,
[/quote]


Yeah, the money looks strange because she's not used to seeing so much of it! Hah!


Relax, mate. Have a laugh.
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Oct 30, 2009 02:57PM)
So, no more money, no ed hardy. Any new moves for us to talk about?
Message: Posted by: Kimura (Oct 30, 2009 06:53PM)
Never before has Z's signature meant as much as in this thread
Message: Posted by: tommy (Oct 31, 2009 06:43AM)
Its is possible to stack trips using merely a strip cut; 2, X, 2, 2 at the bottom. Strip down to the required number and then drop them on top.
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Oct 31, 2009 04:39PM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-30 19:53, Kimura wrote:
Never before has Z's signature meant as much as in this thread
[/quote]

Kim, you got that right.
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Nov 7, 2009 04:58PM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-03 17:07, jmstrings wrote:
[img]http://upshizzle.com/gallery/albums/October_2008/Photo%2016.jpg[/img]
here
[/quote]

I don't mean to nit pick, and could not bring myself to watch the video, because I noticed that not only is the picture on the $20 on the top of the pack upside down, but is that a picture of Grant on it? Who is on a $20 anyhow? Jackson if I am not mistaken.

Grant has that beard, and the dark spot in the center of his hair, Jackson has all that WILD hair going on.

I have been wrong before, A LOT, but it seems odd to me. Maybe we have changed "Legal tender" recently.

Posted: Nov 7, 2009 5:59pm
Oh and congradulations on your "big win"!
Message: Posted by: Maitre D (Nov 7, 2009 07:16PM)
Dannydoyle, read the previous posts. The pictures are simply flipped horizontally.

Dannydoyle, once again, read the previous posts.

With the picture flipped horizontally, the perceived $20 is actually a $50. This also explains why his head appears to be upside-down.

AMcD's last post on this thread has a link to a "corrected" version of these pictures.
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Nov 7, 2009 09:15PM)
Heck of a magic trick that is.
Message: Posted by: blackeagle (Nov 7, 2009 09:19PM)
Listen here is the verdict..... He can get away with that kind of shuffle because he is playing with monopoly money.