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Topic: Share your jazz
Message: Posted by: Eric Richardson (Oct 8, 2009 08:30PM)
I thought it might be fun to discuss jazzing with the mem deck by sharing "victories" and "defeats". Perhaps this will help those who enjoy this type of effect perform it better and more creatively. I would love to hear about your experiences.

Here is one of my better moments:

A Victory: A three phase routine.

1) Sara named the QH. She cut right to it! <false shuffle>

2) Ed named the KC (#2 in Aronson). A wave over the deck and a double lift! I did an ambitious sequence that retained the stack order.

3) Cory named the JS (#1 in Aronson)! He waved his hand over the deck and turned over the top card himself. Huge reaction. Here I stopped!

My experiments in jazzing haven't all gone this smoothly. Like the time I pulled out the deck to do some jazz and accidently pulled out a one way forcing deck. I didn't realize it until the card had been named! If only they had named the AH I would of had a miracle! Oh well...

What are your stories?
Message: Posted by: Ken Abbott (Dec 24, 2009 10:49PM)
I keep a corner short on the queen of hearts. Someone named it so I dribbled to the short card and turned over the queen. I asked do you have another card you would like. He named the 7 of hearts which happened to be the bottom card of the half still in my right hand. I turned the deck face up and took my applause
Message: Posted by: Scott Cram (Dec 25, 2009 01:49PM)
My favorite time of performing of this was when the first person named the 2nd card in my Tamariz stack (2H), and the 2nd person named the 1st (4C)!

Right now, somewhere, there are 3 people out there who think I'm the best card magician in the world.
Message: Posted by: Dennis Loomis (Jan 10, 2010 08:55AM)
I presume that this thread has not gone too far because there just aren't that many people out there that jazz with a mem-deck.

Scott, Ken, and Eric, you guys seem pretty lucky. I've also had some fortuitous situations and I'll share one: As you may know I have a routine called Prediction a la Kruskal with the Aronson stack. It's on my web site and on Simon's. A few months ago I worked out a new presentation for it which I like a lot. (Not yet in print.) It requires that you carry an envelope with you and I vowed to have that envelope handy when I was working with a mem-deck. The very first time this happened, I was planning to show this new routine to some magician buddies and I had the envelope in my pocket. Now, my routine is based on the prediction of the Queen of Hearts, although other cards can be used. I had not yet gotten to this effect and decided to jazz a bit and I asked someone to name any card. Yup... you guessed it, they named the Queen of Hearts! Naturally I went right into Prediction a la Kruskal.

Dennis Loomis
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Noobini (Jan 12, 2010 05:27PM)
Victory (sort of): Victim (magician with no memdeck background) mentions card no.52. I get nervous that he is making fun of me and already know what is about to happen. Did he see my deck switch? I thought it was good myself.

I stick with it and kind of play with his mind a bit, do a few odd body movements while the deck is untouched on the table in front of him. That sort of thing which hopefully will make him uncertain later when he is asked to turn the deck over, if I really picked it up and did things without him noticing it.

He then mentions card no.1. By now I am myself quite insecure because I'm starting to get really certain that he is playing with me and I feel like an idiot for staying with the act. I have never performed anything for a real magician face to face before in my life. My nervousness probably plays like I am behaving weirdly. He is asked to turn over the top card. We both feel really uncomfortable now. There is an odd atmosphere in the room, like a seance. I really feel like the room is closing in on me.

He mentions card no.50. I pick the deck up, "accidentally" leaving two cards behind. I scoop them onto the deck as I handle it only at my fingertips. I am lucky and get exactly two cards left behind with a casual natural motion. He never sees it although he is burning my hands. Again he looks at the bottom card, his card.

He then asks if it is a memdeck, as this is probably the only area he isn't an expert in (yet). I say "yes" as I figure it is obvious to him while he is in fact just clutching at something he hasn't explored himself yet. I wish it was skill but sadly it was just luck. And at the time I was probably more confused and freaked out than he was. But it was a memorable first for me.

Failure: Virtually every time I have done memdeck work for non magician friends. They always ask after the first effect if I have memorized the entire deck order. Or if the deck is set up in some sort of system. Often it is asked jokingly. But logically, to really intelligent analytical people, that is the most obvious answer. The first and so far only time I have did a memdeck effect for someone I didn't know (Two Beginnings), she asked "is it possible to memorize the order of all of the cards?" "Yes, it is", I said. "I saw a guy on Larry King do that. I couldn't believe it but apparently some people can do that".

To my surprise, my memdeck effects that I have worked so hard to be able to do, play a lot weaker to my friends than other (classic) impromptu effects. People are smart. I did my first lapping today and it went great. They were amazed. But already they were turning their attention to my sleeves. Empty. Then the floor. So they didn't find it but the conclusion was still right. "It has to have gone somewhere", they said. "Or are you going to try to make us believe that you can do real magic?" Laughter.
Message: Posted by: mgcpwrs (Jan 12, 2010 05:36PM)
I can't jazz - but the stories are great - if anyone has more - keep them coming.
I use the Osterlind BCS, but that seems limited for jazzing.
Maybe I have to think bigger.
Message: Posted by: Furniture (Jan 14, 2010 11:27AM)
I believe that 'jamming' is a tool that is part of every great magician arsenal, and is not just specific for the memorized deck magic. things can go wrong and normally go wrong, the ability to improvise and have outs to every situation is a must.

mnemonicosis or the trick that cannot be explained are great effects that can help you to improve your 'jamming' technique

ps. I recommend everybody to always have a QH and a 7H in your wallet.
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Jan 14, 2010 06:47PM)
Jazzing is a lot of fun! Using ideas of Juan Tamariz I often pretend to shuffle and to cut the deck while my spectator is thinking of a card. Put the deck down, ask the spectator which card he is thinking of. Say, "great, I did the right thing..." Then let him cut the deck (not completing the cut) while guiding his cut (in relation to the position of his card, e. g. saying "cut about a third"), let him turn over the top pile and see what you can do when you see the bottom card of the top pile: counting, spelling, so many possibilities. The most important thing is that you are believable when you pronounce having done the right thing. Conviction you get if you believe yourself in what you say. Try it. Jan
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Jan 19, 2010 08:08AM)
[quote]
On 2010-01-12 18:36, mgcpwrs wrote:
I can't jazz - but the stories are great - if anyone has more - keep them coming.
I use the Osterlind BCS, but that seems limited for jazzing.
Maybe I have to think bigger.
[/quote]
Indeed you have to think bigger. Mr.Osterlind himself did so. The titles of his publications (about his BCS) say it all.
First he published the "BCS". Then he published the "memorized BCS".
Comments superfluous.
Message: Posted by: scody (Jan 19, 2010 10:24PM)
I was playing with ACAAN tonight at my bar/restaurant.
Seems that most people pick ace of spades if you let them...
Tamariz so thoughtfully put this at number 7... also a number chosen quite often (when given a choice from one to ten).... Twice tonight... no shuffle, no pass... just put the deck down and have them count it off.

Others are as easy... Queen of hearts is 11 (pass four while asking them for a number between one and ten)...
I can still pull off ACAAN with some math and a pass, but if they hit one that you can psych force a number on easily... makes for a fairly impressive quick acaan.

----
My favorite right now is simply doing a spectator peek... and telling them that you don't know the card, but you do know at what number it is... and (as proved tonight)... 2, 3, and 4 selections naming where each person's card is going to fall in the deck is REALLY cool... and just as easy.

Spectator peek with a glimpse is my favorite sleight, and with Tamariz... you can do some cool effects.
Message: Posted by: The Futurist (Jan 20, 2010 01:56PM)
[quote]
On 2010-01-10 09:55, Dennis Loomis wrote:
I presume that this thread has not gone too far because there just aren't that many people out there that jazz with a mem-deck.
[/quote]

But I really hope to be good enough one day to jazz with a mem-deck! Guys, your contributions to this thread are very much appreciated. I have taken a few notes down on potential spelling effects (Aronson stack), counting effects and what have you.

[quote]
On 2010-01-14 19:47, JanForster wrote:
Jazzing is a lot of fun! Using ideas of Juan Tamariz I often pretend to shuffle and to cut the deck while my spectator is thinking of a card. Put the deck down, ask the spectator which card he is thinking of. Say, "great, I did the right thing..." Then let him cut the deck (not completing the cut) while guiding his cut (in relation to the position of his card, e. g. saying "cut about a third"), let him turn over the top pile and see what you can do when you see the bottom card of the top pile: counting, spelling, so many possibilities. The most important thing is that you are believable when you pronounce having done the right thing. Conviction you get if you believe yourself in what you say. Try it. Jan
[/quote]

I also marked up a couple of decks in a fashion as discussed in this thread - http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=346343&forum=205&6 - which I'm hoping will inspire some improvisational moments like this. So I don't have to necessarily peek the bottom card of the cut portion.

[quote]
On 2010-01-19 23:24, scody wrote:
I can still pull off ACAAN with some math and a pass, but if they hit one that you can psych force a number on easily... makes for a fairly impressive quick acaan.
[/quote]

And taking advantage of numbers (birthdays, etc.?) and spelling situations in the environment, I guess, maybe with the odd DL to cheat if it's you dealing off the cards.
Message: Posted by: Dennis Loomis (Jan 21, 2010 11:35AM)
To The Futurist,

For spelling and counting effects you can turn either card which falls on the final letter, or the one after it. This gives you a double whammy.

If you count or spell all of the cards to the table, including the final letter or number, then on top of the deck you have the x+1 card and under it is the x+2 card. As you suggest, you can double lift to show the x+2 card.

There are two alternatives to the double lift. You can thumb off the top card into your other hand, show it, and it's wrong. Now do a Top Change and show the correct card. Or, you can flip over the top card as a single. It's wrong. Flip it back face down and do an Erdnase Color Change. Nothing appears to have happened, but when you flip over the top single card again, it is changed into the correct card.

Any of these procedures allows you to count or spell to any of three cards which increases your odds of finding a good Jazzin technique for the named card.

Dennis Loomis
P.S. Go to Google and type in "Magic DVDS" without the quotations marks and see what comes up first.
Message: Posted by: The Futurist (Jan 21, 2010 03:02PM)
Thank you Dennis, some great food for thought here. I read the article "Preconceived Jazzin with the Aronson Stack" on your site. I do a pretty nice top change actually, that I just came up with one day by accident. Though I shall study my Erdnase and Hugard for other versions of same.

Also, I just thought, I could try lapping a few cards off the top if seated at a table. My misdirectional abilities are coming on apace: I make a silly joke and my interlocutor either laughs or groans. Either way, I get my move in.

Well, I just found out how to not get redirected to the UK version of Google: Google.com leads me to Penguin Magic whose hot DVD seems to be Luke Jermay's Emotional Intelligence.

Edit: I checked the other thread. Have you got an AdWords campaign running? I don't have an ad for loomismagic.com showing up here in the UK. Indeed, I'm still being served ads from UK retailers even on non-local Google.com, which suggests that they're geotargeted in some way.
Message: Posted by: atucci (Jan 31, 2010 12:55PM)
[quote]
On 2009-10-08 21:30, Eric Richardson wrote:
I thought it might be fun to discuss jazzing with the mem deck by sharing "victories" and "defeats". Perhaps this will help those who enjoy this type of effect perform it better and more creatively. I would love to hear about your experiences.
[/quote]

Not sure if you're aware but Eric Mead covers this topic in his book, Tangled Web.
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Jan 31, 2010 01:07PM)
[quote]
On 2010-01-31 13:55, atucci wrote:
[quote]
Not sure if you're aware but Eric Mead covers this topic in his book, Tangled Web.
[/quote]
What exactly writes Eric Mead about . Memdeck? Jazz? or the combination of both?
Message: Posted by: Mago Gregorio (Jan 31, 2010 03:36PM)
This afternoon, a friend ask for the Ace of Spades and another one for Number 8. Just one card to secretly add and a pure miracle (Tamariz stack) "without touching" the cards !
Message: Posted by: atucci (Feb 1, 2010 03:58AM)
[quote]
On 2010-01-31 14:07, Waterloophai wrote:
What exactly writes Eric Mead about . Memdeck? Jazz? or the combination of both?
[/quote]

Waterloophai - both actually. The chapter is titled, "Jazz Chart & Favorite Licks - The Trick That Cannot Be Explained". He writes about his advanced approach to TTTCBE using two borrowed decks, several standard practices he employs, cheating and the use of a borrowed deck & memdeck.

He credits Vernon, Tamariz, Micheal Weber & Eugene Burger as significant influences on his current handling. Recently I've read a bit about TTTCBE, whether the use of sleights dilutes the impact of the finale and outright disagreement with Mead on his 'whatever means necessary' approach.

Mead writes early in the chapter this effect should be less about a method and more of an attitude or way of thinking about magic. I would imagine if you're just beginning to perform TTTCBE using some type of linear approach or standard operating procedure may be necessary until you have enough experience to recognize where you are and what path to take at any given moment.

I hope this helps.
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Feb 1, 2010 02:53PM)
Thanks !
Message: Posted by: LobowolfXXX (Feb 4, 2010 08:15PM)
I use the Joyal stack. Literally the first time I was ready to bust it out, I asked someone to name a card; he named the 9 of spades. I asked him to name a number from 1 to 52; he said 27. The 9S is 27th in the Joyal stack, and as luck would have it, the deck of cards was on the counter (this was in my friend's magic shop) and was actually closer to him (a foot) than to me (5 feet). After a suitable moment of intense concentration... "ok, you know what, I don't even want to touch the deck....go ahead and deal face down to the 27th card..." etc. etc.
There was, of course, only one way to follow that one up.
I left.
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Feb 5, 2010 02:28AM)
[quote]
On 2010-02-04 21:15, LobowolfXXX wrote:
I use the Joyal stack. Literally the first time I was ready to bust it out, I asked someone to name a card; he named the 9 of spades. I asked him to name a number from 1 to 52; he said 27. The 9S is 27th in the Joyal stack, and as luck would have it, the deck of cards was on the counter (this was in my friend's magic shop) and was actually closer to him (a foot) than to me (5 feet). After a suitable moment of intense concentration... "ok, you know what, I don't even want to touch the deck....go ahead and deal face down to the 27th card..." etc. etc.
There was, of course, only one way to follow that one up.
I left.
[/quote]
Hallo Mr. Berglas,
What you described was probable not pure "jazz" because you intended probably to do something well planned. However, if such a feat occurs you did the only right thing: make use of it and stop with whatever you had planned to do.
I sometimes call it a "present of the Gods" in return for our effort to learn a MD.
It are those things (and there are many) that makes a MD so rewarding.
Message: Posted by: BenSimon (Feb 8, 2010 12:05PM)
I want to learn a stack but haven't started to yet, since I'm not sure where to start, Aaronson, Tamariz? But still what happened last night was just priceless. I had just learned how to calculate positons in the Si Stebbins, as sort of something I could do that at least has a tiny tiny connection to a memorised stack, before working on really memorising a stack. Anyways I had a Si Stebbins in hands, knew the bottom card (JS). I was waiting for the subway with some people, one of which didn't have the slightest idea I did magic. When he saw the cards, I told him to name any, as I wanted to just jazz, and see what I can come up with. He named the JS... I slowly turned the deck over... :) Some impact, but unfortunately I sort of ruined the magic by being too surprised and laughing, turning it into mere luck. He wasn't prepared for magic as I didn't present it properly. Something learned.
Today I had a colleage cut exactly to his card, without any adjustments. My colleagues sometimes now just shake their heads smiling when I pull something like this, but I know they're impressed. :) I really want to learn a stack now.
Message: Posted by: SWNerndase (Feb 10, 2010 10:20AM)
I play jazz with the stack (Aronson) a lot. Really a lot. I can tell tales of miracles and tales of disaster. Here was a good one from a couple of weeks ago:

Card is named. I ask for a cut a little more than half. Lady cuts a little less than half and I am 8 cards away. I ask someone else for a number between 1 and 10. He says 6. I have the talon picked up from the table and placed on my hand. Then I ask that 6 cards be slowly removed from the top one by one. What was that card again? (Four of Diamonds) A double turnover reveals the 4D and it's a strong effect.

NOW--another person asks out of the blue, what if she'd said a different card, like the King of Hearts? (Those that know Aronson will recognize that the KH is the f/u card under the f/u 4D after the double turnover.) I try not to laugh, slowly turn the double back down, blow on it and turn over the KH.

(And the crowd goes wild.)

SWN
Message: Posted by: Cohiba (Feb 10, 2010 03:12PM)
Very cool SWN!
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Noobini (Mar 8, 2010 01:07PM)
[quote]
On 2010-01-31 13:55, atucci wrote:
Not sure if you're aware but Eric Mead covers this topic in his book, Tangled Web.
[/quote]

The Lazy Man's Card Trick concept in that book has turned into my current memdeck favorite. I haven't really warmed up to the multiple deck work in the book, but 'Lazy Man' is proving an extraordinary starting point for jazzing.

Although I do need to find better ways of forcing numbers, especially 24, which comes up a lot. All in all I would love more ideas about what to do with the setup. So far I've more or less only tried the Stop-trick or cutting in order to let the spectator count down to his number, or turn the top card over.

I get into it (after doing a few other things first) by openly counting the right number of cards to the table for the setup and then changing my mind about what trick to do. I scoop them all up and say "no, hang on, let's try this first"... Then a false shuffle before handing them the cards. For me that seems better than to stealthily run that many single cards in different series.

But I need to develop more improv ideas for the effect. I cannot think of anything really original. Only lucky numbers and birthdays and such things.
Message: Posted by: Josh Chaikin (May 11, 2010 11:42AM)
I asked someone to name any card, 7S was named (37 in Tamariz).
I asked someone else to name a number and 37 was named.

I stopped there.
Message: Posted by: Vlad_77 (May 11, 2010 12:25PM)
Tony,

Nice to see a mention of Eric Mead's excellent Tangled Web. In my opinion one of the best books about HOW to think about what we do as magicians ever written.

Noobini,

I have had the greatest success using mem decks in gambling "demonstrations". I am writing this because you had mentioned that mem deck effects play weaker for you than impromptu effects. Trust me, do a couple of impromptus, switch in your mem deck - Aronson's effect Bait and Switch is SO lovely to do this - and go into the built in poker deals in the stack. You will SLAY your audiences.

All,

It wasn't my intention to hijack the thread. I just felt compelled to make those comments. Thanks!

Ahimsa,
Vlad
Message: Posted by: onesickknave (May 14, 2010 03:12AM)
Great stories guys... I've been using the Tamariz stack for the last year now and it's completly changed my card magic. Also due to the structure of the deck it is perfect for 'jazzing' as you can flutter between a stay-stack order and the Tamariz stack by doing a series of legit shuffles. Not only are you getting two stacks for the price of one but I've also found that this helps to send the intelligent layman off the scent of a men deck and thus reducing the chance of being pestered by the audience to let them shuffle.