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Topic: Anyone in philly do sideshow trainig?
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 9, 2010 12:38PM)
I'm looking for someone who knows the tricks who's been working for a long time to teach me new things. I already do the human blockhead, I eat fire, and I do a routine with needles through the hand or wherever else.
Message: Posted by: Freak Prodigy (Aug 9, 2010 01:08PM)
Or whatever else...
Message: Posted by: jondark445 (Aug 9, 2010 02:23PM)
There's this guy....Red....Red....ah, his name escapes me....he does something with a sword...somebody help me out here...

:)

--T
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 9, 2010 02:31PM)
He's on the road right now.
Message: Posted by: Danny Borneo (Aug 9, 2010 02:38PM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-09 15:23, jondark445 wrote:
There's this guy....Red....Red....ah, his name escapes me....he does something with a sword...somebody help me out here...

:)

--T
[/quote]

Skelton?...........Foxx?............hmm, not sure.........Buttons?
Message: Posted by: Doctor Mythsonian (Aug 9, 2010 03:32PM)
Red... Peters? Green?
Message: Posted by: thegreatnippulini (Aug 9, 2010 04:33PM)
There's this guy somewhere in central Pa who teaches. Whatsizname.... something like a motorcycle... Harley something-or-other...
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 9, 2010 04:46PM)
You don't have to kick me, to get me going! Phillie's only a hour and a half away.
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 9, 2010 05:11PM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-09 16:32, Doctor Mythsonian wrote:
Red... Peters? Green?
[/quote]

Holy crap! How did you know my last name?
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 9, 2010 05:13PM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-09 14:08, Freak Prodigy wrote:
Or whatever else...
[/quote]

Thank you for the correction.
Message: Posted by: Martin_Ling (Aug 9, 2010 06:55PM)
I just assumed your last name was kmpx18?
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 9, 2010 06:59PM)
Haha no just my screen name there lol
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 9, 2010 11:00PM)
I belive Red's last name is Baron.
Message: Posted by: Freak Prodigy (Aug 10, 2010 04:53AM)
It might seem fitting, but please, no, anything but Baron.
Message: Posted by: Doctor Mythsonian (Aug 10, 2010 12:07PM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-09 18:11, kmpx18 wrote:
[quote]
On 2010-08-09 16:32, Doctor Mythsonian wrote:
Red... Peters? Green?
[/quote]

holy crap how did you know my last name?
[/quote]

I have expanded my powers considerably using the infamous 'egg crushing' spell.
Message: Posted by: jondark445 (Aug 10, 2010 12:49PM)
So much better than the "nut crushing" spell....I'm still sore....
Message: Posted by: Freak Prodigy (Aug 10, 2010 01:58PM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-10 13:07, Doctor Mythsonian wrote:
[quote]
On 2010-08-09 18:11, kmpx18 wrote:
[quote]
On 2010-08-09 16:32, Doctor Mythsonian wrote:
Red... Peters? Green?
[/quote]

holy crap how did you know my last name?
[/quote]

I have expanded my powers considerably using the infamous 'egg crushing' spell.
[/quote]

:)
Message: Posted by: Martin_Ling (Aug 10, 2010 02:53PM)
Wait, is this the spellcasting thread or the mentalism thread?
Message: Posted by: Doctor Mythsonian (Aug 10, 2010 04:03PM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-10 15:53, Martin_Ling wrote:
Wait, is this the spellcasting thread or the mentalism thread?
[/quote]
Yes
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 11, 2010 10:14PM)
Gee folks, I asked Kyle some basic questions in a PM, and he hasn't answered. Did I say something out of line? Did I neglect to ask something?

"Tell me about yourself. Who are you? Who do you work with? Where did you learn the things you already know? What do you want to do with it?"
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 11, 2010 10:27PM)
I'm sorry, I've been a tad bit busy :( I'll be happy to answer them now lol
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 11, 2010 10:37PM)
Harley, I've answered in PM I'm not sure it is thorough enough though.
Let me know if you need anything else XD
Message: Posted by: thegreatnippulini (Aug 12, 2010 07:49AM)
My wife drives an XD... much nicer than the "shed-on-wheels" XB that Scion puts out.
Message: Posted by: Martin_Ling (Aug 12, 2010 03:38PM)
I had an XA, loved it! I have a Xion and would trade it for an XA any day. However, the XD's are beautiful cars, just too much car for the city and my driveway. What was the topic again?
Message: Posted by: Martin_Ling (Aug 12, 2010 03:40PM)
FYI, when Harley smiles at me its like he knows all the questions in my head. He's just letting me figure them out for myself though.
Message: Posted by: Martin_Ling (Aug 13, 2010 12:06PM)
Awkward silence....again.
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 13, 2010 12:53PM)
Oh! I was supposed to ask you what you already knew?

Just wait...one of these days, we actually WILL get to work together.
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 13, 2010 01:43PM)
Well Harley that's kinda iffy. I know all the basics for fire eating I haven't gone advanced yet it's going to take time I'm sure but also I've already looked into Dan Hauss's Through and Through and have been performing it for a while. I also do a bit of the blockhead but that's really it. I'm still young and learning so my skills will need more practice and instruction.
Message: Posted by: Martin_Ling (Aug 14, 2010 09:58AM)
You forgot needles thru hand an "wherever else".*shudder*
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 14, 2010 10:17AM)
That's through and through lol and that's not really what I meant lol.
You're giving it a different context lol.
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 14, 2010 01:35PM)
Hmmm. Is a bit of blockhead like a little bit pregnant?
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 14, 2010 06:48PM)
Haha I meant I do it but I just don't perform it a lot. I'm not really a big fan of it.
Message: Posted by: Freak Prodigy (Aug 14, 2010 11:26PM)
Good christ.
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 14, 2010 11:31PM)
Haha what for?
Message: Posted by: thegreatnippulini (Aug 15, 2010 08:58AM)
I think Brett was giving praise to the other half of WOW... maybe while giving him a milk bone.

A "bit" of blockhead... is this a reference to the drill bits I make for the act? Speaking of which, kmpx13 (is that an alien planet?), if you are ever in the market for high quality stainless steel stage props like BH nails and such, just give me a shout. I happen to live in Bucks County so shipping fees would be a lot lower.
Message: Posted by: Skeleton (Aug 15, 2010 09:41AM)
I am sorry but somehow your humour (?) totally eludes me - in every second posting in this area I read your advices (or should I say threats) that no one should do your stuff without proper tutoring by a skilled performer.
And now here we have one who obviously is seeking the advice you preach and still all he gets is sarcasm and lame jokes?
To be honest if I were someone seeking advice after the comments here I certainly wouldn't choose one of yours to do it...
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 15, 2010 12:08PM)
Well nip that's great lol cause I live just down the street. but currently I'm ok
and skeleton I really appreciate your standing up for me in this case. oh and also nip you got it wrong it's kmpx18 it stands for kyle matthew peters the x is a space marker and 18 represents my age. so no alien planets don't exist and therefore this has nothing to do with false beliefs
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 16, 2010 07:33AM)
Actually, more than 100 alien planets (planets outside our solar system) have been discovered. Just FYI.
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 16, 2010 07:45AM)
Skeleton, Harley--who is one of the most qualified teachers on this forum--contacted Kyle, so there really isn't any need for the rest of us to.

And what gives you the impression that just because someone asks for information, that they are automatically due it? If the person asking doesn't seem serious enough, old enough, or prepared enough to use the information safely and responsibly, it would be wrong for us to simply hand it over.
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 16, 2010 02:47PM)
Stephon ok I believe you about the alien planets but that doesn't mean I believe in aliens. maybe they exist maybe they don't but I don't want to find out.

also I understand the whole seriousness and preparedness information and totally agree. Harley was gracious enough to contact me and we had a get to know you kind of thing. I hope when his classes next come around that I would be able to take part and learn more.
Message: Posted by: Freak Prodigy (Aug 16, 2010 02:49PM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-16 08:45, Stephon wrote:
Skeleton, Harley--who is one of the most qualified teachers on this forum--contacted Kyle, so there really isn't any need for the rest of us to.

And what gives you the impression that just because someone asks for information, that they are automatically due it? If the person asking doesn't seem serious enough, old enough, or prepared enough to use the information safely and responsibly, it would be wrong for us to simply hand it over.
[/quote]

Exactly. As a magician, Skeleton, would you tell someone how to perform all the tricks in your arsenal just because they asked?
Message: Posted by: Skeleton (Aug 17, 2010 02:46AM)
To your comments:

1) For me it was not obvious that harley did contact Kyle and therefore this whole thread came across as though noone would be willing to give him the advise he seeks!

2) No, I would not tell anyone how to perform tricks just because they asked, however if they told me that they are already doing magic (or in this case sideshow-stunts) and only wanted to have a contact (as Kyle did) then of course I would!

And I would do it because I can't stand this whole elitist attitude the whole magic fraternity sometimes is showing and which sometimes also comes across from the sideshow performers!

Because let's face it, what is the big deal - if someone want's to get the secrets and how-to's in these days of the internet he certainly will, and to my understanding that is not a bad thing! Because if the young newcomers were dependent upon getting the teaching from the old-school magicians this artform would be dying rather quickly - at least that is my experience over the last 30 years.

Not to mention the fact that there would be no new input or innovations, as most "oldtimers" tend to preach the old-school way aka "that's the way it was always done bla, bla, bla..." or why do I get the impression that the most innovative magicians are mostly self-taught from the start or have early on gone their own ways?
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 17, 2010 01:20PM)
No one gets hurt performing 98% of the magic tricks that people do; there is a good chance of someone hurting themselves or others if they perform sideshow stunts improperly. Your comparison doesn't hold up.

I believe it wasn't obvious to you, but there is a post in the thread where Harley says that he contacted Kyle and hadn't heard back yet.
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 17, 2010 01:42PM)
We're not discussing double-lifts. I got a paper-cut, the last time I tried one.

Skeleton, are you a stunt-performer?
Message: Posted by: Skeleton (Aug 17, 2010 03:25PM)
@ Harley: No I am not (at least not yet) - but there we have it: don't treat me like a baby, I know quite well that we are not discussing double-lifts!
And I am also not a hot-blooded testosterone-guided youngster (I am 46) who wants or needs to impress someone by doing something outragous.
But on the other hand also don't try to give the impression as if the stunts you are doing are soo out of reach and difficult, because for most of them all it takes are a lot of guts and - here we are again - some good advice/training.
But as I already said, if you come across as such an elitist group as you sometimes do I am certain that a lot of people interested in your stuff will not even try to seek advice from you and will rather be looking for the how-to in the internet - and as far as I got the impression that is exactly what you do NOT want!?
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 17, 2010 04:01PM)
Skeleton, if they were "soo out of reach and difficult", it wouldn't be an issue; no one if trying to teach themselves skydiving, or learning it off the internet.

That is the exact reason why, if someone seems too immature or ill-prepared to learn something dangerous, they need to be educated to that fact. Once they realize it, then they will understand that they need to wait to learn the information.

Again, Harley contacted Kyle. The boy was not brushed off. The rest of us knew it, and there was no need for us to pursue him. And when someone says things like they've done "a bit of blockhead" they are not demonstrating a real understanding of what they are asking for.

You have no idea what the exchange was between Harley and Kyle. Telling someone they are not ready to be taught something is not "elitist", it is responsible. Is, "If you won't teach me, I'll learn it from the internet" really the proper criterion for accepting someone as a student?
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 17, 2010 04:17PM)
I'm wondering if I had perhaps done something wrong.
I was really trying to say that I do do the blockheads I just don't always do it as it is not of my true interest. I have researched much and I'm only looking to further my
Interests
Message: Posted by: Skeleton (Aug 17, 2010 04:20PM)
Well Stephon, as we probably both don't know what has been discussed between Harley and Kyle I think we should leave it here - I guess I made my point.
But even though you are at a first look correct that his statement come across a little bit uncouth one has to keep in mind that he is only 18 and therefore will probably not think twice about every word he posts.
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 17, 2010 05:38PM)
No, Kyle, you have done nothing wrong, you just seem a bit young and inexperienced, and any responsible person would want to be sure they weren't handing a proverbial loaded gun to you.

Keep in contact with Harley, follow his advice, you'll do fine.
Message: Posted by: kmpx18 (Aug 17, 2010 05:40PM)
Thank you stephon I was just worried
yes I am still unexperienced so my words aren't always going to be wise but that's something I want to change
Message: Posted by: Stephon (Aug 17, 2010 05:42PM)
No, we don't know exactly what Harley and Kyle discussed, but I know Harley and he has made his thoughts on the matter of learning/teaching stunts clear--http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=159654&forum=23&16, for example--so, I am confident that I have a good idea.

If you still find that elitist, well, thank you for your input; it has been noted.
Message: Posted by: Freak Prodigy (Aug 17, 2010 06:00PM)
The new "Sideshow Elitist" group is now up on Facebook... Please "like" it, thanks.
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 17, 2010 06:12PM)
Skeleton, I made a joke, at my own expense. And I asked you a question. That was it.

I did not in any way treat you like a baby. I did not imply that you were a "hot-blooded testosterone-guided youngster". That's your anger, your words, and the twists and turns of your life. I have my own twists, thank you.

I asked about your background, because I'm curious to know more.

If I sound elitist, when I talk about the need to learn stunts from experienced stunt performers, then you completely miss the point. You could write volumes about these things, but a book cannot replace good teaching.

Good teaching is an interactive process. When I teach, I can SEE how students use their bodies, what's going through their heads. I can anticipate where they're about to make a mistake, and help them not get hurt. I can show them little things that might go wrong, and how to avoid that. I can teach them what to do, WHEN something goes wrong, because it will.

I've met quite a few magicians who say they know all about "sideshow tricks", but don't know which end of a nail to stick in their nose. When all of your material involves trickery, trickery becomes the only world you can see. It's very cynical, has no element of wonder. Without wonder, they are very poor.

Some of the stunts I do, are traditional standards. Some are not. Some of my stunts are widely copied. Some, no one else does. Always, my routines are my own.

Guts have nothing to do with this, except for performers whose show is essentially bragging about what they can do. They do not interest me.

I teach basic skills to beginners. Advanced skills, I discuss only with very experienced performers. To be a beginner, in my class, requires previous performing experience. You must have vocabulary, in order to make sentences. You must be able to make sentences, to tell a story.

Good performance does not involve doing someone else's show. My students learn to create their own scripts. You can find performers I've taught, coached, or consulted with, on 6 continents. Some of them are the NOW generation, some are the next. I'm pretty excited to see what some of them are doing.

Am I elitist? Skeleton, you were a child, when I started performing. I've appeared on a couple of hundred television shows, aired in about 90 countries, with about a billion viewers. I know a lot of the major players in this genre. I know which ones are interesting, and which do the same old stuff. People hire me to perform, because I'm good at what I do. They know they're going to get their money's worth. I've been told I'm some kind of an expert. Sure! Why not? But elitist?
Message: Posted by: Michael K (Aug 17, 2010 09:33PM)
"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead: his eyes are closed." ~Albert Einstein

While we joke around online, we are very serious about teaching. This section of the Café has seen many people whom no one has ever met or heard about, directly and boldly ask for secrets about very dangerous stunts. The Escape section has recently seen too. Sometimes our jokes and internal jabs, do get intermingled with real answers and real interaction. There isn't any way to read body language, tone, inflection, and so many other cues which are so important in personal communication, text messages may be misinterpreted. This is one of the problems of a text based forum and a huge problem with email.

I've an very lucky and very proud to have been and continue to be a student of Harley Newman. Working with Harley has been the best thing that has happened to me as a performer. Anyone who passes on the opportunity to work with him is sadly missing a rare and immeasurable gift. He is the best.

Michael
Message: Posted by: thegreatnippulini (Aug 18, 2010 08:41AM)
[quote]
On 2010-08-17 14:42, Harley Newman wrote:
We're not discussing double-lifts.[/quote]

I've done double lifts.... I HAVE to. If I only did a single lift my show would be very short.

:)

(from the guy who basically tells his audience how great his abilities are)
Message: Posted by: Kondini (Aug 19, 2010 07:38AM)
I am elitist, so much so I would never mix with the riff raff on here,,,in fact Im so elitist I wouldn`t even dream of talking to myself.

So there.

Ken.