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Topic: Appearing Cane
Message: Posted by: MagicGSX (Oct 15, 2001 06:16AM)
I am looking to buy an appearing cane. Can someone tell me which is considered the best black appearing metal cane on the market. I am considering the newer silver streak model, but am a fan of the traditional black with white tip.
Message: Posted by: Bengi (Oct 29, 2001 04:41PM)
I've tried several....In my opinion, no one will out-do Fantasio



Bengi
Message: Posted by: Mitch (Nov 5, 2001 08:32PM)
I picked up a used Harakhan cane (Japanese)earlier this year as they are considered the best.



They are bronze in colour and are very fast and tight when opened. You can pick one up at stevensmagic.com for about $100 including shipping (if you are in U.S.) imagine more if outside U.S.



I love mine.
Message: Posted by: Peter Marucci (Nov 6, 2001 03:05AM)
Magic, first of all you might ask yourself, why do you want a cane?

The late Sid Lorraine said to me one time that magic must be logical, albeit a sort of strange logic.

And, he added, how many people today use walking sticks?

The vanishing/appearing/dancing cane is much like the giant die in the die box: Who has ever seen such a thing, other than as a magic prop?

If the "cane" is a pool cue, in a routine based on a pool room, then it will work.

But to come on stage with a walking stick, for no apparent reason (other than the obvious: it's a magic prop) just isn't logical.

However, if you insist on it, the Fantasio products are probably the best for your buck.

cheers,

Peter Marucci

showtimecol@aol.com
Message: Posted by: Chad Sanborn (Nov 6, 2001 04:35AM)
[quote]Magic, first of all you might ask yourself, why do you want a cane?

The late Sid Lorraine said to me one time that magic must be logical, albeit a sort of strange logic.

And, he added, how many people today use walking sticks?

The vanishing/appearing/dancing cane is much like the giant die in the die box: Who has ever seen such a thing, other than as a magic prop?

If the "cane" is a pool cue, in a routine based on a pool room, then it will work.

But to come on stage with a walking stick, for no apparent reason (other than the obvious: it’s a magic prop) just isn’t logical.[/quote]

Nothing magicians do is logical. If it was, we wouldn’t fool anybody. Its ok to be illogical. but not ok to be unnatural. There is a difference.



Chad
Message: Posted by: Bengi (Nov 6, 2001 05:49AM)
If it weren't for my appearing cane, my appearing dove would have nowhere to perch!!!!



Bengi :rolleyes:
Message: Posted by: Wallace (Nov 6, 2001 09:39AM)
Thanks folks who use the Fantasio, I’ll stick with my German steel model, it doesn’t ’wobble’!! :nod:

Mind you I must admit that the Fantasio Vanishing Cane is a heck of a lot safer than a steel one....preserves the fingers!! ;)



_________________

Wallace B
Message: Posted by: Rich (Dec 5, 2001 09:53AM)
I have in the past used several types of canes. Fantasio ones look good, but can be slightly flimsy when first produced, being made from plastic. I currently use the silver streak metal cane from The Trickery, which is very visible, easy and once produced really does look like a solid piece of steel. I think it is ok in my act, because mine is a more magical act and so a few things don’t exactly look ’natural’ things that you would find at home. (Remember I also use Vernet multiplying balls).



So if you were getting one for the first time, I would recommend a black Fantasio one.



_________________

Rich - [url=http://www.penna.org.uk"]Penna.org.uk[/url]
Message: Posted by: Scott O. (Dec 7, 2001 06:40PM)
In case anyone is interested, Paul Diamond has a segment on his recent video series on the proper care and handling of an appearing cane. It's on video No. 9 "A Magician's Best Friend". There may not be much there for someone who has used a cane for a while. If you're new to the prop though, he has some nice tips.



Scott O. ;)
Message: Posted by: Peter Marucci (Dec 8, 2001 03:30AM)
Bengi makes a valid point: his cane is used as a place for his doves to perch; that's logical that he would have a cane.

And Chadmagic, yes, everything we do is illogial, but it MUST be within a context to be believable as magic, rather than just tricks.

It has to have a certain "logical illogic", if you will.

Coins are money, can be spent, and people carry them.

You could do exactly the same thing with metal discs -- but it wouldn't be logical.

The doll house is so named because it is, theoretcially, too small for a human (hence the surprise when one appears in it).

You could do the same thing with a "magic box" -- but, then, it wouldn't be magical because is wouldn't be logical (of course someone can fit in a magic box; didn't you just call it a magic box!)

So everything we do isn't illogical, if you think about it. (Or shouldn't be.)

If it is, then you are just doing tricks and not magic (to repeat myself).

cheers,

Peter Marucci

showtimecol@aol.com
Message: Posted by: Jeb Sherrill (Dec 16, 2001 02:40PM)
Appearing canes are one of my favourite stage productions and I've used several. I hate Fantasios (my first cane) way too flimsy. The German one is good. I haven't tried the silver streak, but I'd like too. If you can track one down I seriously suggest a Walsh. To me they've always been the smoothest and the fastest.

Cheers,

Sable :dance:
Message: Posted by: dorbolo (Dec 29, 2001 12:58AM)
Peter,



Your view of magic is very interesting to me. I think that you are saying that the total effect must be something that the spectator can relate to personally and assimilate mentally. "Logical" here, will mean the same as "coherent." Is this what you have in mind?



It does not follow, though, that a logical progression of a routine requires that the props and setting be ordinary objects. Last June I saw Shimada pull canes, parasols, silks, cards, and a flock of doves out of thin air on stage with no explanation and very minimal movement. It was stunningly beautiful. Logical? Well, sure. Each effect built on the last to create a crescendo of tension and aniticipation.



Bill Tarr uses colored poker chips in place of coins. Michael Skinners linking rings were poetry in motion. Not ordinary objects, but not ordinary performers either.



Great performers create moments of sheer beauty and mystery. The logic is in the structure of the act, which can accommodate unusual and exotic props and settings as well as ordinary ones.



Different magicians have different objectives. Perhaps, if the objective is to convince an audience that you have a certain power, then it is important to avoid unusual props. But if the objective is to give the audience an experience of beautiful astonishment, then the exotic can be as effective as the ordinary.



What do you think?



In good spirit,



Jon
Message: Posted by: Dennis Michael (Dec 29, 2001 04:48AM)
Justifing the reason to use an appearing or disappearing cane can be overdone.



I use the Walsh steel cane for the introduction warm-up for my kids show and the vanishing Walsh steel cane to a "The End" 36 inch silk for a close. All work with the same magical word from the kids.



I also have numerous Fantasio canes and candles. His book, effects and routines are great, that is if you do Fantasio stuff.



:magicrabbit:



_________________

Dennis Dowhy (800) 927-6671

[url=http://www.magic-magic.com]www.Magic-Magic.com[/url]

[email]DennisDowhy@magic-magic.com[/email]
Message: Posted by: Peter Marucci (Dec 29, 2001 06:37AM)
Jon, you point out that Bill Tarr uses colored poker chips instead of coins.

Exactly my point!

What he doesn't use is blank metal discs or something like that; something that has no relevance to the audience.

Perhaps "logical" is not the word; "relevant" might be better. Or even "sensible".

For example, take that old standby, the Die Box.

Who has ever seen a die that size being used, other than by Bob Barker on The Price Is Right and by magicians?

Therefore, since you obviously aren't running a television game show, the die is a magic prop and has little relevance to the audience.

The Linking Rings may be considered beautiful but what are they -- other than magic props?

Of course Shimada can get away with producing parasols and silks; he's doing an Oriental act. After all, he's Japanese and, in that context, what he does is logcial, relevant, and sensible.

A clown may use a vanishing/appearing cane (in colors, perhaps) and get away with it.

A magician in white tie and tails may use a vanishing/appearing cane (in black with white tips) and get away with it.

But a magicians in jeans and a psychedelic T-shirt most certainly shouldn't use a standard walking stick; it is not relevant or sensible.

The props that you use must fit the persona you are creating (which, after all, is really another magic prop).

Otherwise, you lower magic to a demonstration of how well you handle magic props -- a sort of "look what I can do and you can't" type of thing -- and that's just plain bad!

cheers,

Peter Marucci

showtimecol@aol.com
Message: Posted by: Thomas Wayne (Dec 29, 2001 06:49AM)
[quote]

On 2001-11-06 05:35, chadmagic wrote:

Nothing magicians do is logical. If it was, we wouldn’t fool anybody. Its ok to be illogical. but not ok to be unnatural. There is a difference.



Chad

[/quote]



You might be over simplifying things here; there are, in fact, many things that magicians do that are COMPLETELY logical. For just one example, an entire set can be devoted to demonstrating various gambling techniques and scams; many magicians do exactly this type of set and there may very well be NOTHING illogical in the entire act.



More on point, however, I would suggest that Peter probably meant to convey it's usually conisdered a good idea to have logical MOTIVATION in your act. Since walking sticks similar to the standard appearing cane went out of style long before any of us were born, he's probably right to question such a choice.



Personally, I think things like the appearing cane are what laymen who don't like magic think of when magic is mentioned.



Regards,

Thomas Wayne
Message: Posted by: Jeb Sherrill (Jan 2, 2002 08:34PM)
Thomas Wayne wrote:

You might be over simplifying things here; there are, in fact, many things that magicians do that are COMPLETELY logical. For just one example, an entire set can be devoted to demonstrating various gambling techniques and scams; many magicians do exactly this type of set and there may very well be NOTHING illogical in the entire act.

____________________________________________



I'd be very careful with the terms "completely" and "nothing". There is nothing the least bit logical about anything we do from a certain angle. Shamada may be up on stage in his full Japanese regalia producing Japanese items, but why. That is a type of logic yes, but where we draw the line is very grey and I suggest great hesitation in drawing those types of lines anywhere when describing what others should and shouldn’t do. Scams, gambling techniques and Japanese motifs may serve as themes, but LOGICAL? We as magicians have defined and redefined what "magic-logic" is over the years and will continue to do so.



For the record I agree with themes and to a great degree I agree with themes and magic making sense in the way you meant, but like so many things it will depend on style.



I can't get too far into this because the subject is just too vast, but for me to make a cane appear in my hand while I'm wearing blue jeans may not make sense, but it does look cool no matter what and the question arises, "why am I doing this". After all, that guy up on stage in the tuxedo with tails making the same cane appear might make you ask, "what's he doing up there in a tuxedo, that's doesn't make any sense? Shoot, where did he get tails?" For the record I'm not saying the blue jeans weren't out of place with an appearing cane, or that I think the other guy shouldn't wear a tuxedo, but we do have to be careful making statements like, "this makes sense and that doesn't". At the very least we had better define our terms.



Besides, this thread was supposed to be about what the best appearing canes were, not should we even use them. I love my canes because I love the effect and that’s about the bottom line in my act (though no, I don’t wear blue jeans).



Sable



:dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance:
Message: Posted by: Thomas Wayne (Jan 2, 2002 11:16PM)
[quote]

On 2002-01-02 21:34, semianimus wrote:

I'd be very careful with the terms "completely" and "nothing". There is nothing the least bit logical about [...]

[/quote]



Though it may have been unintentional, thanks for the laugh, Sable. Truly, the admonishment followed IMMEDIATELY by the perfect example made me laugh out loud.



Regards,

Thomas Wayne
Message: Posted by: Jeb Sherrill (Jan 3, 2002 12:39AM)
I'm glad you caught it. I almost put NOTHING in caps, but decided against it, afraid it might be read as mocking. My favourite jokes are usually too subtle for most to catch. You are indeed a scholar and a gentlemen. I guess that goes without saying though; from your posts I think you read more than I do. ;)



Sable

:dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance:
Message: Posted by: funmagic (Feb 21, 2002 09:03AM)
I cut my hand quite badly with my first steel vanishing cane many years ago and have since used the fantasio plastic canes which I find perfect both in quality and price.
I open my kid shows by selecting a magic wand from a dozen or so on my table which also includes my cane. Every wand is different..some explode, some collapse, some fly out of my hand and some even make noises. The last one I try is a Silver Scepter (perfect for kid shows)...when I've finished with the Silver Scepter I say "Oh I have no more wands left" however, the kids are quick to point out my cane laying on the table, I then pick it us and go to the front of my table saying "Don't be silly, this is not a wand it's my magic handkerchief" which gets the kids screaming. I then vanish the cane revealing a large silk.
As a matter of interest, the silk I use is a black and white paterned which helps hide the rolled up cane. I have also sewn the cane end about a third of the way up from the corner of the silk which again helps hide the rolled up cane.
The selecting of the wand makes for a great warm up and the flash silk production from the cane makes for an excellent opening.
Message: Posted by: Geoff Williams (Mar 6, 2002 09:54AM)
This discussion brings to mind a marvelous essay by Eugene Burger on "self-deception and the Walsh cane."

It's in one of his more recent books (possibly "The Experience of Magic." I'll look up the reference and correct this post if necessary).

Posted: Mar 7, 2002 9:28pm
I found it:

From "The Experience of Magic" - pg. 68 - "Collapsible Canes and Self-Deception."

A very interesting essay. It might be painful to read it.
Message: Posted by: Merlyn of 8 (Mar 15, 2002 06:04AM)
I have used both Fantasio and Walsh canes, I like the Walsh apearing cane because it is very stable when produced and may be held out horizontaly with no woble or curveture as the Fantasio is prone to do, how ever in a sequence of many canes apearing quickly (from a silk) the Fantasio cane works quite well, I use ten of them in this effect and hand each of them to a helper as I produce more they are handled and held verticaly so there is no curve to see and the woble is kept to a minimum, I like the Fantasio vanishing cane better than the steel cane.....I have yet to get cut by the plastic cane!!!!!!!.
And that is my two cents worth on this subject, enjoy!!!!!!
:bunny2: :magicrabbit: :bubbly:
Message: Posted by: Rcitgo (Jun 4, 2002 07:22PM)
I saw my first apearing "Walsh" cane in 1964 when I was nine year's old.A magician named Phillip Morris saw me doing pocket tricks to the kids waiting in line before we were let in the theatre.He invited me backstage to help out with the show.He did the apearing cane and his assistant handed me the cane and I put it on a backstage table.He also did the Super X suspention which I helped carry to his Uhaul trailer.I was walking on air for the next six months so I use Walsh canes instead of Fantasio. :magicrabbit:
Message: Posted by: Alan Munro (Jun 13, 2002 06:58AM)
Don't forget that if you use a hank with your cane, use one that is diamond cut. It helps the cane to work faster.
Message: Posted by: RiffClown (Jun 22, 2002 12:46PM)
I spent the money and purchased the Harakhan. I really like it. Like funmagic implied, if you work with a metal cane, cuts are a very real danger. (I have one now, luckily nowhere too serious.)
Message: Posted by: Peter Marucci (Jun 22, 2002 06:45PM)
I can recall about 50 years ago, on the old Ed Sullivan TV variety show, almost every magician who ever appeared did the vanishing or appearing cane.
And just about everyone in the live and TV audience knew how it worked.
In short, it may have been "pretty" to the magician but to the people he was performing for it was just "lame".
But don't let that stop you; do the vanishing or appearing cane if you want.
Just don't say I didn't tell you! :rolleyes:
cheers,
Peter Marucci
showtimecol@aol.com
Message: Posted by: RiffClown (Jun 23, 2002 12:32PM)
"Magic is not the method but the presentation." I'll consider myself warned. I'm not saying my apprearing cane act is the greatest, but I'm pleased with the quality of the cane I purchased. I agree that a lot of effects had become stagnant (Svengali Decks, linking rings, and to some extent cups and balls for instance). In the right context, an appearing cane (or my ostrich feather to cane) works pretty well. Just don't overuse the effect. Once is quite enough. I by no means would base an entire act on it but it does make a pretty good explanation point. For the predominantly younger audiences I have on a regular basis, I'm pretty sure that they missed Ed Sullivan so it's a pretty fresh effect for them. The adults in the audience seem pretty amazed as well. 95% of my audience is under 45. (mostly military and dependants)
:hmm:

Respectfully, (and you know I very much respect yopur opinion)
Rob
Message: Posted by: Peter Marucci (Jun 23, 2002 03:41PM)
Riff makes a very important point:
Something that may seem "stale" to the magician, may be brand new to the audience.
And, therefore, is an amazing trick!
Remember: Just because you may be bored with it, doesn't mean everyone else is; in fact, some may never have seen it.
cheers,
Peter Marucci
showtimecol@aol.com
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 29, 2002 07:29AM)
Since I had nothing to do this morning, I sat and read each of the post in this topic. I certainly hope MagicGSX has purchased his cane by now. I think the bottom line answer to his original question of which is the best cane to buy is really "it's a matter of taste and what you're going to do with it."

I personally think the Fantasio appearing cane is too flimsy to work with, but that's because it doesn't fit my act. I'm not finding fault with Fantasio products. I use the rest of them with great success. I do a very formal stage act with doves and my wife and I dress accordingly, tails and evening dress. The appearing and vanishing cane fit well with the act because they seem to be a natural accessory.

Ever see James Dimmare's act? If he came out without a cane, it would seem very unnatural. Whether or not anyone still uses a walking stick doesn't matter. It is the character portrayal that makes the difference.

I, too, own Harakan canes and feel they are the best on the market (my opinion) however since they are bronze in color, they don't fit with a black tuxedo, so I use the Walsh canes. ( I am fortunate to have several of each from way back). I do use the Harakan in my kids show as a vanishing cane in newspaper. It works well. Especially since to close the act, the kids make the cane reappear. Enough of my opinion and two cents.

Dave :wavey:
Message: Posted by: harris (Jul 26, 2002 05:14PM)
Years ago I lost my Walsh Cane.

I found another last December in a "magic
shop/basement" in Denver Colorado.

I wish I would have bought the other.

The gentleman was a former President of
the SAM. He was a delight to visit and
had a wealth of stories about the "old days"
and of many magicians from the past.

His name was I believe Schuman. (My nearly normal memory may not have the correct name)Unfortuneatly he passed away this year. My prayers are with him and his family.

I use my cane in a my Library Programs, musical opener to the tune
of Bugs Bunny Overture. It fits the campy
and nostalgic theme.

This is it, no more rehearsing. This is not
a dress rehearsal. This is YOUR MAGICAL LIFE.
Welcome to it.

I also have a new old Blue Fantasio Cane.
It is the first I have owned. The price was
too reasonable to pass up.
I may try the "old" blue 260 balloon to cane.
Whats old is new.

I wrote Fantasio and asked him about the other colors, and he said they were discontinued because of low sales.

I am looking for another blue one, if the
price is right.(enter Bob Barker)

Harris
Message: Posted by: ***Kev*** (Aug 8, 2002 04:15PM)
Fantasio works fine for me,
:)
I agree, Walsh ones are sturdier, but price is my main reason I work with Fantasio over metal ranges.
:baby: :bigsmile: :angel:
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Aug 12, 2002 10:50AM)
I think what Peter may have been getting at was what the reason for purchase actually was. The cane itself is not very impressive as far as the actual appearance, but the use is very obvious....Misdirection! The apearance and display is for the purpose of misdirection. Logically it should show up at the time the medium to large stage peices show up and should be used for directing spectator attention to specific points on the piece being worked and also to give a sense of separation from the piece. If you only touch an Item with the tip, in the mind of the spectator you have not really handled it. It is also very useful in waving around inside and outside of props to show there are no hidden strings, pieces of glass, etc.
(wherever you point with it the spectator will look)

Am I close here, Peter?