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Topic: Johnson Cups on Auction
Message: Posted by: lint (Feb 16, 2011 12:19PM)
On the big auction site there is a listing for Johnson cups for $350. They are listing 5 sets available. The listing shows images of MM cups.

I know the old hands here will have no problem seeing this issue. Just wanted to give a heads up though to anyone who might be tempted to buy a set. CONFIRM they are Johnson Cups.


P.S. On a side note I have a much cheaper set of real johnsons for sale or trade. PM me if you want 'em.
Message: Posted by: cupsandballsmagic (Feb 16, 2011 01:03PM)
Ouch! Thanks for the head's up Todd.

The seller has a chop cup for sale which appears to be the correct picture so I tried to ask a question (thinking that they may have just added the incorrect photo) only to receive an automated response;

"We're sorry we couldn't find an answer for you. Unfortunately, this seller is not able to respond to your question. We suggest reviewing the item again to see if your answer is in the seller's listing."

It seems that they don't want to answer any questions.
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Feb 16, 2011 02:31PM)
Go to the Johnson Products web site and see the photo there.
Message: Posted by: Olivier BIENVENU (Feb 16, 2011 03:58PM)
If you look at the rim, you'll see they are not CNC cups and there are only 2 beads.
Message: Posted by: cupsandballsmagic (Feb 16, 2011 04:23PM)
I think I should have worded my post a little better. I know what Johnson cups look like, Ihave a set. I wanted to send the seller a question to ask if they had put the incorrect photo up by mistake, but it seems like they are not accepting questions. :)

Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Feb 16, 2011 05:39PM)
I sent him a question and got an answer back. You need to see the photos on the Johnson site. That's where his photo came from. I missed their open hours by 1 minute. I was going to check on that photo.

The perpetrator, I mean the seller, said that there were three beads in the photo. You just have to look harder.


He also asked if I was thinking about buying them, so I told him, "Well, not at full retail."
Message: Posted by: cupsandballsmagic (Feb 16, 2011 05:51PM)
Erm, wow, I see what you mean now Bill... Now I am even more confused! I wonder why I couldn't send a question? Perhaps as I am in the UK?
Shame, I missed out on those ;)
Message: Posted by: geemack (Feb 16, 2011 06:15PM)
It could just be sloppy theft of images for the ads and they really are Johnson's Cups. Or it could be sloppy theft of images for the Chop Cup and they could all be MM cups. Or it could be flat out intentional dishonesty.

Someone getting stiffed for a couple hundred dollars is only the start of the problems from this sort of thing. The victim may eventually want to sell them, and if he/she doesn't know any better, they'll go up for sale under the wrong name, and the next guy will get unintentionally ripped off. And when he sells them...

That's why I get peeved when people are lax in describing the items they sell. Like when everyone is guessing what type of GA cups a guy has by asking what fits in them. In the real world people use measure tapes, rulers, micrometers, and other measuring devices. Cups have a size measured in inches and fractions (or centimeters), not in lemons. Load sizes are fine if we're talking aesthetics, but if I'm buying some cups for $50, or maybe $500, I really want to know what kind they are.

Linking Rings which are a quarter inch thick are only [i]about[/i] 5/16 inch thick, but they aren't 5/16 inch thick. Sure they're all round and about the size of a paper plate, but Uday's are $30 and Merv Taylor's are $300 or $400 or... And if I had a dollar for every time someone on eBay tries to sell plated Linking Rings as stainless steel, I could buy another set of Owen's.

I'd venture a guess that there is at least as much raw stupidity among eBay sellers as there is dishonesty. But either way the results are the same to the guy who gets stuck buying something that isn't what was advertised.
Message: Posted by: lint (Feb 16, 2011 06:40PM)
Wow good find bill. odd Johnsons would have the image on their site?
Message: Posted by: geemack (Feb 16, 2011 06:54PM)
[quote][i]On 2011-02-16 15:31, Bill Palmer wrote...[/i]

Go to the Johnson Products web site and see the photo there.[/quote]
Now that is strange.
Message: Posted by: Richard Evans (Feb 16, 2011 07:02PM)
Nice find, Bill!

Who owns the copyright to that image of the brass MM cups? If MM have an issue with Johnson for using/copying their image, that would be even more bizarre!
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Feb 16, 2011 07:24PM)
I'll call them tomorrow. They know me.

I believe the seller is making an honest mistake.

Posted: Feb 17, 2011 2:56pm
I have spoken to the head man at Johnson Products. In order to understand what I'm about to post, you need to understand that the magic line at Johnson Products is a minor part of their work. They have a HUGE CNC facility where they make all sorts of things.

So, I spoke to the man in charge. At first, he said these were his cups. Then he took a really close look at them and realized that the people who had set up his web site had put the wrong picture on the site.

Those pictures that are on ebay were downloaded from Johnson's site. The picture on the Johnson site is wrong.

This is being corrected.
Message: Posted by: fortasse (Feb 17, 2011 05:56PM)
Strange.....how could Johnson's make a mistake like that? Sounds like the photographer they hired went to the wrong factory.

Message: Posted by: lint (Feb 17, 2011 07:47PM)
Especially since that picture of the MM cups has been around for ages. hard to figure how that mistake was made.
Message: Posted by: plungerman (Feb 17, 2011 10:37PM)
Leave it to Bill P. to correct the creator. There's room for no more feathers in your cap.
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Feb 17, 2011 11:45PM)
I quit wearing feathers a long time ago -- now it's just porcupine quills.

I realize I'm leaving myself open for a clever retort. ;)

Take your best shot!
Message: Posted by: gmeister (Feb 18, 2011 08:42AM)
I must resist . . . I must resist . . . I must resist . . . I must re . . .
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Feb 18, 2011 10:07AM)
On 2011-02-17 20:47, lint wrote:
Especially since that picture of the MM cups has been around for ages. hard to figure how that mistake was made.

The guy who set up the web site harvested the photos from places that sold Johnson cups. He didn't know which one these were. It is easy for someone who doesn't do the cups and balls to make the mistake.
Message: Posted by: fortasse (Feb 20, 2011 03:22PM)
Bill :

Does Johnson publish production numbers for their cups? Trying to get an idea of how many cups they generally put out annually. Also, do you know whether they plan to do another run of their copper cups?

Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Feb 20, 2011 07:32PM)
As far as I know, they don't even have a record of the number of cups they have made. Their main products are not magic related at all.

When I spoke to Sam a few days ago, I mentioned that I have a set of them, and he indicated he would be unlikely to make any more. Copper is a very difficult metal to machine with CNC.
Message: Posted by: fortasse (Feb 20, 2011 10:31PM)
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Feb 23, 2011 07:20PM)
I spoke to Sam this afternoon. He says that his site was actually hacked.
Message: Posted by: fortasse (Feb 23, 2011 10:27PM)
Nothing is sacred anymore.