(Close Window)
Topic: Types of doves
Message: Posted by: Anne (Jun 2, 2012 09:16AM)
Hi all,

Another question, questions seem to keep popping up!
What kind of doves do you use for magic? To me they look most like Earasian collared doves.. But.. white..
Anyways, we got tons of them in the backyard (not white), and they seem small enough..

But I'm not sure, what kind of doves are those 'magic' doves?


Thanks!
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 2, 2012 09:46AM)
Java Doves are white and most common with magicians. Ringnecks are slightly beige in color with a darker band on the neck. They work well also. These look identical to what you are calling Eurasian Collared Doves. There are also other breeds which have been used. There are also Fantails, which I have also used, as well as some larger pigeons.

At one time, I had a pair of smaller doves that were speckled. I forget the name of them (maybe Diamond Doves?). I did not try to use them because they were very high-strung. Locally, there are many wild Mourning Doves. They are identical in size to "magician's doves, but the coloring is different. But, I don't know of anyone who had attempted to domesticate them. Not saying it isn't possible, but there may be laws regarding wildlife vs domesticated birds.
Message: Posted by: Regan (Jun 2, 2012 11:53AM)
There is also the "Silky" dove. I have not seen a live Silky but some magicians love them.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 2, 2012 02:23PM)
Michael, the speckled doves are called "Pied" usually a mix of a white and a brown ring neck. True ringnecks are brown but because of genetic breeding, many are white. If you pair a brown ringneck with a white one, you have 3 possibilities wit offspring. They'll either be white, brown or pied.
Message: Posted by: tropicalillusions (Jun 2, 2012 02:28PM)
I do love our silkies for ourdoor shows, heck even indoor, these guys will not fly off, although, we still love our Javas for our flyback material.
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 2, 2012 03:21PM)
Dave,

Thanks for info, but these doves were literally about half the size of whites or ringnecks.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 3, 2012 06:18AM)
Michael, that would probably make them diamond doves. Diamonds are very jittery and more difficult to train but there are a lot of possibilities with the smaller dove.
Message: Posted by: Anne (Jun 3, 2012 06:55AM)
Thanks for all of the information.
I know diamond-doves, I don't know a lot about them but I knew some people who had those little guys. In my opinion they're somewhat skittish?
So, if I'm right, java doves aren't a real breed but are a mutated color of the ringneck doves?

Thanks again.
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 3, 2012 08:54AM)
[quote]
On 2012-06-03 07:55, Anne wrote:
Thanks for all of the information.
I know diamond-doves, I don't know a lot about them but I knew some people who had those little guys. In my opinion they're somewhat skittish?
[/quote]
Mine were very skittish.
[quote]
So, if I'm right, java doves aren't a real breed but are a mutated color of the ringneck doves?

Thanks again.
[/quote]
Apparently, that is true.
Message: Posted by: tropicalillusions (Jun 3, 2012 11:06AM)
Remind me to spell check before I do a final post....LOL, Typing to fast with one FAT finger.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 3, 2012 04:19PM)
Java doves are a breed of dove. They are not mutated ringnecks.
Ringnecks are brown with a black ring around the neck however over time, many have been cross bred with Java or Indian doves
That cross breeding causes some ring necks to be white. The black ring very often is hidden beneath the neck feathers.
Cross breeding a white ring neck with a brown ring neck very often produces a speculed bird called a pied.

Diamond doves are small and come in varied colors.
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 3, 2012 04:33PM)
[quote]
On 2012-06-03 17:19, Dave Scribner wrote:
Java doves are a breed of dove. They are not mutated ringnecks.
[/quote]
I thought so too, but then found this...

http://animal-world.com/encyclo/birds/doves_pigeons/whitedove.php

and this...

http://www.dovepage.com/species/domestic/Ringneck/whiteringneck.html

and this...

http://www.birdtrader.co.uk/breed/doves_java_dove/64

The list goes on.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 3, 2012 07:50PM)
Thanks Michael, I learn something everyday. I was always taught that the Java was a separate breed however I see the second link you gave had references from Wade Oliver. I consider him an expert in the field of doves and would never contradict anything he says.
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 3, 2012 08:51PM)
It was news to me too. Any day I learn something new is a good day! :)
Message: Posted by: Anne (Jun 4, 2012 04:06AM)
Good to make so much more clear for more people then only me ;)

Do any of you have experience with other birds then doves in shows?
Message: Posted by: ThatsJustWrong! (Jun 4, 2012 07:52AM)
[quote]
On 2012-06-02 15:23, Dave Scribner wrote:
If you pair a brown ringneck with a white one, you have 3 possibilities wit offspring. They'll either be white, brown or pied.
[/quote]
Wow, I totally read that as "plaid." I think I need more coffee. Or less.

I used to work with doves quite a bit (all white Java). I have also worked with African Grey parrots and several breeds of conures. I once had a sun conure chew his way out of a box behind me. I could not for the life of me tell why the audience was laughing so hard. Curiously enough, the only hookbill I had a big problem training was the bare eyed cockatoo who are supposed to be great at doing tricks and stunts. Oh well, no more bird shows for me (though we still have several). It's not good for my mentalism when I'm pretty sure my African Grey is smarter than I am.
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 4, 2012 08:28AM)
[quote]
On 2012-06-04 08:52, that'sJustWrong! wrote:

It's not good for my mentalism when I'm pretty sure my African Grey is smarter than I am.
[/quote]
Haven't you heard? The only way to outsmart a parrot is to work on a cruise ship that sinks.

I had a brain lapse once when I thought I could train a Nanday Conure. That was one screamin' ass fool there. The Nanday was pretty loud, too.

I used to use a big white duck. She was pretty darned clever, too!
Message: Posted by: ThatsJustWrong! (Jun 4, 2012 12:17PM)
We've owned Sun, Jenday, Goldcap, Nanday, Peachfront and Patagonian conures. As a rule, most are loud but quiet down in the dark even when they hear sounds around them, so a black drape under the table always worked pretty well for me. Without question, the Nandays were the loudest of the conure club; they were also psychotic. We were given a male with a feather picking problem so we got him a mate to distract him... and they plucked each other totally bald except for the very tops of their heads. On the other hand, it was kinda cool to 'explode' the Goldcap in the dove pan to reveal a bald conure and some singed feathers rising out of it. And bald conures don't fly up to the lighting cables and poop on ya.
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 4, 2012 12:58PM)
Ha-ha!! Who needs a plucked rubber chicken!
Message: Posted by: Anne (Jun 8, 2012 02:18PM)
Awesome, so many birds can be used for magic ;)
Message: Posted by: Michael Baker (Jun 8, 2012 02:26PM)
Sure! Magicians have used a variety of birds: doves, parakeets, canaries, cockatiels, cockatoos, parrots and Macaws, ducks, chickens, and I'd suspect others.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 8, 2012 04:49PM)
I've seen one magician use an ostrich.
Message: Posted by: Bob Sanders (Jun 9, 2012 05:57PM)
My wife owns the only custom prop for Goose to Goat!

Bob