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Topic: Sealed deck routine release date?
Message: Posted by: korttihai_82 (Aug 19, 2012 12:02PM)
Hia

One don't have to be mentalist in order to predict that this will be asked sooner than later ;)

In spring 2012 you wrote in your twitter that your sealed deck routine (2 DVD set mentioned in some other interview) is complete and it should be out by Blackpool FISM. Later you wrote that you missed dealers booth so you had to change the release.

So the question everybody wants to know is when will it be released? :) It was promised to come out already after FISM 2006 at Stockholm and since the method has been used by few tv magicians and other people are trying to profit with the idea by bringing out their own variations on George Schindler - Sealed Surprise plot but they arent nearly as good and polished.

Juha-Matti
Message: Posted by: Scott Kahn (Aug 19, 2012 07:39PM)
I think we all want to know when "Signed, Sealed and Delivered" will be released.
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 19, 2012 08:43PM)
Hi Guys,

I was expecting this question and I wish I had an answer you will like.
The fact is I had actually planned to release it way back in 2003!
It is ready to release and I have had a lot of interest from several of the big companies to represent it too.
It won't be called "Signed, Sealed and Delivered" as originally introduced... long story.
I have a new name and a plan on how to release the effect.
It will be very limited as I want to protect the secret for those that invest in the routine.
Details to be announced soon (see I said you wouldn't like the answer...)

-shawn
Message: Posted by: Christopher Lyle (Aug 19, 2012 10:01PM)
Shawn,

I was the lucky one who you called upon to help during this routine at the World Magic Seminar back a couple of years ago (and got my photo in MAGIC with you doing the routine to boot!). I hadn't seen this routine live and I can say it was a thing of beauty. Fried me...and the funny thing is, I was at your lecture earlier in the day when you talk about how you use getting your sharpie for the "secret action" to take place and it still flew over my head.

I for one hope that you never release it as it's your baby and I think that some things should just stay that way. However...when you do, I'll be line more than likely!

Thanks for being such a great inspiration to the Magic World...

Christopher
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 19, 2012 11:02PM)
Christopher,

Yeah the move can go right by you as it seems so natural... well unless you're as tall and Penn Jillette!
I have never performed for a real giant before and it turns out they see things from a totally different perspective.
I'm very proud to read you think I inspire ... thanks.

-shawn
Message: Posted by: Ray Bertrand (Aug 19, 2012 11:28PM)
A big welcome to you as a 'Special Guest' on the Café. Looking forwrd to your release of that effect Shawn. It literally fries people.

Ray
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Aug 20, 2012 12:40AM)
Howdy... sure had a great time chatting you up at Kramiens.
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 20, 2012 12:47AM)
Pete, it was my pleasure to share a few stories at Kramien's.
Stan just announced it wasn't the last and he plans to do it again... hope we get a change to hang out some more.

-shawn

p.s. Ray it's always great to hear from you. Looking forward to when you move back to the mainland.
Message: Posted by: korttihai_82 (Aug 20, 2012 07:44AM)
[quote]
On 2012-08-19 21:43, Shawn Farquhar wrote:
Hi Guys,

I was expecting this question and I wish I had an answer you will like.
It will be very limited as I want to protect the secret for those that invest in the routine.

-shawn
[/quote]

Actually this part I really like :) I am working pro so I have no problem on investing something I will be able to use and better yet if everybody else isn't doing it as well.

J-M
Message: Posted by: Steven Conner (Aug 20, 2012 08:22AM)
Hi Shawn, how can we get on your list to get in line.
Message: Posted by: Christopher Lyle (Aug 20, 2012 10:03AM)
Yes, please advise...
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 20, 2012 11:05AM)
I have a newsletter I email periodically and always announce things first to the subscribers. Many times I offer discounts when I launch a new effect for a limited time to those that are on the list. You can find the link to subscribe at http://www.magichampion.com

-shawn
Message: Posted by: Christopher Lyle (Aug 20, 2012 12:28PM)
Awesome. I just subscribed.
Message: Posted by: Ray Bertrand (Aug 20, 2012 03:09PM)
Hey Shawn,

I just subscribed as well.

Ray
Message: Posted by: Stucky (Aug 20, 2012 06:37PM)
Did you teach the effect (or a version thereof) on your penguin live lecture?
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Aug 20, 2012 07:00PM)
Just Subscribed.
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 20, 2012 07:23PM)
Hey Stucky,

Yes I taught a similar effect on the Penguin Online lecture.
The effect I taught is called RSVP as in ReSealed Verified Pack.
Basically the premise of RSVP is that when you buy a deck of cards they are in new deck order but that is not how they leave the factory. I explain that cards are just thrown into a box and sort themselves out while in transit to the store. I open a new deck, remove jokers and premium cards and shuffle the remaining cards. Using just six cards (three red and three black) I demonstrate how they won't remain mixed (oil/water) routine. I then go further saying they can be face up and down too and demonstrate a triumph routine. Finally I have the spectator shuffle the cards, face up into face down multiple times and have one card removed and set aside without anyone viewing the suit or value. This shuffled deck is place into the case and the case is signed by the spectator and held in their hands. When they open their hands the pack is found to have ReSealed itself. The outside of the Pack is Verified to to be Sealed. (ReSealed Verified Pack = RSVP). The spectator breaks the seal, opens the deck and confirms the deck is in new deck order without the jokers or premium cards and of course the one previously removed card is absent too...

It's a powerful effect with many phases and lots of moments of strong magic. It is within the technical reach of almost anyone who can handle and shuffle a deck of cards. It can be done standing without tables and will play well for a single person or a huge crowd.

I am sure I could have easily made a video and sold this as a stand alone effect to the magic community but I wanted to give folks who had seen my lecture live a reason to get this video version too.

-shawn
Message: Posted by: Matt Bartz (Aug 21, 2012 03:42PM)
To anyone interested: that Penguin Video Lecture was my first exposure to Shawn's lecture. I'd seen clips of him performing, I'd seen all the awards and accolades, and had always hoped to attend a lecture of his. I came away thoroughly impressed. RSVP was phenomonal, and Shawn was a class act. A great combination of entertaining, enlightening and someone that just seems like an all around nice guy.
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 21, 2012 07:30PM)
Thanks Matt. I'm thrilled to read you liked the lecture online. It was my first time using that type of medium to teach and Shaun Dunn and his crew at Paper Crane Productions did an awesome job of making me feel comfortable. I really struggled with releasing R.V.S.P. in this fashion but now that I've done it I could not be more happy.

-shawn
Message: Posted by: Stucky (Aug 21, 2012 10:14PM)
I think those types of lectures should be special and stand apart from regular ones. I hope more performers tkae these cues.
Message: Posted by: Aractus (Aug 22, 2012 09:24AM)
[quote]
On 2012-08-19 21:43, Shawn Farquhar wrote:
Hi Guys,

I was expecting this question and I wish I had an answer you will like.
The fact is I had actually planned to release it way back in 2003!
It is ready to release and I have had a lot of interest from several of the big companies to represent it too.
It won't be called "Signed, Sealed and Delivered" as originally introduced... long story.
I have a new name and a plan on how to release the effect.
It will be very limited as I want to protect the secret for those that invest in the routine.
Details to be announced soon (see I said you wouldn't like the answer...)

-shawn
[/quote]
Sadly Shawn, mere mortals like myself who like to occupy their puny minds with problem solving puzzles have the unfortunate ability to figure out the techniques to these tricks. Or at least we think we can! I personally loved seeing the trick performed on Penn & Teller's Fool Us. I don't think you can "protect the secret" by doing a limited release because millions of people have seen it performed. You may not like that reality, but that's the reality of TV unfortunately. Just like how the levitation scene in The Exorcist was achieved with wires painted to blend into the background - the director, Friedkin, never chooses to reveal how he achieves his "secret" movie effects (his effect was good, I didn't see the wires the first time). "Signed, Sealed and Delivered" is a great trick so good luck with its continued commercial success.
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 22, 2012 12:19PM)
Mere mortals huh? Yeah me too, Aractus. I have no doubt that many like mind individuals with a bit of magic knowledge may be able to reverse engineer the effect. I don't think this endangers the secret. I think most of those people, after taking the time to discover the solution may in fact guard the secret as well. Yes, it may be a bit naive. I know of one case where a young Canadian medical student reverse engineered the effect from a Cyril video and although it is not totally correct it is very close in the solution. They funny thing was that he somehow felt entitled to sell the solution since he "figured it out". He blatantly said he had no regard for the magic community and just wanted to make a fast buck for his medical training. Yes there will always be people like this, but maybe with luck they are far and few between. I look to the guidance of great magicians like Armando Lucero who has successful taught and yet retained his closely guarded secrets. His idea of workshops and non-disclosure documents appears to be working.

As for the example of the Exorcist film ... I didn't know they used wires until this very moment. I guess that secret was still a secret to me...

-shawn

p.s. Thanks for posting for the first time during my time as a special guest Daniel.
Message: Posted by: korttihai_82 (Aug 22, 2012 08:56PM)
Armando Lucero is a great example indeed as are in a way Bob Kohler Magic products but both have had their leaks. There is people around who have reverse engineered Armando's main moves (I have partisipated in the card workshop so I know when they have hit it completely right). Even at the moment there is two videos in Youtube other people doing Armando's matrix. Neither of the two has attented his workshop. Also there is people who have pirated version of Kohler holdout and Final Answer and others. So it is happening for them as well but to much lesser extend than to lets say some ellusionist or theory 11 routine but it is happening. Why? What are they doing differently?

The biggest difference with their approach to others that are pirated is that they keep the good stuff away from magicians in the first place. Armando for example simply doesn't perform much for magicians. He does only few conventions a year and doesn't usually allow any sort of video taping. Just try youtube, you will find at most 10 videos of the man at all. This is his own choise and topic all its own. Really interesting one I might add. If you attend to some of his workshops or can spend time with him just ask :)

Same is true with many Kohler products. There isn't demos or such availeble that could give anyone enough info to reverse engineer what s going on. In some of the Bob Kohler products you also have to sign a lease that you cant perform that stuff for magicians (This was the case when I bought Scott Alexanders blades from him). It states that I cant use the routine in any magic convention, competition and such. This is no problem for me as I paid 800$ for the exclusivity but its been out for 2-3 years and I have yet to see anyone stealing it so it is also working.

I would assume that both of their products would be copied and ripped off more if people would be able to see em more. Your routine in that sense is in harder position. It is available all over the internet and youtube. So as hard as it might be to admit it, its already out there. There is also few products on the marked that are selling themselves on your routines reputation. Sadly I don't have any real solution on how to get it out in a safe way. If most magicians would be ethical there woudnt be any problems cos they would get it any way in order to get the performance rights when it is released. But in case you choose to go along same lines as for example Kohler has chosen to go with leases and high pricing, there will still be those people who just continue using it with their reverse engineered methods.

What ever your final solution ends up being I hope it will be success.

Juha-Matti
Message: Posted by: Shawn Farquhar (Aug 23, 2012 12:08AM)
Juha-Matti,

You really do understand the situation. I have been struggling with this for quite sometime.
I wasn't aware that Scott Alexander had a contract prohibiting magic event presentations, but that's a great addition to the Fitch/Kolher Holdout papers.
Thanks for your reply and well wishes.

-shawn
Message: Posted by: Aractus (Aug 23, 2012 04:00AM)
[quote]
On 2012-08-22 13:19, Shawn Farquhar wrote:
Mere mortals huh? Yeah me too, Aractus. I have no doubt that many like mind individuals with a bit of magic knowledge may be able to reverse engineer the effect. I don't think this endangers the secret. I think most of those people, after taking the time to discover the solution may in fact guard the secret as well.[/quote]
I agree with that point, at least as long as the person thinks the trick is good illusion, if they think the trick is silly, like say "bending a pen" by jiggling it between two fingers, perhaps not.

As for the Exorcist, the "secret" is plainly visible in any case (maybe not on VHS), they are quite subtle though I imagine most people wouldn't see it in a single viewing, even though it's a long shot with plenty of opportunity to be seen. The fact that the wires were "painted" or coloured probably means someone involved on the set decided to tell the world! I actually think though that knowing too much about the effects in the movie can ruin the experience, but hey so do awfully done effects.
[quote]Yes, it may be a bit naive. I know of one case where a young Canadian medical student reverse engineered the effect from a Cyril video and although it is not totally correct it is very close in the solution. They funny thing was that he somehow felt entitled to sell the solution since he "figured it out". He blatantly said he had no regard for the magic community and just wanted to make a fast buck for his medical training. Yes there will always be people like this, but maybe with luck they are far and few between. I look to the guidance of great magicians like Armando Lucero who has successful taught and yet retained his closely guarded secrets. His idea of workshops and non-disclosure documents appears to be working.[/quote]
I know a few people in the medical world and some are indeed quite odd! Actually a lot of the people I know are odd, I'm probably odd as well.

-Daniel

ps Yes, I don't try to hide my identity, even if my avatar photo is 3 years old (I'll make a new one, I promise).
[quote]
On 2012-08-22 21:56, korttihai_82 wrote:
Your routine in that sense is in harder position. It is available all over the internet and youtube. So as hard as it might be to admit it, its already out there.[/quote]
Nice post, and that ^^ was pretty much my point.
Message: Posted by: Aractus (Aug 23, 2012 08:04AM)
[quote]
On 2012-08-22 13:19, Shawn Farquhar wrote:
They funny thing was that he somehow felt entitled to sell the solution since he "figured it out".[/quote]
I might just add that my views on plagiarism are quite strong - I don't like it. And if he sells your intellectual property (your copyright) that's akin to fraud in my mind. But you know, some people feel entitled to things that aren't theirs, or try to extort their way into things they aren't entitled to. To keep on the medical theme - like patients who lie to their doctors to continue medications they probably shouldn't be taking - squandering resources. Or if you were to go to a website I like, [url=http://www.skeptics.com.au/]Australian Skeptics[/url] (yes they misspell sceptic for some unexplainable reason) you can read the reasons why the Sensaslim "weightloss product" is no more, or why they think the [url=http://ecat.com/]E-Cat[/url] is nothing more than a "magicians illusion". Unfortunately there are people who want to take advantage of others everywhere. Whether it's by selling shonky products, or promising things that are undeliverable, or by illegally copying the work and innovation of others, or customers who try to extort business. Unfortunately people don't like to be wrong, even if you can explain to them why they're wrong. And the internet's the perfect place for people to pretend they're something else. I wonder how this young medical student would do in a face-to-face confrontation? Or even a telephone confrontation? Anyway if there's one thing I've learned about these things it's that direct threats are not usually the best way to diffuse a difficuilt situation, and sometimes patience is a useful starting point.
Message: Posted by: Ba Ba Booey (Aug 23, 2012 10:51AM)
[quote]
On 2012-08-23 09:04, Aractus wrote:
Or if you were to go to a website I like, [url=http://www.skeptics.com.au/]Australian Skeptics[/url] (yes they misspell sceptic for some unexplainable reason)
[/quote]

"Skeptics" and "sceptics" are both spelled (spelt) correctly. It all depends on whether you live in an apartment or a flat, or whether your favorite flavour of ice cream is chocolate or your favorite flavor is vanilla.
Message: Posted by: G. LaBarre (Aug 24, 2012 05:28PM)
In the old days, an effect or it modus operandi could remain a secret for decades. You purchased it, but it wasn't that easy or inexpensive to duplicate or put it into print to share.

I believe it's the speed at which things change nowadays, almost doubling exponentially in shorter time periods, that can be blamed for the rapid demise of magical effects and their secrets. That goes for any product out there really. The speed at which info is callously traded or shared easily on todays electronic mediums and the availability of at home equipment that makes hard copy prints and photos, is both a blessing and a curse. You can now learn more in less time than in any other period in history, but is anything really private or secret anymore and not subject to being abused by a population that has lost their value systems? i.e. Respect

Bring profit into the equation and you've got big time competition.
Message: Posted by: Aractus (Aug 25, 2012 08:24AM)
The Chinese kept the origin of silk a closely guarded secret for 2,000+ years. Even today there are people who think they know what a silkworm is, yet don't know it's a moth!

Also leaks have their benefits, for instance "climategate" or "wikileaks", etc. Scrutiny (ie, scepticism) is also an important part of society, and at the same time one that is presently lacking.
Message: Posted by: rjs (Aug 25, 2012 03:36PM)
Aractus, pull your pants up.
Skeptics is the more accurate spelling.
It's closer to the original word derived from Ancient Greece.
The Aussies got it right!