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Topic: Sound of the Bottom Deal
Message: Posted by: Skewed (Oct 28, 2018 06:25AM)
Hi Everyone, I was just wondering what techniques people employ when doing the bottom deal in order to mitigate the sound?

Cheers
Message: Posted by: Mr. Bones (Oct 28, 2018 06:02PM)
I put in ear plugs.
Message: Posted by: ssibal (Oct 28, 2018 07:22PM)
You cant, so either do them when there is a lot of ambient sounds or donít and risk someone noticing. And believe me that people will notice, especially if you try to make your tops sound like bottoms.
Message: Posted by: Last Laugh (Oct 28, 2018 09:58PM)
Yeah, I really don't think that's true. Here is my bottom deal. I don't think the sound is significantly different at all. I'm still working on rhythm and other things, but the sound doesn't seem like an issue to me. I've only been practicing this seriously for a few months.


[youtube]OWFXymcDMak[/youtube]
Message: Posted by: Cagliostro (Oct 28, 2018 10:53PM)
@Last Laugh: I would say on a practical basis, there is no sound difference. You have a nice smooth bottom deal. However, there is a difference in dealing the bottom from the top card. When you deal from the top, the deck holding hand stays flat. When you pull a bottom, you raise the dealing hand up and then down. It does not stay flat as in the top deal. Minor discrepancy but might want to correct that.
Message: Posted by: Last Laugh (Oct 29, 2018 01:41AM)
Thanks, yes I noticed that too. That was a whole 2 weeks ago though, It's way better now.. lol.

What's interesting is that I didn't see the difference on video when I was dealing around to separate hands. Only when dealing both in a single pile did what you mention stand out so much. It's a good practice (dealing in one pile) to really see the differences.
Message: Posted by: Cagliostro (Oct 29, 2018 09:38AM)
@Last Laugh: Seem like you to put a lot of thought into your quest for mastery of various moves and I really respect that. I was basically the same way - pretty much a perfectionist.

I recall doing a move for Dai Vernon many years ago, it was sort of a challenge put forth by someone at the table and after I did it, Vernon said to me, "you really put a lot of thought into doing that move." He picked up on the effort and though put forth to perfect the move right away.

Nice work. Most never strive to get to the next level, or even know there is a next level.

Keep on truckin'... :)
Message: Posted by: Taylor Haws (Oct 29, 2018 01:06PM)
[quote]On Oct 28, 2018, ssibal wrote:
You cant, so either do them when there is a lot of ambient sounds or donít and risk someone noticing. And believe me that people will notice, especially if you try to make your tops sound like bottoms. [/quote]
wrong. you can mitigate the sound of the bottom deal. it may not be one hundred percent perfect, but a bottom can sound very similar and even almost identical to a top.
Message: Posted by: ssibal (Oct 29, 2018 01:40PM)
In my experience, most people who try to get their tops and bottoms to sound the same, do so by making whichever is quieter sound more noisy. Yes, they accomplished the goal of the two deals sounding the same but that doesnít mean it sounds normal and that people wonít notice that something is off. If you play a private game taking turns dealing and one playerís deals sound noticibly noisier than everyone elseís, it will arouse suspicions.
Message: Posted by: Last Laugh (Oct 29, 2018 03:18PM)
@ Cagliostro

Well shucks. I think I just blushed a little. But you are absolutely correct. While I don't find myself in situations where I'm in physical danger should I flub a move, it's still something I take seriously. I practiced the pass for about 3 years before I deployed it in performance.

@SSibal
I really don't agree. The video above shows me doing tops the way I always do them. I am not adjusting them to match the bottom. If you have a reasonably relaxed grip and you use an unlocking motion (as Jason England says), there is no reason for the bottom to be louder.

It may be that a strike bottom has more potential for noise, as there might be more card against card dragging, but I wouldn't bet that someone like Arnold McD makes much noise with it.
Message: Posted by: Cagliostro (Oct 29, 2018 05:07PM)
[quote]On Oct 29, 2018, Last Laugh wrote:

Well shucks. I think I just blushed a little... [/quote]

Hmm...Might make for an interesting gambling themed novel: [i]The Case of the Blushing Bottom Dealer. [/i]

[quote]...If you have a reasonably relaxed grip and you use an unlocking motion...there is no reason for the bottom to be louder.

It may be that a strike bottom has more potential for noise...[/quote]

Those are good points. I can't detect any meaningful difference in sound between my bottom deal and dealing tops. Relaxed grip and loosening the bottom card does wonders. Also, I used to deal somewhat slowly around the table, (compared to most demonstrators and magicians that are rushing to get the move over with), with no wide swinging of the hands or arms, reaching sometimes back and forth to clear the chip stacks and it almost put people to sleep.

If there is a noticeable difference between the bottom deal and the top deal, I would have to conclude the technique used is incorrect or poor. There might be a minute difference but in normal situations it should not be noticeable.
Message: Posted by: ssibal (Oct 29, 2018 07:41PM)
LastLaugh, I wasnít referring to your specific video, which sounded fine to me.
Message: Posted by: liamwilson1125 (Oct 29, 2018 08:48PM)
[quote]On Oct 28, 2018, Skewed wrote:
Hi Everyone, I was just wondering what techniques people employ when doing the bottom deal in order to mitigate the sound?

Cheers [/quote]

Hi there, don't know if you have seen my thread about same issue or not - http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=666283&forum=188

Top deal and bottom deal always have difference in terms of sound. I have tried as lots of grips as possible and it is still there. However I did experience a smaller sound with a brand new deck (like Jason did mention on my thread). Another point is that when you hit bottom, try to take out the card as flat as possible. This will somehow reduce the friction between the cards and make the sound less noticeable.

Good luck
Message: Posted by: Tahur (Nov 2, 2018 12:35PM)
What I do is just loosen the grip with my left hand. Donít hold too tight of a grip. Clip the card with the right hand fingers when you deal. Hereís a performance https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eKXX0Uei_A4
Message: Posted by: Cagliostro (Nov 2, 2018 12:57PM)
@Tahur: Is there a reason you deal the cards counter-clockwise (right to left) as opposed to clockwise (left to right)?
Message: Posted by: Tahur (Nov 2, 2018 01:37PM)
@cagliostro: I was probably looking at the video recording as I was showing it. I wasnít even aware thanks for bringing that up :) . I can do it clockwise as well.
Message: Posted by: Last Laugh (Nov 2, 2018 03:58PM)
Looks (and sounds) good Tahur.
Message: Posted by: Cagliostro (Nov 2, 2018 04:18PM)
[quote]On Nov 2, 2018, Tahur wrote:

I can do it clockwise as well. [/quote]

Yes, but can you do it standing on one foot and whistling Dixie at the same time.

Now that's really tough to do... ;)