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Topic: Best lines for a comedy hand cuff escape
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 13, 2019 05:49PM)
Hey Café, I'm working on my comedy hand cuff escape. I'm using the Handcuff Escape by Alan Wakeling.I need the best lines and jokes out there please donate your prized possessions for me.
Thank you for your help community.
Message: Posted by: Dick Oslund (Aug 13, 2019 08:32PM)
Why should anyone >>DONATE<< his patter, and presentation, which he has worked to develop, edit, and polish, in many cases, over years of performing?

Alan Wakeling's book, has the basic presentation. You paid for THAT, so you have the right to use it.

In nine years, you have made 93 posts. How many of those posts contributed anything positive to the members?

IMO, you have a lot of chutzpah (GUTS) to ask anyone to just give you what you are asking for!!!
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 13, 2019 08:43PM)
Wow Dick, I asked for help if you don't want to contribute that's ok.
But wow the bitterness.
Message: Posted by: Dick Oslund (Aug 13, 2019 08:59PM)
I'm not bitter, but, your asking for what you are asking for, is very irritating,
Message: Posted by: Cliffg37 (Aug 14, 2019 09:00AM)
[quote]On Aug 13, 2019, HighClass wrote:
Hey Café, I'm working on my comedy hand cuff escape. I'm using the Handcuff Escape by Alan Wakeling.I need the best lines and jokes out there please donate your prized possessions for me.
Thank you for your help community. [/quote]

You may or may not know this, but it is very possible that if someone gave you a line or two, and you used it, it would fall flat for you. Or it might work for you. My lines may or may not fit your character and stage persona. A line that gets huge laughs for me, could totally fail for you. example... A clown in make up, uses lines written by a science magician. It would not work. This is why most purchased tricks come with a very basic patter/presentation and then each one takes it and makes it their own by adding and changing what ever it is that makes them who they are.

A question you might ask, that might get you a better result could be... My stage persona is a _________________ can anyone help me with some ideas for escape patter.
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 14, 2019 04:24PM)
Oooo...let's ratchet this up!

(That's a line)
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 14, 2019 05:01PM)
Cliffg37, You are absolutely correct, lines are just lines. The power is in the performance. I'm just in the research phase of this project. I've poured through all my comedy books.
I've put my writes on the project and now I thought it would be fun to reach out to the magic community so that others working on similar project could benefit as well.

Thank you Harley for contributing.

Here is one I came up with: As your being cuffed "Ah the memories, Tijuana, I'll never forget Margarita"
Wipe a tear from your eye, "Sorry this just reminds me of my father"
To somebody in the front row: "You've been here before" or "I bet this brings back memories for you"
Don't loose the key I really don't want to have to go for the hidden one, that would be embarrassing for both of us.
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Aug 14, 2019 08:09PM)
This brings back memories...oh, you, too?
Message: Posted by: Cliffg37 (Aug 14, 2019 08:38PM)
I don't know you or your character, but the lines you have listed here may well work for you. I doubt they would work for me.
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 15, 2019 07:36AM)
That's ok Cliffg37. Do you have any that would work for you to contribute?
Message: Posted by: jimgerrish (Aug 15, 2019 09:47AM)
My Wiz Kids and I produced a entire book of "Jokes for Jugglers" ( http://wizkidzinc.com/DVDs/DVDs.htm ) and The Non-Profit group gets all the proceeds from the sale of this book, but just out of curiosity I went looking through it to see how many jokes I could find that could be common to both jugglers and Escape Artists (we always had at least one Wiz Kid Escape Artist in our shows). To my surprise, many of the same jokes can be adapted, even if you, as an Escape Artist, can't juggle at all.

Some free examples: “You may notice that while I do this my hands never leave my wrists.”

“And now I will juggle (whatever), with my eyes tied behind my back.”

“For the people in the back who can’t see very well ... I’m juggling 3 balls behind my back while handcuffed!”

Change the word "juggling" to "esacpe":

“My next escape is so difficult that even I can do it.”

“Don’t worry, I’ve done this escape a thousand times ... but it’s only worked twice.”

“I did this escape before President Donald Trump ...(pause)... was elected.”

So even if you don't buy the "Jokes for Jugglers" e-Book (or printed version from Lulu.com) I'm sure you can go through the old Bob Orben joke books or any magic joke books you have and come up with many jokes that can easily be adapted for your use without my help.
Message: Posted by: Cliffg37 (Aug 15, 2019 01:16PM)
Invite a cop onstage to either restrain you , or at least to examine the restraints. Ask him if he can fix a parking ticket. The audience will laugh even before he answers. Works best if the cop is not aware that it is coming. Then you get a natural reaction.
Message: Posted by: dave_matkin (Aug 15, 2019 02:47PM)
[quote]On Aug 15, 2019, jimgerrish wrote:
My Wiz Kids and I produced a entire book of "Jokes for Jugglers" ( http://wizkidzinc.com/DVDs/DVDs.htm ) and The Non-Profit group gets all the proceeds from the sale of this book, but just out of curiosity I went looking through it to see how many jokes I could find that could be common to both jugglers and Escape Artists (we always had at least one Wiz Kid Escape Artist in our shows). To my surprise, many of the same jokes can be adapted, even if you, as an Escape Artist, can't juggle at all.

Some free examples: “You may notice that while I do this my hands never leave my wrists.”

“And now I will juggle (whatever), with my eyes tied behind my back.”

“For the people in the back who can’t see very well ... I’m juggling 3 balls behind my back while handcuffed!”

Change the word "juggling" to "esacpe":

“My next escape is so difficult that even I can do it.”. [/quote]


You charge people for this?

Wow .....

Well you're giving these ones away for free. I mean that's like 10 times more than it's worth.
Message: Posted by: dave_matkin (Aug 15, 2019 04:57PM)
[quote]On Aug 13, 2019, Dick Oslund wrote:
Why should anyone >>DONATE<< his patter, and presentation, which he has worked to develop, edit, and polish, in many cases, over years of performing?

Alan Wakeling's book, has the basic presentation. You paid for THAT, so you have the right to use it.

In nine years, you have made 93 posts. How many of those posts contributed anything positive to the members?

IMO, you have a lot of chutzpah (GUTS) to ask anyone to just give you what you are asking for!!! [/quote]

I agree with you on this Dick. Someone coming on and asking for other people's work is a bit over the top! A person wh as you say 96 posts in 9 years and only 4 in the past month.... One asking for other performers to provide their

[quote]On Aug 13, 2019, HighClass wrote:
best lines and jokes out there please donate your prized possessions for me. [/quote]

Not even some good one liners or sources of such things - not even a polite request but donations of your best prized possessions ...nothing in return just come on and ask for your best stuff. Like you said Dick he seems to have chutzpah!

And ....

The other thing ... Why do people insist on comedy escapes - why are there so few of us just doing "proper" escapes (not that I am that active right now- if you know me you know why). Sure use comedy in your show but don't belittle the escape by bringing it to the level of comedy to make it work for them....

Then he has the further chutzpah to chastise you with this....

[quote]On Aug 13, 2019, HighClass wrote:
Wow Dick, I asked for help if you don't want to contribute that's ok.
But wow the bitterness. [/quote]

How dare you, Dick, not give freely your best material form the decades of working as a full time pro to some random upstart who thinks everyone owes him their best lines without him providing anything..... (If you read Dicks posts and look at his AMAZINGLY kind contributions over his time at the Café).

Dick your reply was INCREDIBLY refined, respectful, polite and very tempered considering!

[quote]On Aug 13, 2019, Dick Oslund wrote:
I'm not bitter, but, your asking for what you are asking for, is very irritating, [/quote]

Dick I am afraid that I have to slightly disagree here....I know your posts and what you share..... You do share ideas, information and more. I am 99% sure that if someone came to you in a measured, polite and respectful manner that you WOULD discuss with them and share some ideas.

Before HighClass (got to love the irony of the profile name here!) gets on my case and tells me that I'm bitter too.... let me reply to your reply.....



[quote]On Aug 14, 2019, HighClass wrote:
Cliffg37, You are absolutely correct, lines are just lines. The power is in the performance. I'm just in the research phase of this project. I've poured through all my comedy books.
I've put my writes on the project and now I thought it would be fun to reach out to the magic community so that others working on similar project could benefit as well.
[/quote]


I am not working on similar project (sic) as I don't see the value in a comedy handcuff escape (in my opinion handcuffs should be a serious proposition that can build a reputation rather than reducing them to a short piece with a few giggles) but I look forward to see what your writes (sic) come up with! Not sure how many other people reading here would also be working on similar project (sic) with comedy handcuff escape and a team of writes (sic). I think it's important to not degrade our spectators though.... So some care maybe needed around one liners about what is essentially also used (by others) as bondage gear. Some jokes I may use in a street gig when using a piece of rope I may not want to use at a middle class WI meeting (Women's institute). Sure pull a di**do out of a body bag but it's probably best not to joke about rope and bondage.



[quote]On Aug 14, 2019, HighClass wrote:

Thank you Harley for contributing.

Here is one I came up with: As your being cuffed "Ah the memories, Tijuana, I'll never forget Margarita"
Wipe a tear from your eye, "Sorry this just reminds me of my father"
To somebody in the front row: "You've been here before" or "I bet this brings back memories for you"
Don't loose the key I really don't want to have to go for the hidden one, that would be embarrassing for both of us. [/quote]

I'm not sure if that is funny. I'm not American so I am not sure if it passes for humour over there. But wow tipping methods! not only on an open forum but in your patter for a show? Brave.....or as Dick said...."chutzpah" indeed!

Back to my proper reply and I'm even willing to share so......... Whilst I wait for the comedy gold from your writes.....

A few things I will share.
1. The first I am sure I am not the first. I got the general idea from Kondini way back I time...and adapted it to a less "adult theme"......so I use this at the start of a body bag or a wheelie bin escape (serious escape - real danger due to the air tight nature of the bag and/or bin :) ). I get s kid up to help out. I tell them they will inspect the bag/bin to make sure there are no hidden tools in there. I stage whisper to them to pass out one tool at a time. And false start my "talk" as the kid pulls out a tool - eg a big hammer....false start...kid pulls out took number 2 a massive saw...etc etc. For a more adult show pull out other "tools".
2. May not be of use to you but here goes.....as I approach the performing area I come on to or sing the great Oasis song "Roll with it!".
3. When using Hanburg 8s I will slip them VERY slowly making sure it looks painful and sore. It looks red and horrid. I lube up with some saliva by licking my left hand and thumb. I will often use the line what is not better when it's hot and wet? It's kept comedy - well by some standards it is - it's rather risky but I use it when the time is right. All the time making sure they can see it's slow going. I keep referring to old methods of escape. Then once I've slipped them slowly I will have them reapplied. Again ... If the situation is right and only if it is right....and I can get away with it I will say.... It's always better the second time...and everyone is more impressed.... I then escape very quickly... I won't reveal the method here but I will refer you to the how to make and use your own gaff handcuffs. I'm sure that's where I saw the gaff described. Took me several hours of work to make but well worth it. And I can still perform this escape without shed loads of pain in my feet.

Look forward to your writes lines to follow. :)
Message: Posted by: Dick Oslund (Aug 16, 2019 06:28AM)
Thanks Dave, for your beautifully written comments!

It's evident that you understand my reasons for responding to the OP, the way that I did.

I've presented an ESCAPE program, successfully, in schools. I'm well aware of the challenge to ENTERTAIN young folks, with escapes!

Back in '95, I was booking school show talent for NATIONAL SCHOOL ASSEMBLIES, for about a month, every autumn. Richard "X" did a fine escape program. He did the "AUSTRALIAN BOARD", THE HUNDRED FOOT ROPE, AND A STRAIT JACKET. Jack Lythgoe and I had booked a full semester tour for him. He was to start in early January, and finish in May.

A week before Christmas, Jack West, the manager of National phoned, and asked if I knew someone who could replace RICHARD! RICHARD had called, Jack, and canceled his contract!

I suggested Jim Jayes, who was a good clown with circus experience, and lots of local experience with marionettes, Punch & Judy, plus, magic and juggling. Jack said "OK, as long as he can feature some escapes." I called Jim, and, offered him my handcuffs, strait jacket, etc. Jim did a fine job on the Idaho, Utah tour; I had Jim UPS "overnight" ship the props to me in Tennessee, when he finished half the tour, and I did the other half in Tennessee and Kentucky.

I didn't do a "challenge" type program. Houdini had "grown up" in Appleton, Wisconsin, a hundred miles from my home town, I did a "historical" presentation of Houdini's success. It played very well. I used some humorous anecdotes about Houdini, and the students (and school principals) liked it.

As you noted, I didn't appreciate High Class's attitude. I've mentored and helped a lot of young guys to get started in the business. They created their own acts, and, are successful.
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 16, 2019 08:16AM)
Jimgerrish, Thank you so much for your contributions. I have just purchased your book and look forward to going through it. Pay no attention to Dave, the ones you offer up were fantastic. Unfortunately on a platform like this you get arm chair critic like Dave and Dick, who just want to criticize and complain. My guess they don't perform much and are bitter about it. On the other hand your Wiz Kids are out there making people happy and bringing smiles with these joke. Good for you my friend.

For anybody else who would like to join this conversation. This is a conversation for those who want to collaborate on a comedy escape routine. If you don't want to or don't feel you should contribute, don't. For those of you who don't like or don't want to do comedy escapes this is not the conversation for you.

In life it is okay to be disappointed, offended or whatever... But we don't always have to voice it. I get offend by cursing, rude people and slow service but I don't go around letting everybody know that I'm offended and offering my 2 cents worth. In stead I simply choose not to enter the conversation of remove my self from the offending situation. Other wise I would go through life sounding like Dave and Dick.

But for the rest of you, my fun loving comedy magi who strive to spread the joy of live through performance and you personalities, jump in and let's have some more fun.
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 16, 2019 08:25AM)
Cliff, love the idea of a cop on stage. I ended my show last week with Hira's rope escape. Of the 2 gentlemen I called on stage to help me, one was a cop. You are right about the comedy. As soon as I asked what he does and got his reply, the audience started laughing. The line about the ticket would have been great. Or perhaps mention the boot on my car outside. Thank you for your contribution, clif.
Message: Posted by: Dick Oslund (Aug 16, 2019 10:57AM)
For your information, Mr. High Class (???) neither Dave Matkin, nor I, are arm chair critics.

I have been performing since the 1940s J.B BOBO, and I, in the '70s, estimated that we each had done at least 20,000 shows. I have worked schools, and colleges for 50 years, state fairs, trade shows from coast to coast and border to border. I have booked and worked in circuses and National Conventions. I have lectured, with many repeat engagements, for rings, assemblies, regional and national conventions + the Magic Castle,twice.

I think that Dave did a masterful job in replying to your statement, so, I don't intend to add to his comments. --And, I don't intend to return to this page, either.
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 16, 2019 02:04PM)
Finally gone, good. Boy he was bringing down the fun of this simple exercise.He could suck the fun out of a clown school. He was as much fun as a tooth extraction. JB BoBo, Bounce Bounce out of here. JB Jaded Bummer. I have, I have, but now your not and your bitter.
Message: Posted by: HighClass (Aug 16, 2019 02:10PM)
I have to say thank you again to Mr. jimgerrish His book ( http://wizkidzinc.com/DVDs/DVDs.htm ) Is a a great resource and helps out some great kids. I would recommend it to anyone wanting to put some comedy in their show.
Message: Posted by: dave_matkin (Aug 16, 2019 05:21PM)
Thanks Dick

And HighClass, I am not 100% convinced that you read down to the part where I shared some of my "funny bits" that I get good responses from, I admit that number 2 may not be very useful to ANYONE else, as far as I know. But it WORKS for me. Don't forget not all comedy need be "lines" - or rather more accurately that the lines can be stage directions. Number 3 may not work for others either. In fact there is only one other EA (adult) in the UK that I know of who can slip a Hanburg 8! (we both escaped Mick Hanzlicks beatifully crafted Houdini's Mirror handcuff replica too - it takes a few minutes but the reactions are great! And the repeat escape at much faster speed gets even better reactions).

Don't get me wrong comedy is good (for example I still look forward to see what your writeRs come up with) but I don't see the point of comedy escapes. Take Michael Griffin, for example, he is a working full time EA pro ....I've not heard him talk about doing comedy escapes and for a really good reason I believe. It is the same with magic too - one of my favourite magicnas to watch is John Archer .... He does 'serious proper big boy magic' (as a friend of mine calls it) ....John is as funny as anyone, but he does not 'water his magic down' to be funny. He is funny and puts on a great show with high quality magic. No need for him to do "funny magic tricks" his comedy adds to his super strong magic. If he did all his tricks straight he would be a very good magician! Same with EAs - do strong solid escapes that get great reactions, sure use comedy as part of your presentation but to do comedy escapes to me is belittling escapes. I'm not a purist in terms of only "legit" escapes. I believe that any method is justified so long as it's entertaining. And if your going to sell items that require a switch or can't be examined I think you need to be honest and upfront about that. For example if you sell a set of cuffs that can not be examined unless the double lock is on you should not say they are fully examinable. Or a lock that has no pins in it at all don't say it's an easy pick lock that can be examined.


Take Gazzo, you either love his performing style or hate him, but his magic is top quality - he took years to hone it on the street. He has a book of lines out.... He doesn't give them away for free....they too were developed over years working them in performance. No magician would just approach him and ask him for a fee copy of his book and expect to get it for free. Sure some are cheeky enough to ask but don't expect to get it for free.

Let me put this another way...... Would you turn up at an escape convention (or a magic convention) and walk up to a performer and ask them outright for their SJ or their Tom Horn belt (insert any other prop here)? I suspect it's a no. Why not? Because those items have a perceived value! For an escape artist (you can change this for magician, sideshow performer, even juggler) their words, their lines, their patter that they have developed is part of their act. It has value, it has been worked on! It's not something that has little or no value to be just given away for free. I can fully understand Dick's response and if you don't get it ..... Well you ... don't get it and you probably won't get it. No matter how simply it were put on paper. And if you don't get it now I suspect you would not spot the good stuff now and even if you would spot it you would likely not value it. It's part of why people can be precious over script - it's as important as the "method" and the "affect" (using Timon Krause's definitions /terminology from the book "Which Hand, Method and Philosophy").

We may. Over time when asked by a friend, valued colleague, a member of our local circle or club share some of what we value of our script and lines but surely we are not expected or obliged, at first asking by someone we barely know, to giveaway our best material? Which IS EXACTLY what you expected. From the tone you used in your first post it felt, to me, like you entirely expected to get all you needed/wanted just from a cursory post that you just threw out there- did you even proof read it? Now before you say, "I'm dyslexic", or "I speak different language".....or another reason why your post may have had a certain "tone" or looked like you hadn't even bothered to proofread your post or it just sounded like you had not spotted that.....let me say this.... We didn't know of any of those potential issues for you...and ... in fact we don't know you. We have not had chance to meet you. Maybe we would like you? Or hate you....or loath you....or just think you're ok.....we haven't had the chance to get to know you before you wanted and outright asked (it felt almost like demanded) our "prized possessions" (your terminology) and then get upset at Dick when he pointed out that his "prized posessions" are indeed PRIZED by him. Lol you have to see the irony there right?

I have not criticised you, I have shared some of my lines and ideas with you and you reply by insulting me and Dick. There is plenty that one can learn from the likes of Dick without that someone spoon feeding their lines to you. I've learnt a shed load from reading other people's posts and even better visiting a performer at an event 200 miles away to spend the day with that performer. I can guarantee you that I didn't learn stuff from them by just asking them outright for their "prized posessios" when I first met them and certainly not from asking them via the very impersonal email or over the phone via text before getting to know them. I did, however, learn a lot from watching, listening and thinking. Sure I asked questions but not until after I watched, thought and had got to know them.

I'm not saying that everyone on here should withhold their lines and ideas from you. I just think your approach was not the best and to have a dig at Dick when he pointed this out to you was just immature. I know I'm immature.....my missus always tells me. But I try not to behave that way.

Let's turn this round to help make the point. Some 6 years ago I had what some may call a major lifestyle change. I was aware of another performer who had been through this same change. I contacted them. Did I ask for their prized possessions....and for free....nope. I apologised for taking up their time without them asking me to contact them and asked for permission to introduce myself (I'd met them before but they meet more people than I do so I had no expectation for them to remember me). I explained my situation (similar to theirs some years sooner) and asked if they had any advice that they were willing to share about how they had coped with this change some years sooner. What did I get? A lovely email reply and the very pleasant surprise of some books that this person had written. Way more than I had hoped for and a million times more than I expected. I think I even put in my email something like "I'm sure you get a a lot of emails asking for help, please do not feel like you have to reply and I think you for taking the time to read my email".

Some of the things that I have learnt over the years in magic, escapes, side show and even clowning (darn it I promised Myself I would not mention that in public) is that ...

1) anyone can self publish- some put time, effort and finance in to their self published work (thinking the Black Project from Looch) others don't put these things into their work and still self publish (not naming here but I have a long list)
2) the value of something you buy is not always what you payed for it. That works both ways, sometimes you buy something and it is not worth what you paid, other times you get a lot more value than you paid.
3) some people sell secrets that a) don't belong to them and are not theirs to sell and b) they don't do justice to theses secrets when they publish them.
4) sometimes people sing the praises of something that is simply not that good.
5) it's dead easy to say negative things about someone online and not actually consider what they have said. Truth can sometimes be a bitter pill to swallow.

Regardless of what you think you know about me.... I still think your fist post in years was worded badly and you were asking for people's performing "valuables" without any thought for them at all. You could have approached it a lot differently..... Eg introduce yourself and maybe discuss the project your working on. Then maybe ask if anyone has any lines that the would Be happy to share. I'm sure you,would have had a better response, although ATU is very quiet these days. I'm 99.9% sure if you had asked for a specific method to be tipped you would have had more replies saying no and more people would have accepted that as a response.

One last hing to say then like Dick, I'm probably not going to post on this thread again...

Just for you Mr or Mrs , Master or Miss highclass (it's a non gender specific name so I don't know which you are...not that that actually makes a difference)...

Yes I don't perform escapes as much as I used to. But being frustrated about not doing so ... not at all! I do get frustrated because of the thing that has made me perform fewer escapes and it is not for lack of opportunities or demand it is because of "it". "It" is the other thing that 'frustrate me' so to suggest I don't perform because you didn't like me reply and omits like beefing grumpy is laughable. To add to that "it" doesn't stop me as much as it might stop others. Im not going to get into it on an open forum. ...But I will say "IT AINT NO ARMCHAIR highclass!" (My own private joke there).

Have a good Friday evening one and all.

Oh and when will you be Harding the ideas that your writes come up with?
Message: Posted by: Cliffg37 (Aug 17, 2019 03:08PM)
Mr. High Class,

I think you have made a small mistake. Dick's words and Dave's words both came out sounding angry, at least to me as I have corresponded here with both of them for several years. Both of them have some very real-world experience. If you are starting out, or close to starting out, then listening to those with more experience is wise.

The reason I shared my cop experience with you is that I felt it cost me nothing, and it is a line I wrote in 2005. If you wanted my more current lines, I would probably not share them at this time.

My best advice for you is to re-read this thread, all of Dick's comments and all of Dave's comments. Try to take out the anger of it, and read what they are really telling you.

If you develop your own patter on your own, and it fits you and works for your character, you will have grown by it and become a stronger performer. Like I said, take out the anger, read it and learn from it if you can.

OH... and telling us a little bit about yourself could be a good thing. WHere you live, what kind of performing you do etc.
Message: Posted by: Hayre (Aug 28, 2019 08:28AM)
Dick's contributions to this forum are priceless. They are almost always given and shared freely. They are gifts. That same spirit of giving may not be what one encounters, or deserves, when asking for people's hard earned 'bits' as if expecting them to be offered up just because you want them. Perhaps you didn't meant to come across that way.
Message: Posted by: Harley Newman (Sep 9, 2019 04:13PM)
I would like to point out that some people are funny, and some are not. Having a funny line will not make an unfunny person comedic.
Message: Posted by: Dick Oslund (Sep 10, 2019 09:50AM)
Dat's da trooth!!!
Message: Posted by: jimgerrish (Sep 10, 2019 12:06PM)
"I'd like to make a few off the cuff remarks..." as a pair of handcuffs, thumbcuffs, and a chain slither out your sleeve and drop to the floor.
Message: Posted by: Cliffg37 (Sep 10, 2019 12:29PM)
[quote]On Sep 10, 2019, jimgerrish wrote:
"I'd like to make a few off the cuff remarks..." as a pair of handcuffs, thumbcuffs, and a chain slither out your sleeve and drop to the floor. [/quote]

If you can make that work it is one hell of a site gag.
Message: Posted by: Dick Oslund (Oct 12, 2019 09:41AM)
HMMMM, I wonder what happened to "High class"!