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Topic: Who makes the best & worst gaffed coins.
Message: Posted by: The Baldini (Nov 7, 2019 01:36PM)
I know it has been asked, but times have changed, business gets sold, older companies get surpassed... you get the picture. So from real world experience, who is the best and worst.
For me, sterling is the worst and Tango is better, but I cant imagine the best. perhaps, Lassen, Schoolcraft or Copeland?
Message: Posted by: warren (Nov 8, 2019 02:03AM)
The best for me is Lassen and the worst is between Sterling and Tango from past experience.
Message: Posted by: Aljaz Son (Nov 8, 2019 01:01PM)
In my personal experience Roy Kueppers is an excellent machinist and delivers quality work for a reasonable price.

Tango is also a nice resource for gaffed coins, is the cheaper (which doesn't always mean less quality) option for most gaffs of US currency AND is the only maker of EU gaffs and gimmicks that I know of.
Message: Posted by: Christian de Punto (Nov 10, 2019 07:02AM)
Based in europe, I m using tango coins. no reason to complain. at the magnet*** fli*** I had to search very long to find how to open :-)
the 2€-sh*** fits perfect and the fol***-2€ is very smart cutted.
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Nov 11, 2019 11:51AM)
Reading the question as looking for a single answer....

"Who makes the best & worst gaffed coins?"

Based on what I've both seen (actually handled) and read, the answer is Roy Kueppers.
Seriously - I've seen people rave about the quality of the items and service they've received, and others rant at the poor quality and poor follow-up for their orders.

Runner up in this category is Tango, but rather than seemingly random variation in experiences, it's more their early stuff was not great, but they have steadily improved.

----

IMHO, Lassen is simply the best, hands down.

Interesting you mention Copeland. I'm a big fan of everything he's put out, his custom Tiger Tan and Kingdom coins are great, but unless I've missed something, he doesn't (yet) make or sell gaffed coins. If/when he does, I have no doubt there will be no compromises on quality.
Message: Posted by: The Baldini (Nov 11, 2019 02:39PM)
Inigmntoya,
I am a bit confused, are you saying Roy K. is best or worst?
Message: Posted by: karnak (Nov 11, 2019 03:13PM)
He’s saying Roy K is both.
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Nov 11, 2019 04:31PM)
[quote]On Nov 11, 2019, karnak wrote:
He’s saying Roy K is both. [/quote]

Both in terms of being at both ends of the spectrum, but definitely not displacing Lassen at the high end.
Message: Posted by: karnak (Nov 11, 2019 07:45PM)
Yes, I oversimplified a bit, just to make the point. Roy K seems hot and cold, inconsistently delivering both very good and very bad. But still, Lassen is tops.
Message: Posted by: BanzaiMagic (Nov 11, 2019 08:47PM)
[quote]On Nov 11, 2019, The Baldini wrote:
Inigmntoya,
I am a bit confused, are you saying Roy K. is best or worst? [/quote]

Yes
Message: Posted by: BanzaiMagic (Nov 11, 2019 08:52PM)
[quote]On Nov 11, 2019, BanzaiMagic wrote:
[quote]On Nov 11, 2019, The Baldini wrote:
Inigmntoya,
I am a bit confused, are you saying Roy K. is best or worst? [/quote]

Yes [/quote]

On a serious note, I own some shelled sets from Roy and they are looser than I would like. Admittedly, I am spoiled by my Lassen sets, and Roy’s sets are usable, but there is a big difference in quality.
Message: Posted by: Poof-Daddy (Nov 11, 2019 09:48PM)
Although I have not been a “team Kueppers” guy in the past. Not to say I have any issue with quality, I just heard so many horror stories about no follow up once ordered, super long waits and the line. I have always bought his products from retailers and never had a problem with quality or getting them within a week (depending on the shop I ordered from).

Recently, as I have seen on Instagram, Roy has moved to Las Vegas NV so I am more that willing to put the past in the past and give him another try now that he is US based rather that his old residence/ business being Canada based. I assure you I have nothing against Canada that has not already been covered by the town of South Park (kidding LOL 😂) I just think that being in Las Vegas seems like a great step that will make him more accessible by email, phone and possibly in person (if he in fact has some kind of storefront there. I do not follow him that close so I do not know the answers here.

My point is the most important part in my opinion - is that I/we should let the past be the past and give him another chance/look. As I also stated, the items of his I purchased from 3rd party vendors has Been great quality.

As for Todd Lassen, I still love his stuff and consider him the top craftsman which justifies the pricing of his goods. Unfortunately, I feel he is leaning toward, if not already in a semi-retirement mode ( I may have misread some of his blog posts and inadvertently listened to some rumors but even so, it will come eventually.

Mark Mason and Bob Swadling have superb quality for the price and are usually my number 1 call on items they carry or can custom make for me. I believe Bob is retired or retiring soon but Mark can do a lot himself and I think Bob taught someone his methods to take over where he will leave off so they will/should be around a while.

Schoolcraft is hit and miss when sets are available but is an excellent choice. You may have better luck contacting him directly and getting your items custom made. Full disclaimer, I have not ever had the privilege of buying from him so these are speculation.

Johnson... I have said it a million times and will a million more - Johnson is the working mans tools. Fantastic items with great quality at the most reasonable prices in the industry IMHO (as well as many others) these are the ones I think active workers should use for the most part along with a set or two from the other guys that are unique and you can afford.

Tango. I am sorry to say that in my opinion they rate with Sterling, Empire and other low end gaffs. Don’t get me wrong. They have a place. They are a great way to spend less on a set and play with it to see if it is a set you would want to buy at a premium from one of the bigger names. Also, contrary to this thought, the TUC is surprisingly great as a gaff and in quality and I consider it one of the best new items from anyone in the coin business that has come out in years.

There are others I have left out because I have not had any dealings with them and do not know anyone who has. As far as I can tell, there are some really great ones out there besides the ones I have mentioned so far.’

The original question by the OP usually turns into a “my dad is better than your dad” thread of answers and has been asked hundreds of times on here. This would usually make me just want to stay out and not comment these days but he did stipulate a good point. It has been a year or two and things do change, people do retire and new folks do pop up. My answer (rather than who is best and who is worse, although it could be taken that way) is meant more to offer different options and known pluses as well as flaws.
Message: Posted by: warren (Nov 13, 2019 03:38PM)
Poof-Daddy what a great post :)
Message: Posted by: Mad Jake (Nov 14, 2019 04:04AM)
I think Todd is the best for coins, then Jamie Schoolcraft. I haven't dealt with Roy K. personally but I do have some of this work and it's comparable to Jamies.
Message: Posted by: tbaer (Nov 14, 2019 03:47PM)
Roy K is definitely hit or miss.
Message: Posted by: The Baldini (Nov 16, 2019 08:54AM)
I guess the next point I should make after reading all of the great feedback especially from PoofD, and his amazing information , which I am grateful for. Would be, if performed correctly I guess any quality would work. But I personally always like to get the best available option. Hence my question.
Message: Posted by: warren (Nov 16, 2019 10:08AM)
Personally from my experience I would stay away from the lower quality gaffs, if price is an issue which I know it can be then I would save and opt for mid range products such as Johnsons,JB Magic etc.
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Nov 16, 2019 05:56PM)
Best available = Lassen
[quote]On Nov 16, 2019, The Baldini wrote:
I guess the next point I should make after reading all of the great feedback especially from PoofD, and his amazing information , which I am grateful for. Would be, if performed correctly I guess any quality would work. But I personally always like to get the best available option. Hence my question. [/quote]
Message: Posted by: wsgumby (Dec 12, 2019 06:06PM)
Due to a hearing problem I can't use the phone, and Lassen will not answer my emails. It doesn't matter how good someone's gaffs are if you can't order from them.
Message: Posted by: elainevblaine (Dec 17, 2019 09:11PM)
[quote]On Dec 12, 2019, wsgumby wrote:
Due to a hearing problem I can't use the phone, and Lassen will not answer my emails. It doesn't matter how good someone's gaffs are if you can't order from them. [/quote]

If it's any consolation, Lassen is no longer taking orders. He doesn't answer his phone or his emails. The only way to get stuff from him right now is on his blog. And you have to be fast. Ha.
Message: Posted by: Mike Powers (Dec 23, 2019 11:25AM)
I recently bought some coins from John Jurney. They are top notch. He has some really unique products, especially coins with magnets inside. I have no financial interest in Mr. Jurney's products. Just want to bring them to the attention of gaffed coin lovers. Check out his products at: www.jjmagiccoins.com. I can definitely attest to the quality of his products.

Mike
Message: Posted by: The Gold Coin (Dec 24, 2019 02:47AM)
While I've never had the privilege of buying from Lassen, I've sampled a fair number of other gaff makers.

Schoolcraft makes beautiful gaffs. If you've ever seen Jamie work, it's pretty obvious why: if the product isn't perfect, it's not leaving his hands until it is. It's also easy to get in touch with his business and place a custom order.

John Jurney's casino chip set is excellent, and on par with Schoolcraft. And now I'm going to mostly agree with Poof-Daddy: Johnson does *very* good work, and they make the whole gamut of gaffs. If you can get your own coins onto their line, I don't think it's possible to do better without going to a custom shop. The one gaff I always carry in case a magic opportunity presents itself is a Johnson coin. Tango is somewhat hit and miss, but the hits are very good (see the TTUC). I think if you can inspect the props in person, say at a magic shop, take a look at the Tango gaffs.
Message: Posted by: KSan (May 30, 2020 08:48AM)
Hello guys!

I read the whole thread and I have a question.

Anyone knows Scotch and Soda English Penny by Eagle Coins ? Are they good quality ? After the coin vanishes from spectator's hand can he look at the coin ?

And who has THE BEST scotch & soda set which can be closely examinable after the effect by a spectator ? Who can create one in these days ? Anyone knows ?
Message: Posted by: griz326 (Jun 24, 2020 02:01PM)
My Lassen TTGF is the finest gaff that I have actually handled. My Mason sets are very good and my Foreangel sets are above average.

My Carpenter coins are bad, but what you'd expect for the cost.

My Tango coins are nice but hard for me to handle smoothly.
Message: Posted by: lemon ice (Jul 1, 2020 07:52AM)
I recently purchased a Schoolcraft OXF and it’s awesome. I will say that I did do a little aging on the [ to get it to better match the [/ and my other coins. Other than that, it’s fantastic. I also own a set of Roy Kueppers coin boxes. They are very good, heavy, and have thick rims for special moves. Downside: they won’t accommodate an X[. Lastly, I own a C/S set, as well as a C/S/B set from someone I only know as Loshayden. Really good work, but relatively unknown as far as I can tell. But hey, they might be reading this very thread right now! Who knows? It’s a mystery.
Message: Posted by: Nev Blenk (Jul 1, 2020 02:07PM)
[quote]On Jul 1, 2020, lemon ice wrote:
I own a C/S set, as well as a C/S/B set from someone I only know as Loshayden. Really good work, but relatively unknown as far as I can tell. But hey, they might be reading this very thread right now! Who knows? It’s a mystery. [/quote]

Ive got to know Losh (foranangel) over the last few months. He has made me some very nice gaffs including some custom work. His communication is great and his turn around is very quick. Best way is to message him via ebay.

Nev
Message: Posted by: Wednesday (Jul 1, 2020 05:46PM)
[quote]On Jul 1, 2020, Nev Blenk wrote:
[quote]On Jul 1, 2020, lemon ice wrote:
I own a C/S set, as well as a C/S/B set from someone I only know as Loshayden. Really good work, but relatively unknown as far as I can tell. But hey, they might be reading this very thread right now! Who knows? It’s a mystery. [/quote]

Ive got to know Losh (foranangel) over the last few months. He has made me some very nice gaffs including some custom work. His communication is great and his turn around is very quick. Best way is to message him via ebay.

Nev [/quote]

If you don't mind me asking, what gaffs have you had made from him?
Message: Posted by: mrmagik68 (Jul 1, 2020 09:50PM)
I've been trying to reach Lassen for a shell set but no luck getting an answer either by phone or email. Is Todd still in business?



Roberto
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Jul 2, 2020 06:52AM)
Roberto, Todd hasn't posted anything for sale in a while, but is still in business. He has a blog that you can subscribe to and get the listing when they come out. He doesn't take orders now, so getting a shell set will mean waiting until he makes some.
Message: Posted by: Nev Blenk (Jul 2, 2020 07:30AM)
[quote]On Jul 1, 2020, Wednesday wrote:

If you don't mind me asking, what gaffs have you had made from him? [/quote]

I originally bought his chinatown half gaff with an east african dime / 64 kennedy which I am very happy with. Since then he has made me a couple of sun and moon gaffs aswell some copper/silvers. He has just finished making me some interesting non standard items. As an after thought I asked him to send me some barber halves which are difficult and costly to find here in the UK. It was no problem for him.
I can't fault his service and friendliness.

Cheers
Nev
Message: Posted by: Wednesday (Jul 2, 2020 10:26PM)
[quote]On Jul 2, 2020, Nev Blenk wrote:
[quote]On Jul 1, 2020, Wednesday wrote:

If you don't mind me asking, what gaffs have you had made from him? [/quote]

I originally bought his chinatown half gaff with an east african dime / 64 kennedy which I am very happy with. Since then he has made me a couple of sun and moon gaffs aswell some copper/silvers. He has just finished making me some interesting non standard items. As an after thought I asked him to send me some barber halves which are difficult and costly to find here in the UK. It was no problem for him.
I can't fault his service and friendliness.

Cheers
Nev [/quote]


That's great to hear. Thanks!
Message: Posted by: mrmagik68 (Jul 2, 2020 10:39PM)
[quote]On Jul 2, 2020, Tom G wrote:
Roberto, Todd hasn't posted anything for sale in a while, but is still in business. He has a blog that you can subscribe to and get the listing when they come out. He doesn't take orders now, so getting a shell set will mean waiting until he makes some. [/quote]


That's a shame. I know how good his work is as I've ordered from him in the past. I'll more than likely go with Schoolcraft as I don't want to wait. I've purchased gaffs from Jaime as well and his work is also stellar. Thanks for the info!


Roberto
Message: Posted by: jdub (Jul 4, 2020 07:57PM)
I have used Johnson for years and have never been disappointed. Their pricing is reasonable and quality is always great.
Message: Posted by: mrmagik68 (Jul 6, 2020 10:42PM)
Has anyone ordered anything from Schoolcraft recently? If so, did they stick to the estimated turnaround or did you have to wait far longer? I ask because I just ordered a Soft Morgan Deans Set and the turnaround I was quoted was about 3-4 weeks. I'm wondering if they keep true to their turnaround times as I have not ordered from them in quite some time. I'm sure the quality will be top notch, I just hate waiting lol. Thanks!




Roberto
Message: Posted by: Jac -dutch- (Jul 12, 2020 06:35AM)
I ‘am very satisfied about the coins from Van Dokkum. Unfortunately he is past. His coins are great.
So I ordered 1,5 year ago by the Frenchman Thierry from Magikoins. I like his work and again I like his coins. His coin is really fine and he can do a lot various coins! He only couldn’t make a expended thing. Maybe in the future he can. (I hope!)
I choose for Magikoins because I read/hear about Lassen his communication and delivery are not that well. Maybe is that solved! We need craftship guys.
Message: Posted by: webtech (Jul 12, 2020 09:48AM)
[quote]On Jul 6, 2020, mrmagik68 wrote:
Has anyone ordered anything from Schoolcraft recently? If so, did they stick to the estimated turnaround or did you have to wait far longer? I ask because I just ordered a Soft Morgan Deans Set and the turnaround I was quoted was about 3-4 weeks. I'm wondering if they keep true to their turnaround times as I have not ordered from them in quite some time. I'm sure the quality will be top notch, I just hate waiting lol. Thanks!




Roberto [/quote]

I know, 3 to 4 weeks sounds excessive. I mean are expensive gaffed coins in such high demand that they can't keep up? Doubt it. I think it's more of that I have a regular job and do this as a side gig so when I get to it I'll get to it sort of thing. I just can't imagine any gaff maker slaving away for 10 hrs a day trying to keep up with demand. Not that these gaffs don't take time to make but 3 to 4 weeks? Maybe he sources his inventory of coins per order? I don't know. But I remember seeing somewhere that when he was in Vegas selling his gaffed coins he spent all night making more. So maybe they don't have to take that long.
Message: Posted by: mrmagik68 (Jul 12, 2020 10:54AM)
Web tech,

I hear ya brother. I think Schoolcraft, similar to Lassen, is a one-man operation so, that's probably why it takes so long. I would imagine that making these gaffs is a painstakingly slow process especially when the quality is top notch. I've ordered from Schoolcraft (as well as Lassen) in the past and have always been satisfied with the quality of their products. But dude, the waiting kills me! I'm like the kid who knows his most requested gift is underneath that tree but there are 25 more days before Christmas! LOL.



Roberto
Message: Posted by: webtech (Jul 13, 2020 10:12AM)
[quote]On Jul 12, 2020, mrmagik68 wrote:
Web tech,

I hear ya brother. I think Schoolcraft, similar to Lassen, is a one-man operation so, that's probably why it takes so long. I would imagine that making these gaffs is a painstakingly slow process especially when the quality is top notch. I've ordered from Schoolcraft (as well as Lassen) in the past and have always been satisfied with the quality of their products. But dude, the waiting kills me! I'm like the kid who knows his most requested gift is underneath that tree but there are 25 more days before Christmas! LOL.



Roberto [/quote]
I know. I am the same way. I have no patience. LOL
Also I am sure you are knowledgeable on the Dean's set. The shell is unexpanded with the other coins shaved down to precisely fit. And also they are re-milled around the edge. So all coins need to be machined in some way. So that does take some time to make. The remilled edge is great for gripping but on a soft Morgan set I always thought it looked odd. You have these soft used coins with perfect edges. Not that anyone would notice. I've always been a fan of an unexpanded set. All the coins are larger which I like. And much it's a much cheaper set.
Message: Posted by: mrmagik68 (Jul 13, 2020 10:43AM)
Webtech,

Yes, I've owned several Deans or Unexpanded sets before, they are beautiful. The only drawback is that you can only use the shell with the accompanying coins but the overall fit is brilliant. As far as the re-milled edges, it's great for palming and edge grip work. I've never had a spectator point out the milled edges on soft coins. If you ever come across a spectator that mentions something like that to you, put your coins away and kindly move on to the next spectator LOL.



Roberto
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Jul 14, 2020 07:16PM)
[quote]On Jul 13, 2020, webtech wrote:
I've always been a fan of an unexpanded set. All the coins are larger which I like. And much it's a much cheaper set. [/quote]

With unexpanded sets the coins are milled down to fit the unexpanded shell, so they should be smaller, not larger?
Message: Posted by: karnak (Jul 14, 2020 07:41PM)
And cheaper? With all that extra work going into shaving down, and even remilling, the matching coins?
Message: Posted by: thegreatscungilli (Jul 16, 2020 06:32PM)
I have one of Lassen's Kennedy Half flippers and his work is outstanding. The Johnson shells are very good, not a Lassen or Schoolcraft but decent workers at a reasonable price.