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Topic: Mechanism to deliver coin to hand invisibly...
Message: Posted by: DJ Trix (Aug 17, 2020 08:12PM)
I am looking for a device that can deliver a coin to a hand without needing to do a body steal proper. Similar to Hidden Hand by Sean Fields.

The issue is I want to do this sleeveless, or else I could just use a holdout system of any variety.

Can anyone recommend a device that they have tested that can accomplish this? Is 'Hidden Hand' the only publicly released mechanism of this nature that can be done sleeveless?

I appreciate any feedback offered.
Message: Posted by: Poof-Daddy (Aug 18, 2020 03:04PM)
TKO 2.0 will handle it.
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 18, 2020 03:52PM)
Raven from Chazpro is an alternate method. But it requires a special coin, you may already have.
And if you have that special coin, then there are several methods of delivery.
Hook coin.

Jerry
Message: Posted by: DJ Trix (Aug 18, 2020 05:14PM)
Hi the Raven would require sleeves correct? Your talking about a traditional Raven p**l?
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 18, 2020 07:10PM)
Raven can be done with short sleeves.

Demo
GO HERE:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozFJN4jxHfs
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 18, 2020 07:44PM)
Other options.

Control by Darryl Vanamburg
Pro:
Powerful, very powerful. Two hour instructions. Lots of options and comes with a "kit".

Cons:
Cost. Size. Weak concealment, treat it like TT. Loud. Read the reviews.

Silent Assistant.
Pro:
Cost. Smaller, better concealment. Quite.

Cons: Weak. No kit. Sans Minds.

Everything has a trade off.
Right down a list of wants. Then right a list of all the device options.
Then compare and see which best meets your needs.
Message: Posted by: countrymaven (Aug 18, 2020 08:23PM)
Until you try a magnetic holdout on the side of the back pocket, do not discount it. you naturally lower your hand anyways. You can ditch, cover and retrieve with this natural move.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Aug 18, 2020 08:51PM)
Https://vimeo.com/280797958 😉
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 18, 2020 10:18PM)
There is a whole other conversation on Gregory Wilson Split Focus.

GO HERE:

https://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=670021

To me it appears that I already have several versions of this already. Clocking in at $150, with no major innovations, I'll pass.
Thank you for pointing this out MB. Always helps to show options.
Message: Posted by: DJ Trix (Aug 18, 2020 10:25PM)
Ah yes a Raven can be used in short sleeves, I forgot about this..

It does seem like a more appropriate method to ditch an object though. Rather then a device to deliver an object to a hand.

Again, let me clarify, I am seeking to go from empty hands, to having a coin delivered to my hand, while wearing no sleeves.

Thanks for the input guys.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Aug 19, 2020 05:51AM)
[quote]On Aug 18, 2020, Jerry wrote:
There is a whole other conversation on Gregory Wilson Split Focus.

GO HERE:

https://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=670021

To me it appears that I already have several versions of this already. Clocking in at $150, with no major innovations, I'll pass.
Thank you for pointing this out MB. Always helps to show options. [/quote]

Just showing this, not for the effect or the coins, but as to the request here of how to (more simply) invisibly deliver a coin to the hand, as suggested above my post.
Message: Posted by: Dougini (Aug 24, 2020 03:54PM)
How about this?

"If I had to do just one thing to prove I am a magician, it would be NOW-U-C-IT, NOW-U-DON'T."
Meir Yedid

Prove your magic mettle once and for all with NOW-U-C-IT, NOW-U-DON'T. With no suspicious moves, you can show your hand empty front and back, but close your hand and open it, and there rests a coin! Close your fist over the coin and open it again and the coin is gone! Pure magic! At least the spectators will think so!

But you can do even more! The accompanying DVD contains 60 minutes of performance and explanation of 20 routines, moves and ideas with NOW-U-C-IT, NOW-U-DON'T. Also, in addition to the versatile gimmick and instructions on how to make more, you get a booklet jam-packed with over 50 ideas, techniques and routines from the likes of Jeff Stewart, Ken Krenzel, Meir Yedid, Bob Friedhoffer, John Cornelius, James Swoger, Ed Mellon, David Regal and Steve Schneiderman.

Get yours today and you, too, can make objects disappear and reappear - just like real magic!
https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/close-up-magic/special-edition-now-u-c-it-now-u-dont/

Doug
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 24, 2020 07:43PM)
Dougini, I do not think the OP wants any gimmick coins or devices.
I love "NOW U C IT". I agree it is one of the best secret weapons in coin magic.

But, it does have some limitations.
You can not go into a routine with other coins or use is with a coin box for example.
Message: Posted by: scotchrocket (Aug 25, 2020 08:50AM)
If you'd prefer to use sleight of hand, perhaps the [i]Sylvester Pitch[/i] would work for you. If not, could you provide some more context of what you're looking to do?
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Aug 25, 2020 10:11AM)
Hiya doing Doug? :)

Hey, I used to have something like this long ago called, "Fickle Nickel." Looks to work the same way and this version of it addresses the request I used to have of wanting it to be a bigger coin...Hooray for that! :D That it is here as dollar size coin makes it much more visible and amazing looking. I remember it being a fun effect, but Jerry brings up some good points about it to be further considered.

And Rocket, the "Sylvester Pitch" could produce this (without a gaff) effect as originally asked for here alrighty, pretty believably I'd say. I actually use my little [b]Quick Pitch[/b] to do just this for many years now. ;) *And also, my [b]10 Switch[/b] could deliver this as well. :)
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 25, 2020 05:40PM)
John Cornelius Fickle nickel is vanishing only. This is a production.
I guess you could reverse the method, but I think that would be awkward. Gravity will work against you.

"The Hidden Hand" - is NOT the answer. It is complete trash.

OP stated "device that can deliver a coin to a hand without needing to do a body steal proper". And no sleeves.

All the device mentioned and suggested so far are not acceptable.

No sleeves
No coat
No body steals
No holdouts
No clips
No gimmick coins
No hand apparatus
Hands empty

I do not know if anything exists that meets this criterion.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Aug 25, 2020 07:46PM)
This is just too easy. ☺️

Just saying, but the the OP doesn’t seem to be totally against half the stuff you mention here...And he actually speaks of “holdouts” as a viable alternative.

But anyway as to Fickle Nickel, it was always an effect of vanish “and” production...Always! And it is just as easy to produce the coin as it is to vanish it, nothing “awkward” to it at all, no more than what you see with newer takes that are mentioned here. But don’t take my word for it (as you clearly haven’t- NP), see for yourself as it’s an old trick...

[YOUTUBE]8MhNwDToHc0[/YOUTUBE]
Message: Posted by: Poof-Daddy (Aug 25, 2020 08:25PM)
If you go the "untucked shirt" route, the "Secret Servante" by Sean Goodman would work and is on sale right now @ VI
https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic-accessories/secret-servante/
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 26, 2020 09:34AM)
MB - Your correct, you can vanish AND appear the coin, once you are SETUP.
The video does not show how he got into his hands. You have place the coin into your hand using a certain method.
I am basing this on John Cornelius method, your method may have improved on it without a setup required.

However, both Fickle and Now U See It are tethered. This limit the coin, unless a switch is made.

Correct also, OP only disregarded Raven so far.
No mention on Poof TKO, countrymaven holdout or your suggestion on Split Focus (although $150 for the set may beyond their requirements).

I believe Secret Servante is the best answer.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Aug 26, 2020 11:28AM)
Thanks Jerry.

I actually was never speaking of Fickle Nickel as a solution here, I was just responding to the mention of Now UC It, Now U Don't.

And also again, I was not mentioning Split Focus as an effect, but to point toward a way to bring a "coin to hand invisibly" via the method used by Wilson's effect. The method he uses does not cost $150, more like $5-10 bucks depending on what you use. I have used an old money clip to do this quite effectively enough, without doing this effect at all. I was simply pointing to the piece of it that the OP needed. Figured people would recognize it easy enough beyond the cost of the effect.

And finally here, PD's recommendation of Sean's wonderful "Secret Servante" is indeed a good, flexible solution that should be given a try. :)
Message: Posted by: John Long (Aug 28, 2020 08:52AM)
A method that I like for initial loads, is to use a small cloth pouch to store/carry the coins to a performance.
So, for a 2 in the hand/1 in the pocket type trick: 4 coins are kept in the pouch; I grab the closed end of the pouch at the bottom, and then start opening the top drawstring with the right (and look as if inspecting the coins). As I do this, the left hand is squeezing away all but 1 coin (and getting a grip on the 1 through the cloth.) I then tip the bag over and dump out 3 coins onto the table. As people look at those coins, I casually move the bag over to the right hand, drop the remaining coin into the right as the right continues the motion to the side, and drop the bag off to the side.

John
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 28, 2020 09:26AM)
Copeland Coins "Traveler" and Tony Miller's Real Man's Coin Wallet, are perfect for this.
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Aug 30, 2020 08:32PM)
I have done more research.

Avoid these items:

Black Widow (no longer available, except after market). Old gamblers system. Well made. NOT short sleeves.

Gonzo - Great if the spectators are toe to toe standing on a ladder (watch the demo video if you think I am kidding). Black Widow rip-off. NOT short sleeves.

Hidden Hand - You will scream in anger when you open the box (Materials/construction vs cost). Terrible angles. You can actually see the ring in the performance. NOT short sleeves.

Invisible Hand (personally got sucker punch on this one). Really old principle, that has been published several times for decades. Not updated or improved. Very expensive fishing line.

Paul Diamonds Phantom (I know, I know - made you laugh).

Most are lame Raven wanna-be, that "improved" the method. With terrible angle problems, and very limited arm mobility. Most do not show how to get into the device.

I define short sleeves as - sleeves that do not past the biceps. Not - roll-up long sleeves.
Message: Posted by: DJ Trix (Aug 31, 2020 03:37AM)
Everyone, thank you for sharing your input. The most appropriate solution I have thus far is just to use a Florentine Style holdout which is basically like a Black Widow.

I really want to perform the piece sleeveless but the cleanness of the load would be compromised. Thus I was seeing if there was anything publicly released that would solve this issue.

I do own a Hidden Hand and although I cannot see it as being valuable for a live performer, I see great value in it for video work. Or doing something one on one as a rare performance. I am trying to work out a Florentine Holdout that is sleeveless but ultimately it wouldnt be realistic except for video work.
Message: Posted by: DJ Trix (Aug 31, 2020 11:31AM)
Jerry I am using rolled long sleeves if I ultimately can. Rolled right above the elbow. There have been such great submissions on this topic, especially the 'now you see it' device. But due to the movements I am needing to do right before the reveal of a coin, that kind of billiard ball principle wouldnt be possible. Although I am going to buy that DVD for other applications.
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Sep 2, 2020 10:48PM)
I am going to continue my research on this.

I have the following being sent/purchased.
"The Art of Eddie Joseph" has the Mirage Holdout.
Jack Miller Hold Out Miracles DVD and PDF of the book. One of the first complete holdout devices resource. Although I am certain this item goes way back.

Reviewed Alan Alan dual control. Which is almost exactly like the Hidden Hand, expect it came out in the 1950's.

Also going through the usual suspects - Greater Magic; Pallbearer Review; Apocalypse and more as I search the library.

DJ, can you tell us more about the Florentine Style holdout? I have never heard of it.

Will update as I found new/old information.

If you don't want something found, put it in a book.
Message: Posted by: DJ Trix (Sep 3, 2020 04:20AM)
Will PM you about the Florentine Jerry.
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Sep 7, 2020 02:08PM)
Reconsidering the Black Widow and Trabucco holdouts.

Currently reading a 8 page posting on Trabucco and then a 34 page Black Widow post!

Still need to finish Eddie Fisher (Mirage holdout) and Jack Miller/Tannen holdout miracle book.

I know DJ said no jacket. The Trabucco does not require a jacket, hence my reconsidering.

There is a no or short sleeve houldout cheating gambler's use. I can not recall the exact name. In the act of folding your arms the desire object is extracted. I have to go through my card cheating material to get a source. I went into the crypt where I keep my books, the primary mission was to get Tommy Wonder book volume two that go over the Miller houldout. I go back for the card cheating later.

The Black Widow, is for my interests, but working with it if I get it, may give insight to a short sleeve variant.
Message: Posted by: charlie_d (Sep 11, 2020 05:09AM)
Eric Jones has a method in his "Oxy Clean" routine that might suit; he has his sleeves rolled up above the elbow. Not sleeveless, and it's accompanied by careful choreography, but it's a very nice low-tech way to do what you need; your hands are legitimately empty to begin with. Eric also covers Chris Korn's "Korn production" on his first "Metal" DVD, which is a pure sleight approach, nicely choreographed, that might make you rethink the need for mechanical assistance? The effect is that the hands are casually shown to be empty then the coin is produced apparently from nowhere. Although it's sleight of hand, it's very much at the easier end of the scale.

The "oxy clean" method would work with a long sleeved t-shirt, with sleeves rolled up. A Tshirt might be difficult, but it could still be doable.

Joe Mogar's "Pocket Pal" or something similar might work, again with a bit of careful choreography. Mark Mason also supplies something similar as a simple add-on to the triception set; there are a few published routines that involve this sort of thing.

TKO 2.0 with a button up shirt, like Vinny said.

Re: the florentine holdout; I really don't think that would work at all. It barely works even with sleeves and it'd be super suspicious imo. Great for stage, but not for a sleeveless coin production.

Another principle that might work is Brian Platt's "Blackout", which can be used for a sleeveless production where your hands are legitimately empty at the start. You can even follow up with a vanish where your hands end up legitimately empty. Like everything else, this item has its own issues, but depending on your conditions, it might work.

Good luck with it; let us know how it goes...!
Message: Posted by: Psy1 (Feb 17, 2021 11:54AM)
Has anyone used Copeland Coins device called Blackbird? It looks extremely well made and could be a very efficient way to load coins (billets?) into your hands. https://www.copelandcoins.com/collections/all/products/blackbird
Message: Posted by: martonikus (Feb 17, 2021 05:52PM)
Pocket Pal from Joe Mogar Magic.
Message: Posted by: Joseph Mitchell (Feb 24, 2021 08:36AM)
How about a spring loaded coin gun hidden in your jacket which shoots the coin at high speed into your awaiting hand? Turn the setting too high and you get a Stigmata effect as a bonus.
Message: Posted by: KungFuMagic (Feb 25, 2021 05:14PM)
[quote]On Feb 17, 2021, Psy1 wrote:
Has anyone used Copeland Coins device called Blackbird? It looks extremely well made and could be a very efficient way to load coins (billets?) into your hands. https://www.copelandcoins.com/collections/all/products/blackbird [/quote]


While it is certainly a stunning looking video and tool, and useful for lots of things .... the OP is performing with no sleeves. Gonna be a hard repurposing to get it effective sleeveless.
Message: Posted by: andykean (Feb 25, 2021 06:19PM)
Secret servante is excellent in my opinion, and great value.
Message: Posted by: simplymagicweb (Feb 28, 2021 07:03AM)
[quote]On Feb 25, 2021, andykean wrote:
Secret servante is excellent in my opinion, and great value. [/quote]

Thanks Andy - as it's my baby obviously I'm a bit biased! I've got a special offer on it too at the moment - just Ł20 including postage worldwide. As you say Andy, great value...
Message: Posted by: gregg webb (Mar 1, 2021 07:40PM)
I'm thinking going a different route entirely and it is probably not what you are after - a device. But, if you want to really seem like your hands are empty and then produce a coin...I am going to try to do a different trick, say a packet trick with cards, that you can do with a coin palmed all the while. Such as Twisting the Aces. Then, after setting the cards down, and announcing a coin trick, produce the palmed coin. I think Max Malini would like it. He loved things that took patience.
Message: Posted by: guazelli (Mar 24, 2021 04:43AM)
I use an homemade holdout that can be used with sleeves and without...
If you want you can check it at this fb page
https://m.facebook.com/THE-THING-THAT-NEVER-WAS-104046861234618/

If someone pass by let me know what you think about it.