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Topic: Fugitive Coins
Message: Posted by: snushy (Feb 10, 2021 11:22AM)
Perfect coin for Fugitive Coins? I've tried many alternatives and most of the coins that have the proper diameter are quite thick, and I sometimes get nailed for that reason. Anybody have an ideal coin for this brilliant effect?
Thanks!
Message: Posted by: Michael Rubinstein (Feb 10, 2021 12:03PM)
David used a commemorative coin of Pope John Paul that he got at the Vatican. It just needs to be the size between a half dollar and a dollar, not thick.
Message: Posted by: snushy (Feb 10, 2021 02:27PM)
Thanks very much Michael!
Message: Posted by: Frank Yuen (Feb 10, 2021 04:13PM)
Doesn't he recommend the correct coin in Expert Coin Magic? I don't recall the coin but I do know I bought the specific coin that he mentioned in a coin shop so I definitely saw/heard it somewhere.
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Feb 10, 2021 08:29PM)
I've used an older Canadian Silver Dollar, slightly on the larger side, but milled.
Message: Posted by: J-Mac (Feb 10, 2021 09:48PM)
Philippine peso silver coin, 1907 - 1912. Perfect size.

Jim
Message: Posted by: karnak (Feb 13, 2021 05:19PM)
Anyone know of an online source (other than auction sites — ones I’ve seen are bids only, no buy-it-now option) for an inexpensive circulated old silver Philippine peso of the date range Jim specified?

Or anyone have one of their own they’d be willing to part with?
Message: Posted by: Michael Rubinstein (Feb 13, 2021 06:11PM)
In his lecture notes, both a bahamian dollar and a Mexican silver 5 peso coin as being the right size.
Message: Posted by: John Long (Feb 13, 2021 09:44PM)
[quote]On Feb 10, 2021, Frank Yuen wrote:
Doesn't he recommend the correct coin in Expert Coin Magic? I don't recall the coin but I do know I bought the specific coin that he mentioned in a coin shop so I definitely saw/heard it somewhere. [/quote]

Is that in his video series, or a book by Dave R?

Thanks;
John
Message: Posted by: Michael Rubinstein (Feb 14, 2021 06:25AM)
In the book the size of the coin is described, but not the type of currency. It was discussed in his lecture noted as statwd. He may have also discussed it on video or at his early lectures, but I don't have that information. I know he told me about the coin he got at the Vatican, and being that I lived in Italy I was able to pick one up for myself.
Message: Posted by: magicfish (Feb 14, 2021 10:27AM)
On his Stars of Magic VHS , he refers to it as a Mexican centavo.
Message: Posted by: karnak (Feb 14, 2021 11:58AM)
I did a bit of “research” (i.e., Googling), and came up with this:

Half dollar = 30.6 mm
Silver dollar = 38 mm

So presumably something roughly midway in between would be around 34 mm or so.

Canadian silver dollar = 32 mm
Bahamian silver dollar (1966-70 or maybe later) = 34 mm
Mexican silver 5 peso (1955-57; dates matter!) = 35 mm
Philippine silver 1 peso (1907-12) = 35 mm

Hope this helps other seekers.
Message: Posted by: John Long (Feb 14, 2021 08:40PM)
I mistyped, I was interested where the "Fugitive Coin" is taught.
Thanks;
John
Message: Posted by: karnak (Feb 14, 2021 08:42PM)
It’s in the big “Expert Coin Magic” Roth book, and evidently also in some Roth lecture notes.
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Feb 14, 2021 08:45PM)
I took some measurements the other day and my Canadian Silver dollar is 35.9mm, width 2.7. I have a Philippine Piso with a much more current date a 33.4mm and w of 2.3. Feeling the difference between a half and a quarter, was best duplicated with the Canadian coin. Your mileage may vary.
Message: Posted by: CoinBoy101 (Feb 17, 2021 03:14PM)
The correct sized coin is described in Expert Coin Magic as being "larger than the half dollar in the same ratio that a half dollar is larger than a quarter"
Message: Posted by: magicfish (Feb 18, 2021 04:14AM)
[quote]On Feb 17, 2021, CoinBoy101 wrote:
The correct sized coin is described in Expert Coin Magic as being "larger than the half dollar in the same ratio that a half dollar is larger than a quarter" [/quote]
Correct. Any ideas?
I'm practicing right now with Canadian currency. I think I've found the correct ratios. Quarter- 2 Dollar Coin- Silver Dollar.
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Feb 18, 2021 08:12AM)
Magicfish, what it boils down to is that the spectator can feel the distinct difference. I found that even though some coins were bigger than the half, it wasn't enough to be able to tell the difference easily. And the difference in the half and quarter is quite obvious. Just feel the difference in your 2 regular coins, then eliminate the smaller one and ring in the bigger one and see if the difference is as obvious.
Message: Posted by: magicfish (Feb 18, 2021 10:01AM)
Thanks Tom. I agree 100% with your description of the principle here.
For me, I've found that the Canadian Silver Dollar is proportionately larger than the 2 Dollar coin, as the 2 Dollar Coin is to the quarter.
The thickness is very close as well.
I was curious as to which coin Coinboy101 finds appropriate.
Message: Posted by: John Long (Feb 19, 2021 08:36PM)
[quote]On Feb 14, 2021, karnak wrote:
It’s in the big “Expert Coin Magic” Roth book, and evidently also in some Roth lecture notes. [/quote]

Thanks; I guess I'll have to wait for the reprinting.

John
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Feb 20, 2021 08:01AM)
It's also available as a Vault Video Download.
Message: Posted by: John Long (Feb 20, 2021 09:29PM)
Tom:

Thanks, Can you give me the contact info for "Vault"

John
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Feb 21, 2021 06:30AM)
The Vault is just a general name they use for the old video series. Here's the link for Penguin, but if you have a favorite magic shop that offers downloads, they'll probably have it too.
https://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S27640
Message: Posted by: karnak (Feb 27, 2021 08:24PM)
[quote]
Canadian silver dollar = 32 mm
Bahamian silver dollar (1966-70 or maybe later) = 34 mm
Mexican silver 5 peso (1955-57; dates matter!) = 35 mm
Philippine silver 1 peso (1907-12) = 35 mm [/quote]

Compulsive that I am, and for the record, I did a bit more math:

Quarter = 0.955 inch = 24.26 mm
Half Dollar = 1.205 inch = 30.61 mm
Same Ratio Up = 1.52 inch = 38.62 mm

A silver dollar is only 38.10 mm.

But we’re looking for a coin that is bigger than a half, yet smaller than a dollar — right? (The proverbial “75 cent piece.”)

So am I not doing something right, mathematically speaking, when the whole idea is to have a special coin that is "larger than the half dollar in the same ratio that a half dollar is larger than a quarter"?

I am confused.
Message: Posted by: John Long (Feb 27, 2021 09:48PM)
[quote]On Feb 21, 2021, Tom G wrote:
The Vault is just a general name they use for the old video series. Here's the link for Penguin, but if you have a favorite magic shop that offers downloads, they'll probably have it too.
https://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S27640 [/quote]

Thanks Tom.
I like the structure of the routine.

John
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Feb 28, 2021 07:12AM)
Karnak, I think it boils down to it being easy to feel the difference between the half and the chosen coin. I got slightly different measurements, but coins and dates can put sizes all over. IE the Canadian Silver Dollar I have is 35.9mm. That's about 6mm difference between a quarter and a half and the half and my Canadian Dollar. Easy to feel the difference. The Piso I have is 33.4mm and it's tough to tell the difference between the half an Piso. I don't think math needs to be involved. Just the spec thinking he's got a half and an quarter in his hand, when he's really got a half and a (insert your favorite coin here) in his hand.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Feb 28, 2021 07:59AM)
[quote]On Feb 27, 2021, John Long wrote:

Thanks Tom.
I like the structure of the routine.

John [/quote]

Yeah, it’s one of Roth’s easier tricks to do but a solid fooler. And Tom is right, nothing complicated here, just a quick fooling of the mind as to two of the five senses, sight and touch. Getting the right size coin is usually the biggest trick of it all. 😁 That has probably stopped more people to date from doing this little gem than anything else. 😊
Message: Posted by: gregg webb (Apr 11, 2021 08:22PM)
It is the old peso.
Message: Posted by: gregg webb (Apr 11, 2021 08:30PM)
Mexican circa 1958.