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Topic: "Russian Roulette" (Jack Yates) with 6 cards at Trickshop
Message: Posted by: docguitarman (Jun 1, 2021 11:00PM)
Hi all,

This is intriguing. It says it is based on a Jack Yates method. The write up makes it sound like it is a self-working c***t f**ce, but 6 being even (not a prime) I cannot see how it would work as written. I've searched the literature for a reference to the Jack Yates method but with no luck. Not looking for how it works. But if anyone knows the trick and can can provide an opinion I'd appreciate it.
It's only 2.50 at the moment. But I don't like getting "nickeled and dimed" to death!
Regards,
Phil
Here is the link:
https://trickshop.com/russian-roulette-card-trick.html
Message: Posted by: John7 (Jun 2, 2021 08:13AM)
I bought it about a week ago. I think it's fantastic. Haven't done it to anyone except myself yet but it has the potential to be great fun as you put an imaginary gun to your head (with your fingers) and pull the trigger 5 times hoping for an empty chamber. As written, you ask the spectator to pull 5 black cards and a red card out of the deck but, if you take the 6 cards out of the deck yourself at the start without showing them to the spectator, then at the end of the routine they will think they were all black but they can then turn the last card over to see there was a live round in the chamber. Also, pulling the cards out of the deck yourself allows you to choose a better "bullet" card than just a random red eg the Ace of Hearts. No force - they pick any number 1-6 and that's the number you go with for the rest of the routine. If you know Harry Lorayne's Utility Mixer, that fits perfectly with this trick to mix the packet before you start.
Message: Posted by: docguitarman (Jun 2, 2021 03:21PM)
[quote]On Jun 2, 2021, John7 wrote:
I bought it about a week ago. I think it's fantastic. Haven't done it to anyone except myself yet but it has the potential to be great fun as you put an imaginary gun to your head (with your fingers) and pull the trigger 5 times hoping for an empty chamber. As written, you ask the spectator to pull 5 black cards and a red card out of the deck but, if you take the 6 cards out of the deck yourself at the start without showing them to the spectator, then at the end of the routine they will think they were all black but they can then turn the last card over to see there was a live round in the chamber. Also, pulling the cards out of the deck yourself allows you to choose a better "bullet" card than just a random red eg the Ace of Hearts. No force - they pick any number 1-6 and that's the number you go with for the rest of the routine. If you know Harry Lorayne's Utility Mixer, that fits perfectly with this trick to mix the packet before you start. [/quote]
Thank you John!
Speaking of false mixes I believe I have a Charlier finish somewhere in my library but forget exactly where! (DVD or pdf and author? Who knows!) I see that the Utility Mixer is in Harry Loraynes "More Jaw Droppers" -- I may need to pick that up!
If I can't locate the Charlier ending I may want to pick up Michel Potts, Hobson's Choice, which describes a "Fin de Charlier"

My memory of where my stuff is, is getting worse!!!
Regards,
Phil
Message: Posted by: Wravyn (Jun 3, 2021 05:15PM)
I picked this up also. I am not going to use it as Russian Roulette, but a picture of a knife or spike on one card and the rest blank. A safe version of the 'Spiked' trick.
Message: Posted by: docguitarman (Jun 3, 2021 05:47PM)
[quote]On Jun 3, 2021, Wravyn wrote:
I picked this up also. I am not going to use it as Russian Roulette, but a picture of a knife or spike on one card and the rest blank. A safe version of the 'Spiked' trick. [/quote]

I think I agree. You never know when you have someone of a sensitive disposition in the audience.

I like Yates method a lot... a method that works with 6 which is not a prime number. The method alone is worth the price!

Phil
Message: Posted by: John7 (Jun 3, 2021 06:18PM)
It's a great little trick isn't it? Since I bought it I've been sitting here idly doing it for myself and having almost as much fun as (I imagine) doing it for someone else. The Russian Roulette premise would work well for me as a hobbyist showing tricks just to friends and family. I like the variation where you can let the spectator shuffle the cards.
Message: Posted by: rowdymagi5 (Jun 4, 2021 10:11AM)
I think it depends on which numbers they call out. If they hit on the numbers where you do not need to mix the cards, you are golden. Otherwise, in my opinion, anytime they name a number and then you start manipulating the cards, it is always a dead giveaway,
Message: Posted by: Claudio (Jun 4, 2021 12:26PM)
I was intrigued by this.

Is there more to the Jack Yates method than working out the starting position of the target card from the called-out number?

After all there are only 6 starting positions so it did not take much time to reverse-engineer.

I donít know the original method, which might well be cleverer than what I came up with, but in my handling thereís no need to mix the cards after the number has been called.
Message: Posted by: docguitarman (Jun 4, 2021 12:40PM)
[quote]On Jun 4, 2021, Claudio wrote:
I was intrigued by this.

Is there more to the Jack Yates method than working out the starting position of the target card from the called-out number?

After all there are only 6 starting positions so it did not take much time to reverse-engineer.

I donít know the original method, which might well be cleverer than what I came up with, but in my handling thereís no need to mix the cards after the number has been called. [/quote]

I'd say yes and no. The method is a little bit more clever than just working out the starting position. Your solution sounds different. There are some easy "sleights" and moves employed. As I mentioned since 6 is not a prime it is not based on the prime number force. That's all I'll say without giving it away ! I tried reverse-engineering it, but I miss read details of the procedure. For the intro $2.50 I think I got my money's worth.

Regards,
Phil
Message: Posted by: Claudio (Jun 4, 2021 01:06PM)
[quote]On Jun 4, 2021, docguitarman wrote:
[quote]On Jun 4, 2021, Claudio wrote:
I was intrigued by this.

Is there more to the Jack Yates method than working out the starting position of the target card from the called-out number?

After all there are only 6 starting positions so it did not take much time to reverse-engineer.

I donít know the original method, which might well be cleverer than what I came up with, but in my handling thereís no need to mix the cards after the number has been called. [/quote]



I'd say yes and no. The method is a little bit more clever than just working out the starting position. Your solution sounds different. There are some easy "sleights" and moves employed. As I mentioned since 6 is not a prime it is not based on the prime number force. That's all I'll say without giving it away ! I tried reverse-engineering it, but I miss read details of the procedure. For the intro $2.50 I think I got my money's worth.

Regards,
Phil [/quote]

Phil,

A ďtrickĒ is so much more than a method, so even if the method is simple, other elements (presentation etc.) make up the value of the trick. I hope my post did not appear disparaging.

To be sure Iím getting the procedure (not the method) right: When the number is called out, the cards are dealt from top to bottom one at a time and the next card (at named number + 1) is turned up and eliminated?

If youíre OK discussing method by PM, Iíll be happy to share my findings and exchange ideas about the handling.
Message: Posted by: docguitarman (Jun 4, 2021 01:43PM)
[quote]On Jun 4, 2021, Claudio wrote:
[quote]On Jun 4, 2021, docguitarman wrote:
[quote]On Jun 4, 2021, Claudio wrote:
I was intrigued by this.

Is there more to the Jack Yates method than working out the starting position of the target card from the called-out number?

After all there are only 6 starting positions so it did not take much time to reverse-engineer.

I donít know the original method, which might well be cleverer than what I came up with, but in my handling thereís no need to mix the cards after the number has been called. [/quote]



I'd say yes and no. The method is a little bit more clever than just working out the starting position. Your solution sounds different. There are some easy "sleights" and moves employed. As I mentioned since 6 is not a prime it is not based on the prime number force. That's all I'll say without giving it away ! I tried reverse-engineering it, but I miss read details of the procedure. For the intro $2.50 I think I got my money's worth.

Regards,
Phil [/quote]

Phil,

A ďtrickĒ is so much more than a method, so even if the method is simple, other elements (presentation etc.) make up the value of the trick. I hope my post did not appear disparaging.

To be sure Iím getting the procedure (not the method) right: When the number is called out, the cards are dealt from top to bottom one at a time and the next card (at named number + 1) is turned up and eliminated?

If youíre OK discussing method by PM, Iíll be happy to share my findings and exchange ideas about the handling. [/quote]

Hi Claudio,
Yes I agree 100% that the effect is more than the method. I did not find your post disparaging at all. The e-book contains presentation elements too. Yes, the procedure is exactly as you say. It is stated in the description but I did key in on the elimination part which in the description says: "...until only two cards remain."
I'd be interested in your method. Shoot me a PM. Of course, I won't divulge the ebook method if yours is different. From your description it sounds different to me and intriguing!
Regards,
Phil
Message: Posted by: Claudio (Jun 4, 2021 02:28PM)
PM sent.
Message: Posted by: socalguy (Jun 6, 2021 08:50AM)
I just purchased this. The price is now $5, but I love the fun Russian Roulette premise.
Thanks for posting and love the additional commentary. Now I am interested in buying Loraynes
Jaw Droppers. I have most of his books but not this one.
Message: Posted by: ipe (Jun 7, 2021 08:49AM)
I bought it and I'm not so happy.
50% of the time (but I would say the probability is psychologically higher) you need to manipulate the cards after the number is called.

Anyone has an improvement of it?

Claudio, how much for you hands-off version? :bg:
Message: Posted by: Claudio (Jun 7, 2021 08:53AM)
[quote]On Jun 7, 2021, ipe wrote:
I bought it and I'm not so happy.
50% of the time (but I would say the probability is psychologically higher) you need to manipulate the cards after the number is called.

Anyone has an improvement of it?

Claudio, how much for you hands-off version? :bg: [/quote]

PMed you Ipe.
Message: Posted by: Claudio (Jun 7, 2021 02:33PM)
I have had a few requests about my handling that I was happy to share by PM.

Much of the feedback I got was complimentary and I thank you guys for that and your further ideas.

But my belief is that even with what I consider an improvement, the Jack Yates handling is in fact, IMHO, suboptimal and is not what Iíd use for that effect.

Best,
Claudio