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Topic: Cardini and others - finally have it.
Message: Posted by: zaki_rafih99 (Jan 4, 2005 04:43PM)
Hey guys, I finally have the footage, well most of it, the quality is shockingly good as well. when my friend made them onto a dvd for me the quality was garbage and I was worried the original ripped files would have been the same quality. but they are not, they are the same quality as the tape I had originally got them from! right now I have 3 of the 5 performances on my computer , Cardini's full act, Lance Burton's candlestick/dove act, and Norm Nielson's Card/Violin act. I am still waiting to get the Pual Gertner tonight show act, and the Dai Vernon cups and balls act (from the Magic Circus when he was 78). If anyone is able to host these on a site please respond and tell me how to get the files to you, I don't have my own site and have no way of getting the files to everyone.

thanks,

zack
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 4, 2005 04:59PM)
I'll host them. Send them to MagicShaneW@gmail.com.

If you can't send them due to file size, add me to MSN messenger at MagicShane@hotmail.com.

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: zaki_rafih99 (Jan 4, 2005 06:39PM)
Ok, Shane has offered to host it. I'm just sending him the stuff now so hopefully by maybe tomorrow you can view them.
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 4, 2005 08:27PM)
I'm recieving the files now. When they have finished downloading, I'll compress and upload them to [url]http://www.MagicShane.com[/url].

I'll post when they're up.

Shane Wiker


Posted: Jan 5, 2005 1:56pm
----------------------------------------
The Cardini footage is up and working.

See them in the video section of my website (See link in signature).

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: RazzleDazzle (Jan 5, 2005 01:14PM)
Cant seem to find the video section of your site. I see your personal demo (nice work). ;)
Message: Posted by: Vandy Grift (Jan 5, 2005 01:30PM)
This is excellent. Thanks zaki and Shane for getting this up on the site. Awesome.
Message: Posted by: Paul H (Jan 5, 2005 01:39PM)
I cant locate the video section either. I very much enjoyed your card magic though.

Regards,

Paul H
Message: Posted by: Vandy Grift (Jan 5, 2005 01:52PM)
You will need to click on the "Magician" tab on the top of the page. Enter the password, then you will be taken to the magicians page. Click videos and you'll find it.
Message: Posted by: Gary D (Jan 5, 2005 01:59PM)
Thanks very much for this.
Message: Posted by: paisa23 (Jan 5, 2005 02:32PM)
Shane I cant locate anything in your site. Can you help me?


Posted: Jan 5, 2005 3:34pm
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I think I got it up. Thanks a lot.


Posted: Jan 5, 2005 3:41pm
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Ok, I did get it and wow the man was really something huh? Thank you guys for posting this up.
Message: Posted by: Elias P (Jan 5, 2005 04:12PM)
I really enjoyed watching that. Thanks a lot Zack and Shane!
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 5, 2005 07:35PM)
I just uploaded a video of Norm Nielson's card and violin act.

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: Thirston (Jan 5, 2005 07:49PM)
This is good, my computer will play all of these.
Message: Posted by: zaki_rafih99 (Jan 5, 2005 10:49PM)
Hope everyone can enjoy them.
Message: Posted by: kipling100 (Jan 6, 2005 03:03AM)
THANKS!!
How did you get the Cardini footage?
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 6, 2005 12:50PM)
It's great to see that everyone is enjoying them. I've just added a clip of Dai Vernon performing his cups and balls routine (Under the Magician>Videos>Other section).

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: paisa23 (Jan 6, 2005 01:40PM)
The Dai clip is great thanks a lot Shane.
Message: Posted by: tommy (Jan 6, 2005 02:52PM)
Zaki and Shane

Thanks. I do not know how they do that stuff but how could that Cardini do it wearing gloves!
Message: Posted by: sugam (Jan 6, 2005 03:13PM)
Thanks for these videos and hosting them!

Yeah, card manipulations with gloves... one of the great things about Cardini.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 6, 2005 03:14PM)
Shane, I look forward to watching those videos later this evening. Do I need a password?

Best to you, and THANKS!! jon
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 6, 2005 03:22PM)
Jonathan,

Yes, you do need a password to get into the magicians section, but I'm sure you already know it. When you click on magicians, a box should pop up with a question. Answer it in all lower case, and then just click on videos, and either card or other to access them. You can also select news to see what's been updated.

Tomorrow I'll add a clip of Paul Gertner and his cups and balls routine.

Iíve also sent an e-mail about hosting the Lance Burton clip, and am waiting for it to be approved.

Thanks for the clips Zack.

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: Magicmike1949 (Jan 6, 2005 11:51PM)
Thanks for sharing. Really appreciate it. Cardini was one of the greatest. Unique.
Message: Posted by: Tony Noice (Jan 7, 2005 12:41AM)
Hi Shane,
Any way that you can post the Cardini footage so it can be accessed on a Mac? RealPlayer and QuickTime usually work fine. Is yours in MediaPlayer?
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 7, 2005 12:44AM)
Tony,

Yes, it's in WMV format. I'll try to convert it to RealPlayer if I can, and PM you when I do.

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: Firebert (Jan 7, 2005 01:09AM)
Shane and Zak, I just watched the videos. I absolutely loved them, and want to thank you both for sharing them. If anybody wants to see what REAL magic looks like, watch the Cardini footage. WOW. :jump:
Message: Posted by: Paul Sherman (Jan 7, 2005 02:45AM)
Shane, thanks for hosting the Cardini video. Zack, thanks for digging up the footage. I had only seen a small portion of his act (the end of the cigarette act, concluding with the cigar production).

Talk about a beautiful act by an amazing artist.

Paul
Message: Posted by: JackTrumper (Jan 7, 2005 04:25AM)
Thx guys both Zaki and Shane really enjoyed it.
Message: Posted by: Yfirum (Jan 7, 2005 04:36AM)
Wow, thanks for sharing!
Cardini is unbelievable...
Message: Posted by: Gary D (Jan 7, 2005 07:33AM)
Thanks very much.

I've wanted to see the Dai routine for ages.
Message: Posted by: Gary Plants (Jan 7, 2005 10:27AM)
Shane,

Do you suppose that L&L would care about posting part of a video that they are selling? Maybe you asked permission to put this on your site. If you didn't, you might want to.
Message: Posted by: Andrei (Jan 7, 2005 10:37AM)
Thanks Shane and Zaki.
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 7, 2005 10:46AM)
[quote]
On 2005-01-07 11:27, hofzinser wrote:
Shane,

Do you suppose that L&L would care about posting part of a video that they are selling? Maybe you asked permission to put this on your site. If you didn't, you might want to.
[/quote]

I thought about that, but here's why I don't think I should contact L&L (I'm not sure if all of them are sold by L&L, or just the Dai Vernon one, since I didn't have them originally). L&L didn't originally make that video, they took it from Dai Vernon. Although I'm not 100% sure, I don't think that L&L exclusively owns that video. Also, I think it will be ok to show that clip, since I'm not selling it, but I could be wrong, so if someone could explain the law regarding this situation, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks,
Shane Wiker

I've uploaded a video of Paul Gertner performing a bill change, a matrix routine, and a cups and balls routine (The video was originally from the Tonight Show).

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: Roy McIlwee (Jan 7, 2005 11:43AM)
Thanks for the great footage, Roy McIlwee
Message: Posted by: Yiannis (Jan 7, 2005 12:30PM)
Zaki and Shane, many thanks for the great footage!!
Message: Posted by: Bennettjc (Jan 7, 2005 08:25PM)
Shane:
I'm going to send you something from Don Alan and a little Vernon home movie.
Thanks so much for hosting!
Message: Posted by: ncsteve (Jan 7, 2005 09:37PM)
I am answering the question correctly but when I enter it (at the "magician" tab I just get a page of computer hyroglypics. Can anyone tell me how to fix this?
Thanks,
Steve
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 7, 2005 11:28PM)
The answer is "marlo." It's been debated over whether Marlo or Vernon invented the move, but the difference is that they called it different things.

Since the question is who invented the tilt move, the answer is "marlo."


Bennett,

I sent you instructions on how to send the file.

Thanks,
Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: ncsteve (Jan 8, 2005 03:06AM)
Since one of the most famous (& talked about moves in magic) "The Man That Fooled Houdini" was used before Marlo was no more than a baby(or maybe no more than a gleem in the old man's eye). I can't really see any reason to debate. But whatever you wanna believe is OK with me. I am grateful for the Cardini video.
I just hate I was too foolish to rename all the sleights I found on my own. I was young & never realized I could claim sleights just by changing their name.
Oh well live & learn,
Steve
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 8, 2005 12:04PM)
Steve,

Honestly, I'm in no position to argue over who created the move. What I'm saying is that since they named the move different things (Note, I'm still not saying that Marlo invented the move, or that naming it differently means itís a different move), it should be clear that since the question is, "Who invented the tilt move?" the answer would be Marlo.

Like I said, I don't know enough about the subject to debate over whether Marlo or Vernon invented the move, but I think most people will be able to answer the question anyway.

I haven't added any updates yet as of today, but I will be adding a couple of things (And converting some of the files to Real Media Player) this afternoon.

I still haven't heard back about the Lance Burton clip, but I'll keep you posted.

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: Cameron Roat (Jan 8, 2005 01:01PM)
Steve,

The trick with which Dai Vernon fooled Harry Houdini had absolutely nothing to do with tilt (or the depth illusion). Also, I would not be so quick to chastise Edward Marlo and his vast contribution to card magic.

Shane,

Thanks for the great magic video clips.

Cameron
Message: Posted by: gilbert3 (Jan 8, 2005 01:05PM)
Hofzinser invented the tilt move
Message: Posted by: Bennettjc (Jan 8, 2005 09:51PM)
A Don Alan file was just sent to Shane. Enjoy! And thanks, again, Shane for hosting.
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 8, 2005 10:14PM)
Thanks Bennett,

I've already done my update for today, but I'll add it to the site first thing tomorrow morning.

If anyone else has any videos, send me an e-mail. I can send you a Gmail account, which will allow you to send videos of almost any size.

Shane Wiker

Update: Jan 9 2005

A video of Don Alan performing a chop cup routine, a cup and sponge ball routine, and a coin and hat routine has been added. Go to the video section, then the others section to find the video.

Also, the Cardini video has been converted to Real Media format for those without Windows Media Player. Just go to the Cardini page and click on RM (It's next to WMV).

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: Bennettjc (Jan 9, 2005 07:12AM)
Guys:
I realized that the Don Alan clip doesn't include card magic so this may be the wrong forum...However he is thought of by some to be a pioneer of close-up presentation. I heard Eugene Burger say "Today most close-up magicians are imitating Don Alan and they don't even know who he is." Hence..my sending the clip to Shane.
Message: Posted by: fingerjack (Jan 9, 2005 09:10AM)
Thanks for the Cardini clip fellas! I had previously only had bits and pieces. To think, I took Giobbi's word on the TILT. Great stuff and thanks again!
Message: Posted by: Gary D (Jan 9, 2005 12:53PM)
I'm looking forward to promise Vernon movie.
Message: Posted by: JoshEarp (Jan 9, 2005 06:06PM)
I am curious as to how you guys "obtain" these clips.

Anyways, I have enjoyed every video on there.

Any new videos coming into act soon?
Message: Posted by: Adam Keisner (Jan 9, 2005 06:15PM)
Thanks for that Zack and Shane, great to see footage of Don Alan.
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 9, 2005 06:21PM)
I've received a PM telling me that the Don Alan video is actually from Glenn Bishop's website, so I took the video down.

You can see it at:
http://www.bishmagic.org/

Josh,

Like I said, I'm still waiting to hear back about the Lance Burton clip. If I can get permission, it will go online soon. If I don't hear back today, I'll call.

If anyone else has any videos, send them to mail@magicshane.com, or MagicShaneW@gmail.com

If the file is too large, I'll send you a Gmail account which will allow you to send videos of almost any size.

Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: JoshEarp (Jan 9, 2005 06:32PM)
That's sad to hear.

I mean, so what if you guys have the same video? What's the big deal?
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 9, 2005 07:16PM)
[quote]
On 2005-01-08 04:06, ncsteve wrote:
Since one of the most famous (& talked about moves in magic) "The Man That Fooled Houdini" was used before Marlo was no more than a baby...[/quote]

I'm confused by this reference to the Vernon/Houdini thing. The guy used a DL and a DB to make a card placed second from the top reappear on the top of the deck. What does this have to do with Marlo?

Where is a record of Hofzinser using a depth illusion in his card magic? Folks like Richard Hatch, Edward Victor, Dai Vernon and Ed Marlo would have been very attentive to messing up any Hofzinser credits.
Message: Posted by: Ziggy (Jan 9, 2005 09:02PM)
Thanks Shane for hosting these videos, it was a real pleasure to watch the old masters at work, I have never seen Cardini perform before, wow, incredible
Message: Posted by: gilbert3 (Jan 10, 2005 05:33AM)
[quote]
Where is a record of Hofzinser using a depth illusion in his card magic? Folks like Richard Hatch, Edward Victor, Dai Vernon and Ed Marlo would have been very attentive to messing up any Hofzinser credits.
[/quote]

See 'Remember and Forget #1' from 'Hofzinsers Card Conjuring' and read with an open mind. Also see same in 'Hofzinsers Card Tricks' by Karl Fulves and read the end notes.
Message: Posted by: Bennettjc (Jan 10, 2005 01:24PM)
Shane and Mr. Bishop:
Sorry about the Don Alan video. I download so much stuff that I forget where I get it from.

Some people where asking about the Vernon home video. It is possible that I may have gotten that from Mr. Bishop's site as well. It appears to be no longer there.
Perhaps it can be reposted.
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jan 10, 2005 03:49PM)
If it was Vernon doing the cone ball and hank, Silent Mora and Charlie Miller... Yes it was from my web site...
Message: Posted by: T. Joseph O'Malley (Jan 10, 2005 06:24PM)
[quote]
On 2005-01-09 20:16, Jonathan Townsend wrote:
I'm confused by this reference to the Vernon/Houdini thing. The guy used a DL and a DB to make a card placed second from the top reappear on the top of the deck. What does this have to do with Marlo?
[/quote]

In this case, nothing. I have heard MANY guys wrongly state that Vernon used the depth of illusion/tilt/whatever you want to call it move to fool Houdini - that he tried to create the illusion of inserting into the centre of the deck. My understanding is that he openly placed the card under the DB card and made no secret "move" of doing this. The DL was the move.

I wasn't there though...my guess is that there's a teaching video out there that is popular that wrongly states that this is how Vernon fooled Houdini - with the "tilt". It couldn't be in a book, otherwise there'd only be about 5 people who think this...
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jan 10, 2005 07:03PM)
The trick that fooled Houdini according to the Revelations video on card cheating was the same effect that fooled Kennedy and helped Vernon learn the center deal. It wasn't the tilt or the Depth deception according to that story...

It was something else...

It is not my effect to expose so I wonít expose it here!
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 11, 2005 12:47AM)
The Dai Vernon video has been taken down, after receiving an e-mail from Steve Pellegrino from L&L. It's a shame that people are so paranoid about these things, especially considering the fact that it's not reducing sales. Anyway, the law is the law. Sorry to disappoint you guys.

Shane Wiker

BTW, the rest of the videos are still up.
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Jan 11, 2005 01:00AM)
Shane:

Your posting of the video was completely with good intentions. I understood that from the outset. But you did the right thing taking it down.
Message: Posted by: BlackShadow (Jan 11, 2005 06:59AM)
I fully support the ideals of Shane on this matter. It's a shame that certain people cannot recognise the true benefits of endeavours such as his, and the overall benefit they will bring to the magical community.
Message: Posted by: chrisrkline (Jan 11, 2005 07:42AM)
It is within L&L rights to do this. I am guessing that L&L, and Mr. Pellegino understand that Shane meant no harm here. They are simply following standard business practices concerning copyrighted material. Shane can seek permission to show this or any other video on his site using standard legal channels. I hope this does not turn into a personal attack on anyone, least of which L&L Publishing. L&L does not have to justify to anyone their view on bringing benefits to the magical community or how they should handle third party usage of copyrighted material.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 11, 2005 08:51AM)
Folks, Perhaps they would be more amenable to these small video performance clips being hosted if;

1) permissions for hosting were granted beforehand
2) the clip would have a banner stating the copyright
3) the page liking the clip would have a clear statement of the source and permissions

Just a few suggestions on what can be discussed among those who wish to have clips online and those who wish to host the clips for display
Message: Posted by: mormonyoyoman (Jan 11, 2005 07:32PM)
I really doubt L&L was being nasty-tempered, Black Shadow. The problems with holding a copyright (or a patent) is that if you DON'T stop people from using your copyrighted (or patented) product without permission, you lose the copyright (or patent). National Periodical Publications almost lost their copyright (twice) to Superman, once because of this very thing. (And what a shame, since it would have been lost to Superman's creators.)

*jeep!
--Chet
Message: Posted by: Laban (Jan 12, 2005 10:39AM)
[b]Shane Wiker[/b]

Great site, I loved it.

*Though I'd like to suggest, that you make a 'harder' password for the magicians section - just a suggestion :) *
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 12, 2005 11:38AM)
Laban,

Thanks for the compliment. The reason I don't make the password harder is because I'm not looking to keep out newer magicians, I'm only trying to keep out laymen. I'm sure that most laymen won't know the answer, but most magicians will.

I'm still looking for more submissions; so if anyone has an article, video (Of themselves or someone else, as long as you know who owns it), or review, send it to mail@MagicShane.com

Thanks,
Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: BlackShadow (Jan 12, 2005 12:30PM)
I never said L&L were being nasty tempered or did I say they weren't acting within their rights.

But I do believe in this situation when a low res clip has been posted on a bonafide website, that a sensible course of action which benefits the majority is to grant permission for it to be posted with a link and reference to that company's products which may feature it or related material such as L&L's C&B series by Ammar.

Instead, the standard course of action is to demand removal without, it seems, considering the above option. That would in fact negate the argument concerning possible loss of copyright, because then permission would have been given and the terms of that permission made clear.

Anyway, enough of that. That's my point of view and I'm sticking to it ;)

I like your site and how it's developing Shane. I would post on the board, but you need to register and its such a hassle regsitering for all these multiple boards. If you want a much better free message board system which is much more customisable/powerful than ezboards (eg you can have some forums for guest posting and others where you must register as well as all the hidden ones and ones where you need a minimum number of posts to see then I'd suggest http://www.proboards.com )

PW was very obvious to me, but a layman could find it in 10 secs using Google if he wanted. I'm not a fan of secret areas but if you do want to keep them more secure, you need a quiz system like the Learned Pig which has its many drawbacks too!
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 15, 2005 09:08PM)
Black Shadow,

I've tried several times over the last week, but the Pro Boards website seems to be down. :hmm:

Also, I just got an e-mail back, which said:

"I had Lance Burton look at the video and he feels that you run the risk of infringing on a copyright and prefers that you don't use it. The BBC filmed the Paul Daniels show some 22 years ago so unless you want to deal with the BBC and buy the rights it's not legal to use."

Sorry everyone, but it looks like I won't be able to use the Lance Burton video.

Oh well,
Shane Wiker
Message: Posted by: richardl (Jan 17, 2005 05:04PM)
Wow!

Great videos!

The Norn Nielson and Cardini clips were amazing. Good job!

Keep up the good work Shane.

BTW, it must be pretty cool to know that Lance Burton went to your website. :)

- Richard
Message: Posted by: Shane Wiker (Jan 19, 2005 09:07PM)
Thanks Richard,

Isn't it great to watch such amazing magicians?

Jonathan Townsend submitted a very deceptive video of his ball vanish.

Shane Wiker