The Magic Caf
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » All tied up! » » Copyright help (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Cliffg37
View Profile
Inner circle
Long Beach, CA
2491 Posts

Profile of Cliffg37
Hi Everybody,

I need some help with a copyright question, and perhaps one of you can help me.

As I have read in "The Linking Ring" the magazine of The International Brotherhood of magicians, you can not copyright an effect. You can patent a piece of magical equipment of your design, and if you "write a play" you can copyright the patter and effect together.

This means if you market an effect with patter, that can be protected by copyright from a friend sharing with a freind kind of thing.
The last bit is a suggestion that when a magician performs for magicians, he should credit the inventer/creator of an effect. Performing for a lay audience this is not necessary.

Can anyone add to this, specifically for escapes?

I recieved a scathing e-mail yesterday from the so called manager of an E.A. telling me of his plans to "do what ever he had to" so as to prevent my doing the dragged escape which he felt his client had the copyright to. The e-mail came through my personal box, where I prefer that Café business be kept to "PMs".

My feeling is that the "dragged" escape probably goes back to the early 1900s where it was probably done with a horse and buggy. Can anyone verify that or point me in the right direction to look for it?

In any case I did not take this e-mail too seriously (though I saved it if need be for legal purposes) since the author acknowleged in the e-mail that I had added my own bit and changed it from his clients act.

Assistance is welcomed.
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right!
Harley Newman
View Profile
Inner circle
5117 Posts

Profile of Harley Newman
You can patent equipment. You can copyright a script, with either a paper script, or a videotape. But that's as far as a creator is protected.

If you create a stunt or escape, others can copy it, as long as they change the presentation. Many performers use this as justification for outright stealing the material of others, and say it's ethical. I disagree, but I'm not a lawyer, judge, or jury. I'm just a guy whose material is sometimes "borrowed".

This may be changing, as intellectual property laws seem to be changing. Consulting a lawyer who specializes in intellectual property law, would be your best bet.

Re: the dragging escape, I've heard several forms of it over the years. I have no knowledge of its origin. I believe Steve Baker was the first to do it on TV, and certainly his presentation is his own. The idea of drawn and quartered is much older than Steve, elder statesman though he is.
“You can’t depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus” -Mark Twain

www.bladewalker.com
Harry Murphy
View Profile
Inner circle
Maryland
5445 Posts

Profile of Harry Murphy
Cliff, don't worry about it! Shortly after I had performed my version of the "Risking Being Dragged to Death Escape" and posted about it here on the Café', I got a similar, but very abusive, email. The EA in question ranted and raved using foul and abusive language of how I had stolen his great, unique, and wonderful idea.

I went to his website and read his advertised "proposed" presentations and mine came no where close! In fact, my performance would be considered pertty tame (or lame) compared to his "proposed" idea.

Frankly, the concept has a long history and is even featured in some old films. Dean Gunnarson did a version many years ago actually being dragged behind a speedboat (which is documented on the DVD of his various escapes that he sells).

The version I performed, and that you planned to perform, is not anything like the version that the “EA” who emailed you proposes to perform. The only thing they have in common is the risk of being dragged if one doesn’t escape.

His presentation is very good and unique to him (I might add that he has yet to perform his version and most likely never will). However, the basic concept (being dragged) is not his. He can copyright his script about risking being dragged by a jet car with hands cuffed and then fastened in a box all he wants. My script/performance (and probably yours) doesn’t come anywhere close to his.

You (and everyone in the world) have my permission to perform the escape exactly as I outlined it. The version I performed is not even close to anyone else’s (not the abusive “EA’s”, Dean Gunnarson’s, Steranko’s version from the 50’s, Steve Baker's version, or any of the Hollywood versions that have been seen on the silver screen for decades!).

If you want a nice exercise, go to that abusive EA’s website and get a list of all the corporate functions he has performed at. Now start calling (or emailing) the companies trying to locate anyone who remembers hiring him or remembers his act. tell them you want their review of how good a job he did for them. You will be very surprised!
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
Cliffg37
View Profile
Inner circle
Long Beach, CA
2491 Posts

Profile of Cliffg37
Thanks Harry,

I feel better about it now.
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right!
Starry
View Profile
Loyal user
New York
219 Posts

Profile of Starry
Cliff,

I'm not an attorney, but I've played one on TV.

Don't sweat it too much, he doesn't have much to stand on. A copyright protects the written language and not the idea or concept. Being a publisher, I own several copyrighted works, and I have also applied for a couple of patents. One of which is still pending. The EA could apply for a "design" patent which may be granted, but any pre-existence of the "design" would pretty much exclude granting. Here is some information from the U.S. Copyright office.

Scripts

Generally, dramatic works such as plays, screenplays, and radio or television scripts are works intended to be performed. Dramatic works usually include spoken text, plot, and directions for action. Because of misconceptions about copyright registration for radio and television presentations, the following points require emphasis:

* The title of a program or series of programs cannot be copyrighted;
* The general idea or concept for a program is not copyrightable. Copyright will protect the literary or dramatic expression of an author’s idea but not the idea itself; and
* Registration for a particular script applies only to the copyrightable material in that script. “Blanket” registration for future scripts or for a series as a whole is not available. (However, an unpublished collection of material may be registered with one application.)

Pantomimes and Choreographic Works

Choreography and pantomimes are also copyrightable dramatic works. Choreography is the composition and arrangement of dance movements and patterns usually intended to be accompanied by music. As distinct from choreography, pantomime is the art of imitating or acting out situations, characters, or other events. To be protected by copyright, pantomimes and choreography need not tell a story or be presented before an audience. Each work, however, must be fixed in a tangible medium of expression from which the work can be performed. Note: Sports games and physical-fitness exercises are not considered choreographic works.
Ace Starry - Author or THE MAGIC LIFE - A NOVEL PHILOSOPHY
http://www.starry.com/
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » All tied up! » » Copyright help (0 Likes)
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.03 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL