I get quite a few emails from various 'sellers' of magic items as I expect many if not all of us do. Anyway I received one today and it made me think does such a thing as false advertising exsist when marketing a 'magic item'? If so what can be done? I know we have all bought items in the past probably due to the advertising hype (if you haven't you have been very fortunate!)only to be somewhat disgrunteled upon receiveing item as the ad. wasn't entirely misleading but we were fooled by the hype. Not much you can do about that, only be a little more cautious next time or wait for reviews etc. But have a look at this http://www.magicmakersinc.com/AWDEMO.wmv
and listen to the description of the wallet. Now I'm NOT saying this is the usual M.M. copy of another effect I am just concerned that the description and hype given to the wallet isn't quite right. Surely this is the old effect of the matching prediction under the envelope but brought out of the wallet. Fair enough. Nice idea I suppose, but to claim that the 'Wallet' is something special is surely misleading. I could be wrong but I can't see what extra the wallet can add apart from presentation. Has anyone purchased this effect? If so, no need to go into detail about the mechanics, just say whether I am right or wrong. Again!

Posted: Jun 28, 2006 6:34am
By the way Steve, please don't delete this topic. I know I may be giving something away in the previous post, but, if I am right I think potential purchasers should be made aware. If I am wrong, then no harm done! Thanks.

I'm just wondering why you need this wallet to do this trick. Can't you do it with just the envelope?

That's my point, What is so special about the wallet? Is this false advertising?

Not if they tell you it is the "method" you are paying for.

Fals advertising and magic sellers? First time those 2 phrases have collided isn't it?

Danny, did you read my initial post? Have you looked at the link? I don't think you have otherwise you couldn't possibly arrived at what you have just said. The 'method' isn't mentioned. Whoever is demonstrating it just refers to the special wallet. False advertising or 'hype', I think there could be difference.
Anyway forget it. It's going nowhere as usual. I just found it interesting to see how obviously true proffesional and respected dealers sold their stuff. I didn't mean to offend anyone. Leave you to it.

Actually oddly enough buddy I AGREE WITH YOU!

why so hostile?

magic dealers have been hyping so long they forget the truth.

back off settle down and take this with you. I am on your side.

I am just happy that my act needs little more than some rope and a deck of cards. I don't like magic as a hobby so I am immune to the hype game.

anyone who needs the things, or has magic as a hobby should be quite upset!

I just get a bit 'miffed' when, like yourself, you jump in with a reply without even taking a look at what I was refering to. IF the method was for sale then obviously no problem. IF you had watched the clip then you would have noticed that the method wasn't for sale as such, the method isn't mentioned. All emphasis is on this 'special' wallet. But as you say you don't buy gimmicks etc. so probably you won't understand what I mean. I'm not wanting a war with you, neither do I want you to simply agree with everything I post, but you have started immediately in this topic exactly as you have done in the others - trying to shoot me down even if what you say bares no relevance to the point I am making.

Collin take a step back buddy.

First off LOTS of tricks that are selling special wallets are really selling methods.

For example a Mullica Wallet. Available for 10 bucks at Wal Mart. Cost what about 90? Almost 1 minute of modification is needed. So are they selling method or wallet? You tell me.

You are not too bright as I said I agree with you!!!!!!!!! NOT trying to shoot you down, but pointing out how right you are.

Apparantly on planet collin this is a bad thing. Sorry to agree with you.

YES the method is not mentioned. Let me brace you for a harsh reality. MAGIC DEALERS ARE IN BUSINESS TO SELL STUFF. As such they make things sound as good as possible.

Many of them actually guild the lilly! And a few flat out lie!

So you say the method isn't for sale as such. Like I said neither is it for the Mullica, but again it is a good example.

So step back. Take your panties out of a bunch and realise when someone actually agrees with you.

Oh and it DOES have a bearing on what you said. You may not be lucid enough to connect it, but I bet others are.

Right. Now read the first thing I said.'Does false advertising exist when selling a magic item? Well DOES IT? The clue is in the question. DOES IT? You, Danny have pointed out that it does. Question 2. Can anything be done about it? You have decided that it can't, because there are lot's of people 'doing it'. O.K. Copies are here to stay and lets face it NOT MANY RIP-OFF MERCHANTS ARE BREAKING ANY LAWS. If the item hasn't got a Patent anyone can make it. But, surely you have Trading standards over there don't you? Whether an item is genuine or not, if it doesn't do what you claim it can do then are you or are you not breaking some sort of law? But as you also point out some lie and that is acceptable. It is the norm. So we live with it. Nothing like a bit of progress is there, and this is nothing like progress. But I'm not lucid enough (thankfully) to follow that train of thought.

Collin I don't think anyone should buy the rip off stuff.

In that other thread you allude to I have made my position clear. I don't support it in any way.

Do we live with it? NO we shouldn't.
Most magic items are sold with nonsense copy. Welcome to life. It really is the reason I learned slight of hand more than depending on gimicks and others tricks.

there has been 0 serious movement against these things. Look at your own life saver trick. Look at the pen thru anything. The magic community embraced the coppies. It sucks your right.

How many shops sell cheap knock offs of D'Lites? All screwed up? 6 card repeat? and on and on and on.

Is it right? NO. can it be stopped? Yes. Don't patronize those establishments. Learn slight of hand. Lots of ways to stop it. Problem is it involves work. Most simply like to complain, and not put in the work.

Is it right? NO. can it be stopped? Yes.
Give us a clue then.

I agree, (as it seams we all do...) Rip-Off Artists SUCK! (Sorry for the strong language.)

So what do we do that will have real impact and is legitimately doable? (Besides "Out" the losers and STOP patronizing them with our business?)


I am at your service and In HIS Service,
Deano
<><

Happy Independence Weekend to one and all in the USA and anyone who likes freedom!

As I have said before in many topics covering similar ailments of the magic world, I LAY ALL THE BLAME AT THE FEET OF THE BLIND GREEDY EDITORS OF 'RESPECTABLE' MAGIC MAGAZINES.
If you cant advertise, you will not sell. You can have cheapomagic.com today, but if you can't tell anyone it your site exists, no-one (or very few) will find it. I know I may as well bang my head against a wall but just because nothing changes it will NEVER, EVER change my view that I would like to leave 'magic' as we know it in a better state than when I found it. Anyone reading this will have some sort of interest in the art of magic otherwise they wouldn't be here. Fair comment? So why should the 'old boy's' say ''been there, tried that, forget it''?

If thing's don't alter they WILL stay the same.

Is that what everyone want's? Honestly? If that is the case, then I have got it wrong. I have read many times on different effects and in books 'Don't reveal the secret'! Well why don't we start to add in closed brackets (unless you want to sell a rip-off version of your own, then we'll turn a blind eye'?

Fiunal word: If you aim for nothing I guarrantee you will hit your target.

Over to you Danny.

Colin... I get it, you along with most all of us don’t like theft and corruption, so THAT is why I ask you AGAIN, as a passionate advocate, instead of being a victim and blaming (speaking as one who has been ripped off as well...) WHAT DO YOU SUGGEST WE ACTUALLY DO to make things better for the next guys as well as begin to get back what may have been lost?

NO more "finger pointing and blaming", What do we do now?

That is what I am asking so we can begin to take some sort of control back instead of running around as wounded kitten and victim...

What say you?

SOLUTIONS brother... solutions!

I will even start the ball rolling:

- Certainly we can start by creating appropriate awareness and “out” the buggers!
- We can STOP supporting them and/maybe even or ANY business who supports them! (though THAT is complete topic all by itself since lots of magic shops buy rip-off stuff both knowingly and un-knowingly… separate topic of that same insidious bugger!)
- Stop, in your example, subscribing to the mags that support those business.
- Heck, we could write letters.
- Hire legal support as a group
- Report and follow up were we legally can! (Like E-bay… etc! Actually THAT are ‘pretty good’ about this kinda’ stuff if someone reports it!)
… we could, we could, we could.

How about using the outrage and make something GOOD out of it? Blame, finger pointing, rightous indignation and outraged apathy rarely accomplishes much of note.

What do we "DO" brother?

THAT is a discussion worth having and then doing something about!

Your turn...

I am at your service and In HIS Service,
Deano
<><

[Quote]- Certainly we can start by creating appropriate awareness and “out” the buggers!
- We can STOP supporting them and/maybe even or ANY business who supports them! (though THAT is complete topic all by itself since lots of magic shops buy rip-off stuff both knowingly and un-knowingly… separate topic of that same insidious bugger!)
- Stop, in your example, subscribing to the mags that support those business.
- Heck, we could write letters.
- Hire legal support as a group
- Report and follow up were we legally can! (Like E-bay… etc! Actually THAT are ‘pretty good’ about this kinda’ stuff if someone reports it!)
… we could, we could, we could

EXACTLY!

That basically covers what I tried to do at the time when it affected me most. I did contact the magazines. Did I get any replies? No.
I asked in this, and other forums, for people to stop subscribing to the mags that suppoted the rip-off artists. My post's got deleted.
etc. etc.
All you get is people posting reasons why copies aren't such a bad thing 'really' and what laws are they breaking? Ethical laws don't count.

In another topic I put the link so anyone (especially newcomers) would be made aware that there are copies out there and what the most common ones were. Not cosidered important enough to be a 'sticky topic' and so it slowly dissapears into oblivion.

All I was asking for was a little help, as I don't possess a magic wand but as you appear to have jumped on Danny's ''let's have an argument with the Brit. rather than a discussion bandwagon'', I think I'll finish there. I'll have a look in a couple of years and see how you have got on. Good luck!

Collin your a professional victim it seems.

Nobody wants to argue with you. How may times do I have to say I agree with you before you get it? I understand English is a bit different over here, but it seems as if you should understand we are on your side with this.

We would like to stop the rip off artists too. The only one arguing is the Brit! Now get past it and lets try to find a solution.

How about a magic publication which is dedicated to only advertisers above board? A new web site maybe with the same conditions? Yea it may take money but I bet we could come up with it.

Wanna try to do something like that or just complain how everyone is against the Brit?

Deans point is stop fingerpointing and do something.

I can’t judge if this is false advertising, for I don’t know if/how the wallet is gimmicked. It could be possible (but in my opinion rather unlikely) that it could produce any given card. Who knows?

In my eyes however, the video is extremely fair: I’ve seen the effect and already god two ideas how to do it with a plain wallet. Therefore buying this wallet is not an option for me. What more can I expect from video advertisement, than to teach me a trick and save money?

What can we do against false advertising, well ...

• not buying that stuff unseen
  
• read/write reviews
  
• buy at your local brick & mortar shop
  

Is it just me thinking like a magician? The method is painfully obvious and I would be afraid to perform this in front of any college graduate.

If You are thinking like a magician aren’t You intrigued to even fool college graduates with simple methods? Although I’ve to admit that with the shown handling You need a lot of personality and presentation – more than I could muster. Therefore why not change the handling: place the prediction at the table at the very beginning, show that it is a regular deck of cards or let the spectator reveal the identity of the stopped card as well as one ahead and one below and then let her have a free choice.

OK, for all this this You don’t need a gimmicked wallet. So maybe it was false advertising in the sense of “advertising gone flase”. On first glance the clip promots the product, on second it clearly steers You away from it.