How would I "prove" otherwise...I think I will refrain for now..

however check this out..

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1352057.stm

Truth is a perfect defence in a slander suit. Or a pinstriped suit, or a tuxedo.

Danny the link workeed earlier go back and look at it. They are all very respected in the medical profession. In fact Dr Prem was a major figure of the medical and dental association in the UK. They are all respected figures in the medical profession...

Im not saying I am agreeing with them.

Pretty ironic if you ask me, isn't the person who abused her as a child more responsible than the hypnotist? At least I KNOW that is what an American court will say.

Even funnier she only got 6500 pounds, the idiot should have paid her off.

By the way he "fell short of the standard of care" according to the judge. NOTHING to do with hypnosis.

The standard of care while using hypnosis...

There is a difference. And the claim was she was damaged because of "known dangers".

right she was on stage with a hypnotist and it had NOTHING to do with hypnosis despite criteria for standard of care comes from the hypnotism act.

Talk about spin.....you guys make me dizzy sometimes..

I don't think she was bothered about the money...

Posted: Jun 30, 2007 6:50pm
Here is a link that is working for that publication...

http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~katfox/stage1.htm

investigating stage hypnosis by tracey Okeef

MP all I did was quote the link YOU PROVIDED.

How am I spinning anything?

Interesting to note also that the case is 1994 and it seems to be THE ONLY one you can find. Tens of thousands of shows since havn't really suffered.

Although I will say that I can think of many shows not doing post proms any more because of 2 things. Broken wrists, and hypnotists doing inappropriate material.

REAL dangers and far more dangerous.

All I am doing is providing another side of the argument...

I didn't have to search for it I rememberd it since it had a big impact on insurance availability. I didn't spend much time on it. The other link I knew about it because as I said I appeard on the news defending stage hypnosis against Dr Prem who was the president of the medical and dental hypnosis association at the time. And a huge anti stage figure.

Just because there hasn't been successul prosecutions doesn't mean its safe. It means its difficult to prove one way or another.

All I am saying is I believe there may be some truth that it is potentially harmful in the wrong hands or for certain people who get up on stage.

And the incedents I have described which did indeed happen were dangerous for various reasons.

The "doctor" who wrote the book has a DCH "Doctor of Clinical Hypnosis" degree. Which is a degree not offered by any accredited school nor is it considered a valid degree by the APA for membership in ASCH. Interesting book? Perhaps. But as one who IS a clinical member of mainstream professional associations, I can assure you it is not one that will be published by any acceptable scientific/psychological journal or press. Most likely self-published.

Now lets enter the credential debate... LOL Guess that's another topic.

Posted: Jun 30, 2007 9:20pm
By the way MP -- The ONLY association accepted by the AMA, APA, ADA, BMA and BDA as the "medical and dental hypnosis" organization is ASCH and its foriegn counterparts. Now ASCH does NOT endorse stage hypnotism, quite the contrary, but when you claim someone is head of a "medical and dental" hypnosis association --- and it isn't ASCH, the AMA isn't accepting them as a valid organization....
And your Dr. Prem has never been head of ASCH...

OOPS.

Yea lets have a Bigfoot debate Richard, it is more credible it seems than our "Doctor" friend.

How can you have a debate, everyone KNOWS bigfoot is real. Who would one debate? He is a master stage hypnotist from Ireland, with a mail-order degree when not out skiing in Nepal. (Isn't that where bigfoot lives???)

Actually, I am off to Vegas in the AM to see the new show at House of Blues.

Please report on the show. I'm working here in Orlando at the HOB and I've been hinting of some kind of Belushi Seance with live music.

Tracy O'Keefe actually, Tracy put her "degree" on the title page of her OTHER book (Secret, Don't Tell, The Truth About Hypnotism) BEFORE she "earned" it. The "university" is a NON-RESIDENTIAL school - as in a diploma mill. She cited the "case" of Svengali and Trilby as FACT in the book!

Quality research this book most certainly is NOT. I would hazard a guess tht this book is not much more than a re-hash of the earlier nonsense, particularly as I cannot find ANY reviews of this book, which was published several years ago!

So citing O'Keefe, MP, is not a particularly good idea, especially when you are dealing with someone who bothers to check facts. Her degree is from a discredited diploma mill, which had to move from California to Hawaii, she tried to put it on the cover of her other book before she had been awarded the degree ad the other book was, allegedly her "doctoral" dissertation, which was NOT reviewed by a panel of academicians AT her so-called "university," as admitted to BY the university, itself!

Hence, her credibility is more than somewhat lacking.

Quod erat demonstratum.

Lee Darrow, C.H.

"This is a very important book. I congratulate the author for her courage and hard work" - Dr Basil Finer, MD, PhD Journal of European Society of Hypnosis in Psychotherapy and Psychosomatic Medicine


"This is a controversial book, which deserves to be read by every hypnotherapist" - Dr Morris Berg PhD, National Association of Counsellors, Hypnotherapists, and Psychotherapists

"Well put together and easy to read" - Derek Crussell, South London Hypnotherapy Practice

"It's about time someone wrote a book like this" - Dr Prem Misra, psychiatrist and past president of the British Society of Medical and Dental Hypnosis, Scotland


"An astounding piece of work" - Dr Miller, American Institute of Hypnotherapy on the thesis that formed the basis of this book


These testimonials are from professionals with impressive credentials and certainly not from a paper mill.


I recall you cited Melvin powers as one of your sources earlier to back up your argument..

I think I would be more likely to listen to the above esteemed professionals..

MP- after Lees post I am shocked that your would defend the integrity of the research in the book...

yoU KNOW LITTLE ABOUT HYPNOSIS EDUCATION OR CREDENTIALING. The quotes come from people with impressive sounding organization, but none with worldwide or national recognition, or acceptance by the American, British or other Medical Associations -- or even by psycholocical or hypnosis organizations.

You also fail to regognize, people are narcassistic, and LOVE having blurbs written by them on the backs of other peoples books. I have 14 books, I send copies to impressive people and they write a "blurb" even though they have never met me or probaly haven't read the book. Blurbs are a marketing tool. Easy to get and have no real meaning.... Bet if the people who wrote the blurbs read this post, they would be embarassed becasue it does associate them with a less than credible publication from a research perspective.

Just becasue something looks impressive, does not mean it is upon closer examination.

Goota run, going to feed the ducks with the kids tonight! Quack Quack for now!

There are no credentialing in hypnosis that are formely recognised anywhere. Especially stage hypnosis.

I am not sure they would be embarrassed either.My "friend" doctor Prem a respected figure in the medical community makes all kinds of claims about stage hypnosis. most of which are a bit "out there".

These are members of the Anti-brigade and will go to their graves with their views irrespective of what research says...But none the less they are respected.

Just because something looks impressive on closer examination it isn't. isn't that true of hypnosis certifications? Much more than the above book which does have support from respected sources.

My view is that by and large hypnosis is safe but there are real elements that are potentially damaging that do get glossed over. And my personal experiences are true of what I have witnessed.

And with that I will close my contribution to this thread. And move on.

Im with you MP, if I had a key I'd lock it! LOL