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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Roller coaster day. Got to my spot, ran into a cousin (I love living in RI) and I showed him some card stuff. A couple of people came by and I showed them some card stuff. I ended up with $8.00 in the hat and I hadn't even officially started yet.
Then I discovered I'd left my scissors at home! There was a CVS (drug store) a few blocks away and $7.00 of my hard won money was gone. I started working. I was doing great, little kids, college students, another magician, people in the pizza parlor. I'm making everyone happy. Everybody except the police lieutenant (sp) standing behind me. "What're you doing?" "Performing magic." "What's with the bucket?" "People give me tips." "I won't have it." "Um, I have a license..." "And it says; at the descretion of the police, doesn't it?" "Um yeah." "I won't have it!" So I pack up and he stands there watching me. When it's all in the case, he goes to his car and I ask him "why?" Now, listen to this reasoning. "OK, I've got you here, I've got the banjo player down the street and the other guy up there. With all of you it becomes a carnival and I get complaints so I won't have it." Here comes the wowser. "Maybe if you weren't soliciting money. If you didn't have the bucket there and weren't taking money from people then it would be OK." Now, exactly _how_ would "not taking money" change anything that he was complaining about? If all three of us were still there; "not taking money," it would still be the same "carnival" wouldn't it? Anyway, I took my $20-something dollars and went home. There was a Waterfire tonight, but I was told I have to get a special permit from the Waterfire people to perform there. I got his e-mail address and I'll look into that, but it's late in the season to be getting involved in Waterfire. I feel crappy.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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tom hughes Loyal user 225 Posts |
Mandrake,
today I headed out of the house to check out a pitch in a town I had heard of but never visited. When I got there it was busy but being down south roasting hot I waited an hour for it to cool down and see how the pitch worked, some local shopkeepers mentioned that I may need a permit but since there were no police in sight I decided to go for it. I found out that the pitch is good, easy to draw a crowd but that it only really works during the day. By the time I finished my show the foot traffic which had been pretty heavy had slowed to almost nothing. I packed up and went home having made just enough to cover my gas for the 1 1/2 journey each way from my home to the pitch. Result: I learned something. I'll go and work that pitch again but this time I'll get there early and work it all day... I'll make a bundle. Your result: You found out that there is one cop in Providence who is a complete pillock... so now you know to avoid him or have a quiet word with his boss later this week or somehow sort it that he never hasles you again ( isn't Rhode Island the most corrupt state in the U.S.?)... and you found out that you need to talk to the Waterfire people.... next time you'll rake it in! If we didn't fail every so often success wouldn't taste nearly so good! tom
http://www.ashevillemagic.com
http://www.themagictomshow.com magician/magic show in asheville w.n.c. |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
There are some interesting ways of circumventing these things. One is not to have the bucket and to say, "Usually, at the end of the act, I will make a very strong plea for you to toss money into my hat. Today, I have been told that I can't ask for money, so I won't."
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
I never made a strong plea for money. This guy didn't even want a passive bucket. Thanks Tom, the guy was a lieutenant, I'd have to go up to a captain to talk to his boss. (I just might anyway!) It's my opinion that the best (or maybe only) spots are ones with a lot of good natured foot traffic. In big cities, that would be parks, museums or theatre areas. In Providence, Thayer St. was about it. (Maybe Roger Williams park, I might take a look over there.)
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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Dave V Inner circle Las Vegas, NV 4824 Posts |
Lose the tip bucket and only give your hat lines when he's not around? Just a thought...
No trees were killed in the making of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
I'm surprised you aren't trying Roger Williams Park. I walked through it a couple of times when I was at NEMCA. It looks like a really nice place to busk.
One thing you might do, though, is go to the captain you referred to, or even before city council and explain that if you have a permit to busk, that you should be able to pass the hat, because that is part of busking. It's not begging. It's not accosting people for money. You do a show which they get to watch. If they like you, they give you money. They are not obligated to. I'm sure that your permit doesn't say that it's a busking permit, per se, though.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Well, the lt. came up from behind me so I didn't even see him. I get "into the loop" and don't see anything outside the group I'm working with.
Bill, here is the permit, on a letterhead from the Board of Licenses with the names of five people on the board and the mayor of Providence; To Whom It May Concern From Andrew J. Annaldo Chairman & Secretary RE: Permission to perform Date: August 20, 2004 Please be advised that the Providence Board of Licenses, this date, has Granted permission to; Edward Rhodes to perfomr Magic, in the City of Providence within the discretion of the local Police authority (PROVIDENCE); providing there is no solicitation for funds. Very truly yours Andrew J. Annaldo Chairman & Secretary The board of licenses told me I could have a bucket, but no hat line. (Although they didn't phrase it that way.) The Lt. claimed that a bucket _was_ a solicatation for funds. I have to go in to work at 3:00 tomorrow. I'm going to go talk to the police first.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
That sucks!
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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marty.sasaki Inner circle 1117 Posts |
Ask for a clarification. If you were told that you could have a "tip jar" as long as you don't have a "hat line", they should be happy to state this directly.
That really is a shame.
Marty Sasaki
Arlington, Massachusetts, USA Standard disclaimer: I'm just a hobbyist who enjoys occasionally mystifying friends and family, so my opinions should be viewed with this in mind. |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
That was what I was told by the Board. I'm going to Police Headquarters and ask them what is what. If they agree with the Board, I'll ask if I can get that in writing on THEIR letterhead. If the agree with the Lt., I'm hosed.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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Andy the cardician Inner circle A street named after my dad 3362 Posts |
Good luck
Cards never lie
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JoeJoe Inner circle Myrtle Beach 1915 Posts |
You could file a motion with the Court Clerk asking for a restraining order against the police due to the fact that busking is protected under the First Amendment including the solicitation for funds. I know it's been posted before, but once again the Community Arts Advocates website:
http://communityartsadvocates.org/saalegal.html It's probably not the easiest route, but would be pretty much bullet proof. With that piece of paper, the Lt. wouldn't dare touch you. And if he did, he would face the scorn of the judge for disobeying him which would most likely include a fine and perhaps even a day or so in jail. -JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Police receptionist said I had to call Internal Affairs. I have to find out what district Thayer St. is in, that ought to help find out who the lt. was. (I would have asked name and badge number, but he looked like he was in a mood to take anything as "resisting authority" and I'd end up with a night on the City; ie in jail!)
Incidently, Bill, you're right. While I _am_ going to try and work this out with the police, I'm also spending next Saturday and Sunday at Roger Williams Park, probably near the zoo and see what happens. (What worries me is I'm not 100% certain RWP is _in_ Providence. But I _tried_ doing it the right way and this is where it got me! Consarnit! (hope that doesn't get censored ) I'm going to work!)
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Turns out the Zoo security wanted me to call the Zoo PR Department to get permission. (Look, I'm 52 and not good at confrontations. I always end up asking for permission!)
The Carosel (sp) area near the playground and snack bar turned out to be much better. Got there late because of the busses, but was still able to work a couple of hours and get more than I got on Thayer St.! Owner of the carosel came out and said I couldn't stay there because they have "licenses" for their "vendors." When he realized I wasn't selling anything, he did a 180 and said it was alright to be there and maybe I could go inside the carosel building next time! It's been a good day! Quote:
On 2007-09-29 14:33, Bill Palmer wrote: That is truth, Bill. Don't think I don't wish I could find another typesetting/graphic arts position and tell Wal*Mart where they could put their Sales Association position.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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Brady Loyal user Los Angeles, CA 235 Posts |
I don't quite understand why you would need a permit if you can't solicit funds and you can't have a tip jar? What would the purpose of the permit be? You already have the first amendment. If you don't solicit funds, you can do magic on public property virtually anywhere, anytime.
Is the purpose of the permit for the board of supervisors to throw around their weight and try to control every little thing that happens in the town? I don't get it. I think JoeJoe has the right idea. Regards, Brady |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
In truth, I didn't get it either. I didn't know the permit would be so toothless until _after_ they gave it to me!
Oh well, at least it didn't cost anything... and is worth what I paid for it.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Quote:
On Oct 7, 2007, ed rhodes wrote: Brought this up in other threads, but since I mention the Carousel Village here, I thought I would up date. Several years ago, the Zoo BOUGHT the Carousel Village from the original owners, and have decided they "don't need" a magician on the premises. So, I don't work there now. This year, they started doing a "food truck" festival on Fridays. I wrote them and almost got scammed by someone. But I was told she WASN'T part of the group running the events and the people who WERE running the event didn't want buskers there.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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