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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
It has always been my belief that magicians do not need to buy more magic. We need to learn to be more creative with the magic we already have. How many of us can honestly admit that we have a drawer at home with tricks we have bought and have never used and are sitting there in that drawer for months? I think if we are honest, then pretty much all of us can relate to that.
The point is that we own so much magic and tricks but we do not spend enough time really learning to think creatively with the magic we do. We are so eager to find and buy what I call a "routine in a box". Those are the tricks that not only tell you how to do the trick, but also show you what to say, how to say it, what jokes to use, how to move and even a DVD showing you exactly how the other magician does it. How does this make you a better creative thinker? It doesn;t. The only thing this does it create more magic clones. How do you fix this problem? Throw the directions away. That's right, learn to do the trick and learn how to make the trick work, then throw the directions away or pack them up so you do not see them or look at them. This forces you to create a routine that FITS YOU and YOUR personality and character on stage. Just because a routine works for one magician does NOT mean it is going to work for you. Each of us are different and we each have qualities on stage that make us who we are. We need to take the tricks we do and create a routine that brings out those qualities. So why are people not creative? Why do they not want to do this? Why? cause magicians are more then anything.. one simple word.... LAZY!! Being creative takes work. I will not lie to you about that. It takes work to learn to be creative. But then again, any GOOD thing always does. But I feel my audiences deserve that of me and it makes me a better magician. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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harris Inner circle Harris Deutsch 8812 Posts |
Hey Kyle...We are reading your stuff in our Ring 129 Newsletter..Cool there and here....
Journalling is a good way of self discovery...I actually started writing more regularly..Nothing like helping others to also help yourself..It is a good season to give and receive.. Someone suggested every once in awhile throw out your best stuff..(I don't subscribe to that)... Others say throw out your weakest stuff..(I suggest moving it to another section as it may play better in a different position...then look at tossing stuff.. I have brought stuff back ...like my melodica (mouth piano) production from scarves...as a middle bit this holiday season...) Still closing with vent...though last night and this morning I was thinking about using a puppet with articulated hands to do a snow storm...in places that don't mind the confetti/paper...We had a teach a trick on snow storms at our Ring 129 meeting last night...
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
drlaugh4u@gmail.com music, magic and marvelous toys http://magician.org/member/drlaugh4u |
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Ireland Loyal user Regina, Sask. Canada 217 Posts |
Going back to Rob's question about an adult comedy closer...this is something I've struggled with as well....I am assuming that by 'audience' we are talking about comedy magic done before a large gathering (50 or 60 to a few hundred people or so, not the 'audiences' that are around a restaurant table for example). I think if the theme is predominantly comedy magic, with perhaps one or two effects that may be more 'emotional' in tone, a comedy closer would be consistent. The comedy lines we use can be even more significant than the effects we choose but closers such as the Multiplying Bottles, a torn and restored effect or even the Can O Corn (although here there is one volunteer onstage at the end) can be used as long as the clothing of these effects (ie the lines) are comedic. Bits of gags and business can be very important here.... the other night I closed with a simple sight gag....the 'amazing floating ball' done with a soup ladle....people laughed. In the Can O Corn effect, the volunteer can be dismissed followed by some comedic words of departure to the group. What is the opinion of the rest of you about this??? Don from Regina, Canada
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Magic Rob New user Denver, CO 99 Posts |
Frank and Kyle,
Your advice is well received and I believe that your intentions are sincere. That said, your assumptions about why I am asking for input regarding a new closing routine are misunderstood. I agree whole-heartedly that any routine with work can be developed into a strong closer. However, I am looking for something new and different; something that I haven't thought about before. This shouldn't imply that I am being "lazy" or that I want a "routine in a box". It simply means I want to stimulate my creativity with some fresh ideas to keep things interesting for me as a performing artist. It goes without saying that to be successful, I have to make the closer (and really all of the effects in my act) uniquely my own with my personal style and nuances. Trying to use someone else's act simply doesn't create a strong and professional performance. When I am developing a new show, I actually buy quite a few new tricks that seem like they are my style. I monkey around with each effect for a while, maybe trying it a time or two in front of an audience. Then I weed out the ones that don't quite suit me, my style or the flow of the show and I end up with a strong act. It's a lot of work, but it's a process that's been effective for me. Respectfully, Rob |
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Magic Rob New user Denver, CO 99 Posts |
Harris,
As always, great advice. I really like the idea about every once in a while throwing out your best stuff. The only trouble is, mis cajones aren't big enough to do that. I've got an ego to feed, you know. That's it...this is just the inspiration I needed to get these aging yarbles started in strength training at the gym. In six weeks or years they're going to be strong enough to start getting rid of all the good stuff in my show. Make way Bally's Total Fitness! |
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Magic Rob New user Denver, CO 99 Posts |
Don,
From what I read many years ago, the closing effect should happen with only the performer on the stage. Your final effect should be the one they remember you with; the one they talk about as they leave the theater. Onstage assistants or vounteers could distract from this association. In my opinion, if it works for you to send the volunteer to his seat and then make a closing remark - great. I have seen some performers use onstage volunteers in a strong routine second to last, send them to their seat, and then finish with a quick, impressive closing piece. I would say do whatever works for you personally... |
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Magic Rob New user Denver, CO 99 Posts |
Why didn't anyone comment on the Weird Al parody mentioned 10 posts back? Here it is again:
http://www.weirdalforum.com/private/yourepitiful.mp3 or go to: weirdal.com Don't cha thinks its kinda funny? |
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Ireland Loyal user Regina, Sask. Canada 217 Posts |
I wonder if we place too much emphasis on the last effect...in terms of comedy magic, if people haven't laughed or been entertained throughout, I doubt the last effect will save our butts. If they have had a fun time, I don't think saying goodnight as a volunteer leaves the stage is that big of a deal. I know that's the theory, and likely correct, but in practice, if people have enjoyed themselves, a few comedic departing lines said alone on stage, doesn't detract from people asking for my business card after the peformance.
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Hi Rob,
Thanks for the posts and the great sharing of information. My post was really not aimed at or targeted towards you as it was more or less thoughts that can pertain to anyone trying to be more creative with their own magic. Sorry if there was anything implied in it as it was not meant to be sarcastic or rude. My main thoughts here is the fact that many people do not even attempt to be creative out of the fact that it takes work to be that way. I applaude you actually because you are here stating clearly that you want to be creative and you are putting forth the effort to come up with something new and fresh to add to your show. You have already taken that hardest step in the creative process. That is simply the art of taking action and doing it. Since we have been talking a lot about creativity in magic and how you can open yourself up to being more creative with your magic, I thought it might be helpful to discuss brain storming techniques that can be used to help in the creative process. I would like to share with you one of the techniques I use most often and that has really helped me out over the years. I hope it might do the same for you. Being an artist, I have always used different creative and brain storming techniques to generate art ideas for my fine art as well as my logo designs. I just had never thought about the fact that some of these techniques that I had always used, could not only carry over to magic, but could really work well. The problem with creativity and brain storming is that we can not always focus as much as we want to be able to. There are so many outside influences and distractions that prevents our mind from staying on topic. We tend to drift around too much and never get a chance to lock in on some great ideas and to really explore them in detail. The other problem is that we over think things too much. We often get hung up on trying to be creative and trying hard to figure out a particular idea, that we allow other great ideas to just roll on by our mind. All this frustration often leads to lack of creativity and so we shy away from trying it again out of fear. So how can you brain storm effectively to really generate results while avoiding some of these more common pitfalls? Well, one suggestion is to occupy your mind and teach your mind to think a certain way by simply fooling it. The mind is great at doing tasks and accomplishing them. When your mind is actively involved in a step by step process, there is no time for it to wander like it often does in most creative processes that we have used in the past. One way to do this is a form of brain storming that was taught to me years ago and that I have modified since then over time. It is a process that focuses the mind to being creative even if it does not realize it is doing so. It works something like this: Start off with an idea that you have for a act, routine or even a show. Figure out to yourself what are the main words or ideas that you want to generate ideas for in this new act or routine. Try and come up with the single words that best reflect this act. For example, let’s use the idea of coming up with a magical routine that is themed around the idea of art. When we look at it we get two main words that are the focus for this act. Those words are “art” and “magic”. Next, take out a sheet of paper and on the left side of the page, write the word art on the top. Now go over to the right side of the page and write the word Magic. Start with the word art. Start to think of any word that you can think of that has to do with the word art. The idea here is a free-flowing generation of words. You are not trying to develop ideas or thoughts. Just simply write down words that you associate to the word art. Some of these words might be; paper, color, paint, paintbrush, easel etc. I think you get the idea. Now you do the same thing for the word magic. Just generating words and not stopping to dwell on any of them. Once you have compiled your lists, the fun and creativity really starts to happen. The idea is to start to cross reference words from both lists to generate new words and new creative ideas. For example you may take the word paintbrush from one list and the word “vanish” from the other list. All of a sudden you generate the idea of a vanishing paintbrush. You keep doing this by cross-referencing other words together. By doing this, your teaching your brain to stay focused by occupying it with a select group of steps it must do. But in the end your generating ideas and creative thoughts that you may not have come up with on your own or in other means. It really does work and is quite amazing what can be generated just from this simple process. I hope you may give this a try. If you do, please let me know how it works out for you. I am sure it will work. So sure that I can almost guarantee you will create better ideas and at a faster rate then ever before. I look forward to hearing your thoughts and learning from you all. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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KyletheGreat Special user Georgia 560 Posts |
WOW! What a dissertation!
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Thanks Kyle. I just strongly believe in the power of creative thought in magic. This brainstorming technique is something I have used in my art and design for a long time and I have carried it over into the magic I do. I find that it works amazingly well to focus the mind on the task of creating creative ideas. I hope people may try it and see if it works well for them also. My pleasure.
Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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Magic Rob New user Denver, CO 99 Posts |
Kyle,
I've never tried that technique before, but I can see how it would be effective. I'm definitely going to use this information. You are a true professional who's willing to share very worthwhile advice. I'm no Nostradamus, but I see writing a book in your future. Hopefully you are more organized than I am about keeping notes. Thanks for sharing your ideas and I will let you know how it works out when I get a chance to seriously try it. I've never read it, but I think Dariel Fitzkee's classic book "The Trick Brain" touches on creative techniques along this line. Good stuff... |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Rob: Thank you so very much my friend. Your kind words are most appreciated. The technique I mention works amazingly well. The problem with creative thought is that if you do not do it regularly your brain drifts too much. Meaning you have to train your mind to work on a task at hand. The brain is very good at tasks and at going through various set courses of action. This brainstorming technique works because you are teaching the mind to go through a set course of tasks and this focuses the mind in a controlled manner. It is amazing how many great ideas can be derived from this simple technique.
If you do use this information and try it out, please let me know how it goes for you. Everyone will go about it slightly differently, but the results you get will more then likely astound you. I always end up with ideas that I never would have imagined at the start. I am always more then willing to share my knowledge, information and advice with other magicians. I always said that if I stayed in magic long enough, and if I ever had anything worth while to share, I was going to do just that. I find that by sharing, I am helping other magicians which in turn helps the magical arts grow. I am not sure about a book, but many folks have asked me if I am writing one or if I could. I have been asked many times about that in the past. I guess it is something I should consider perhaps. I do have two writings that are nbot out there for people to obtain. this is my chair suspension ebook which covers off on a lot of information on the chair suspension illusion and the performance of it. I also just finished last month my first fuill solo lecture on creativity. The lecture is called "Encore! creativity In The Art of Magic!". It went over very well when I debuted it in MD last month. it is a topic that is not lectured on as much as it should and I go into explainging why people are not as creative as they could be, common pitfalls and how anyone can learn simple techniques to be as creative as they want to be. I finished the 15 page lecture notes and they have been well received so far. I am just trying now to make people aware that this lecture is out there and that the lecture notes are available as well. I will have to do more of that in 2008 and hope I get the chance to lectuire on it more next year. I also do save all of my writings. It is a habit that my ,mom taught me and I am grateful for it. As you may already know, I write for 2 magic ezines. One I write for weekly which is Alan watson's ezine where I write a weekly column on many different magic topics. the other I write for monthly which is Angelo satgnaros Smoke and Mirrors. both have been generous enough to provide me a place to write on any topic I choose about magic and to hopefully share ideas with others. Because I write the weekly column, I have well over 60+ articles I have written to date on various topics in magic rnaging from creativity to how to market your magic more effectively. All of these are saved. Maybe one of these days I can put someone of them into a book format. It is something I will have to consider. Thanks again my friend. Much appreciated. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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harris Inner circle Harris Deutsch 8812 Posts |
Regarding Wierd Al...Some of his stuff is really good. I grew up on Alan Sherman and Tom Lehr as early parody influences....
http://www.magician.org/member/doctoroflaughology/about Above is a picture of Nigel's new twin sister...At one of my recent shows an audience member quiped that she looks like one of Al's "daughters"..(Harris is just jealous of her hair...No more hair jokes Nigel...No more hair Mr. Harris...er Harrless...
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
drlaugh4u@gmail.com music, magic and marvelous toys http://magician.org/member/drlaugh4u |
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RevJohn Inner circle Oregon City Oregon, Oregon 2473 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-12-08 10:27, magic4u02 wrote: Kyle, Just wanted to tell you that this post helped me immensely in working up my latest show. I working through the effects, and nothing was clicking together, and wasn't getting a common thread, etc. And when I read your post about picking up the common words, etc... something Clicked. My show that I am working on is now themed, "Growing Up With Magic." Each effect ties into something about my life, and it is a double theme. Not only have I grown up with Magic in my life, but Magic has helped me grow up. It is working pretty well. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. They were truly inspiring. RevJohn |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
RevJohn,
thank you so much my friend for your kind words and thoughts. it is much appreciated. I am really glad that my post has helped you out and given you more direction. that is always great to hear. The problem qwith creativity is that the brain tries to go in so many directions that it is hard to stay focused. The ideas I mention in this thread are geared at giving your mind something to do. The mind is great at tackling task we ask of it. So this is a way to do just that and in so doing, generate creative ideas you may not have thought about before. I would like to hear more about your act and keep me posted with how it is going and how you are using effective means to really gorw your creativity and to apply that to the magic you create. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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JOEMAGICMAN New user New York 11 Posts |
Hi guys its my first time posting. I've learned so much from you guys. Could somebody explain what is a call back? thanks
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Ian Keable New user London, England 16 Posts |
A call back is a reference later on in the act to something that happened earlier. The best call backs are unexpected, so they take the audience by surprise when they happen. The call back can be magical (for instance, something that has vanished earlier, and which the audience have forgotten about, makes an unexpectedly reappearance) or it can be comic (a gag is repeated in a different way or in a different context later on in the act).
The master of call backs is Mac King where for instance apparently nonsensical magical words suddenly take on meaning, his 'worm' keeps appearing in surprising places and his cloak of invisibility comes back into play two or three times after its initial introduction. If you watch Michael Finney's Live at Lake Tahoe! you will see many examples of call backs - he is particularly good at referencing back audience members' occupations. It's a strong technique as it demonstrates to an audience that some thought has gone into your act and, if done correctly, it can considerably enhance a gag or piece of business.
Ian Keable
Author of Stand-Up, A Professional Guide to Comedy Magic Available for sale at http://www.iankeable.co.uk |
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Ian Keable New user London, England 16 Posts |
With regard to closing tricks, my own view is that you should probably close with your strongest trick - which with comedy acts will probably be the one that generates the most laughs. Michael Finney for example closes with his Card on Forehead, Mike Caveney with his David Williamson with Rocky and Jeff Hobson Egg Bag with Watch Steals Reproduced. The exception might be to close with something short and quick that pulls big applause (productions are good for doing this - it's the one time where perhaps it's best to do something that makes the audience go 'wow' rather than necessarily frying their brains: which means they will sit in stunned silence - not what you want at the end of your act!).
Ian Keable
Author of Stand-Up, A Professional Guide to Comedy Magic Available for sale at http://www.iankeable.co.uk |
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