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Daren Inner circle 2051 Posts |
Hope my question makes sense but basically want to get back into stay stack from the end of Martin Nash's routine, Ovation, you end with pairs of cards from top to bottom, so two red 10's two black 4's, two red 6's etc. etc., how to get back into stay stack from this order would be great?
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Axelchen Elite user Germany 413 Posts |
Hello daren!
technically just do one anti-faro and then reverse the top or bottom 26 cards. I think the main problem would be the presentational dimension to cover these actions...tamariz´s mnemonica could give you some advice, I think. axel |
Daren Inner circle 2051 Posts |
Thanks but can it be done with a faro (in or out) and then a run of cards?
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Josh Chaikin Inner circle Kansas City 1430 Posts |
Looking at it, there's no easy solution, given the nature of the cards at the end, and what stay stack constitutes. What are you trying to do?
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Daren Inner circle 2051 Posts |
I want to perform Ovation by Martin Nash, then get back into stay stack, then from stay stack back into mnemonica order.
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T. Joseph O'Malley Inner circle Canada 1937 Posts |
Probably not the knucklebusting/mathematical answer that you're looking for, but I'd say do a deck switch.
tjo'
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Josh Chaikin Inner circle Kansas City 1430 Posts |
Unless I'm mistaken, stay stack is a general term that refers to a mirror stack that perfect faros won't disrupt. That being the case, a deck switch would be your best bet. (Then again, I'm only beginning to seriously study the effects of a faro on stay stack now).
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johnnymajestic New user 24 Posts |
Deck Switch
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Axelchen Elite user Germany 413 Posts |
Hello again daren.
my problem is that I don´t know ovation from Martin Nash, so I don´t know the whole sequence the deck is in. to me it makes no sense to do a faro (in or out) until I know the whole sequence. and it sounds that you want the deck in a special stay-stack order, right? or just any stay-stack order? if that, I think the esiest way is a reverse-faro (seperating all pairs, the sequence is identically) so you get two halfs of the same sequence, reverse-count one half so you get a mirror- or stay-stack. can you give my any reference to the ovation-trick? I got three dvds from Mr. Nash but can´t remember ovation. or is it in apocalypse? perhaps another tip: on Denis Behrs homepage there was (is?) a link to faro-calculating-program. you can type in a special sequence and the program shows you the new sequence after a faro-in, out, reverse etc. I like it. axel |
Cohiba Special user Michigan 749 Posts |
Just do Ovation in reverse. I'm not sure what the effect is, but usually effects can work both ways. Look at twisting the aces: the first time they flip one way, in reverse they just flip back. It gives a sort of closure to the effect, plus you're reset to do it again.
You could even use Tony Chapek's rewind gag as a presentation if all else fails. |
Cohiba Special user Michigan 749 Posts |
I'm sorry dude. I feel your pain. I know the deck switch is not what you were hoping for. I couldn't resist being an idiot for a minute. Good luck on your quest.
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Axelchen Elite user Germany 413 Posts |
By browsing through the other threads I found a hint to another stck-calculating site:
shuffled not stirred - histed heisted, dennis loomis linked a website of his friend nick pudar http://www.stackview.com . I just saw the screenshots but that looks great. perhaps you can find a better solution by using bit-power! good luck! axel |
Josh Chaikin Inner circle Kansas City 1430 Posts |
A reverse or anti-faro, followed by reversing the lower half of the deck seems like it would work, Or you could collect the cards individually, rather than picking up the pairs, then reverse the bottom half, and you'd have stay stack. Doesn't seem very practical to me, but, unless I'm thinking of another effect, Ovation is better suited as a closer.
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JasonEngland V.I.P. Las Vegas, NV 1728 Posts |
Daren,
Some of what's posted above is true, some is not, depending on when you clarified your desire to eventually get into Mnemonica. You'll have to be familiar with getting into Mnemonica from new deck order probably to understand this, but here goes: Stay stack is a concept, not a particular ordering of the cards. If 1 - 52 are mates, 2 - 51 are mates, 3 - 50, 4 - 49, 5 - 48, etc, then you're in stay stack. The problem is that if you want to go from stay stack to Mnemonica you're going to need a specific order that happens to be a stay stack order also. There are billions of ways to make a stay stack deck. Only a few of these work for you, and you'll have to memorize the sequence of one that works (probably the main one you go through while getting to Mnemonica from NDO). For instance, you are in a stay stack position with black aces on top and bottom and black nines in the middle of the deck right before you reverse 26, cut at the KD and faro (then cut 9D to bottom) to get into Mnemonica. However, if you don't get back to EXACTLY this version of stay stack you'll have a difficult time getting into Mnemonica. Assuming you know the exact order of the cards in the stay stack that you need (the above-mentioned version with black aces on top and bottom), then a simple way to get there from Nash's routine is to divide each pair into two piles. Place all the cards in one pile face up and all the mates into another pile that is face down. Make sure to assemble your piles so that the AC is on the very bottom before beginning your reversal of 26 cards. It's an ugly procedure to be sure, but it works. My suggestion is don't bother. Nash's routine is a closer. Scoop up the deck and fix it backstage. Jason
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
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Daren Inner circle 2051 Posts |
Thanks for all your tips guys, much appreciated
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16544 Posts |
A wild guess is deal out four bridge hands and pick the hands up in reverse order.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
Andy the cardician Inner circle A street named after my dad 3362 Posts |
Jason is spot on, only one stay stack arrangement will result in Mnemonica.
Agreed as well as using Ovation as an ending - as also recommended by Martin. It is such a powerful piece of magic that is difficult to top. Also, Ovation leaves you with a table full of card pairs. In theory, you could bring them back into the stay stack position and proceed as described by Tamariz in his book to get into a mnemonica set-up. But this will be rather time consuming and will disrupt your performance in a very unsettling way. So if you want to proceed, scrap the cards together, pack them into a box and do a deck switch. You can also choose to present the deck to the spectator that helped you during the Ovation trick, giving you a perfect reason to bring out a new deck.
Cards never lie
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