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randallmagic New user 34 Posts |
I saw this unit on Viking Magic's website. http://www.vikingmagic.com/?nd=full&key=1220
Is this a good unit? How far a spread will the light go out? I would be interested in finding out more about small stage spot lighting. Thanks to all for helping. Randall Randall Magic, LLC |
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
Although Viking doesn't mention it, that spot is actually a Chauvet product, and all the specs can be found on the following web page.
http://www.chauvetlighting.com/followspot-400g.html |
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randallmagic New user 34 Posts |
Wow, your fantastic. I got an email from Viking that just repeated what was on the site. Have you or anyone else used this light?
Randall |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
I've used these quite a few times. As with any instrument the weak link is output. These have pretty good optics so they are pretty punchy for the size but they just won't cut through much ambient light from a distance of more than 50 feet or so, much less if you're using color.
On the good side, they have DMX control built in so you can adjust the color and diming from a regular DMX light board which is very handy for us. The dichroics are all built in on a DMX wheel so if you want Special Lav or a certain light flesh pink, you're out of luck. They are very inexpensive, small and easy to travel with, it just depends on how far away you are and how much other light is on the stage as to whether or not they will be effective. They're only using about 3 or 4 amps so you're not drawing a lot of power either. For me, they are very convenient side lights. I use them on stands in 2 and it solves MANY problems for black art and other sensitive lighting effects. I've also used them just up of the proscenium on lifts for a high side light follow spot. It is a great angle and keeps all of the spill off the back drop.
Ray Pierce
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
As Ray points out, these lights are a relative bargain considering their flexibility.
Alas, a few hundred watts is still only a few hundred watts, so the fixture has to be used within it's design range. When you examine that an actual followspot of the large, professional variety can cost $10,000.00 on up, and that fixture based DMX control over color changes and dimming can cost a couple'a grand.........these followspots do begin to appear as quite the bargain. My needs as they relate to lighting are different than what these are designed for, but I certainly wouldn't hesitate to purchase Chauvet products if I was in the market for this type of lighting instrument. Chauvet has been successfully selling theatrical fixtures into this market for a long time, and as Ray also pointed out above, these fixtures can be used for a lot more than just followspots. |
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randallmagic New user 34 Posts |
Thanks guys. Could you explain what DMX control does for the performer? And is there an adjustment to enlarge the spot or make it smaller?
Randall Randall Magic, LLC |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
Yes, there is an iris on the top to change the size of the spot.
DMX is a networking protocol which allows you to control lighting and effects with a universal language. It can use either a 5 pin XLR cable or even regular 3 pin Mike Cable (although they recommend using data specific cable but mike lines typically work for most runs. Typically the connection is made between your lighting controller and dimmer packs or intelligent lighting fixtures. You daisy chain all of the packs and fixtures together and by setting individual addresses for each fixture, you can control them all from the board through one cable run. There are many resources on DMX and it is good to have at least a working knowledge of it if you're going to be doing much with lighting nowdays.
Ray Pierce
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JoeC New user Asia 59 Posts |
I own this same Chauvet spotlight purchased from a dealer in Florida. Besides it's weak output it is not very durable. The metal frame brace on mine has bent more than once. Also the plastic knobs on it will not take too much abuse.
Just my 2 cents. it is cheap, but you get what you pay for. Real high-quality spotlights can go for 2,000 USD plus. |
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Christopher Starr Inner circle Heart of America 1850 Posts |
Thanks for your insight JoeC - you probably saved a bunch of us a lot of money.
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
I could easily say my car isn't very durable as every time I run into a wall, something cracks on it.
Durability IS a key factor if you're touring. The original post didn't mention the need. I've used these at a fixed location for a club with dim lighting for years and they are fine but I wouldn't put one in my road case to travel without a LOT of padding. Yes, you need to get good equipment but I frequently send as much on road cases as I do on props. I have some spots that I've used for years, (not these in the article) but they've held up well because we take care of them and maintain them. The more delicate the equipment is, the more important it is to pack it well for travel. That being said, no I wouldn't expect a $300 micro follow spot to pack the same punch or be as durable as a $5000 Lycian, but they do have a use in certain situations and if you're careful with them, they will last. Just don't toss them in the sub trunk and expect a great performance from them.
Ray Pierce
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
The Chauvet is designed within certain constraints, those constraints focused on keeping the price low but still offering a fixture that does a specific job well.
If used within the original design constraints, the Chauvet will perform in an excellent fashion. Comparing inexpensive lighting fixtures of any type to far more expensive fixtures that offer the same basic specs is practically impossible. Obviously, if one of your major design prerequisites is to offer a low price, you will not be competing with the same basic type of fixtures as offered by a manufacturer who isn't worried about price point. There are dozens of Chinese, Taiwan, and Korean manufacturers offering lighting instruments, and none of them are under any illusions that they're competing head on with ETC, Strand, Strong, Lycian, Selecon, etc. The end user shouldn't be under the impression that these low priced fixtures are intended to compete directly with expensive, premium brand fixtures.........they're not, if anything they're only designed to compete with each other. But the makers of low cost lighting fixtrures do recognize that everybody can't afford the best, and they offer to fill that lower end market very effectively. The Chauvet spot above is excellent value for the dollar if the fixture is used within its intended design specifications. |
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randallmagic New user 34 Posts |
Good discussion on this, you all have helped me on this. I agree you can't compare a Ford Focus with a Mercedes even though both are cars.
I do mostly small shows so it sounds like these lights will help my shows. Thanks to all. Randall |
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berrysr New user 15 Posts |
Another cheap spotlight is the Chauvet DMX-155. It runs about $150 and has DMX
pan and tilt along with a color Gobo wheel. But as with the spot above it is not a supper bright (150W)light but you get what you pay for. I use the DigiSelect DMX light controller to change the positiona and color of my spot during the show. You can even drag the spot light around the stage using a mouse. One draw back is the spot light is ellptical so Horizontal movement is not in a straight line You have to go to soemthing like the Chauvet MiN Spot DMX LED Moving Yoke Fixture for more control but all these lights are best in a dark stage enviroment |
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Dennis Michael Inner circle Southern, NJ 5821 Posts |
You can get the Chauvet 400G Follow spot for $280 at http://www.pssl.com lighting. Call them and tell them you saw it included with the tripod stand (a $70 item) and they will match it. (If you look hard enough you may find it cheaper with stand and pssl will match the price plus shipping.)
I have mine for two years, and three other members of my SAM club also have and use it. I have had problems with it: The buttons displayed the wrong color. I open it, played with the wheel and Fixed it myself. A Friends handle broke. The most important thing is to buy spare Eiko 360 W Av/Photo lamp. Others turn off the spotlight with the power switch and do not let the fan cool off the bulb. Shut the Bulb off (Blackout button) let it cool with fan then turn it off. Nothing like finding out just before the show starts you don't have a bulb and the one in the spot light is burnt out. One gets use to using this machine and it is worth every penny I spent on it. I have it packed in a rollable foot locker with a set of flood lights. (Foam packed) PS.. I grown to listen to Ray Pierce posts. He is quite knowledgeable and most of the time "Dead on" in his advice.
Dennis Michael
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jlevey Inner circle Montreal, Quebec, Canada 2076 Posts |
In an earlier post, above, berrysr said"...I use the DigiSelect DMX light controller to change the position and color of my spot during the show. You can even drag the spot light around the stage using a mouse..."
Dear berrysr, I was quite disturbed to learn that you use a mouse to drag your spot light around on stage. The SFCAVSA (society for cruelty against very small animals) will surely be onto you soon, and then you'll regret it! ...lol Jonathan PS: seriously, there is lots of valuable input in this thread --and it's spot on! Thanks!
Jonathan
Max & Maxine Entertainment Magicians with a touch of comedy! ___________________________________ www.maxmagician.com www.mindreadershow.com www.monsieurmagic.com |
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Kevin Ridgeway V.I.P. Indianapolis, IN & Phoenix, AZ 1832 Posts |
Here is what we did when we couldn't justify $5K or more for a follow spot.
We got an ETC Source Four ellipsoidal with a 750 watt bulb. We then got a 10 degree lens and dropped in an iris. Here is what it did for us: A 750 watt source four is quite bright. The 10 degree lens is extremely tight and makes for a good long throw. The iris allows you to change the diameter of the light. Running this light through our dimmer allowed us to control when the light was on or off. All the spot operator had to do was keep it on the performer...our light board turned the light on and off via the dimmer...thus the spot op really could not ever have the light on when it wasn't supposed to be. Kevin
Living Illusions
Ridgeway & Johnson Entertainment Inc Kevin Ridgeway & Kristen Johnson aka Lady Houdini The World's Premier Female Escape Artist www.LadyHoudini.com www.livingillusions.com |
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CNYMagician New user Central New York 27 Posts |
Quote:
We got an ETC Source Four ellipsoidal with a 750 watt bulb. We then got a 10 degree lens and dropped in an iris. I've done this several times for various shows. The iris is a great accessory, but if you don't already have one - get a handle for it as well. http://www.productionadvantageonline.com......360.aspx Also even with the handle, it runs a lot hotter than a "Real" follow spot, so if it is on for very long, your spot op may want to wear gloves. |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-09-26 11:05, Living Illusions wrote: A VERY workable solution. Lekos were used for years for short throw followspots in certain situations and were very practical. What the money buys you in a traditional follow spot is typically controlability. You're getting color boomerangs, easier focusing (going from a soft edge to hard edge) cooling fans, frequently better optics, shuttering, etc. These are frequently not needed for some shows. If you're just using it for a fixed color spot for magic, a Source Four will probably give you all you need. It WILL take slightly more power but this isn't a problem for most situations. If you need to smoothly switch colors it can be harder. The throw distance is the biggest mitigating factor for light in general. The more expensive spots are brighter and have larger lensing to create a smaller spot at a greater distance. To get a full body spot at 50 feet in a dark club will cost you a lot less than getting a full body at 300 feet in an arena that will cut through as lot of other lighting for a concert. Really look at your needs before getting more than is necessary or geting something that won't fill your needs. If you don't use it regularly, rent it! Most theatrical supply houses will rent you anything you need for shows an you can just factor that in as part of your package. If you DO go the source four route definitely follow Bruce's advice for the additional handle and gloves. Also a really good base or stand as it's not typically intended for motion so beef up the bearings around the clamp. Add some large fender washers and UHMW washers or other bearings on the main bolt to keep it smooth. It can really get jerky otherwise. I use a threaded clamp and have a large handle on the top which helps tighten it down or adjust the panning pressure when necessary. http://www.mcmaster.com/#8558k8/=3tc1os The other issue is the dimming. If you have good spot ops, they can have all of the control at the spot. You can add an independent dimmer for them to operate or have a blackout shutter to take out the spot. The problem I have with having an external control for the spot (coming from a programmed dimmer board or other automated system) is that they will never know exactly when the spot is coming on so unless they are blindly following you all the time even when the spot is off, you will not always get a good "pick up" when the spot turns on. If they know the show perfectly and are rehearsed to know when the spot is coming on, it's no problem. The other (and always better) solution is to have your stage manager or TD calling the show via headsets so they know exactly when to be ready for the cue to go. Yes, it adds another person to some shows that don't have it. I actually developed a system years ago when I didn't have the money for an extra person to call my shows. I recorded my show tracks on 2 channels of a 4 track recorder. The 3rd track was for the headsets and I "called" the show on these tracks giving all the regular standby and GO cues the spot ops and everyone else were used to. I routed this track to a clear com interface and it played during the entire show. Now there was no feedback if someone asked a question or needed clarification but at that point it was such a simple show it worked pretty well. The 4th track was a wireless dressing room monitor and it called "places and gave our pre show stand by warnings. It was a mix of my voice and the show track once the show started. The entire track started at 45 minutes before the show before the house opened. The preshow music came on, faded down into the overture than the show played straight through along with every cue including a preshow "talk through" of the cues for the crew on headset at 5 minutes till show. This wouldn't work in many cases but our full show was on track and all of my talk pieces were timed to the music beds so it worked out well for us. Our Stage Manager is the most important person on our show as it is HIS show once I step on stage. He calls the show and makes it work. Invest in talent... not just your own. Get the most professional support team you can to help make the show a success. David Novich, Mark Measures, Blake Torney and most recently Dale Hindman have called my shows for years and they are the best of the best. Sorry for rambling on so many topics but hopefully it all fits together!
Ray Pierce
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CNYMagician New user Central New York 27 Posts |
Wow, Ray! I know I tend to go off on stream of consciousness rambles at times, but I think you just got me beat! ;-) (Great advice in there though.)
Follow Spots can range from the Chauvet units that started this thread, to modified Source Fours, to Altspots, to the carbon arc troupers I still run, to the 4,000 Watt Lycian Super Arc. This all really underscores the similar range in the size of Magic shows. To give anyone advice on whether a unit is good for their needs, we really HAVE to ask "What ARE your needs?" I suspect most here are not working on the scale that Ray does. If someone is performing in church basements, the Chauvet unit would probably be fine. School assemblies: something bigger. Full theatres: bigger yet. Of course, someone performing in church basements probably does not have a spot operator on staff. Training a volunteer that the client provides may - or may not be worth the effort. In a school auditorium or a theatre, they probably already have their own follow spot appropriate to the venue - and an experienced operator available. Every circumstance is different, so before really valuable advice can be given about tech, we must first know 1] Where will you be performing - size & type of venue. 2] Size of your show. One man show? One or more assistants? Full scale illusion show? 3] Do you have your own stage manager, lighting operator, sound operator and/or spot operator? 4] If not, who will be filling these roles? |
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jlevey Inner circle Montreal, Quebec, Canada 2076 Posts |
Performing in a school gym.church basement, or small hotel room with 150 to 200 seated guests maximum, what is really recommended --without going to high-end equipment?
I have been using two lights on either side with 300 watts (quartz type) in each unit (with a slightly "pink" gel over the glass -to give the stage area a warmer feeling and especially lessen the harshness on my eyes as I look out into the audience during performance). Up until today this set up has seemed "fine" for my needs --I use to work with 500watts (quartz type) in each unit, but found that way too bright and it "really" hurt my eyes. However, my light have been the type of garage/workshop lights sold at the local home depot and the wiring went bad on one of them today. Instead of replacing the unit with the same inexpensive (...ok, "cheap") model, I am considering to upgrade to a professional (but still not "too" expensive) stage light (one on each side of the stage at 45 degrees. I invite all those "in the know" to kindly add your suggestion(s), even if it has already been mentioned in an earlier post. Please re-confirm? Is there any set of units that would be in the $150-250 range max? If so, that would be great since my budget at this time for this purchase is relatively (very) limited --and I may just go back to the workshop lights for the time being, until my budget expands. Problem is the small metal box that houses the wires of these home depot type lights seems fragile and poorly done, thus leaving themselves more vulnerable to breakage. The metal box enclosure on my units actually seemed to "wiggle" from day one. Jonathan
Jonathan
Max & Maxine Entertainment Magicians with a touch of comedy! ___________________________________ www.maxmagician.com www.mindreadershow.com www.monsieurmagic.com |
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